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[G] Spanishiwa's No Gas FE ZvX - Page 24

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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isospeedrix
Profile Joined November 2010
United States215 Posts
April 14 2011 22:40 GMT
#461
I just wanna drop in and say I've been having reasonable success against Terran with this build. Thanks.
http://www.youtube.com/isospeedrix
Havefa1th
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States245 Posts
April 14 2011 22:47 GMT
#462
I've used this exclusively against protoss, and it really shines because it allows me to hold off early pressure without making roaches, which are really expensive in terms of opportunity costs (1 drone to make extractor, one drone to make the roach warren, 3 drones to mine gas that aren't mining minerals, roaches that could be drones, etc.) while still being able to drone hard. It transitions well into just about everything and has really helped out my ZvP game.

Even if nothing about this build is unique, it has CLEARLY helped me in my play and feels so much smoother than what I was doing before. Thanks Spanishiwa!

/end informerical interview tone
"Apparently I just needed to play the way I did... and realize he killed his own command center." - Idra
ALittleLuk
Profile Joined December 2010
United States13 Posts
April 14 2011 23:48 GMT
#463
This has helped my ZvT so much, makes it feel like I'm playing a game instead of being punished for picking zerg. ;D Thank you a lot sir, I can tell your going to do very well in your SC2 future!
Thanks again!!!
"I don't know what I haven't learnt." - Random Quote
Mithrandir
Profile Joined March 2011
United States99 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-15 02:17:01
April 15 2011 00:18 GMT
#464
On April 14 2011 12:53 Kogut wrote:
DarkForce, why you no win NASL? Perhaps you could have used some Spanishiwa flare!

Looking forward to seeing this build on the D9D.


DarkForce,

I saw this guy's post and thought it was extremely rude. There seem to be a whole lot of ignorant people who think they know better than you. A good example of the Dunning Kruger effect.

Some of us are very grateful that you take the time to critique and give your thoughts on strategy, as you are the highest level zerg I can think of who bothers to do so. Please don't stop.

That is all.
CiscoKid
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada20 Posts
April 15 2011 01:02 GMT
#465
On April 15 2011 09:18 Mithrandir wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 14 2011 12:53 Kogut wrote:
DarkForce, why you no win NASL? Perhaps you could have used some Spanishiwa flare!

Looking forward to seeing this build on the D9D.


DarkForce,

I saw this guy's post and thought it was extremely rude. There seem to be a whole lot of ignorant people who think they know better than you. A good example of the Dunning Kruger effect.

Some of us are very grateful to that you take the time to critique and give your thoughts on strategy, as you are the highest level zerg I can think of who bothers to do so. Please don't stop.

That is all.


It's funny when people think an opening is the end all be all of a matchup... there is a lot more going for this game then that. if you could win 100% of games with a tricky opening or a specific build then this game would be broken. Not to mention you kind of cheapen the victory of who DarkForce played by saying that too...

and yeah DarkForce is such a huge contributor to this forum lets try not to piss him please lol
AngryBear
Profile Joined March 2011
United States32 Posts
April 15 2011 01:38 GMT
#466
This is directed more towards Spainishiwa, but anyone else feel free to chime in :

When do you take your 3rd? I've been taking mine around 12 minutes right after I switch into my offensive push out (usually Roach/Corruptor). I've also been experimenting with a double expand (on bigger maps) around 14 minutes or right after I hold their second push.
Server: US / B.Net ID: AngryBear 582
CiscoKid
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada20 Posts
April 15 2011 01:50 GMT
#467
and yeah i really like this opening... really makes sense as you can fend off most early cheese with no gas at all, did this today and loved it, good job!
Bauldur
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States24 Posts
April 15 2011 03:40 GMT
#468
Spanishiwa, you mentioned in the Day9 daily that this build suffers from certain types of cheeses, however im more curious about midgame vs fast expands...does this build put you way ahead of a normal fast expand or is it just simply a safer more efficient way to do it? Since the opposing player has a much harder time harassing against this build, I assume that their best choice against it would be to FE against the zerg if this is seen (albeit that would probably have to be the decision made before scouting it but im just having a really hard time understanding how to compete against this build.)
I do not judge you by the quantity of posts, but by the quality of thought and logic put into them.
C.N.Presents
Profile Joined February 2010
United States8 Posts
April 15 2011 03:59 GMT
#469
I've been trying to learn this build religiously, but for some reason I simply can't pull it off. I think I lost like 12 matches in a row because of this (vs Terran and Toss).

I can never be ready for 3rax stim timing pushes, or any protoss push.

And I'm trying to switch back to my old playstyle and for some reason my brain is disregarding gas until very late all over again.

I'm not blaming this build in anyway, as it seems (and is shown) to be very effective vs early pressure, but early pressure is what's destroying me when using this build, ironically. If I can make it to mid game then I usually win.
Be strong and courageous. Do not be afraid or terrified because of them, for the LORD your God goes with you; he will never leave you nor forsake you.
EscPlan9
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States2777 Posts
April 15 2011 04:08 GMT
#470
On April 15 2011 12:59 C.N.Presents wrote:
I've been trying to learn this build religiously, but for some reason I simply can't pull it off. I think I lost like 12 matches in a row because of this (vs Terran and Toss).

