• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 00:39
CEST 06:39
KST 13:39
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun13[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt1: Inheritors16[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt2: All Star10Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists22[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9
Community News
RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event8Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results02026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers25Maestros of the Game 2 announced92026 GSL Tour plans announced15
StarCraft 2
General
Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool MaNa leaves Team Liquid
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) SC2 INu's Battles#15 <BO.9 2Matches> WardiTV Spring Cup SEL Masters #6 - Solar vs Classic (SC: Evo)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 523 Firewall Mutation # 522 Flip My Base Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss
Brood War
General
ASL21 General Discussion Why there arent any 256x256 pro maps? BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion Pros React To: Leta vs Tulbo (ASL S21, Ro.8)
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro8 Day 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [BSL22] RO16 Group Stage - 02 - 10 May
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend?
Other Games
General Games
Dawn of War IV Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Daigo vs Menard Best of 10 Diablo IV
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread 3D technology/software discussion Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
streaming software Strange computer issues (software) [G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Sexual Health Of Gamers
TrAiDoS
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1303 users

Chrono Trigger Mafia - Page 259

Forum Index > TL Mafia
Post a Reply
Prev 1 257 258 259 260 261 384 Next
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
November 30 2012 15:48 GMT
#5161
why did you vote yourself in the first place?
No gg, No skill.
goodkarma
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States1067 Posts
November 30 2012 15:49 GMT
#5162
On December 01 2012 00:19 phagga wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 30 2012 09:21 Hapahauli wrote:
GK saw Sandro as town. If GK were scum, he would at least know that Sandro is not scum. GK wants to have sandro in his team. I don't like the reasoning of GK, I think its contradicting. I therefore make the hypothesis that if GK is scum, he takes Sandro (whom he knows not to be scum) on his team to look more townie. That's the whole story. I did not say anywhere in that post that I think that Sandro is town.

Hell, i even write one paragraph earlier: " If GK thinks Sandro is so townie that you includes him in your team" (it should actually say "you" instead of "GK", but whatever).


What about GK's previous analysis was "contradictory?" He wanted someone he thought was town on his team - that's pretty straightfoward to me.


Ok, let's do this right so we can hopefully close that topic. I want to put this into relation of the dialog I already had with GK at that point and how I felt about GK then. Context matters, after all.

So let's start with what Goodkarma wrote here:

Show nested quote +
On November 21 2012 13:06 goodkarma wrote:
Who I would nominate (if not myself):

As of right now, my support for a party leader (besides myself) would be sandroba.

Sandroba seems to be adopting a solid strategy at present. I wholeheartedly agree with going with the most townie individuals, even if they are inexperienced. We don't know how the minigames are going to work yet, but we do know with 100% certainty that scum will count against their success. In a game where we don't lynch, all we can do is establish who is actually town. It is absolutely ridiculous to nominate people who have both strong scum and town games and are hard to read day one (thinking of Marv).

I also completely agree with the suggestion that's been brought up that parties be suggested by those who are hoping to be nominated up-front. This is especially important if we are to nominate a townie who isn't as experienced.


Goodkarma for President:

As your leader, I will do my best to further the policy of choosing the most obvious townies as detailed above. Along those lines, I would elect to choose both sandroba and promethelax for my party. The third is still tentative, as the game has only been going for a short time.


So, in this very post he says that he would support Sandro because he adopts a solid strategy. Then he proposes himself as party leader and says he would take Sandroba on his team. I found this strange, which is why I asked him:

Show nested quote +
On November 21 2012 15:59 phagga wrote:
You would vote Sandroba because you think his strategy is solid. His strategy involves taking less known townies on the team and no additional vets, to make it harder for scum to decide who to snipe. Your Strategy however would be to take at least one vet and a well known, albeit newer town player to your team. Why?


His answer

Show nested quote +
On November 21 2012 17:07 goodkarma wrote:
I agree with Sandroba insofar as that lesser known players that are obvious townies should be strongly considered. However, at the end of the day, going with your three strongest town reads is going to be optimal for selecting a party. Unfortunately I, like several other players here, have somewhat of a bias at times towards prioritizing players that we have played with before. It could also be said that less experienced players are more likely to post like crap and not distinguish themselves as town than "vets" (look at deino). So there might be some unintentional bias towards vets (which is something I would try to avoid to the best of my ability). To be clear I will definitely be reassessing my read on Prox (as well as Sandroba) before making a finalized Vice Presidential Candidate trifecta.

