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On April 13 2011 16:32 aidnai wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2011 16:22 Protactinium wrote:On April 13 2011 15:56 Mig wrote:
I don't really understand why prot didn't just run for mayor normally instead of trying the assassin gambit. Everyone agrees hes a very strong player with excellent analysis, it seems like he would be a great mayor just as a normal townie. If he runs this gambit and it fails then he has to convince the town he was faking before and even if he accomplishes that the assassins will still likely target him. And I want to add I did say earlier that it would be in prots best interest to lie about the number of assassins no matter what because it might trick the assassins into voting someone else.
So I still believe that prot is an assassin, however I think there's a good chance coag is mafia. If prot used his 1 dt check last night and hit a red I think the obvious play for him would be to role claim dt. Then if we lynch that player he called out and its right he can ask for medic protection. Why didn't I run for mayor normally? First of all, I wanted to mix it up a bit, and second, it gives us way more information than we would have had otherwise. Like I said, an assassin claim provokes a mafia reaction in order for them to avoid an assassin mayor/pardoner. Even if I die tonight, its well worth it. I'm pretty confident you'd all be pretty lost right now if I hadn't drawn out the mafia. drawn out which mafia? you've put out coag, he hasn't flipped yet, but having read his posts myself he was not high on my suspect list. Also, 'mix it up a bit' sounds retarded. You coulda won the mayor campaign easily with zero claims, most townies were complaining about how stupid all the other campaigns were and EVEN AFTER CLAIMING BLACK you came in an easy 3rd place... It's definitely suspicious that IF you are an assassin, this is your only viable play today. Even more so that there wasn't actually a good reason to claim assassin in the first place as a DT. I think that, as you said yourself, you got assassin, didn't like the role, and tried to make the best of the situation. IN ANY CASE, I'm not going to let this prevent scumhunting at least for the sake of our vigilantes. i.e. even if we lynch coag, the remaining vigis might have something to go on.
I'm not going to derail this by making more claims than I can substantiate right now, so I'm going to only announce this one. However, after this lynch I'll show you my list. I have four, possibly more depending on how the day goes right now, and I'll post it after the lynch goes through. Even if I die during the next night, the town will be in a much better position.
Also, the point of claiming black was to draw Mafia reactions (along with more subtle black reactions). That alone should be enough for me to claim black, since if I had claimed normally or hadn't claimed at all the mafia would probably be lurking in the shadows and wouldn't have a need to come out to oppose me in large numbers. If I had claimed normally and failed, that would have been death right there. Had I not claimed, Mafia would still be in the shadows and it would be much harder for everybody, let alone me, to pick them out.
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Also aidnai why don't you like Horang2?
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United States15034 Posts
On April 13 2011 17:06 Barundar wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2011 16:51 Protactinium wrote:On April 13 2011 15:57 Barundar wrote:
Oh dramaz!
First of all we knew protac was going to do something drastic to not get killed tonight. Personally I'm not buying the whole "it was safer for me to claim assassin than DT", claiming assassin is painting a huge target on his back. The reason people jumped on Pandain was because of his plan of a non-town mayor, and because his sole platform was the DT claim. We saw from Protac's campaign that he was quite capable of making a case for himself more than just his role claim.
It seems all too convenient to me that he would
A) Fake claim assassin over DT
B) Find mafia in the first go when he doesn't get elected into office.
C) Roleclaims instead of building a case, on day 2.
I found Coag to be one of the most pro town players, quite unlike the analysis provided by our "DT". That said, I'm looking forward to Coags response. Like I said, claiming DT doesn't work. But I find it interesting how you say that it's "convenient" that I found Mafia in the first go when I didn't get elected to office. I am easily the best player in this game. Yet you seem to think that the Mafia are hiding well. I'm sure you didn't want to let that slip, did you? As to your third part, I roleclaimed while building a case, which is something you've either blatantly ignored or didn't notice. Obviously, you didn't read any of my case on Coagulation, did you? Didn't think so. We have Coag's response now. He's blowing up and getting desperate, so you can honestly just give up. Your defense of him is laughably transparent. Coagulation is nowhere near being pro-town. Why do you think that? Lol now "It's convenient that you find scum in first go when it's the only way you could survive" translates into "scum is hiding well"? Nice try  I like how you keep blowing your own trumpet. I read your case, and your main point is he only defended kavdragon before the lynch was sent in, and that he couldn't point to who he wanted to instead. I didn't specify which lurker I wanted killed myself either, but like coag I got pretty fucking pissed off when I woke up and saw Kavdragon had flipped green. But what it really comes down to is not both of you can be town. One of you is lieing. It's beneficial to trade scum for town 1 for 1, so town wins in any case. Whats up to town to decide is whether we use a lynch on one of you, or just let you die to assassins and lynch coag depending on what you flip.
