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let me preface my comments with the fact that I hit 30 2 months ago and only have around 250 wins under my belt. take my suggestions with a grain of salt and let me know if i'm wrong
I have an easy time versus trynds as well. Just remember to only trade when you are at lower hp AND when w isnt on cooldown.
A typical exchange for me would look at this..
Trynd comes in and engage me with mocking shout or spin, i e when my hp is lower, then w autoattack till either he runs off or it expires. if trynd is still trading with u when w is finished and chase u, i e again and run off. i spec 9/21/0 and do not usually lose these trades.
i also strongly recommend opening W then E. if u take Q at 1 or 2 u are asking to get raped.
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I used to run Irelia 0-21-9, because I'm a MS whore, and I built around mobility (every single item of the "final" build would buff mine and/or allow me to slow foes) to not only stick to people, but also be able to flee easily or go from one target to another.
However, I've been advised to try stuff like FM/Wit's End/Atmas on her (not particularly all nor in that order), which is also great to stick to someone, but loses a lot on mobility (no FoN/Zeal for example, less CDR to just Q-E everyone trying to run away). Should I keep playing 0-21-9 to retain some MS, or just go outright 9-21-0 to max my attack speed with Wit's?
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On December 05 2011 12:15 Alaric wrote:
I used to run Irelia 0-21-9, because I'm a MS whore, and I built around mobility (every single item of the "final" build would buff mine and/or allow me to slow foes) to not only stick to people, but also be able to flee easily or go from one target to another.
However, I've been advised to try stuff like FM/Wit's End/Atmas on her (not particularly all nor in that order), which is also great to stick to someone, but loses a lot on mobility (no FoN/Zeal for example, less CDR to just Q-E everyone trying to run away). Should I keep playing 0-21-9 to retain some MS, or just go outright 9-21-0 to max my attack speed with Wit's?
I go 21/9 with specs in MS. IMO 0/21/9 is the safest on irelia atm at top because it aloows you to assume any role you see fit. 21 defense allows you to be a bruiser that can withstand most heavy hitter. While 9 gives you movement speed you need to be really mobile to snipe their ad carry.
For attack speed, I think all you really need is a wit's end. My irelia build atm is usually boots/3pots into wards+phage+merc into FM into atmas into wit's end or FON. If they have a heavy magic team like top rumble/singed. I usually delay my phage and get SV into phage into wit's end.
I
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I feel like 9 utility is better for Irelia than 9 offense but that's just how I FEEL.
ms quints would be a better source of ms than the points in utility unless you're already running those
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On December 05 2011 10:20 Brees wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2011 10:18 Cloud9157 wrote:On December 05 2011 10:11 Brees wrote:
he can barely do damage to you once you get wriggle's/tabi and if he tries to play aggressive spin is always going to leave you with less hp then him so you can just immediately stun and then go to town on him with true damage and burst him down everytime. And Tryndamere won't get a Wriggle's himself? armor doesn't affect true damage or irelia's stun which are the 2 skills you max vs him. My most played is tryn in solo q 1800-ish and ive yet to beat an irelia, its a stomp everytime. I can beat pretty much any other character.
If you max stun before Q, Then your mobility in a teamfight takes a huge hit which imo is kinda shit, you might win lane a bit but you are a lot less useful in teamfights.
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You only need 2-3 levels in q. The extra stun duration is really important in teamfights too.
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On December 05 2011 10:06 xbankx wrote:
Irelia does not hardcounter tryn. You really can't trade with tryndmere. YOu can farm as well as him though if you are good at positioning and use your Q only to "hit" slightly dangerous creeps. I don't think I ever pushed tryndmere out of a lane without a jungler. His max fury hits hard+mocking cry just takes out too much damage to trade.
Irelia is my favorite top lane however she just doesn't stack up well versus heroes like uydr and gp.