I don't feel it's absolutely necessary that all three chosen members are townie looking newbies. I feel that the chosen members should be closest to 100% confirmed town, and that newbies should not be left out of consideration. Maybe there is a small difference between myself and Sandroba in this area. That's good for my election campaign I suppose...


So, he explains he has a slightly different plan than Sandro. Fair enough. Still, I wondered, why would anyone who has a town read on Sandro would vote Goodkarma instead of Sandroba, when Sandroba was running for party leader himself? After all, he is the vet, the well known scumhunter who was drawing votes with his name alone. Why would GK expect to be voted instead of Sandroba when his team contained Sandroba as well?

I also have a short discussion with GK about town/scumhunting here. After that I write the following:

Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 07:04 phagga wrote:
- Goodkarma: I will have to go through his filter again (not in the next 10 hours though), but my gut currently says that he is talking too much about the importance of townhunting. I have him in my mind as "looks like he is contributing but is not really helping town". Do not want him on the party.


I do not call him scum. I voice my suspicion of him. Some later, Goodkarma posts this:

Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 15:10 goodkarma wrote:
3) Sandroba: However much I feel he's playing lazy (he is), I keep coming back to his filter. I do currently believe that he is town. Everything he has done to date has been to provide clarity and insight into reads others have had and the general mechanics of this specific game. He could do this as scum, but I am inclined to believe he could have been a little less helpful and gotten away with it as scum as well. I look forward to seeing his proposed party as this will provide the information I need to help solidify my understanding of his thought process and determine if he truly belongs on this platform. But as it currently stands, I believe him to be town, and am including him on my platform.


And again, I wonder, why should anyone vote GK instead of Sandroba if GK is gonna take Sand on his team anyway. Their plans differ only slightly, and most people would probably trust a town sand more to make accurate reads than a town GK.

I was then writing a longer post about who I wanted as party leader and why. Somewhere in there was this part about Goodkarma and that I did not understand why he was voting Sandroba. Then I realised that it might be better to ask GK beforehand, show that I don't trust him and then post the longer post. Additionally, I wanted to show him where I came from with my suspiciouns and added that "What do you say about this:" part. However, it was meant to draw a reaction, i did not have a scum read on him at that point, I just wanted to see how he responded. So I posted this:

Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 18:52 phagga wrote:
@Goodkarma

If you trust Sandro so much, why do you not vote him? If GK thinks Sandro is so townie that you includes him in your team, why should I vote you instead of Sandro?

What do you say to the following: You are scum, you include a town sandro to make his team more townie, hoping to catch more votes like that.


Also, after copying the short paragraph in a new post, I started changing the sentences from third person to second person (as I was going to ask GK directly instead of talking about him in 3rd person). I made an error in the second sentence of the first paragraph (it should be "if you think Sandro..."). The reason is that I was doing this in a hurry, I was at work. I had already typed this long post that I wanted to put online, so I hurried to get this short post about GK out. Perhaps that is a reason why I did not word it clear enough, which is possibly why you seem to interpret it as "phagga says GK is scum and Sandro is town", while in reality it was supposed to be a hypothetical question that
- should provoke a reaction of GK
- should show GK what my fear about his candidature was

Then, 3 minutes later, I posted the aforementioned big post, where I discussed who I wanted to vote and why.

So, I admit, contradiction is the wrong word. His candidature did not make any sense to me with Sandroba in his team. Also, I know I am not the only one who felt that way, look at this post from prom for example, or risks post here.



So you consider rehashing old arguements I've already addressed activity? You do know Hapa has a case against you, and you are continuing to behave as scum in the way highlighted in that case, right? + Show Spoiler +
(Not coming up with any new arguement of any kind. Attacking "safe" players who already have cases against them...)
Clarity_nl
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands6826 Posts
November 30 2012 15:51 GMT
#5163
GK, I said we should ignore you voting for yourself. I didn't say we should ignore you entirely.
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT AGAINST STUPIDITY CLARITY, I BELIEVE IN YOU! - Palmar
goodkarma
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States1067 Posts
November 30 2012 15:56 GMT
#5164
On December 01 2012 00:48 Oatsmaster wrote:
why did you vote yourself in the first place?


