EPTiGrok's Good Clean Old-fashioned Mafia - Page 30
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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GreYMisT
United States6736 Posts
On June 14 2012 00:31 VisceraEyes wrote: FWIW GreY, I read the bolded as "Because Radfield, someone who is supporting Palmar, is here, Palmar isn't going to be lynched. Because this is something I'd like to avoid (because Palmar is my lynch of chocie) I'm leaving my vote on Palmar" If that is what he meant that is still weird. Its basically him saying I prefer my vote not to matter. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
Everyone's vote matters, whether they're voting with the majority or not. | ||
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gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
chaoser is absent from the discussion for now, and I'd like him to chime in. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
On June 14 2012 03:15 VisceraEyes wrote: So what do you say to Palmar's accusations against you gonzaw? They are shit so I'll ignore them. | ||
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Mr. Wiggles
Canada5894 Posts
On June 13 2012 12:11 chaoser wrote: How do I generally start off games? I post "Blank is mafia, let's lynch him". This worked well for me for a while after that game I fakeclaimed DT but now it no longer works. When radfield jokingly suggested RNG and then Ace backed it up I figured it was a good way to pressure. I think palmar explained it really well and is kind of what I was going for in my post about why I started off talking about RNG but didn't really get across at all with my "it provides an amazing amount of pressure" Palmar's: Notice the part where he talks about settling it early, which is why I asked palmar to do RNG before the first 24 hours was up. I couldn't explain in thread at all as palmar points out so that's why I told radfield: The VE/gonzaw vanilla towny/vanilla townie was actually just an over reaction on my part and once I realized no one else was bothered by it, I knew it was a false reading on my part. When I first saw VE claim vanilla townie and then gonzaw counterclaim it as vanilla towny, I though I had caught them on something huge since I was taking both their posts seriously. The OP allows for me to post my PM so I'll do it to explain: Vanilla towny/townie/anything like that is never mentioned in the PM and so I was like wtf...did VE mess up and gonzaw caught him on it or did VE bait with it and then gonzaw got caught and was very confused. I don't remember right now but after a few minutes of thinking, I ended up reasoning out that the most suspicious person in that interaction was not VE or gonzaw but greymist because he hadn't responded the way I did, which was to do a double take upon seeing the VE/gonzaw interaction since Vanilla townie is never mentioned in our PMs as townies. I figured any townie would immediately be like wtf... That's why I immediately asked people what they thought of the usage of the words. Once I realized no one else really reacted the same way I did, I knew it probably didn't mean much. However I had already found greymist's posts to be suspicious at that point already because it looked like he was picking and choosing who he wanted to point fingers at while ignoring others who were guilty of the same things he was pointing out in the people he wanted to point out at. And at the same time his case on Ace came up and it was ridiculously scummy, I mean, how can anyone think it's not, especially if he said he was suspicious of wiggles and then all of a sudden moves on to Ace while wiggles was also guilty of not posting much content at all? Then I had to go out for dinner with a friend for his birthday and basically till now hadn't even looked in the thread. That's why I didn't change my vote. I think I've answered all your questions, please point out more if I haven't Ok, so this explains the points I didn't like. To make it clear though, you're saying you were planning on changing your vote to MZ but were out? Next, while this provides explanation that could say why you did what you did, all you've done in this post is defend yourself. Who do you think is scum? Who do you want to lynch? If you want me to move my vote off of you, I want to see what your own opinion on things is. Right now, my only misgiving about Radfield is that he asks a lot of questions but doesn't interact with other people. For example, he asks me: On June 12 2012 18:43 Radfield wrote: And I make a reply, and then he just ignores it. He doesn't engage with me after asking me for my reads, and this is the same for a lot of his questions. Besides that though, I'm not sure if I see the case on him. I went back and read through his filter, and not much stuck out as scummy besides that. Also something funny:Wiggles, that's all well and good, but those posts are startlingly neutral. Who would you have voted for yesterday. Who do you think is playing scummy. + Show Spoiler + On June 07 2012 09:27 Radfield wrote: I sense meta will play a strong role in this game. I vote we lynch the first player to use the term 'scumslip' inappropriately. :p Obviously this is damning evidence and Radfield should lynch himself. If I change my read on chaoser, or need to vote to get him lynched, I'll switch onto Hesmyrr. I like the case on him, and what BB added. His Day 1 vote made me a little suspicious, but I wasn't ready to call him out completely on it, as well, I didn't like his case on VE very much. It had a couple points that were OK, but a big part of it seemed like it was just completely ignoring the content of VE's posts in favour of calling him scum for them. I want to see what he has to say in defense as well. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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GreYMisT