On December 05 2011 12:23 xbankx wrote:
I go 21/9 with specs in MS. IMO 0/21/9 is the safest on irelia atm at top because it aloows you to assume any role you see fit. 21 defense allows you to be a bruiser that can withstand most heavy hitter. While 9 gives you movement speed you need to be really mobile to snipe their ad carry.
For attack speed, I think all you really need is a wit's end. My irelia build atm is usually boots/3pots into wards+phage+merc into FM into atmas into wit's end or FON. If they have a heavy magic team like top rumble/singed. I usually delay my phage and get SV into phage into wit's end.
Don't mean to put you on the spot, but perhaps your squishy opening build gives you a hard time against bruisers?
Sometimes Irelia has to open cloth or Doran's Shield and not rush her Triforce items.
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On December 05 2011 15:41 broz0rs wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2011 10:06 xbankx wrote:
Irelia does not hardcounter tryn. You really can't trade with tryndmere. YOu can farm as well as him though if you are good at positioning and use your Q only to "hit" slightly dangerous creeps. I don't think I ever pushed tryndmere out of a lane without a jungler. His max fury hits hard+mocking cry just takes out too much damage to trade.
Irelia is my favorite top lane however she just doesn't stack up well versus heroes like uydr and gp. Show nested quote +On December 05 2011 12:23 xbankx wrote:
I go 21/9 with specs in MS. IMO 0/21/9 is the safest on irelia atm at top because it aloows you to assume any role you see fit. 21 defense allows you to be a bruiser that can withstand most heavy hitter. While 9 gives you movement speed you need to be really mobile to snipe their ad carry.
For attack speed, I think all you really need is a wit's end. My irelia build atm is usually boots/3pots into wards+phage+merc into FM into atmas into wit's end or FON. If they have a heavy magic team like top rumble/singed. I usually delay my phage and get SV into phage into wit's end. Don't mean to put you on the spot, but perhaps your squishy opening build gives you a hard time against bruisers? Sometimes Irelia has to open cloth or Doran's Shield and not rush her Triforce items.
Do you guys run armor quints? I go 21/9/0 and open cloth armor and I still think he just straight up wins trades at level 2.
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I run 21/9 with armor seals and I open cloth+5 pots against Trynd.
Wriggles makes it better, but I still feel he owns you in the end.
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I have trouble against Akali, and Riven. I run armour pen reds, armour yellows, mr / level blues, and ms quints with 21 defemse and the extra movement speed in utility. Should I make a rune page specific to laning vs these champs? I can't win trades at level 4, and end up falling very behind because I can't even farm with out losing a third of my bar.
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I'd run armor or hp regen quints vs. any of those terror toplane champs. Besides, farm at tower till around level 7-9 when you can trade with them. You're weak early on. I've beaten most of the different difficult lanes, olaf, trynd, riven with hpregen quints, cloth+5 into boots+chain vest and then continuing the build. It sure is a big farmfest, but you shouldn't be losing any trades with 120+ armor before level 9.
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You don't get the movement in utility and movement quints and then expect to win early laning phase, are you serious? Get armour quints and get at least 9 in offense if not 21. Also rush ninja tabi into vamp sceptre/cloth armour into wriggles, ninja tabi stupidly efficient against a pure autoattacker.
If you're losing trades at level 2; no shit, irelia loses to everyone at level 2. Why are you trading at level 2? If he hits you just stun him and run off, he'll draw creep aggro and push lane towards you. You only start doing shit when you get level 5+ and your true damage becomes significant and you have like over 100 armour. Irelia has so much armour, 5 pots, the easiest creep clearing at tower in the game and a free stun when you're lower hp not to mention free lifesteal how the hell can you have trouble sitting back building armour then zoning him from lane?