As I just said, I was frustrated with this game. I was thinking that after I flip town, people would finally get their acts together. As in, consider what I've just presented: what is (at least in my humble opinion) a rather definitive writeup showing exactly why phagga and strong are scum (by process of elimination: their actions are scummy, and nearly everyone else can be pegged as 3rd party or town).

If people won't let me contribute by actually considering what I tell them, then death is my greatest contribution... At least that was my line of thought at the time.
goodkarma
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States1067 Posts
November 30 2012 15:57 GMT
#5165
On December 01 2012 00:51 Clarity_nl wrote:
GK, I said we should ignore you voting for yourself. I didn't say we should ignore you entirely.


Great. Please comment on my case.
phagga
Profile Joined February 2012
Switzerland2194 Posts
November 30 2012 16:09 GMT
#5166
On December 01 2012 00:49 goodkarma wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2012 00:19 phagga wrote:
On November 30 2012 09:21 Hapahauli wrote:
GK saw Sandro as town. If GK were scum, he would at least know that Sandro is not scum. GK wants to have sandro in his team. I don't like the reasoning of GK, I think its contradicting. I therefore make the hypothesis that if GK is scum, he takes Sandro (whom he knows not to be scum) on his team to look more townie. That's the whole story. I did not say anywhere in that post that I think that Sandro is town.

Hell, i even write one paragraph earlier: " If GK thinks Sandro is so townie that you includes him in your team" (it should actually say "you" instead of "GK", but whatever).


What about GK's previous analysis was "contradictory?" He wanted someone he thought was town on his team - that's pretty straightfoward to me.


Ok, let's do this right so we can hopefully close that topic. I want to put this into relation of the dialog I already had with GK at that point and how I felt about GK then. Context matters, after all.

So let's start with what Goodkarma wrote here:

On November 21 2012 13:06 goodkarma wrote:
Who I would nominate (if not myself):

As of right now, my support for a party leader (besides myself) would be sandroba.

Sandroba seems to be adopting a solid strategy at present. I wholeheartedly agree with going with the most townie individuals, even if they are inexperienced. We don't know how the minigames are going to work yet, but we do know with 100% certainty that scum will count against their success. In a game where we don't lynch, all we can do is establish who is actually town. It is absolutely ridiculous to nominate people who have both strong scum and town games and are hard to read day one (thinking of Marv).

I also completely agree with the suggestion that's been brought up that parties be suggested by those who are hoping to be nominated up-front. This is especially important if we are to nominate a townie who isn't as experienced.


Goodkarma for President:

As your leader, I will do my best to further the policy of choosing the most obvious townies as detailed above. Along those lines, I would elect to choose both sandroba and promethelax for my party. The third is still tentative, as the game has only been going for a short time.


So, in this very post he says that he would support Sandro because he adopts a solid strategy. Then he proposes himself as party leader and says he would take Sandroba on his team. I found this strange, which is why I asked him:

On November 21 2012 15:59 phagga wrote:
You would vote Sandroba because you think his strategy is solid. His strategy involves taking less known townies on the team and no additional vets, to make it harder for scum to decide who to snipe. Your Strategy however would be to take at least one vet and a well known, albeit newer town player to your team. Why?


His answer

On November 21 2012 17:07 goodkarma wrote:
I agree with Sandroba insofar as that lesser known players that are obvious townies should be strongly considered. However, at the end of the day, going with your three strongest town reads is going to be optimal for selecting a party. Unfortunately I, like several other players here, have somewhat of a bias at times towards prioritizing players that we have played with before. It could also be said that less experienced players are more likely to post like crap and not distinguish themselves as town than "vets" (look at deino). So there might be some unintentional bias towards vets (which is something I would try to avoid to the best of my ability). To be clear I will definitely be reassessing my read on Prox (as well as Sandroba) before making a finalized Vice Presidential Candidate trifecta.

I don't feel it's absolutely necessary that all three chosen members are townie looking newbies. I feel that the chosen members should be closest to 100% confirmed town, and that newbies should not be left out of consideration. Maybe there is a small difference between myself and Sandroba in this area. That's good for my election campaign I suppose...