United States6736 Posts
On June 14 2012 00:48 VisceraEyes wrote: That's an odd way of looking at votes. "If you're not voting for who gets lynched, your vote doesn't matter" Everyone's vote matters, whether they're voting with the majority or not. Well it would be ok, but notice how he didn't even try to convince anyone to vote palmar. If he was that adamant, he would at least try I get us to vote for his choice right? | ||
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gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
He does that "ask lots of questions" thing he's doing here, and does post the odd  smiley and stuff.He started posting in that game way into D1, and didn't seem so enthusiastic as this game (specially not at the beginning of it). I didn't really read the whole thread (just his filter), but it didn't seem he was active in discussions in it, but he does here. It also seems to me Rad was happy to accuse people in that game, even early in the game (Sheth, Toad). He's being more careful this game, with his "It's too early to make conclusions", and not being convinced on a Palmar or VE lynch, trying to find an alternative for the MZ lynch, etc. I'm not saying that behaviour of his isn't suspicious and is fine or anything (it isn't), what I'm saying is that if I take his scum meta from AC it doesn't really fit (to that specific meta). Maybe I didn't analyze it thorough, but I don't see any reason to do it since I don't see much that can convince me to lynch him today otherwise, so my vote is still on Hesmyrr. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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Mr. Wiggles
Canada5894 Posts
On June 14 2012 04:04 VisceraEyes wrote: Wiggles what do you think of gonzaw sir? Palmar is hellbent on his destruction, which concerns me. Clearly you don't agree with his vote, so what do you think of the event if it's not worth commenting on or even mentioning? I think Gonzaw is town. If Palmar wants to lynch him, it doesn't look like he's doing a very good job. He's the only vote on him, and he hasn't produced anything resembling a case. He's made a post defending rad, but hasn't produced anything similar with reasons for why Gonzaw is scum. So, right now it's just baseless and there's nothing to comment about. If Palmar comes in with a case, I'll read that and respond to it. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
Why is this not something worth commenting on Wiggles? | ||
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Hesmyrr
Canada5776 Posts
My post in page 19 is not pointless. Like I stated I did not have any scum-read (at least one I believed I could push for with logic) except the fact that I did not want to see Palmar lynched. I also still thought VisceraEyes had reasonable chance of flipping scum while I had null read on MZ, so I tried to determine what to do using vote associatons. At that point BrownBear was unreasonably pushing for Palmar lynch and the post I quoted stood out as weak, passive defense of MZ. Thus I considered the possibility of BrownBear-MZ scum team therefore asked BB to flesh out his response to better. Unfortunately he then went afk for rest of the day so I dropped it. What do you mean I barely mentioned MZ and Palmar? I was perhaps wishy-washy at that time, but one point I made clear was that I did not want to see Palmar lynched. I've repeatedly stated that was my primary objective. I did want to lynch VisceraEyes over MZ, but "I couldn't find concrete argument to merit analysis post yet" a.k.a. I had no smoking gun that was going to persuade people, since others have dismissed my original argument and there wasn't much else to add. In fact the post you have quoted is continuation of my argument for VisceraEyes lynch. I noticed the suspicious interaction between him and Radfield, and tried to ascertain scumminess of those two by probing his response. Note that I actively start pressuring Radfield for his response thereafter. You bring up MZ repeatedly, but I do NOT have to wreck my brain trying to confirm him alignment. If VE become further scummy, then MZ definitely becomes town. Too bad you dismissed my last post since that's the conclusion you so sorely demand; between those two at least Radfield emerged greatly scummy. Due to time constraints I am not going to be write proper analysis for today. I will post it on June 15, 2 ~ 3 KST. | ||
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gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