Like, look at the damn numbers. He gains 25 AD, up to 50 if he's REALLY low. You gain 75 TRUE AD. He gets some more crit he's going to be using his Q to heal most likely and once he does that you can just zone him because without fury he doesn't do shit to you. If he maxes mocking shout he doesn't have more than 1 point in heal and your true damage doesn't care that much against his W compared to other champs. Even still, you can still stun him with E run away and then your E cd is up 6 seconds before his W and you just WQE him and you easily win that trade.
The thing about trynd is, once you can stop him free hitting on creeps all the time he won't have fury to make him hit harder and that snowballs into him getting zoned even harder. He also tends to push lane to stack up fury which means once you're strong you get to hold the lane pushing and force him to go gank or something when he just wants to farm.
Akali and riven are the same as most other lanes, you play passive as shit until you get your wriggles and at least level 7 (obviously don't want ninja tabi against them, so just farm 1300 gold and go get wriggles) and then you're suddenly healing for 45+ a hit, attacking pretty fast if you have attack speed reds and the offensive attack speed shit and have so much armour they hit you less than you heal for, pretty absurd.
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On December 05 2011 23:40 Slayer91 wrote:
he'll draw creep aggro and push lane towards you.
i just want to point out these two aren't one and the same most of the time. a hero drawing creep aggro pushes the lane towards him not from him.
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On December 06 2011 00:45 redtooth wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2011 23:40 Slayer91 wrote:
he'll draw creep aggro and push lane towards you. i just want to point out these two aren't one and the same most of the time. a hero drawing creep aggro pushes the lane towards him not from him.
what? no, slayer's right
blue champ attacks purple champ
purple creeps attack blue champ instead of purple minions, while blue creeps attack purple minions.
by blue champ attacking purple champ, he has pushed the lane by diverting damage away from his creeps.
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I feel movement speed quints and the 5% movement speed from initiator + utility masteries is too good once dragon fights, start to happen, but I would be willing to change things to lane against Akali specifically, being able to chase down the carries is what Irelia is all about and movement speed combined with 65% cc reduction just helps this.
Still if you're unable to even get out to the creeps in the middle of the lane, when the lane is reset vs. Akali, what do you do? If you just try to walk up to the creeps she's going to drop her slow and try to land a few procs on you resulting in you losing like a 4th or a 3rd of your health each. Do you let her harass so she draws aggro then pull the lane into the tower so you can farm it? I don't see how a wriggles lantern is going to help, because she's going to be out farming me and will be able to buy her hextech revolver when I get wriggles, so she gets tons of sustain and the armour isn't going to give me anything beneficial. I have tried waiting until level 7 and getting wriggles, but she still beats me and then a tanky jungler like Udyr will just dive me / attack my tower / stun me under the tower and tank it for the akali to just burst me down depending upon how much health I'm at.
I don't see how Ninja tabi are going to help. With the removal of nimbleness, the life saving dodge percs just don't happen anymore, and Akali is mostly magic damage so the cloth armour isn't going to be very effective. What should I do when fighting Akali? I lose trades pre-six, I lose trades post six. Is starks an option I haven't looked at because the Wriggles hasn't worked. Witt's end hasn't been effective because I haven't been able to get it stacked before the damage is done. I'm absolutely clueless in this match up.
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On December 05 2011 15:41 broz0rs wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2011 10:06 xbankx wrote:
Irelia does not hardcounter tryn. You really can't trade with tryndmere. YOu can farm as well as him though if you are good at positioning and use your Q only to "hit" slightly dangerous creeps. I don't think I ever pushed tryndmere out of a lane without a jungler. His max fury hits hard+mocking cry just takes out too much damage to trade.
Irelia is my favorite top lane however she just doesn't stack up well versus heroes like uydr and gp. Show nested quote +On December 05 2011 12:23 xbankx wrote:
I go 21/9 with specs in MS. IMO 0/21/9 is the safest on irelia atm at top because it aloows you to assume any role you see fit. 21 defense allows you to be a bruiser that can withstand most heavy hitter. While 9 gives you movement speed you need to be really mobile to snipe their ad carry.