So, he explains he has a slightly different plan than Sandro. Fair enough. Still, I wondered, why would anyone who has a town read on Sandro would vote Goodkarma instead of Sandroba, when Sandroba was running for party leader himself? After all, he is the vet, the well known scumhunter who was drawing votes with his name alone. Why would GK expect to be voted instead of Sandroba when his team contained Sandroba as well?

I also have a short discussion with GK about town/scumhunting here. After that I write the following:

On November 22 2012 07:04 phagga wrote:
- Goodkarma: I will have to go through his filter again (not in the next 10 hours though), but my gut currently says that he is talking too much about the importance of townhunting. I have him in my mind as "looks like he is contributing but is not really helping town". Do not want him on the party.


I do not call him scum. I voice my suspicion of him. Some later, Goodkarma posts this:

On November 22 2012 15:10 goodkarma wrote:
3) Sandroba: However much I feel he's playing lazy (he is), I keep coming back to his filter. I do currently believe that he is town. Everything he has done to date has been to provide clarity and insight into reads others have had and the general mechanics of this specific game. He could do this as scum, but I am inclined to believe he could have been a little less helpful and gotten away with it as scum as well. I look forward to seeing his proposed party as this will provide the information I need to help solidify my understanding of his thought process and determine if he truly belongs on this platform. But as it currently stands, I believe him to be town, and am including him on my platform.


And again, I wonder, why should anyone vote GK instead of Sandroba if GK is gonna take Sand on his team anyway. Their plans differ only slightly, and most people would probably trust a town sand more to make accurate reads than a town GK.

I was then writing a longer post about who I wanted as party leader and why. Somewhere in there was this part about Goodkarma and that I did not understand why he was voting Sandroba. Then I realised that it might be better to ask GK beforehand, show that I don't trust him and then post the longer post. Additionally, I wanted to show him where I came from with my suspiciouns and added that "What do you say about this:" part. However, it was meant to draw a reaction, i did not have a scum read on him at that point, I just wanted to see how he responded. So I posted this:

On November 22 2012 18:52 phagga wrote:
@Goodkarma

If you trust Sandro so much, why do you not vote him? If GK thinks Sandro is so townie that you includes him in your team, why should I vote you instead of Sandro?

What do you say to the following: You are scum, you include a town sandro to make his team more townie, hoping to catch more votes like that.


Also, after copying the short paragraph in a new post, I started changing the sentences from third person to second person (as I was going to ask GK directly instead of talking about him in 3rd person). I made an error in the second sentence of the first paragraph (it should be "if you think Sandro..."). The reason is that I was doing this in a hurry, I was at work. I had already typed this long post that I wanted to put online, so I hurried to get this short post about GK out. Perhaps that is a reason why I did not word it clear enough, which is possibly why you seem to interpret it as "phagga says GK is scum and Sandro is town", while in reality it was supposed to be a hypothetical question that
- should provoke a reaction of GK
- should show GK what my fear about his candidature was

Then, 3 minutes later, I posted the aforementioned big post, where I discussed who I wanted to vote and why.

So, I admit, contradiction is the wrong word. His candidature did not make any sense to me with Sandroba in his team. Also, I know I am not the only one who felt that way, look at this post from prom for example, or risks post here.



So you consider rehashing old arguements I've already addressed activity? You do know Hapa has a case against you, and you are continuing to behave as scum in the way highlighted in that case, right? + Show Spoiler +
(Not coming up with any new arguement of any kind. Attacking "safe" players who already have cases against them...)
eh, I was answering a question hapa asked me. Since when is that a bad thing? Are you actually reading what I post?