So...you made your standard "defense" post....so what now? You'll wait until a couple of hours before the deadline to show up again? (I think that June 15 3 KST may even be after the deadline, but I'm not too good with time-zone conversions  )What have you say about being actively lurking and only posting when called out? What about you being totally absent the whole night? What about you being absent until you made your VE "case" and until you made those other posts 9 pages later? Did your internet connection fail as well? You can say anything you want about your thoughts on MZ/Palmar/VE since you haven't posted them before, so if you were scum faking those reads (as if you had them at that time) it would be easy as pie, so I won't take that into account | ||
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gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
On June 12 2012 08:01 Hesmyrr wrote: I am not insinuating, I am stating your behaviour before then was deservingly suspicious. Also I was still divided on whether to vote for VisceraEyes or MZ so wanted to see if there was going to be more materials/clues, like how you just behaved. You just wrote "I don't have the ability to make a coherant case in this amount of time", but you posted your suspicion on 6:11 so I'm not telling you to work on the fly. I don't even have to tie it into VE partnership to make it scummy, like you said ("I think the honest reason is that I wanted(and want) an alternative to a MZ lynch") you could be preparing in advance to make yourself look less responsible when MZ flips town, since you were looking for 'alternatives'. Keeping my eyes on you. Also VE, why are you so concerned about where my vote is parked? As I see it, with Radfield present there is no way Palmar is going to be lynched - which is one thing I definitely do not want to see at the moment - so I see no reason for me to change my vote unless necessary. Yep, nice conclusion there. You say that Rad's behaviour before then was suspicious (not his behaviour right now); then you spout some stuff about things Radfield said and only conclude with "Keeping my eyes on you" Nope, I'm sure I'd have noticed something like that when I first read this post in the first place, and there you go I read it again and found the same problems with it as the rest of your posts. | ||
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gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
On June 13 2012 23:10 Radfield wrote: This is actually true enough in a sense. Day 1 I had about 2 hours to make a decision, and didn't really see any strong cases. So yes, I was looking for a reason to vote someone. Yesterday I barely even looked at the thread. As I said, I will spend time tonight. Day 2 is my special day, let me dazzle you with my awe inspiring townieness and scumhunting skills. Until he fulfills this promise, I don't see why he shouldn't be pressured. Hesmyrr would still get lynched for now (has 3 votes, the only way Radfield could get lynched is if chaoser+Hesmyrr vote him and Palmar drastically changes his read to lynch Rad and Rad votes for someone other than Hesmyrr), so there are no problems here. | ||
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GreYMisT
United States6736 Posts
On June 14 2012 06:53 Hesmyrr wrote: Looks like people are holding some misconceptions. In response to gonzaw's post, firstly, my case is not entirely based on RNG but the fact that he'd been indecisive and have not been scum-hunting at that moment. This objection became alleviated on the future which is why I struggled a bit on the deadline since I had no clear suspect to comfortably push for. My post in page 19 is not pointless. Like I stated I did not have any scum-read (at least one I believed I could push for with logic) except the fact that I did not want to see Palmar lynched. I also still thought VisceraEyes had reasonable chance of flipping scum while I had null read on MZ, so I tried to determine what to do using vote associatons. At that point BrownBear was unreasonably pushing for Palmar lynch and the post I quoted stood out as weak, passive defense of MZ. Thus I considered the possibility of BrownBear-MZ scum team therefore asked BB to flesh out his response to better. Unfortunately he then went afk for rest of the day so I dropped it. What do you mean I barely mentioned MZ and Palmar? I was perhaps wishy-washy at that time, but one point I made clear was that I did not want to see Palmar lynched. I've repeatedly stated that was my primary objective. I did want to lynch VisceraEyes over MZ, but "I couldn't find concrete argument to merit analysis post yet" a.k.a. I had no smoking gun that was going to persuade people, since others have dismissed my original argument and there wasn't much else to add. In fact the post you have quoted is continuation of my argument for VisceraEyes lynch. I noticed the suspicious interaction between him and Radfield, and tried to ascertain scumminess of those two by probing his response. Note that I actively start pressuring Radfield for his response thereafter. You bring up MZ repeatedly, but I do NOT have to wreck my brain trying to confirm him alignment. If VE become further scummy, then MZ definitely becomes town. Too bad you dismissed my last post since that's the conclusion you so sorely demand; between those two at least Radfield emerged greatly scummy. Due to time constraints I am not going to be write proper analysis for today. I will post it on June 15, 2 ~ 3 KST. You say VE still had a resonable chance of flipping scum. Do you not think he does anymore? | ||
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Radfield
Canada2720 Posts
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