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On February 05 2014 00:15 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2014 00:11 raynpelikoneet wrote:On February 05 2014 00:10 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 04 2014 23:58 marvellosity wrote:
Artanis, be very specific what the issue is with my post, because at the moment I'm not seeing it and it looks like you're just saying things. Quote stuff and explain what is wrong with it. You might be right because I'm getting confused with specific wording. My point was simply that I considered point 2 and 3 non alignment indicative. That's all there is to it. I reread regarding point 1 and Rayn's answer and find his answer lacking. It's a bad open and together with the inconsistency I would consider him smelly. How is my answer lacking? I don't even know what you are talking about. Clarifying your position when you hadn't even entered the thread yet feels unnecessary. And if you felt there wasn't much alignment indicative things in the thread yet, why did you have a problem with Promethelax' post?
I have already explained my stance on HF's post and marv regarding it. If you think trying to be clear is a scumtell then.. idk what to think.
ehh.. Because there was not much alignment indicative things yet Promethelax somehow considered everyone town and by that reasoned a scumread on people who had not posted yet.. What's wrong with that?
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Votecount
Artanis[Xp] (2) - Holyflare, WaveofShadow, marvellosity
Holyflare (1) - Artanis[Xp], DarthPunk
marvellosity (1) - WaveofShadow, DarthPunk
WaveofShadow (1) - Holyflare
raynpelikoneet (0) - marvellosity
DarthPunk (0) - Holyflare, iamperfection, DarthPunk, marvellosity
Promethelax (0) - DarthPunk
Not Voting - raynpelikoneet, iamperfection, Promethelax, Cephiro
If any votes have been missed, please let us know!
With 9 players remaining, 5 votes are required to lynch.
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On February 05 2014 00:03 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 23:55 WaveofShadow wrote:On February 04 2014 23:51 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Are you saying you are scum Wave? You know, I can actually picture you saying this sentence now.  No, that is not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is HF's meta case makes some degree of sense only because he is comparing this game to my very last (which isn't a great comparison to begin with). He isn't trying to compare this game to my scumgame 9 months ago---so he is technically right when he says i am playing differently this game as compared to my last. The problem is, that doesn't make me scummy in the slightest. No amount of wishy-washiness or lack thereof will do so either. And also yes, your play is more comparable to what i read in Shadow game than what i have witnessed in other games you have been in lately. In Shadow game, as in this game on D1 you did not stand out as much as you have in other games, for example 4 Persona and Thug Life (i don't remember much of NWM). In those games, to me, you looked far more aggressive and emotional in comparsion to this and Shadow game.
Maybe because you weren't in that game you don't REALLY know, but I am way more aggressive (see Artanis vote/push) in this game compared to Shadow and I believe I stand out more as well. And the reverse about emotion----I was way more emotional in Shadow game than this one as well. I can't tell whether I should expect you to realize that or not...meh.
Self-meta analysis is really really useless though so I'm dropping it.
On February 05 2014 00:10 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2014 00:09 marvellosity wrote:
Obviously it's not useful, but what else is there to say about it? Just wait and see what he posts later. If you remember what happened in LXII was that nearly every time Cephiro posted was to tell he will post later on.. But yes, you are right.
And this was one of my 'aggressive' games where I pushed him like crazy D1(?), was shot and nobody listened. I almost wish you hadn't brought that to mind though Rayn.
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On February 04 2014 14:45 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 12:00 WaveofShadow wrote:On February 04 2014 10:49 Holyflare wrote:On February 04 2014 10:45 iamperfection wrote:
dp can get emotional as town.
answer my question dp its quite a simple one. Yes. There is a difference though. Getting emotional in the game when people aren't doing something or are town that aren't listening is when it mostly happens. Getting emotional at someone pushing "shit cases" and being "awful" shouldn't trigger those same emotions though, your first thought should be that they are scum pushing an agenda and then further investigate. Especially as DP has said "HF is a good town player that I listened to" (in Titanic). So if he thinks I am being shit in this game he should jump to the conclusion that I am being scum. Yet, this anger relates to someone that has a scum mindset of a towny pushing a case that doesn't "make sense to me even if I AM scum". Catching up, but....um...did you or did you not read my reactions to Toad's/Foolishness's terrible cases on me last game? Your conclusions are completely wrong imo. Toad's case was legitimately beyond terrible. This case was totally unjustified rage on a case that wasn't awful. How can you equate the two things at all? The fact that 3 people jumped onto him because of that shows that other people agree why so have you taken the opposite point of view? Please explain how my conclusions are wrong.