(posting from phone)
"A person who does not concern himself with politics has already made the political choice he was so anxious to spare himself: he is serving the ruling party." - Max Frisch
phagga
Profile Joined February 2012
Switzerland2194 Posts
November 30 2012 16:11 GMT
#5167
Ebwop I hope you see the irony in your answer to me. That post of yours was just ridiculous.
"A person who does not concern himself with politics has already made the political choice he was so anxious to spare himself: he is serving the ruling party." - Max Frisch
phagga
Profile Joined February 2012
Switzerland2194 Posts
November 30 2012 16:19 GMT
#5168
Just a thought: is it possible that scum has an ability to reverse the voting list? Meaning the guy with the least votes gets llynched/leader?
"A person who does not concern himself with politics has already made the political choice he was so anxious to spare himself: he is serving the ruling party." - Max Frisch
Clarity_nl
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands6826 Posts
November 30 2012 16:20 GMT
#5169
Seems way too overpowered.
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT AGAINST STUPIDITY CLARITY, I BELIEVE IN YOU! - Palmar
iamperfection
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9645 Posts
November 30 2012 16:25 GMT
#5170
On December 01 2012 01:19 phagga wrote:
Just a thought: is it possible that scum has an ability to reverse the voting list? Meaning the guy with the least votes gets llynched/leader?

dont even see how that would work what would you do with all the people with 0 votes?
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=406168&currentpage=78#1551
phagga
Profile Joined February 2012
Switzerland2194 Posts
November 30 2012 16:32 GMT
#5171
On December 01 2012 01:25 iamperfection wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2012 01:19 phagga wrote:
Just a thought: is it possible that scum has an ability to reverse the voting list? Meaning the guy with the least votes gets llynched/leader?

dont even see how that would work what would you do with all the people with 0 votes?

Ignore them, probably? I dont know, it is just something that came to my mind while pondering about the game. That is why I ask you guys about your opinion. Might be i am just too paranoid.
"A person who does not concern himself with politics has already made the political choice he was so anxious to spare himself: he is serving the ruling party." - Max Frisch
goodkarma
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States1067 Posts
November 30 2012 16:34 GMT
#5172
On December 01 2012 01:09 phagga wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2012 00:49 goodkarma wrote:
On December 01 2012 00:19 phagga wrote:
On November 30 2012 09:21 Hapahauli wrote:
GK saw Sandro as town. If GK were scum, he would at least know that Sandro is not scum. GK wants to have sandro in his team. I don't like the reasoning of GK, I think its contradicting. I therefore make the hypothesis that if GK is scum, he takes Sandro (whom he knows not to be scum) on his team to look more townie. That's the whole story. I did not say anywhere in that post that I think that Sandro is town.

Hell, i even write one paragraph earlier: " If GK thinks Sandro is so townie that you includes him in your team" (it should actually say "you" instead of "GK", but whatever).


What about GK's previous analysis was "contradictory?" He wanted someone he thought was town on his team - that's pretty straightfoward to me.


Ok, let's do this right so we can hopefully close that topic. I want to put this into relation of the dialog I already had with GK at that point and how I felt about GK then. Context matters, after all.

So let's start with what Goodkarma wrote here:

On November 21 2012 13:06 goodkarma wrote:
Who I would nominate (if not myself):

As of right now, my support for a party leader (besides myself) would be sandroba.

Sandroba seems to be adopting a solid strategy at present. I wholeheartedly agree with going with the most townie individuals, even if they are inexperienced. We don't know how the minigames are going to work yet, but we do know with 100% certainty that scum will count against their success. In a game where we don't lynch, all we can do is establish who is actually town. It is absolutely ridiculous to nominate people who have both strong scum and town games and are hard to read day one (thinking of Marv).

I also completely agree with the suggestion that's been brought up that parties be suggested by those who are hoping to be nominated up-front. This is especially important if we are to nominate a townie who isn't as experienced.


Goodkarma for President:

As your leader, I will do my best to further the policy of choosing the most obvious townies as detailed above. Along those lines, I would elect to choose both sandroba and promethelax for my party. The third is still tentative, as the game has only been going for a short time.


So, in this very post he says that he would support Sandro because he adopts a solid strategy. Then he proposes himself as party leader and says he would take Sandroba on his team. I found this strange, which is why I asked him:

On November 21 2012 15:59 phagga wrote:
You would vote Sandroba because you think his strategy is solid. His strategy involves taking less known townies on the team and no additional vets, to make it harder for scum to decide who to snipe. Your Strategy however would be to take at least one vet and a well known, albeit newer town player to your team. Why?