For attack speed, I think all you really need is a wit's end. My irelia build atm is usually boots/3pots into wards+phage+merc into FM into atmas into wit's end or FON. If they have a heavy magic team like top rumble/singed. I usually delay my phage and get SV into phage into wit's end. Don't mean to put you on the spot, but perhaps your squishy opening build gives you a hard time against bruisers? Sometimes Irelia has to open cloth or Doran's Shield and not rush her Triforce items.
Personally Im a huge fan of wickd so I learn irelia builds from him. And what he said one time on his stream that you never want to start anything but boots+pots. His reasoning is that boots+pots lets you be aggressive in lane when you have the chance, but if you start cloth+5 pots, you no longer have that option. Personally the only time I start with non-boots is vs GP which without the 5 pots you really can't stay in lane.
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On December 06 2011 01:20 Sabin010 wrote:
I feel movement speed quints and the 5% movement speed from initiator + utility masteries is too good once dragon fights, start to happen, but I would be willing to change things to lane against Akali specifically, being able to chase down the carries is what Irelia is all about and movement speed combined with 65% cc reduction just helps this.
Still if you're unable to even get out to the creeps in the middle of the lane, when the lane is reset vs. Akali, what do you do? If you just try to walk up to the creeps she's going to drop her slow and try to land a few procs on you resulting in you losing like a 4th or a 3rd of your health each. Do you let her harass so she draws aggro then pull the lane into the tower so you can farm it? I don't see how a wriggles lantern is going to help, because she's going to be out farming me and will be able to buy her hextech revolver when I get wriggles, so she gets tons of sustain and the armour isn't going to give me anything beneficial. I have tried waiting until level 7 and getting wriggles, but she still beats me and then a tanky jungler like Udyr will just dive me / attack my tower / stun me under the tower and tank it for the akali to just burst me down depending upon how much health I'm at.
I don't see how Ninja tabi are going to help. With the removal of nimbleness, the life saving dodge percs just don't happen anymore, and Akali is mostly magic damage so the cloth armour isn't going to be very effective. What should I do when fighting Akali? I lose trades pre-six, I lose trades post six. Is starks an option I haven't looked at because the Wriggles hasn't worked. Witt's end hasn't been effective because I haven't been able to get it stacked before the damage is done. I'm absolutely clueless in this match up.
To fight akali, you have to play extremely smart and careful. Akali snowballs easily. Imo, to fight akali, you have to bait the cloud. You bait it by pretending to be aggressive when the creep wave is low, mehish akali will usually attempt cloud to hide from your aggressive and do her Q into attack harass. All you need to do is back off. Then once the cloud goes on cooldown. you can go back in, active your true damage E when you have lower hp. Then when she starts to run Q into her. Timing of this type of harassment is also very important. You want to strike when she doesn't have a lot of creeps on her side.
Riven is mehish. I perfersonally attack the same way I attack akali, Fight when her skills are on cooldown.
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On December 06 2011 01:20 Sabin010 wrote:
I feel movement speed quints and the 5% movement speed from initiator + utility masteries is too good once dragon fights, start to happen, but I would be willing to change things to lane against Akali specifically, being able to chase down the carries is what Irelia is all about and movement speed combined with 65% cc reduction just helps this.
you fundamentally misunderstand the game. Irelia is about chasing down carries, sure, but that's all secondary to not getting shit on in lane. Your runes and masteries are there to make sure you don't get shit on in lane, because no one gives a fuck if your movespeed is 12 higher than it would be without those quints if you have 30 CS out of laning because you got zoned. Besides, you really think you're going to be above 70% HP diving through a team? please, initiator is a shitty mastery. and you really overestimate juggernaut by putting it in terms of having 65% cc reduction. I mean, la-di-fucking-da, if I just have mercs + my passive, I have 61% CC reuction. Is it really worth taking a bunch of mediocre masteries to get another 0.08 seconds shaved off of a 2 second stun? The answer, of course, is no. Simply put, the math doesn't lie, defensive tree is really mediocre past veteran's scars and it's foolish to go that far down it when you can put the offensive tree to use.