Now onto Prome. Half of Prome's filter is talking about tactics that scum can do and what would be best for the town to do. Now, at the start of the game it isn't so bad, however, when he talks about it more and more even though he has "thought about it a lot before the game" his ideas do not add up. In fact, there are many contradictions in his thought processes. For instance, over time Prome discusses how it is more beneficial to kill a fringe looking townie/scum to then shoot who we think is actual scum so we can determine the alignment from the flip. Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 11:32 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 11:29 marvellosity wrote:On February 04 2014 11:28 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 11:25 Holyflare wrote:On February 04 2014 11:23 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 11:19 marvellosity wrote:On February 04 2014 11:16 DarthPunk wrote:On February 04 2014 11:15 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 11:12 DarthPunk wrote:
[quote]
It's not the same in this setup because you get a vig shot bro. one bad shot and lylo. Totally the same, lynching scum>vigging them. Actually maybe not now that I write it down. Would prefer to lynch a townie who was on the margins of looking scummy and have them shoot a scum. It will confirm two alignments. Was thinking in the pre game if one player is kicking ass and taking names for town scum may actually choose to bus to be able to use their shot on said player. We should not be too confidant that those who push scum are town. There is valid reason for scum to bus even when neither scum is in danger. That is a fucking stupid plan if you are scum. Actually it's interesting and worth spending at least some thought on. Some time down the line you have player A and player B, both are suspicious and town is deciding between them. One mafia one townie. One is going to be lynched, the other will be vigged by the lynched player (seems a sensible play). Makes sense for the mafia in that situation to bus the mafia, so the mafia dies and doesn't flip, and the townie flips. Probably a better result for mafia than the townie not flipping and shooting the mafia who does flip. So it seems there's probably situations where bussing might be optimal for mafia It is actually a great plan for mafia. Even more than that the bussed mafia can shoot bigawesometownie1 and next day it is likely that town will lynch scummylookingtowniewhowasupforlynch since lynchedmafiaplayerX didn't shoot him. Does DP saying that a great plan for mafia is shitty make him scum? Yes/no? That is why we come to a consensus and make the people we lynch shoot specific targets. Can I assume for a minute that you are not dumb? Given your play in past games I think I can assume that. Why will mafia do what we tell them? If we all get together to lynch Cephero and he says he'll shoot artanis but really shoots marv how do we punish him for that? We don't. He is already dead. So why are you harping on this point. You haven't thought about this at all, have you? Play nice. That scenario removes the doubt from Cephiro's flip, which is a decently good thing. Given that we lynched him I'd say we're reasonably sure. I still think scum killing townie#1 and town knowing that dead guy=scum is > for scum than townie#4 being dead and town not knowing if dead=scum maybe that is just me though. However, he also states that he'd never mislynch Cephiro. Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 11:34 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 11:33 iamperfection wrote:On February 04 2014 11:32 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 11:29 marvellosity wrote:On February 04 2014 11:28 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 11:25 Holyflare wrote:On February 04 2014 11:23 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 11:19 marvellosity wrote:On February 04 2014 11:16 DarthPunk wrote:
[quote]
That is a fucking stupid plan if you are scum. Actually it's interesting and worth spending at least some thought on. Some time down the line you have player A and player B, both are suspicious and town is deciding between them. One mafia one townie. One is going to be lynched, the other will be vigged by the lynched player (seems a sensible play). Makes sense for the mafia in that situation to bus the mafia, so the mafia dies and doesn't flip, and the townie flips. Probably a better result for mafia than the townie not flipping and shooting the mafia who does flip. So it seems there's probably situations where bussing might be optimal for mafia It is actually a great plan for mafia. Even more than that the bussed mafia can shoot bigawesometownie1 and next day it is likely that town will lynch scummylookingtowniewhowasupforlynch since lynchedmafiaplayerX didn't shoot him. Does DP saying that a great plan for mafia is shitty make him scum? Yes/no? That is why we come to a consensus and make the people we lynch shoot specific targets. Can I assume for a minute that you are not dumb? Given your play in past games I think I can assume that. Why will mafia do what we tell them? If we all get together to lynch Cephero and he says he'll shoot artanis but really shoots marv how do we punish him for that? We don't. He is already dead. So why are you harping on this point. You haven't thought about this at all, have you? Play nice. That scenario removes the doubt from Cephiro's flip, which is a decently good thing. Given that we lynched him I'd say we're reasonably sure. I still think scum killing townie#1 and town knowing that dead guy=scum is > for scum than townie#4 being dead and town not knowing if dead=scum maybe that is just me though. wat !?! you never mislynch people? I've never mislynched cephero This presumably implies that he can read Cephiro quite well, to the ability that he wouldn't mislynch him. Yet, his stance on Cephiro becomes increasingly more different than Artanis: Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 11:37 Promethelax wrote:
yeah, I don't disagree. Your problem though is that scum will shoot said townies if/when we lynch them.