His answer

On November 21 2012 17:07 goodkarma wrote:
I agree with Sandroba insofar as that lesser known players that are obvious townies should be strongly considered. However, at the end of the day, going with your three strongest town reads is going to be optimal for selecting a party. Unfortunately I, like several other players here, have somewhat of a bias at times towards prioritizing players that we have played with before. It could also be said that less experienced players are more likely to post like crap and not distinguish themselves as town than "vets" (look at deino). So there might be some unintentional bias towards vets (which is something I would try to avoid to the best of my ability). To be clear I will definitely be reassessing my read on Prox (as well as Sandroba) before making a finalized Vice Presidential Candidate trifecta.

I don't feel it's absolutely necessary that all three chosen members are townie looking newbies. I feel that the chosen members should be closest to 100% confirmed town, and that newbies should not be left out of consideration. Maybe there is a small difference between myself and Sandroba in this area. That's good for my election campaign I suppose...


So, he explains he has a slightly different plan than Sandro. Fair enough. Still, I wondered, why would anyone who has a town read on Sandro would vote Goodkarma instead of Sandroba, when Sandroba was running for party leader himself? After all, he is the vet, the well known scumhunter who was drawing votes with his name alone. Why would GK expect to be voted instead of Sandroba when his team contained Sandroba as well?

I also have a short discussion with GK about town/scumhunting here. After that I write the following:

On November 22 2012 07:04 phagga wrote:
- Goodkarma: I will have to go through his filter again (not in the next 10 hours though), but my gut currently says that he is talking too much about the importance of townhunting. I have him in my mind as "looks like he is contributing but is not really helping town". Do not want him on the party.


I do not call him scum. I voice my suspicion of him. Some later, Goodkarma posts this:

On November 22 2012 15:10 goodkarma wrote:
3) Sandroba: However much I feel he's playing lazy (he is), I keep coming back to his filter. I do currently believe that he is town. Everything he has done to date has been to provide clarity and insight into reads others have had and the general mechanics of this specific game. He could do this as scum, but I am inclined to believe he could have been a little less helpful and gotten away with it as scum as well. I look forward to seeing his proposed party as this will provide the information I need to help solidify my understanding of his thought process and determine if he truly belongs on this platform. But as it currently stands, I believe him to be town, and am including him on my platform.


And again, I wonder, why should anyone vote GK instead of Sandroba if GK is gonna take Sand on his team anyway. Their plans differ only slightly, and most people would probably trust a town sand more to make accurate reads than a town GK.

I was then writing a longer post about who I wanted as party leader and why. Somewhere in there was this part about Goodkarma and that I did not understand why he was voting Sandroba. Then I realised that it might be better to ask GK beforehand, show that I don't trust him and then post the longer post. Additionally, I wanted to show him where I came from with my suspiciouns and added that "What do you say about this:" part. However, it was meant to draw a reaction, i did not have a scum read on him at that point, I just wanted to see how he responded. So I posted this:

On November 22 2012 18:52 phagga wrote:
@Goodkarma

If you trust Sandro so much, why do you not vote him? If GK thinks Sandro is so townie that you includes him in your team, why should I vote you instead of Sandro?

What do you say to the following: You are scum, you include a town sandro to make his team more townie, hoping to catch more votes like that.


Also, after copying the short paragraph in a new post, I started changing the sentences from third person to second person (as I was going to ask GK directly instead of talking about him in 3rd person). I made an error in the second sentence of the first paragraph (it should be "if you think Sandro..."). The reason is that I was doing this in a hurry, I was at work. I had already typed this long post that I wanted to put online, so I hurried to get this short post about GK out. Perhaps that is a reason why I did not word it clear enough, which is possibly why you seem to interpret it as "phagga says GK is scum and Sandro is town", while in reality it was supposed to be a hypothetical question that
- should provoke a reaction of GK
- should show GK what my fear about his candidature was

Then, 3 minutes later, I posted the aforementioned big post, where I discussed who I wanted to vote and why.

So, I admit, contradiction is the wrong word. His candidature did not make any sense to me with Sandroba in his team. Also, I know I am not the only one who felt that way, look at this post from prom for example, or risks post here.