so basically you lose lanes because you're speccing like an idiot because you think you need things that you don't. Armor or MRes quints go a long ass way to not losing all these matchups with irelia, as would speccing a bare minimum of 9 in offensive to at least get attack speed and 10% arpen, if not taking a full 21 to get crit, lifesteal, arpen and executioner. believe it or not, you can still stick to carries with just a triforce. a slow + speed buff is all you need to stick to them, you don't need balls out movespeed by any stretch of the imagination.
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On December 06 2011 01:04 Mogwai wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2011 00:45 redtooth wrote:On December 05 2011 23:40 Slayer91 wrote:
he'll draw creep aggro and push lane towards you. i just want to point out these two aren't one and the same most of the time. a hero drawing creep aggro pushes the lane towards him not from him. what? no, slayer's right blue champ attacks purple champ purple creeps attack blue champ instead of purple minions, while blue creeps attack purple minions. by blue champ attacking purple champ, he has pushed the lane by diverting damage away from his creeps.
i derped.
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On December 06 2011 01:43 Mogwai wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2011 01:20 Sabin010 wrote:
I feel movement speed quints and the 5% movement speed from initiator + utility masteries is too good once dragon fights, start to happen, but I would be willing to change things to lane against Akali specifically, being able to chase down the carries is what Irelia is all about and movement speed combined with 65% cc reduction just helps this. you fundamentally misunderstand the game. Irelia is about chasing down carries, sure, but that's all secondary to not getting shit on in lane. Your runes and masteries are there to make sure you don't get shit on in lane, because no one gives a fuck if your movespeed is 12 higher than it would be without those quints if you have 30 CS out of laning because you got zoned. Besides, you really think you're going to be above 70% HP diving through a team? please, initiator is a shitty mastery. and you really overestimate juggernaut by putting it in terms of having 65% cc reduction. I mean, la-di-fucking-da, if I just have mercs + my passive, I have 61% CC reuction. Is it really worth taking a bunch of mediocre masteries to get another 0.08 seconds shaved off of a 2 second stun? The answer, of course, is no. Simply put, the math doesn't lie, defensive tree is really mediocre past veteran's scars and it's foolish to go that far down it when you can put the offensive tree to use. so basically you lose lanes because you're speccing like an idiot because you think you need things that you don't. Armor or MRes quints go a long ass way to not losing all these matchups with irelia, as would speccing a bare minimum of 9 in offensive to at least get attack speed and 10% arpen, if not taking a full 21 to get crit, lifesteal, arpen and executioner. believe it or not, you can still stick to carries with just a triforce. a slow + speed buff is all you need to stick to them, you don't need balls out movespeed by any stretch of the imagination.
6% attackspeed is pretty pathetic, especially on a champ with a move built in to apply an extra hit. 10% armour penetration is not going to really do anything when facing a champion who's coming to lane with less than 30 armour. Honor guard is a direct counter to havoc. Juggernaut is going to be worth about 100 health in the endgame, and early game (pre-mercs) its 10% cc reduction is going to give you more reduction when against 1 or 2 champs in lane than the end game bonus of 4%. The 6% bonus damage to champs less than 40% is better for one of your team mates because Irelia can put the stun and get the guy to 40% so some one else can finish them, and if they're only at 10% you should be able to kill them with a w auto attack q anyway. I'll try some flat MR runes. when against Akali, but don't tell me im speccing like an idiot, and fundamentally don't understand the game, when you posted this less than a month ago.