Right now I'd say marv/imp both looking townie to me.
Waiting to hear from Artanis as I don't have trouble reading him. Need some personal time with him to really 'get a feel' for things. Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 11:40 Promethelax wrote:
I find myself kinda into the idea of lynching Cephiro (I finally figured out how to spell it) basically only he and Rayn have not been here for the opening remarks and I've found the general pace and movement of this opening to be townie and interested. I'd be willing to lynch those who are not here. Ergo Cephiro/rayn.
He doesn't mislynch Cephiro, yet here we have him increasingly leaning more and more towards lynching him without even talking to him OR rayn. Like, I understand that the pace feels towny right now but why Cephiro over Rayn? Like there is a legitimate super focus on lynching Cephiro over Artanis who claimed mafia with no thread activity further or rayn who hasn't typed at all either. He "thinks" there is a mafia between rayn and cephiro based on the thread but if that's the case then he WOULDN'T want to lynch Cephiro based on what he's said before, he would want to vote a fringe towny (probably me based on his next post), yet this conclusion is seemingly absent: Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 11:50 Promethelax wrote:
While we sit around waiting for DP to sift through Art's filters shall we move this discussion away from Dp and towards HF? Yes, yes we shall.
Why did Holy just vanish, he was here excited to be playing but when things got hot he got out of the kitchen. He was here to claim a mindmeld and here to argue its validity but he hasn't provided anything new to the discussion. Is HF scum? Inside sources say yes. His only reasoning? That I vanished. Lol. Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 12:31 Promethelax wrote:
Sorry, that wasn't productive, mad at people who are not you.
two reasons
1: gut says people present are town for various reasons. I would bet good money that at least one of ceph/rayn are scum
2. it was a change of topic from the DP thinks Art is scum for something prome thinks is not alignment indicative. Amd I was/am bored with that topic. This is also an incoherent thought. If the people present are town then why is he mad at those people and displaying it in the thread? If there is a good chance of scum in cephiro/rayn then surely he should be happy that he's narrowed down the pool of potential scum to two?
I've never played with Cephiro, it was a joke.
And the people I was mad at were my girlfriend.
Your case is invalid.
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United Kingdom36161 Posts
Noone pushed Cephiro like crazy on Day 1.
And Cephiro was mine/yamato's lynch D2 but Mocsta fakeclaimed doctor to save him from the lynch.
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On February 04 2014 19:31 DarthPunk wrote:
##marv
You are voting based on your bruised ego, gave no reasoning for your votes, and have not made a case on either of the people you voted for based on events in the game.
marv is super obviously town. For meta reasons.
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On February 04 2014 19:49 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 19:46 marvellosity wrote:
How do I know? You just made some weird nitpicky thing about a post I made, and said Prome is mafia when he probably isn't. Very bleh. Yeah and you didn't even care to answer me. You said "mafia benefits from chaos and whatever shit", then you call DP out for it when it was clearly Holyflare who caused the thing in the first place. So yes, i want to know why it's only DP's "fault". And now you are being a bitch and doing the same thing here, and i have no fucking idea why.
I cared to fall asleep though.
Early game is early game. Like you I'm bored of DP going on about his bullshit with Artanis' entrance. I tried, halfheartedly, to change the direction of the conversation onto HF. This game has felt like one with an end day shennanie scum lynch. And the players who haven't done anything to strike me as townie are: HF/Rayn/Ceph/Art of those three I like Artanis most on a personal level and find him easiest to read (I have no idea how I would read Ceph as I've never played with him) so I'd rather like to lynch one of the other three guys.
