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Vatican City State1872 Posts
On November 08 2007 04:22 skyglow1 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2007 03:55 mahnini wrote:On November 08 2007 02:39 Never Post wrote:
This sounds remarkably similar to the "does .999... = 1" thing.
People would benefit so much from learning just a bit more maths. I know I'm late but... You can't ever reach something if your destination is half the length of the required distance, it makes no sense. It's more like divide number by two infinitely and expecting it to reach zero. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno's_paradoxes#Proposed_solution_using_mathematical_series_notationI really like this possible solution: Show nested quote +Main article: Planck lenghtAnother proposed solution to some of the paradoxes is to consider that space and time are not infinitely divisible. Just because our number system enables us to give a number between any two numbers, it does not necessarily follow that there is a point in space between any two different points in space, and the same goes for time. If space-time is not infinitely divisible (and thus not perfectly continuous), it is "discrete" (composed of “lumps” and “jumps”). This means that motion is, at the smallest physical level, may be a series of jumps from one quantum space-time coordinate to the next, each occurring over distance and time intervals that are not divisible into smaller measures.[2] Thus the total number of quantum jumps made while traversing from point A to point B would be finite, and there is no paradox. Btw the 0.999...=1 can be simply proved: 1/3=0.333... 1/3x3=0.999... But we know that 1/3x3=1, so 0.999...=1
the thing that I don't like about this argument is that this is a completely different situation, you aren't dealing with 1/3's and your answer with this problem will never be a clean .999...
1/2^infinity =\\= .999 ever, unless you round it.
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First, thanks for another nice thread.
On November 08 2007 04:18 DrainX wrote:(...) to CrownRoyal Here is what I dont like about your argument: Say that the world was predetermined. Say that if you knew the exact state of the universe at one point you could predict the future until the end. If someone did predict the future couldnt he then choose not to follow that predicted future? If he tries to kill himself when the prediction says he goes shopping the next day what would stop him? Some divine force?  I just dont think it makes sense.
The problem with your counter-argument is that you can never predict the future exactly. To be able to do that you need to have information about everything which causes a sort of infinate loop.
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Vatican City State1872 Posts
btw that previous post could easily be flawed
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On November 08 2007 04:39 CrownRoyal wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2007 04:22 skyglow1 wrote:On November 08 2007 03:55 mahnini wrote:On November 08 2007 02:39 Never Post wrote:
This sounds remarkably similar to the "does .999... = 1" thing.
People would benefit so much from learning just a bit more maths. I know I'm late but... You can't ever reach something if your destination is half the length of the required distance, it makes no sense. It's more like divide number by two infinitely and expecting it to reach zero. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno's_paradoxes#Proposed_solution_using_mathematical_series_notationI really like this possible solution: Main article: Planck lenghtAnother proposed solution to some of the paradoxes is to consider that space and time are not infinitely divisible. Just because our number system enables us to give a number between any two numbers, it does not necessarily follow that there is a point in space between any two different points in space, and the same goes for time. If space-time is not infinitely divisible (and thus not perfectly continuous), it is "discrete" (composed of “lumps” and “jumps”). This means that motion is, at the smallest physical level, may be a series of jumps from one quantum space-time coordinate to the next, each occurring over distance and time intervals that are not divisible into smaller measures.[2] Thus the total number of quantum jumps made while traversing from point A to point B would be finite, and there is no paradox. Btw the 0.999...=1 can be simply proved: 1/3=0.333... 1/3x3=0.999... But we know that 1/3x3=1, so 0.999...=1 the thing that I don't like about this argument is that this is a completely different situation, you aren't dealing with 1/3's and your answer with this problem will never be a clean .999... 1/2^infinity =\\= .999 ever, unless you round it.
haha I'd have to agree:D 1/2^infinity=0 =/=0.999.....=1
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Vatican City State1872 Posts
although I obviously can't understand it nor does it make sense the best I can explain my idea is that the universe started as an equation in its self.
some variable sparked a change in the equation and it came to life evolving with every living second.
No computer could ever compute that kind of information though and it's more or less some weak attempt to prove that the christian god does not exist, or if he does exist than he is the biggest bastard of all time and isn't worthy of anything that he gets anyway.
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Vatican City State1872 Posts
I've spent a sick amount of time thinking about religion/philosophy/other things like that.
I try to prove things to myself using theory and I write down a lot of crazy things.
Maybe i'll figure it out and write a book or something some day.
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But seriously, the 0.999...=1 discussion is really not interesting. 0.999... is 1, but it's really a silly notation for 1. You never write out a number in decimals and end with ..., just as you don't write 1/2^infinity. Using infinity as a number, or the value of a valuable makes no sense. You would have to use the limit's notation and instead write something like
lim[n->infinity] sum(9/10^k,k=1..n) = 1
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[QUOTE]On November 08 2007 04:22 skyglow1 wrote:
[QUOTE]On November 08 2007 03:55 mahnini wrote:
[QUOTE]On November 08 2007 02:39 Never Post wrote:
This sounds remarkably similar to the "does .999... = 1" thing.
People would benefit so much from learning just a bit more maths.[/QUOTE]
I know I'm late but...
You can't ever reach something if your destination is half the length of the required distance, it makes no sense.
It's more like divide number by two infinitely and expecting it to reach zero.[/QUOTE]
[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno's_paradoxes#Proposed_solution_using_mathematical_series_notation]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno's_paradoxes#Proposed_solution_using_mathematical_series_notation[/url]
I don't get this. Suppose we take the element of time out, what happens then? Now I'm genuinely curious.
