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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
Eh, now that I think about it, riven can move about reasonably well even while slowed, so maybe not. Teemo? Irelia? Renekton's been discussed already and seems manageable but on the difficult side. Can you push a Nasus out of lane on her? Trading farm with Nasus seems... less than the ideal situation (as both of you scale really well into the late game) | ||
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Navi
5286 Posts
i ran caster runes and masteries one game and shat on nasus regardless like mpen, AP, AP/lvl, all useless stats on riven he probably didn't rune perfectly either but still probably better than me lol riven definetly handles nasus better than, say, jax, in teamfights because a lot of her damage is aoe spells, and her teamwide dps is probably higher for most of the game. she has a decent kit to shut him down in lane, so i wouldn't be afraid to pick riven into nasus. teemo can't handle riven's burst, and can't kite her completely his blind obviously strong against her, but depending on when he blinds you you can use your skills accordingly (i.e. blind at start of q's, use q and w up to three charges, and then e-> q knockback when blind is off, etc irelia is complicated, but riven can beat her early. if nothing else trading farm with her isn't a bad proposition, and ask your jungler for ganks when u feel weak etc. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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starfries
Canada3508 Posts
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CeriseCherries
6170 Posts
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deth2munkies
United States4051 Posts
On December 02 2011 00:43 Requizen wrote: Finally laned against my first Wukong that wasn't a total derp. It's an interesting match-up, to say the least. No real sustain in either champ, some pretty good damage on both sides. Riven definitely has the edge I think, though. Her combo is longer and scales better than Charge -> Q (-> Ult). Wukong has more utility thanks to his ult for teamfights, but his late game damage has nothing on Riven. While this is true, I think a good Wukong can probably be even or slightly outperform Riven in the early game. His Q seems to scale better than anything short of a full combo with autoattacks, which is extraordinarily hard to get against someone who has a dash and an invis. Mid-late game, she shits all over him, though. Also, I've noticed just how much the minion changes affect the matchup when I ended up getting duo laned top by a panth/nidalee. Nid kept me completely zoned until I got a jungle gank, killed both of them, then panth started roaming and I finally won the lane. She never even dropped HP with 1 pot and her heal, even when I had a full wave of minions attacking her for short periods, and I couldn't get close with her passive and boots opening. Very frustrating. | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On December 02 2011 10:44 CeriseCherries wrote: what about putting riven bot o.o I've laned blitz + riven pretty nicely Seems like you'd get zoned by a good sustaining harass lane comp (basically any AD + sona) and with blitz, winning lane is basically is blitz landing decent grabs? If yes, you're probably winning lane. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On December 01 2011 14:20 Navi wrote: riven destroys nasus i ran caster runes and masteries one game and shat on nasus regardless like mpen, AP, AP/lvl, all useless stats on riven he probably didn't rune perfectly either but still probably better than me lol riven definetly handles nasus better than, say, jax, in teamfights because a lot of her damage is aoe spells, and her teamwide dps is probably higher for most of the game. she has a decent kit to shut him down in lane, so i wouldn't be afraid to pick riven into nasus. teemo can't handle riven's burst, and can't kite her completely his blind obviously strong against her, but depending on when he blinds you you can use your skills accordingly (i.e. blind at start of q's, use q and w up to three charges, and then e-> q knockback when blind is off, etc irelia is complicated, but riven can beat her early. if nothing else trading farm with her isn't a bad proposition, and ask your jungler for ganks when u feel weak etc. I went against a nasus once who rushed frozen heart before like...anything even tier 2 boots. lvls 1-6 were ezmode and i got a nice cs advantage, but after he hit like lvl 7 and finished glacial i couldn't trade with him anymore. i was able to maintain a nice cs lead for the rest of laning, but yea...after a certain point i couldnt do crap against nasus's lifesteal and massive armor stack. | ||
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Navi
5286 Posts
On December 02 2011 12:29 Ryuu314 wrote: I went against a nasus once who rushed frozen heart before like...anything even tier 2 boots. lvls 1-6 were ezmode and i got a nice cs advantage, but after he hit like lvl 7 and finished glacial i couldn't trade with him anymore. i was able to maintain a nice cs lead for the rest of laning, but yea...after a certain point i couldnt do crap against nasus's lifesteal and massive armor stack. trade farm, aoe down their team in teamfights, profit the one thing i really like about riven is that you never have to be afraid of trading farm with anybody because you will scale comparably or better than them (ignoring ridiculous cases where nasus gets like 400 q stacks or something) posting here for reference: matchups + Show Spoiler + garen can go for a level 2 kill wtih dblade and ad marks, but if he doesn't manage to kill her then, he's fucked and her e makes it so that you can trade with garen post 3 very easily not to mention you can w before his q auto gets into range and run away if you dont wanna fight with him at any point pantheon gets destroyed and is fairly easy to gank nasus gets destroyed and is easy to gank cho is really disadvantaged level 1-2, but if he can get over the rocky early levels and builds some good armor early it can become a farm off (i still wouldn't want to play cho against her because you're kinda forced into a static build path that the enemy AP should be able to take advantage of but w/e) they're both decent to gank for, but late game riven is a much bigger beast midgame fights they're both strong olaf is strong vs her, its a matchup with very little margin of error for riven, but whoever gets the first gank will usually win. riven outscales him like fuck, so he MUST win or he's screwed tryndamere scales comparably with riven and is equally strong or stronger at levels 2-3, so that's another matchup that comes down to ganks and individual skill level / use of skills well. ryze with boots can kite her quite well, riven needs boots in that matchup because of how ryze's w works. after ryze gets tear, its a pain in the ass, because you WILL be forced back, even with wriggles. udyr and irelia work, but neither can usually shut down her farm, and neither like trading farm because there are very few windows where either is as strong as riven in teamfights (level 7 irelia is pretty scary, but most dragon teamfights won't happen then; riven does a lot more aoe damage than irelia as well as being comparably or more mobile). gangplank... i've never seen a gangplank shut me down, but i have shut down a TON of gangplanks. he has less survivability if he builds glass cannon, and his kit in general is less suited for teamfighting with the exception of his ult (and riven's probably does more damage anyway) and will get shut down if both riven and GP have wriggles and they are trading hits i would probably go ryze or olaf because each definitely has a time period during which they are definitively stronger than riven in lane and in teamfights, and tryndamere for a safe fall-back that has good scaling (because olaf at least gets outscaled like fuck by riven, and ryze while having quite a bit of utility has less damage than her for sure) | ||
NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
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Navi
5286 Posts
i'd be willing to play around with that matchup later with u if u'd like | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On December 03 2011 07:28 NeoIllusions wrote: Swain? How does Riven fare? Never get caught in Nevermove thanks to dash-iness. Can't really trade that hard with him, thanks to bird sustain, but you can burst faster than his DoTs can kill you most of the time. Not enough experience, I'm sure Navi has a better idea. | ||
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Navi
5286 Posts
and if you run ignite you can kill him at most stages in the game, because even if he nevermores you, you can still autoattack him (and get in a position to do so by using your e and q, or just use them to dodge it if he doesn't use nevermore over where he will be standing when disengaging, but if he can't do that he's probably not a great swain). it's not a complete stomp though, because swain's kit still has good cc, but imo the deciding factor is the two sides' proneness to ganks, and swain is definetly more gankable at just about every stage in the game because of riven's mobility and instant ministun and swain's lack of mobility | ||
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Brambled
United States750 Posts
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On December 05 2011 12:08 Brambled wrote: So just tried to straight up fight lvl1 against Leesin and just about got my ass handed to me. Also why the hell does it feel like she has the worse base attack speed in game. I think Lee sin has the strongest lvl 1 in the game bar none. Better than Riven/Panth and anyone else I can think of. Correct me if I'm wrong. Thing about lee sin tho is that Riven wrecks him after a few levels and she far far outscales lee sin. | ||
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Blademage
United States128 Posts
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
On December 05 2011 12:10 Ryuu314 wrote: I think Lee sin has the strongest lvl 1 in the game bar none. Better than Riven/Panth and anyone else I can think of. Correct me if I'm wrong. Thing about lee sin tho is that Riven wrecks him after a few levels and she far far outscales lee sin. pretty sure panth will win kus of passive. real tough for just about any melee to beat panth 1v1 edit: at level 1 that is | ||
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Navi
5286 Posts
On December 02 2011 11:26 sylverfyre wrote: Seems like you'd get zoned by a good sustaining harass lane comp (basically any AD + sona) and with blitz, winning lane is basically is blitz landing decent grabs? If yes, you're probably winning lane. i really really really want to try riven leona, if i ever had to run her botlane that lane just sounds like the most annoying sht ever double melee? too bad you're dead zzz | ||
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danana
United States321 Posts
On December 06 2011 11:32 Navi wrote: i really really really want to try riven leona, if i ever had to run her botlane that lane just sounds like the most annoying sht ever double melee? too bad you're dead zzz I did this in a bot game once - obviously not even close to a good indicator of what would happen in a real game, but the killing power was hilarious. Also, super big thanks for this guide! I think it's one of the best guides because whenever I play I have a good feeling for the direction I want to go with my build and stuff - like when you say what Riven scales with, it seems super obvious when you explain it but a lot of people don't think about that stuff, so I've been consistently out-damaging opposing Rivens with other builds. Had an epic comeback game where we were behind at least 10 kills and ~4 turrets (we hadn't taken ANY of their turrets at this point), but after a few good teamfights (including a quadrakill and pentakill for me!!!) we won the game. Btw, what can I do to protect myself vs counterjungling at the beginning as jungle Riven? it's probably just a matter of having my team coordinate better, but i had one game where my big wraith was stolen (not a big deal at my level of play... i'm not even lvl 30 yet) and another where i got ganked twice at blue, and i felt waaay behind and didn't know what i should have done about them. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On December 06 2011 11:41 danana wrote: I did this in a bot game once - obviously not even close to a good indicator of what would happen in a real game, but the killing power was hilarious. Also, super big thanks for this guide! I think it's one of the best guides because whenever I play I have a good feeling for the direction I want to go with my build and stuff - like when you say what Riven scales with, it seems super obvious when you explain it but a lot of people don't think about that stuff, so I've been consistently out-damaging opposing Rivens with other builds. Had an epic comeback game where we were behind at least 10 kills and ~4 turrets (we hadn't taken ANY of their turrets at this point), but after a few good teamfights (including a quadrakill and pentakill for me!!!) we won the game. Btw, what can I do to protect myself vs counterjungling at the beginning as jungle Riven? it's probably just a matter of having my team coordinate better, but i had one game where my big wraith was stolen (not a big deal at my level of play... i'm not even lvl 30 yet) and another where i got ganked twice at blue, and i felt waaay behind and didn't know what i should have done about them. Generally if you feel that the other team has warded your blue/ any camp just skip it unless you have a high level of coordination with your team. You're better off running damage control and just farming the rest of your jungle than trying to be stubborn about grabbing blue. A big part of jungling is adapting. | ||
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