I can never be ready for 3rax stim timing pushes, or any protoss push.

And I'm trying to switch back to my old playstyle and for some reason my brain is disregarding gas until very late all over again.

I'm not blaming this build in anyway, as it seems (and is shown) to be very effective vs early pressure, but early pressure is what's destroying me when using this build, ironically. If I can make it to mid game then I usually win.


Review Spanishiwa's replays and yours. Note the timings when early pressure happens, note what Spanishiwa had, what you had, and how you defended compared to Spanishiwa. There's plenty of replays here to help you out.
Undefeated TL Tecmo Super Bowl League Champion
Chinesewonder
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada354 Posts
April 15 2011 04:15 GMT
#471
Thanks. Subbed
DisaFear
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Australia4074 Posts
April 15 2011 09:06 GMT
#472
Just saw this build in use against CrunCher on Psy's Channel.
I don't even know what i just watched, was it porn or starcraft? Amazingly bizzaringly amazing build
How devious | http://anartisticanswer.blogspot.com.au/
DImported
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia149 Posts
April 15 2011 09:17 GMT
#473
I've been using this with quite a bit of success in my ZvZs. Thank you,
Summerfield
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Sweden88 Posts
April 15 2011 11:22 GMT
#474
I am currently platinum and have just recently begun to use this build and at first I lost like five or six matches in a row because I didn't have the timings right and continued to make mistakes. However, as I get used to it more and more it gets increasingly more effective. I am nowhere near to get this build to work beyond the 50+ food limit and still make plenty of mistakes before 50 food, but because this is such a eco based defensive strategy I have no problems holding 4 gates and often spot probes or pylons in time because of effective creep spread. When I see the 4 gate I often have like 30+ drones with two or three spine crawlers, 4 queens and a couple of lings and my minerals is often up to 500+ which allows me to make lings quick to defend. I am astounded how easy it is to control the Toss movement because of the spines and totally annihilate stalkers, sentries and zealots with lings and queens. This build is really, really effective and has helped me a lot against some of the more aggressive toss strategies that usually killed me before.
"And this queen is like F-u darkshrine you are dying like the bitch you are!" - PsYstarcraft
DarKcS
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Australia1237 Posts
April 15 2011 11:51 GMT
#475
Funny when I get fast 3 gated, forgot my spawning pool till 17 food (delayed by like 150 minerals worth of drones - a long time) - yet I still held it. Spine placement is important though, really gotta pre-place them for a flank on your expo mineral line or else :<
Die tomorrow - Live today
vojnik
Profile Joined October 2010
Macedonia923 Posts
April 15 2011 12:25 GMT
#476


wow just wow at this game :D
For the swarm!
hpTheGreat
Profile Joined August 2010
United States173 Posts
April 15 2011 13:21 GMT
#477
Hey, first of all thanks for posting this.
I've been using this against toss and its workign out very well.
I do lose to late early-game / early mid-game aggression right before my gas units/upgrades kick in. I am trying to figure out how to stay alive during that timing window.

Also, I am having issues with not droning enough and find my self running low on minerals by the time i take my 4th. This style allows you to be very aggressive with drops and infestor harass that I have less time to focus on my macro. It is a pleasant change of pace.

Im gonna watch some of those zvt's and see how you handle that.
thanks again
Steamboatlol
Profile Joined April 2010
United States161 Posts
April 15 2011 14:07 GMT
#478
Wow, blown away by the raw earlymid/mid game potential of this build. It's kinda reminiscent of fruit dealer's style where you explode with tech only instead of using mutas to get there you're using just solid economic management and much less costly ling/bane harass so it comes a lot faster and a lot safer. Here's to hoping it becomes a trend.
champy
Profile Joined January 2011
Sweden33 Posts
April 15 2011 17:33 GMT
#479
This is so exciting, I've had this sinking feeling when I see both terran and protoss beeing able to set up a better economy than zerg, but with this build you really get the benefit of an exponential economy. Each larva up until 30-40 supply is worth its weight in gold and I can hardly finish this sentence because I tried it out and it is completely awesome. Early economy leads gives you so much freedom later on, you can pretty much build any tech building and use scouting to abuse any and every weakness. It gives you a completely new range of options, its like going from

"Uh-oh, I haven't scouted in 30 seconds, I have to sacrifice an ovie and half my zerglings to get a picture of what I'm going to die to"

to

"LOL my economy is ridiculous! He can't even get a third! Ok, so which unit do I feel like finishing him off with?"

Please enter the above text in the field to prove you are not a robot.
shuckyducky
Profile Joined October 2010
United States19 Posts
April 15 2011 17:35 GMT
#480
Video for Day9's walk through of this build with Spanishiwa himself is up.
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