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On February 05 2014 02:09 Promethelax wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 19:49 raynpelikoneet wrote:On February 04 2014 19:46 marvellosity wrote:
How do I know? You just made some weird nitpicky thing about a post I made, and said Prome is mafia when he probably isn't. Very bleh. Yeah and you didn't even care to answer me. You said "mafia benefits from chaos and whatever shit", then you call DP out for it when it was clearly Holyflare who caused the thing in the first place. So yes, i want to know why it's only DP's "fault". And now you are being a bitch and doing the same thing here, and i have no fucking idea why. I cared to fall asleep though. Early game is early game. Like you I'm bored of DP going on about his bullshit with Artanis' entrance. I tried, halfheartedly, to change the direction of the conversation onto HF. This game has felt like one with an end day shennanie scum lynch. And the players who haven't done anything to strike me as townie are: HF/Rayn/Ceph/Art of those three I like Artanis most on a personal level and find him easiest to read (I have no idea how I would read Ceph as I've never played with him) so I'd rather like to lynch one of the other three guys.
Bold and red don't really go together. Try again.
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On February 04 2014 19:59 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 19:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:On February 04 2014 19:54 DarthPunk wrote:On February 04 2014 19:51 raynpelikoneet wrote:
DarthPunk marv is not mafia. How do you figure? Because he just is not. Do you think he would do this shit as mafia? This is like fucking begging to get shot. Yeah i don't buy that . Why would town marv who usually is a reasonable sort of fellow would do what he just did? Doesn't make any sense. It was not pro town. It did not facilitate any sort of discussion, basically he made two shitty votes with no reasoning and then went on an ego rampage all over the place.
He would do that because you, the person, annoy him. As is clear from his posts about you in various thread recent;y. In pregame didn't he say "oh great, another thread with DP talking bollocks in it" not word for word but that was the general idea and here you are talking bullocks about him being scum when anyone who knows how to read marv knows he is town right now. This is the towniest filter I've seen from marv when he was playing under his main.
If you are allowed to unreasonably rage at people for not bowing to your whim about how they approach the game marv is also allowed to get mad at people for calling his scum play bad (i.e. easy to catch) and following that up by failing to find him town when he is obviously town.
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On February 04 2014 20:13 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 19:25 marvellosity wrote:
##unvote
##Vote: raynpelikoneet
8.raynpelikoneet
3.Holyflare
6.DarthPunk
5.WaveOfShadow
2.iamperfection
4.Promethelax
9.Cephiro
1.marvellosity
7.Artanis Revising this list 8.raynpelikoneet 4.Holyflare 3.DarthPunk 6.WaveOfShadow 2.iamperfection 5.Promethelax 9.Cephiro 1.marvellosity 7.Artanis DP ^ 3 places [/b]
waaaaaaaaaaaaait one hot second. Why in the name of the three headed money goddess is Cephiro 9 and Rayn 8 when you are sure Rayn is scum?
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Why not? Cephiro was defaulted to 9 because he hadn't posted. What a stupid question.
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On February 04 2014 21:15 marvellosity wrote:
If your accusation on him had included "but I think x or y (in this case Artanis) aren't townie, how can he think this" then I'd be more sympathetic, but you didn't say that - you made it into a general point, and as a general point it's meaningless.
There are three scum. I happen to think that marv/dp/iamp/wos are town as am I. So that leaves me with four players who could be scum and of them two have not posted. So I am pretty damn sure at least one of the two players who haven't posted are scum. I didn't spell it out earlier but it makes perfect sense. Why is this a hard concept to follow?
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On February 05 2014 02:20 Promethelax wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 21:15 marvellosity wrote:
If your accusation on him had included "but I think x or y (in this case Artanis) aren't townie, how can he think this" then I'd be more sympathetic, but you didn't say that - you made it into a general point, and as a general point it's meaningless. There are three scum. I happen to think that marv/dp/iamp/wos are town as am I. So that leaves me with four players who could be scum and of them two have not posted. So I am pretty damn sure at least one of the two players who haven't posted are scum. I didn't spell it out earlier but it makes perfect sense. Why is this a hard concept to follow?
Why are you quoting me here?
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Fucking fantastic. We can all go home, Prome solved the game in 6hours.
gg.
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On February 04 2014 23:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:Okay, so: 1) Artanis makes a lynch plan Prome assumedly finds pro-town. 2) Instead of commenting on that, or implying he finds this alignment indicative (more on that later) he posts this: Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 11:11 Promethelax wrote:
marv baby, talk to me about Artanis. Is his mafia claim in any way alignment indicative, I'm inclined to say no since well...that is dumb. I don't see him being more likely or less likely to post that as either alignment and until someone finds a quote saying "I would never claim scum as town" -artanis, I won't believe that to be a real reason to find him scummy. Now what's the motivation behind this post? Is it to find out more about Artanis? No, because Prome states his own opinion. Is to find out more about your (marv's) alignment? I find it hard to believe so, because why would he ask the question this way (give an answer) if he wanted to find out more about you marv. The only reason i can come up with is "hey what do you think so i know if i can use that against Artanis later on if needed". 3) After this Prome makes a same sort of plan (in different words) than Artanis made on step (1). Based on (2) i would think if someone comes up with a same like of suggestion you find pro town, you would give him town credit for it. Therefore it makes even less sense to me he asks you about if Artanis' scumclaim is alignment indicative or not (not to mention he himself does not find it alignment indicative).
