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On January 27 2017 08:04 iCanada wrote:
Who did you lane against?
I have a hard time seeing ww as a top in pro play because his wave control just isn't good. He 1v1s real well, but how is he going to stop a Sion / Mao / Poppy / Fiora / Camille from shoving him in and winning the rest of the map while WW either loses farm / XP or watches his lane opponent snowball?
WW has always dumpstered most top laners 1v1. Thus was true since he was released. Has been true since he was released.
Wouldn't Fiora have to wait for Tiamat too, or is it the E you're counting as part of her wave pushing as well?
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On January 27 2017 14:52 lilwisper wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2017 08:04 iCanada wrote:
Who did you lane against?
I have a hard time seeing ww as a top in pro play because his wave control just isn't good. He 1v1s real well, but how is he going to stop a Sion / Mao / Poppy / Fiora / Camille from shoving him in and winning the rest of the map while WW either loses farm / XP or watches his lane opponent snowball?
WW has always dumpstered most top laners 1v1. Thus was true since he was released. Has been true since he was released. Wouldn't Fiora have to wait for Tiamat too, or is it the E you're counting as part of her wave pushing as well?
You're right about waveclear, but I don't think WW can fight Fiora. I could be wrong, but I think WW would just be zoned. Less healing than Vitals, true damage ignores E DR, Fiora gets the AS prior to being low, and she can outplay with W.
I'd assume WW would be holding on till jungle pressure arrives, personally.
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On January 27 2017 14:57 iCanada wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2017 14:52 lilwisper wrote:On January 27 2017 08:04 iCanada wrote:
Who did you lane against?
I have a hard time seeing ww as a top in pro play because his wave control just isn't good. He 1v1s real well, but how is he going to stop a Sion / Mao / Poppy / Fiora / Camille from shoving him in and winning the rest of the map while WW either loses farm / XP or watches his lane opponent snowball?
WW has always dumpstered most top laners 1v1. Thus was true since he was released. Has been true since he was released. Wouldn't Fiora have to wait for Tiamat too, or is it the E you're counting as part of her wave pushing as well? You're right about waveclear, but I don't think WW can fight Fiora. I could be wrong, but I think WW would just be zoned. Less healing than Vitals, true damage ignores E DR, Fiora gets the AS prior to being low, and she can outplay with W. I'd assume WW would be holding on till jungle pressure arrives, personally.
I see. Plus you have to add that WW's healing doesn't even kick in until he's at half. You only get extra dmg before hand.
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On January 27 2017 14:18 iCanada wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2017 11:53 VayneAuthority wrote:
new ww is basically trundle with a more versatile ult but its not targetable and not reliable. I don't really like it much, rip old warwick. you dont even go on hit anymore, you build like trundle (iceborn/titanic/visage/etc)
his kit is built completely around Q spam just like trundle, pretty sad what they turned him into. just another spam proc abuser I mean, as someone who played old WW all the time in the jungle, I feel like it seems pretty true and modern. He was pretty Q spam before. You can build on hit, its just bad because of the way the jungle is. Thats not the champ thats the jungle. He built SV & IBG before.
it's honestly not, the skills are similar but the playstyle is way different.
My biggest gripe - The new q's mechanic. It feels insanely clunky to use and doesnt go off in lane a lot, really messes up trades and is way too slow. A far cry from warwick's double click q from before that was much smoother to use.
giving him a gapclose on his one strong ability makes it so you go in when is least convenient for you and smart players have already picked up that you just punish the shit out of him when he qs you while you run away like a bitch until its up again.
2nd biggest playstyle change - blood scent only activating out of combat. Completely defeats the purpose of the skill in teamfights and has been turned into a pubstomp ability. Probably the worst change that cannot be fixed in any way or form. Just another affirmation that he only has 1 playstyle, and its all in (which he isnt that great at)
(For people that didn't play warwick, he was a champion with high sustain completely built around "melee kiting" and knowing your limits. getting somebody low enough for blood scent in teamfights and using the perm speed boost to maneuver was a large part of his kit)
the obvious complaint - The skillshot ult. it isn't more powerful, but it's now a skillshot. Hitbox is tiny and easy to miss, good luck locking down those mobile champs you used to counter. Ult is hilariously easy to stop, and in this iteration the damage doesn't even go off if its stopped. if they have a champ like thresh or tf with fast on demand cc he isn't worth picking.
anddd that's my rant on how riot ruined another of my mains. add that to the list. Apparently galio's up next but he's so shitty right now that I don't really care
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
Yeah, I'm not following. Choosing to cast Warwick Q is now actually a decision and not just spam as much as you can? Isn't that a good thing? Thresh/TF can interrupt his suppression ... as if they couldn't before? And the damage on the ult is both higher than it used to be and also definitely procs even if the ult is interrupted.
IDK man, I agree that the Q is super clunky (I think it's actually bugged), but pre-rework Warwick's design was absolute trash. It was zero mechanics and all decisionmaking, except even the decisionmaking wasn't really there because it was always obvious when to use his abilities. The new kit at least adds some semblance of mechanics and gives your abilities some tradeoffs instead of "activate as soon as it is off cooldown".
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On January 28 2017 00:19 GrandInquisitor wrote:
Yeah, I'm not following. Choosing to cast Warwick Q is now actually a decision and not just spam as much as you can? Isn't that a good thing? Thresh/TF can interrupt his suppression ... as if they couldn't before? And the damage on the ult is both higher than it used to be and also definitely procs even if the ult is interrupted.