On November 02 2011 03:06 Mogwai wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2011 11:04 redtooth wrote:On November 01 2011 03:24 Mogwai wrote:On November 01 2011 03:18 Makavw wrote:Irelia used to be my favourite char but now i just dont see a reason to play her anymore  . She cannot force anyone out of the lane, she is not the best afk farmer , she doesnt counter anyone but she can be countered :/. The only reason why irelia is still good for me is beeing the most mobile "tank" in game. Other then that if i want to farm i pick Nasus or Gp, if i want to be aggresive i pick Garen/Renekton. Also i have yet to lose a lane versus irelia as garen. He seems like super hard counter to her unless he gets ganked early . Irelia is flexible enough to spec vs. anyone. She doesn't win many lanes, but she doesn't lose the way Nasus or Singed can, and she has comparable power when farmed. Lol @ farming with GP, on equal farm, Irelia takes a massive massive dump on GP. Irelia is my go-to safe pick in lane. She can just spec balls out defensive and arrive on lane with like 70 Armor vs. Garen/Pantheon/Talon with 5 hp pots and just outsustain them until wriggle's and then she just fucks them in the face. You can literally just outspec whoever you're laning against and get your farm vs. ANYONE, which transistions into her retarded mid-late game. She's a really stupid character, but I love Irelia and I can't believe people bitch about her power (it's STILL fucking absurd). =/ i hear such passionate praise about irelia but i've never seen her perform that well. when laning against her i found it to be such an easy win even back when she was considered 'broken'. now that i'm playing as her i just can't seem find her place. she doesn't have the ridiculous early game of garen, the broken midgame of nidalee, the unstoppable lategame of jax. at the same time her mediocrity at all stages of the game don't add up to her being 'versatile'. i was talking to spud about this earlier and he also doesn't find her to be too strong either. maybe i'm just that bad at the game. also, how do you beat AP with stuns as irelia (sion, ryze, even kennen). AP with stuns? Flat MRes Glyphs, Flat MRes Quints, 0/21/9, open regrowth, rush philo -> Merc's + Wit's End. Garen early game is Garen early game. Irelia can very easily spec and build to never lose a lane to Garen and by the time she gets wriggle's, he can't do fucking anything. Irelia 1v1 murders Nidalee midgame AND is stronger in teamfights (by a mile too, it's not even close). Nidalee gives more mobility but, w/e, it's fucking Nidalee. Jax's "unstoppable" late game is something I've still yet to fucking see. Most overrated phase on any character ever. Irelia does more in your standard teamfight than Jax will and doesn't require you to build an entire fucking team around all-inning on Jax's lategame. I dunno man, I'm not sure what I'm supposed to say. When I play Irelia, I feel like I cannot lose a lane hard enough to hurt my team because I can build whatever I need to stop the opposing damage and just get my farm and then in teamfights I can alternately peel and kill tanks or dive and kill carries regardless of my build at that point in time due to her crazy ass kit.
I take it the best would be to play flat mr glyphs and mr quints, keeping the same masteries, and opening regen pendent would be the best way to stay in the lane long enough to farm up some nice items.
On December 06 2011 01:38 xbankx wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2011 01:20 Sabin010 wrote:
I feel movement speed quints and the 5% movement speed from initiator + utility masteries is too good once dragon fights, start to happen, but I would be willing to change things to lane against Akali specifically, being able to chase down the carries is what Irelia is all about and movement speed combined with 65% cc reduction just helps this.
Still if you're unable to even get out to the creeps in the middle of the lane, when the lane is reset vs. Akali, what do you do? If you just try to walk up to the creeps she's going to drop her slow and try to land a few procs on you resulting in you losing like a 4th or a 3rd of your health each. Do you let her harass so she draws aggro then pull the lane into the tower so you can farm it? I don't see how a wriggles lantern is going to help, because she's going to be out farming me and will be able to buy her hextech revolver when I get wriggles, so she gets tons of sustain and the armour isn't going to give me anything beneficial. I have tried waiting until level 7 and getting wriggles, but she still beats me and then a tanky jungler like Udyr will just dive me / attack my tower / stun me under the tower and tank it for the akali to just burst me down depending upon how much health I'm at.