Actually his main point was that he checked coagulation and got "mafia"
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On April 13 2011 17:06 urashimakt wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2011 17:01 Rean wrote:On April 13 2011 15:35 Barundar wrote:
Rean was quite active as a blue in insane mafia 2, and was inactive (and got modkilled for it) as scum in mafia 36. Now he is inactive again, and he is trolling to boot.
Yeah, nice try. Except my first mafia game here was Death Factory (townie twin with RoL), second game Insane Mafia 2. As for the Coagulation affair: looking through all of his previous posts, two things really stand out above all: he is extremely paranoid of Prot becoming mayor, freaking out whenever it seems likely that he's being elected only to continue lurking once the threat dies down. Secondly, he has another classic "100% town guys dw had town read all along" read a la Lemonwalrus on GMarshal, despite the fact that alot of people have being pointing out how scummy GMarshal has been all along. I don't know, but I doubt anyone not mafia buddy's with him would trust their reads this much when alot of others are doubting him. Then again, that's what I thought in Insane Mafia 2 aswell and look how that turned out >.> If I had to guess right now, i'd say that both Coagulation and GMarshal are red.Protactinium: I honestly don't fucking know if you're assassin or DT, and quite frankly I couldn't care less. Being a veteran player you could've easily made that read as a assassin. Right now i'd say we lynch Coagulation and if he flips red, medic Prot. If he flips green (doubtful) Prot dies. I don't have anything against what you've said except that you should care if he's assassin, since assassin can't use their DT check night 1. Just a thought.
I'm saying that if he's a assassin, he just made the read on Coagulation because it's pretty easy to see he's scum based on his posting. He's a veteran player after all, it wouldn't be all that far-fetched.
Sure, he'd be lying his ass off but he's not actually being detrimental to town so /care.
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On April 13 2011 16:46 Barundar wrote:
What this really comes down to is that protact and coag can't be on the same team. One of them is lieing. Congrats to us, we are getting us a scum.
As for who of them to kill first, I'm going to go with my read on coag, which has been pro town so far, despite what protact has written. Protact is writing a long story to explain his actions, and I'm going to go with the simplest explanation: He has been lieing and is now throwing another gambit to avoid dieing.
Both the simplest explanation and my read points away from coag being scum, that's how I will vote.
Explain exactly how Coagulation has been pro-town so far? I think you're just making stuff up out of thin air here. Either way, if he truly is town, then why do you want to lynch me? It's obvious that if Coagulation is not red when he flips, I'm dead. Lynching me is a sorry excuse to save Coagulation.
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On April 13 2011 17:00 DoctorHelvetica wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2011 16:56 Coagulation wrote:
I ment scum as in assassin.
DOCH please use your head man. are you really surprised hes pulling this? he has nothing to gain from this as assassin i thought about it. if you are assassin and we lynch you and he hits kitaman27 (or whoever he thinks is the next assassin) he's pretty much guaranteed to be killed that same night. if there are 3 assassins this would result in a TIE the only way this makes sense is if there are two assassins. if protact was assassin he would know that and lynching you is a way to get you killed without letting you take him down as well. That way he can win his game and he is transported out immediately.
Hes gambling im RED so he can get MED PROTECT
HE DIDNT DT CHECK ME
I FUCKING KNOW THIS
LET THE ASSASSIN DIE NIGHT 2
I would love to be DT checked night 2 and have this cleared up without the town losing a town role in the process.
Give me till night 2 to prove i am town.
I CAN PROVE IT.