IDK man, I agree that the Q is super clunky (I think it's actually bugged), but pre-rework Warwick's design was absolute trash. It was zero mechanics and all decisionmaking, except even the decisionmaking wasn't really there because it was always obvious when to use his abilities. The new kit at least adds some semblance of mechanics and gives your abilities some tradeoffs instead of "activate as soon as it is off cooldown".
actually it's worse, its not mana gated at all anymore so you build around spamming Q and procs (hence why is he basically now trundle)
I mean maybe some people will like that new playstyle and pick it up but for old ww players it feels like a slap in the face. But what ya gonna do. As long as nasus isn't touched i will continue to play this game but that would probably be the last straw
as for your other point it would be nice if they realized that players like us do exist that want 100% decision making no mechanic champions.
I had 60 APM playing broodwar, but that didn't stop me from getting B on PGT and taking sets against people like artosis with strong mental skills. (got completely destroyed by idra though the one set i played vs him)
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No movement speed in combat def feels "naked" compared to before
Also once again they removed a classic section quote I guess it's only fun if they run was just too outdated and no longer fits the character (wat?) just throw it in the pile with feeling a chill and the cycle of life continuing I guess..
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I understand wanting to keep certain elements of champions, or even the champions in their entirety, but it's very difficult for something to thrive when it's just outclassed in every single mechanic that's coming out.
If WW wants to keep up, he needs a new set of skills, but also preferably needs to maintain his identity. What else would you have done to make WW viable again?
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I just wish they kept his Point and Click Ult Targeting. I don't see a reason to move almost every champ and rework away from that. They are powerful abilities, but you need some balance with all the mobility.
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i dont mind ult being skill shot as long as its easier to hit
the current one is actually quite hard (or near impossible) to hit vs anyone with a dash or blink
maybe target a certain radius in the ground at X range and if a champion is caught inside there it gets ulted? if multiple champs are there it latches you on to whatever is nearest to ww as he jumps there. idk just make it easier to hit if they want it to be a skillshot. and there was a good point by the ww main on reddit how its hilarious that ww's ult used as an escape doesn't fit the character at all
w is quite boring. change that to something else idk what. its just lame
q I agree is clunky too (the jump over part). if they fix that I think that skill can be ok albeit it is not the most interesting skill either.
the one skill I really liked is the E.
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They should make w his old e, but with the low health steroid. It's not perfect but it was a cooler/more powerful ability.
I would also make the q ground target to improve his jungle patching although that would be more genaric
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I for one like the new WW.
And it's shocking to me how many people using WW ult like malph ult. It's not an initiate. It's a pick spell or a follow up to E.
I do think he ought to be able to R-flash though.
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the one thing that made warwick unique as a bruiser was that point and click ult. The rest of the kit is basically standard bruisery sustain/tankiness and a modicum of mobility.
They can give him small leaps and move his tankiness/sustain around, but now he's just another flavorless bruiser type champ with numbers that aren't impressive enough to be worth picking.
if you can't use the ult to initiate or to guarantee a good start to a gank, what is your role? what makes him better than trundle or voli or singed or aatrox or udyr or xinzhao besides bigger/smaller numbers? it really feels like a failure of a rework.
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So far my record on Support WW is 0 wins, 0 losses, 1 dodge. I'll keep you updated.
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I think the blood hunter theme is enough to live on but they've gone way to soft on the actual killing power of the ability. This is a character who was not top tier with his old ult, so if you're going to keep his kit similar while removing his instant ranged stun you need to go ham on the power level of those abilities. And to me his w, his most thematic rings of we didn't want this to be too good when it should be too good.
I do find the e to be a powerful and cool idea for a life steal tank but I think his passive being 50% sorta subverts what the e brings idk
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On January 27 2017 14:23 Jek wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2017 10:02 Reson wrote:
I see. Guess it was just a bit weird to me that you cant choose direction.
Any word on replays?
Also, do people not use the target info box? Isnt it being in the top left really out of the way? Google is telling me that it hasnt always been there. Do people not need it because they know all the effects of the items so they can just calculate from the tab interface? The info seems pretty critical to me.
I use the info box to see what runes they are running, I'm too lazy to use op.gg to see. Knowing their exact number of resists and CDR (particular important in botlane) is quite handy too.
But isnt the top left location out of the way? Or do you generally just look at it once at the beginning and thats it.
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why does the last 10 seconds of champ select play the sound effects for when it's your turn to draft now?
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On January 28 2017 11:57 Reson wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2017 14:23 Jek wrote:On January 27 2017 10:02 Reson wrote:
I see. Guess it was just a bit weird to me that you cant choose direction.
Any word on replays?
Also, do people not use the target info box? Isnt it being in the top left really out of the way? Google is telling me that it hasnt always been there. Do people not need it because they know all the effects of the items so they can just calculate from the tab interface? The info seems pretty critical to me.
I use the info box to see what runes they are running, I'm too lazy to use op.gg to see. Knowing their exact number of resists and CDR (particular important in botlane) is quite handy too. But isnt the top left location out of the way? Or do you generally just look at it once at the beginning and thats it.
I use it in the beginning or if I'm planing an all-in to get a more precise idea of their HP and resists. It doesn't really feel that far away once you get used to it, sort of like how using the minimap and grabbing info from scoreboard by flashing it become a muscle memory. Getting the habit of using at level 1 to get an idea of their runes is the most important part of it in my opinion.
Of course you could just look it up on op.gg instead. In case you haven't used it, you just find youself or someone in the game on it click "Live Game" and it give you a lot of information about everyone in the game. As soon as you're in loading screen it has the information. The only times I use op.gg to check is in normals if we get roflestomped to see if we're against master or challengers, if I lane against one/two I usually ask if they after the game care tell me what I fucked up at, most dont mind spending a few seconds on writing a few lines. Likewise if I support one. 
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On January 28 2017 12:36 Frolossus wrote:
why does the last 10 seconds of champ select play the sound effects for when it's your turn to draft now?
So you don't forget to do masteries and runes. Happened to me a few times ;(
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EPT