Because WHAT marv says has nothing to do with how I read him it is all in the HOW he says things. He can have the answer written out for him, he knows the right answer as either alignment. That has NOTHING to do with it. It is how marv says things and sees things, not whether he can pull out the rote 'right' answer.
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Tell me, what had scum!marv said then?
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On February 04 2014 23:22 Cephiro wrote:
Back home and briefly read through the thread. I still have some things to take care of, so I will post my thoughts later on in the evening. I like the content available so far, although some back and forth's were taken too far and lost their usefulness in my opinion.
Automatic + for everyone that isn't rushing to get a lynch done too quickly.
SOMEONE HAS A WORSE OPENING POST THAN ME! I've never been so happy in my life.
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On February 05 2014 02:10 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2014 02:09 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 19:49 raynpelikoneet wrote:On February 04 2014 19:46 marvellosity wrote:
How do I know? You just made some weird nitpicky thing about a post I made, and said Prome is mafia when he probably isn't. Very bleh. Yeah and you didn't even care to answer me. You said "mafia benefits from chaos and whatever shit", then you call DP out for it when it was clearly Holyflare who caused the thing in the first place. So yes, i want to know why it's only DP's "fault". And now you are being a bitch and doing the same thing here, and i have no fucking idea why. I cared to fall asleep though. Early game is early game. Like you I'm bored of DP going on about his bullshit with Artanis' entrance. I tried, halfheartedly, to change the direction of the conversation onto HF. This game has felt like one with an end day shennanie scum lynch. And the players who haven't done anything to strike me as townie are: HF/Rayn/Ceph/Art of those three I like Artanis most on a personal level and find him easiest to read (I have no idea how I would read Ceph as I've never played with him) so I'd rather like to lynch one of the other three guys. Bold and red don't really go together. Try again.
I have not had the chance to read him yet so at this point I'd prefer not to lynch him.
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On February 05 2014 02:29 Promethelax wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2014 02:10 marvellosity wrote:On February 05 2014 02:09 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 19:49 raynpelikoneet wrote:On February 04 2014 19:46 marvellosity wrote:
How do I know? You just made some weird nitpicky thing about a post I made, and said Prome is mafia when he probably isn't. Very bleh. Yeah and you didn't even care to answer me. You said "mafia benefits from chaos and whatever shit", then you call DP out for it when it was clearly Holyflare who caused the thing in the first place. So yes, i want to know why it's only DP's "fault". And now you are being a bitch and doing the same thing here, and i have no fucking idea why. I cared to fall asleep though. Early game is early game. Like you I'm bored of DP going on about his bullshit with Artanis' entrance. I tried, halfheartedly, to change the direction of the conversation onto HF. This game has felt like one with an end day shennanie scum lynch. And the players who haven't done anything to strike me as townie are: HF/Rayn/Ceph/Art of those three I like Artanis most on a personal level and find him easiest to read (I have no idea how I would read Ceph as I've never played with him) so I'd rather like to lynch one of the other three guys. Bold and red don't really go together. Try again. I have not had the chance to read him yet so at this point I'd prefer not to lynch him.
Probably better to read people before offering opinions on who you want to lynch, hmm darling?
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On February 05 2014 02:21 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2014 02:20 Promethelax wrote:On February 04 2014 21:15 marvellosity wrote:
If your accusation on him had included "but I think x or y (in this case Artanis) aren't townie, how can he think this" then I'd be more sympathetic, but you didn't say that - you made it into a general point, and as a general point it's meaningless. There are three scum. I happen to think that marv/dp/iamp/wos are town as am I. So that leaves me with four players who could be scum and of them two have not posted. So I am pretty damn sure at least one of the two players who haven't posted are scum. I didn't spell it out earlier but it makes perfect sense. Why is this a hard concept to follow? Why are you quoting me here?
I was ignoring this idea from you/rayn but finally saw enough posts about it to be worth responding. Grabbed your post because it was in front of me when I decided the idead was worth responding to.
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EPT