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But what it really comes down to is not both of you can be town. One of you is lieing. It's beneficial to trade scum for town 1 for 1, so town wins in any case. Whats up to town to decide is whether we use a lynch on one of you, or just let you die to assassins and lynch coag depending on what you flip.
Obviously lynch Coag, let him die to assassins is the best option. If Coag is green, ain't no one going to be protecting him, he's going to be dead. If Coag is red, we pat ourselves on the back for a good lynch and deal with him later. Win win.
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United States15034 Posts
Let me stress this again one more time.
The only way Protactinium can get a win off this play is if he and Coagulation are the two assassins.
This assumes that:
-Coagulation is an assassin
-There are only two assassins in the game.
I find the second prospect highly unlikely. In the event of 3 assassins, Protactinium is almost guaranteed loss.
I seriously doubt this is a bid for medic protection and honestly I don't care because:
a)In order to get the medic protection he'd have to be correct about Chaoser. This is a huge gamble.
b)This will still give him a real check on night 2 to use again in our favor, particularly if he strikes red with it. This benefits town.
However this play could also make sense under a third condition:
Protactinium and Coagulation are both red. An early bus like this puts Protactinium in a position where he is trusted and he could simply spend the rest of the game saying he never got another red check while busting out misleading analysis.
I find this very unlikely. Detective is imo the trickiest and worst claim for a mafia to make and he really had no reason to be desperate. If he wanted to avoid getting hit by assassins he could have just made a safe claim that's easy to fake like Veteran or Vigilante.
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a)In order to get the medic protection he'd have to be correct about Chaoser. This is a huge gamble.
Wait, what'd he say about me? lol I'm tired from writing a paper, did I miss something?
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United States15034 Posts
On April 13 2011 17:14 Coagulation wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2011 17:00 DoctorHelvetica wrote:On April 13 2011 16:56 Coagulation wrote:
I ment scum as in assassin.
DOCH please use your head man. are you really surprised hes pulling this? he has nothing to gain from this as assassin i thought about it. if you are assassin and we lynch you and he hits kitaman27 (or whoever he thinks is the next assassin) he's pretty much guaranteed to be killed that same night. if there are 3 assassins this would result in a TIE the only way this makes sense is if there are two assassins. if protact was assassin he would know that and lynching you is a way to get you killed without letting you take him down as well. That way he can win his game and he is transported out immediately. Hes gambling im RED so he can get MED PROTECT HE DIDNT DT CHECK ME I FUCKING KNOW THIS LET THE ASSASSIN DIE NIGHT 2 I would love to be DT checked night 2 and have this cleared up without the town losing a town role in the process. Give me till night 2 to prove i am town. I CAN PROVE IT.
There are easier ways to get the medic protection if he's that desperate for protection. This move doesn't sit right with me.
You can prove it? There are no confirmation roles in this game buddy. The closest thing is vig.
OH WAIT MAFIA CAN FAKE THAT PERFECTLY HUH
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United States15034 Posts
On April 13 2011 17:17 chaoser wrote:Show nested quote +a)In order to get the medic protection he'd have to be correct about Chaoser. This is a huge gamble. Wait, what'd he say about me? lol I'm tired from writing a paper, did I miss something?
Sorry, you were on my mind when I was typing. I meant Coagulation.
Errr not in any sort of homoerotic way. In a "I want to re-read your day 1 meta" way because something doesn't sit right with me but I'm not ready to FoS you or anything so I wouldn't worry about it.
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I CAN PROVE IT WHEN Protactinium FLIPS ASSASSIN
THEN U GUYS CAN DT CHECK ME FOR ALL I FUCKING CARE.
ITS JUST IF U GIVE ME 1 NIGHT
THIS WILL RESOLVE ITSELF. DONT LYNCH A TOWNIE CAUSE AN ASSASSIN IS SPEWING LIES TO STAY ALIVE.
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On April 13 2011 17:06 Barundar wrote:
Whats up to town to decide is whether we use a lynch on one of you, or just let you die to assassins and lynch coag depending on what you flip.