I don't see how Ninja tabi are going to help. With the removal of nimbleness, the life saving dodge percs just don't happen anymore, and Akali is mostly magic damage so the cloth armour isn't going to be very effective. What should I do when fighting Akali? I lose trades pre-six, I lose trades post six. Is starks an option I haven't looked at because the Wriggles hasn't worked. Witt's end hasn't been effective because I haven't been able to get it stacked before the damage is done. I'm absolutely clueless in this match up. To fight akali, you have to play extremely smart and careful. Akali snowballs easily. Imo, to fight akali, you have to bait the cloud. You bait it by pretending to be aggressive when the creep wave is low, mehish akali will usually attempt cloud to hide from your aggressive and do her Q into attack harass. All you need to do is back off. Then once the cloud goes on cooldown. you can go back in, active your true damage E when you have lower hp. Then when she starts to run Q into her. Timing of this type of harassment is also very important. You want to strike when she doesn't have a lot of creeps on her side. Riven is mehish. I perfersonally attack the same way I attack akali, Fight when her skills are on cooldown.
What about the Akali's that use the pool to zone you off the creeps, and isn't afraid to trade outside the pool? Should I be trying to get in the bush just so I don't lose xp? I mean I just want to farm up and make it to the mid game where I can actually trade with her, but I feel if she forces me back and gets a revolver before I can get a phage and philosopher's stone, im going to have a hard time staying in lane.
Here is something interesting pointed out on GD regarding the true damage of Irelia's W and the 6% bonus damage final red mastery.
On December 06 2011 02:40 Takkara wrote:So I'm unsure if people have already done this analysis, so I apologize if it's old hat, but I wanted to investigate the effect of Executioner, the 21 point talent in Offense. Text reads: "Increases damage dealt by 6% to targets below 40% health." My questions basically were this: - Does it apply to on-hit items?
- Does it affect smite?
- Will it only proc when the target is below 40% health or do you get the 6% on whatever portion of damage that occurred below 40%? In other words, if someone has 41% health and you hit them for 1000, do they get hit for somewhere near 1060 or do they get hit for near 1000?
- Does it affect Red buff?
So, here are my findings. They're trivial to reproduce. I have some video and pictures, but it's so meaningless to post them because there's nothing hard to the recreation. I just used Udyr in a custom game and tanked big buffs in Turtle to avoid extraneous damage. Does it apply to on-hit effects?Turns out the answer to this is: yes. Wit's End and Malady both gain 6% damage when the target is below 40% health. Does it apply to smite?No. Smite is unaffected by this talent. Does it only work if the target is below 40% or does any damage that falls below 40% cause it to proc?I've never seen an intermediate value. I've only ever seen my hits do the normal hit or the 6% more hit. I've never seen an intermediate value. This seems unlikely that I always EXACTLY hit 40% health on all the mobs, so I think this is conclusively proven. Does it apply to red buff?No it does not. This lead me to my biggest discovery through all of this: Executioner does not apply to true damage. Thinking this was the reason I saw no increase in the red buff or smite damage, I loaded up a game with Irelia and tried it out on the jungle mobs. Her W bonus does not scale when the target is below 40%. Additionally, the 6 damage returned to mobs from Bladed Armor does not appear to scale but it is too insignificant to really notice even if it did. Anywho, hope this helps someone. If this was already discussed before, sorry! But I was just curious if classic Saint strategy of "fast-smiting" big buffs was the new optimal strategy if you go 21 in Offense. Turns out it is as long as you're not afraid of it being stolen from you. However, the true damage not scaling issue is particularly interesting, and I'm not sure if it's not a bug. Edit:After doing some reading it's intended behavior because that's what "true" damage means, I suppose. Oh well, good to have it confirmed I suppose.
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EPT