So you consider rehashing old arguements I've already addressed activity? You do know Hapa has a case against you, and you are continuing to behave as scum in the way highlighted in that case, right? + Show Spoiler +
(Not coming up with any new arguement of any kind. Attacking "safe" players who already have cases against them...)
eh, I was answering a question hapa asked me. Since when is that a bad thing? Are you actually reading what I post?

(posting from phone)


Does it matter who it was in reply to? It's rehashing arguments all the same...

Here's a thought: Besides me (and obviously Toad), who do you think has the highest chance of being scum and why?
iamperfection
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9645 Posts
November 30 2012 16:36 GMT
#5173
anyways gk you suggested that phagga is continuing his "making cases on easy targets".

My comment is that i dont really see how this is problem with this state of the game since it has been somewhat determined who is town and third party through verifiable claims and strong meta reads. I dont see how this is a scum tell at this point in the game.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=406168&currentpage=78#1551
iamperfection
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9645 Posts
November 30 2012 16:37 GMT
#5174
he said hopeless gk
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=406168&currentpage=78#1551
Dienosore
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Brunei Darussalam622 Posts
November 30 2012 16:41 GMT
#5175
On December 01 2012 00:44 goodkarma wrote:
Stop and think for a second: As scum: Do you seriously think that I would make a detailed list post highlighting all my reads in this game? This would give you an abundance of information if I were to flip scum, and that just isn't my scumgame... Further, that's way more effort than I put into my scum game...

Seriously. Get your head out of your ass and spend a few seconds to consider the merits of my writeup.


Except you fail to mention that you put that exact same list in the mason qt before you posted it here. Now, I'm not sure why you felt the need to throw all that info to the public? Giving cases on scum is fine, but copy/pasting your notepad list of reads on half of the people of the game just doesn't make sense to me... Maybe you were scared Syllo was going to expose it, and so you decided to post here in the forums before he did as a bit of damage control?
iamperfection
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9645 Posts
November 30 2012 16:42 GMT
#5176
On December 01 2012 01:41 Dienosore wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2012 00:44 goodkarma wrote:
Stop and think for a second: As scum: Do you seriously think that I would make a detailed list post highlighting all my reads in this game? This would give you an abundance of information if I were to flip scum, and that just isn't my scumgame... Further, that's way more effort than I put into my scum game...

Seriously. Get your head out of your ass and spend a few seconds to consider the merits of my writeup.


Except you fail to mention that you put that exact same list in the mason qt before you posted it here. Now, I'm not sure why you felt the need to throw all that info to the public? Giving cases on scum is fine, but copy/pasting your notepad list of reads on half of the people of the game just doesn't make sense to me... Maybe you were scared Syllo was going to expose it, and so you decided to post here in the forums before he did as a bit of damage control?

when did he post it in the qt?
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=406168&currentpage=78#1551
Dienosore
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Brunei Darussalam622 Posts
November 30 2012 16:49 GMT
#5177
In the QT:
goodkarma
11-27-2012
07:13 PM ET (US)

On TL:
November 28 2012 09:57
goodkarma
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States1067 Posts
November 30 2012 17:05 GMT
#5178
On December 01 2012 01:37 iamperfection wrote:
he said hopeless gk


I almost missed it. He linked to a very old case on Hopeless about a page ago... Let's take a look at it:

On November 29 2012 01:32 phagga wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 28 2012 22:23 strongandbig wrote:
Now, phagga I have a couple of questions for you:
1. As far as I can tell, you changed your mind on your scumread on goodkarma because of the timing of his vote on Sandroba. Could you update that read for us? Given that Sandroba never really responded to Syllo's case or made a real effort to not get himself lynched, I'm hesitant to draw any conclusions from who voted for him when. It's definitely possible that his teammates knew he wasn't going to try very hard, and started bussing him very early. So if you ignore gk's vote on sandro, do you still think he's town or do you want to lynch him again.
2. You said you object to hopeless being in the party. do you think he's scum? What do you think of my stuff on his behavior since the check on him and acro?
3. What is kitaman's alignment and why do you think that?

-snip-

2. I remember going over Hopeless' filter a few days ago and setting him null on my list. Then Hope came up with this strange theorie about what if Toad flips town, followed by TC saying that Acro and Hope are of opposite alignement. Then he wanted to be part of the party to show that he is town, which was a red flag for me. Since then he is marked as scum.