That's a pretty important point. Unless there's a situation where Prot miraculously lives through night 2, we're going to know exactly what he was up to. If we have another target that's just as likely to be mafia, we could lynch them and either hope we have another vigilante for Coag or lynch him day 3.
But doing that would probably mean we 100% lose Prot, if there's even a remote chance he really is DT.
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United States15034 Posts
On April 13 2011 17:19 Coagulation wrote:
I CAN PROVE IT WHEN Protactinium FLIPS ASSASSIN
THEN U GUYS CAN DT CHECK ME FOR ALL I FUCKING CARE.
ITS JUST IF U GIVE ME 1 NIGHT
THIS WILL RESOLVE ITSELF. DONT LYNCH A TOWNIE CAUSE AN ASSASSIN IS SPEWING LIES TO STAY ALIVE.
If your plan is to claim vig i'm not impressed
because that won't actually prove shit
and that's the only role that can do anything like "prove" itself unless you're about to make some insane calleresque claim
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HES NOT DT
o god im so pissed.
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Well, nevermind. Brain fart. It would be too late for anyone to hit him if we wait for Prot to die in the night, it would turn into a day 3 lynch.
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How can anyone oppose lynching Coagulation when he's checked to be Red? It doesn't matter if Protact is Black/Blue, what matters is we lynch a scum.
Okay, Coag flips green/blue, that means Protact gets no medic protection, he gets killed by Assassins, and we continue on with our lives searching for scum. No offense, but it's not like Coagulation has been doing amazing analysis this game.
Coag flips red, great for town. Medics will protect Prot, and if Prot is DT great. If he is Assassin, he has no more DT checks and cannot continue to pretend to be DT UNLESS, he nails SCUM for us with analysis 100% accurately (WHICH IS WHAT TOWN WANTS LOL).
Coag flips black, outcomes have been explained by Dr. H.
Why would we not lynch Coagulation? So many scum buddies coming out to defend him atm.
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On April 13 2011 17:21 DoctorHelvetica wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2011 17:19 Coagulation wrote:
I CAN PROVE IT WHEN Protactinium FLIPS ASSASSIN
THEN U GUYS CAN DT CHECK ME FOR ALL I FUCKING CARE.
ITS JUST IF U GIVE ME 1 NIGHT
THIS WILL RESOLVE ITSELF. DONT LYNCH A TOWNIE CAUSE AN ASSASSIN IS SPEWING LIES TO STAY ALIVE.
If your plan is to claim vig i'm not impressed because that won't actually prove shit and that's the only role that can do anything like "prove" itself unless you're about to make some insane calleresque claim
I already told you guys im vet.
I dont have to do anything.
The assassins will fucking kill prot night 2
THAT SHOULD BE PRETTY OBVIOUS HE DIDNT DT CHECK ME AT THAT POINT.
AND IT WOULD BE FANTASTIC IF YOU WOULD HOLD ME TO A DT CHECK NIGHT 2 ALSO.
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On April 13 2011 16:58 Mig wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2011 16:54 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
he has nothing to gain from this as scum
it doesn't reek of anything besides you getting lynched He has nothing to gain from this as scum I agree, but he has a lot to gain from this if hes an assassin. In fact this is literally his only chance at surviving. Prot could be 100% right and coag is scum. But the problem is no matter what I feel like the best play for him will always be to role claim dt. However, if he was going to lie and role claim it makes sense that he would pick the person he felt was most likely to actually be scum. So basically if anyone wants to lynch coag that's fine but use prots arguments as the reason do not consider his role claim, there is just too high of a chance that he could be lying about it.
As DoctorHelvetica pointed out, this can't be an Assassin ploy to win unless there's only two Assassins. Just think about it for a second and try hard to convince yourself that there really are only two Assassins. So you're saying I'm not a DT but I picked Coagulation to roleclaim DT to try to save myself? Step back and think about it for a bit. You seem to be trying to make the facts fit your concept that I am an Assassin. And even though we've established how that's irrational, why would you still doubt me? I am undoubtedly the most pro-town person here at the moment. Try not to over think this. Let's see how this unfolds and go from there, ok?
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^^for the 69th time, assasins cannot use abilities night 1.
If he is an assassin, he could not have checked coag last night.
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EPT