Regarding your post, I like the point about his sentence that he will not bring any last minute shenanigans. I mean, this is what everyone expects, why does he feel he has to announce this? seems like he is missing a townie mindest.

The "Bring it, bitches" is interesting because he first takes a defensive stance in his answers to TCs case, but then tries to look aggressive with that last sentence. It does not seem authentic, but I don't think it's alignement indicative.

-snip-




This only adds to the evidence this guy is scum. It is super-lazy to use this as your case. What's more, it was a case he didn't have any conviction with describing. I'm not at all convinced from his case he thinks hopeless is scum.:

Let's start with the bolded part.: The opposite alignment issue was already explained. And wanting to be in a party at this point in the game would be suicide for scum. So that only leaves a strange remark about Toad being town...


Second paragraph: "Regarding your post, I like the point about his sentence that he will not bring any last minute shenanigans. I mean, this is what everyone expects, why does he feel he has to announce this? seems like he is missing a townie mindest.":

How is a "no shenanigans" announcement indicative of only a scum mentality? He needs to elaborate on this point...


Third Paragraph: "The "Bring it, bitches" is interesting because he first takes a defensive stance in his answers to TCs case, but then tries to look aggressive with that last sentence. It does not seem authentic, but I don't think it's alignement indicative. "

So here, he's saying that what hopeless says isn't genuine, but isn't necessarily scum motivated. In other words, he tells us nothing.


So what I get from this post that amounts to any kind of opinion at all is: 1) Hopeless said Toad could be town once, 2) Announcing no shennanigans means Hopeless is scum...

Does everyone see how wishy-washy and weak this case is? This is exactly how a scum trying to blend in posts. It is blatantly obvious from stunts like this that phagga is scum.
iamperfection
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9645 Posts
November 30 2012 17:11 GMT
#5179
ok so whats the deal with the qt reads and only sharing them just recently.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=406168&currentpage=78#1551
goodkarma
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States1067 Posts
November 30 2012 17:14 GMT
#5180
On December 01 2012 01:41 Dienosore wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2012 00:44 goodkarma wrote:
Stop and think for a second: As scum: Do you seriously think that I would make a detailed list post highlighting all my reads in this game? This would give you an abundance of information if I were to flip scum, and that just isn't my scumgame... Further, that's way more effort than I put into my scum game...

Seriously. Get your head out of your ass and spend a few seconds to consider the merits of my writeup.


Except you fail to mention that you put that exact same list in the mason qt before you posted it here. Now, I'm not sure why you felt the need to throw all that info to the public? Giving cases on scum is fine, but copy/pasting your notepad list of reads on half of the people of the game just doesn't make sense to me... Maybe you were scared Syllo was going to expose it, and so you decided to post here in the forums before he did as a bit of damage control?



In other words: I threw out a lot of my thoughts into the forums that day without really editing them... Exactly as I previously described.
Prev 1 257 258 259 260 261 384 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
2026 GSL S1: Ro12 Group B
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 133
StarCraft: Brood War
Icarus 9
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm122
League of Legends
JimRising 720
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King82
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor128
Other Games
summit1g5141
WinterStarcraft401
monkeys_forever386
PiGStarcraft183
C9.Mang063
ViBE49
UpATreeSC44
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick557
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream53
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 31
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• practicex 47
• Sammyuel 35
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• RayReign 41
• Azhi_Dahaki10
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo1861
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
5h 21m
herO vs TriGGeR
NightMare vs Solar
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
9h 21m
BSL
14h 21m
IPSL
14h 21m
eOnzErG vs TBD
G5 vs Nesh
Patches Events
19h 21m
Replay Cast
1d 4h
Wardi Open
1d 5h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 5h
Jaedong vs Light
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 11h
Replay Cast
1d 19h
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Snow vs Flash
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
GSL
3 days
Classic vs Cure
Maru vs Rogue
GSL
4 days
SHIN vs Zoun
ByuN vs herO
OSC
4 days
OSC
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Escore
5 days
The PondCast
5 days
WardiTV Invitational
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
SHIN vs Bunny
ByuN vs Shameless
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
BSL
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W5
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
KK 2v2 League Season 1
Acropolis #4
SCTL 2026 Spring
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.