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what do you mean by "taking the time out"? that makes no sense to me
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Vatican City State1872 Posts
Wikipedia wrote:
[edit] Are space and time infinitely divisible?
Main article: Planck length
Another proposed solution to some of the paradoxes is to consider that space and time are not infinitely divisible. Just because our number system enables us to give a number between any two numbers, it does not necessarily follow that there is a point in space between any two different points in space, and the same goes for time.
If space-time is not infinitely divisible (and thus not perfectly continuous), it is "discrete" (composed of “lumps” and “jumps”). This means that motion is, at the smallest physical level, may be a series of jumps from one quantum space-time coordinate to the next, each occurring over distance and time intervals that are not divisible into smaller measures.[2]
Thus the total number of quantum jumps made while traversing from point A to point B would be finite, and there is no paradox.
wouldn't these lumps just turn into the smallest of numbers in our number system and the whole process is back to normal?
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Vatican City State1872 Posts
I guess our number system is infinite though so that doesn't really make any sense.
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On November 08 2007 05:05 jtan wrote:
what do you mean by "taking the time out"? that makes no sense to me
Hmm, I want to say something, but I can't wrap words around the concept. ~.~
Is there a proof for this somewhere?
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On November 08 2007 05:10 CrownRoyal wrote:
I guess our number system is infinite though so that doesn't really make any sense.
now wait. If you are talking about Zeno's paradox you don't really need advanced theories like indivisibility of space and time to show Zeno was wrong. You just have to know a few thing about limits. Zeno's original argument in short is like:
(1)-assume you want to move 1 mile
(2)-you run half, then half of the rest and so on. distance to move= 1/2+1/4+....
(3)-but you can't move an infinite amount of distances in a finite amount of time
(4)-therefore you can never reach the end
(5)-therefore all movement are an illusion
here (3) is false. You can move an infinite amount of length-intervals in a finite amout of time: if the length-intervals gets infinatly short. Example: you divide 1 meter into n intervals, each interval get's length 1/n meters. Move at 1m/s. Time it takes to move 1 interval: 1/n seconds. Time to move through all intervals: n*(1/n) seconds=1second. If you let n->infinity you still get the same result. An infinite amount of intervals, each being infinitly small, but you get through them all in 1 second.
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Yes I believe this notion of time travel requires a discussion of Predestination and theology as well.
Imagine we can travel back in time, to the time of Jesus. You are going from your universe to another universe in which you existed 2000 years ago. So, dissapearing from your universe and appearing in another in which you do exist means that God would have to change the outcome of reality when you open a wormhole through space-time. This means that whatever you do God is watching and has predetermined your fate.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Predestination_(Calvinism)
Holy shit! this all makes sense know.
Discuss please.
As NewbSaibot said, there have been artifacts found in Jerusalem, artifacts which seem too futuristic to be from that time, perhaps proof of time travel by space aliens? who knows.. the fact is the New World Order is hiding these artifacts in maximum security bunkers, there is current research by top scientist and astrologers to decipher the code of the artifacts, I heard from reliable sources that the code contains some sort of alien language. Whatever it may be, the vortex between our universe and theirs is coming to a tangent yet unknown by currents physics.
Really scary stuff.
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I find calvinism to be bullshit, I'm for determinism, but having a god in that theory is just superfluous.
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On November 08 2007 05:42 jtan wrote:
I find calvinism to be bullshit, I'm for determinism, but having a god in that theory is just superfluous.
This is the kind of mind control I been warned about, Calvinism is the new liberation program by once thought disappeared civilization of Atlantis. Bear in mind that this is highly classified information. Bush is linked to the British Royal family. The british have recently inplanted tracking chips on high school students to control their minds and create an army of zombies. Don't you see the pattern here? Bush is attempting to hold off the alien invasion and the second coming of Jesus Christ by blocking the prayers of children. It is all part of the New World Order.
Ok, im finished here. If I dont reply in 2 hours that means I been taken for hostage by the Bush Administration in one of their secret prisons in Albania.
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Vatican City State1872 Posts
On November 08 2007 05:48 Rev0lution wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2007 05:42 jtan wrote:
I find calvinism to be bullshit, I'm for determinism, but having a god in that theory is just superfluous. This is the kind of mind control I been warned about, Calvinism is the new liberation program by once thought disappeared civilization of Atlantis. Bear in mind that this is highly classified information. Bush is linked to the British Royal family. The british have recently inplanted tracking chips on high school students to control their minds and create an army of zombies. Don't you see the pattern here? Bush is attempting to hold off the alien invasion and the second coming of Jesus Christ by blocking the prayers of children. It is all part of the New World Order. Ok, im finished here. If I dont reply in 2 hours that means I been taken for hostage by the Bush Administration in one of their secret prisons in Albania.
this is probably the greatest post in the history of posts.
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or just the most off topic one
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The only theories i know of time travel(that i've read about) aren't really what people would consider time travel. One of them deals with traveling at the speed of light(which can't be done anyway) that if you reach that point of speed time will go faster around you, or something like that, i read it awhile ago. another theory is black holes, if you're stuck in the event horizon time elsewhere will again go faster, but, that again is impossible. the last one is probably the closest to actual going back in time, but only to a certain point. i don't remeber exactly how to explain it but you'd have to build a device and you can only travel back in time to when it's first turned on. so say it's turnd on and 100 years later it's still on you could go through it, but only back when it was first turned on.
those are the only theories i've read of, but time travel in general doesn't make sense. if you DO go back in time, then everything you do you've already done, like the example of say killing yourself when you're younger... it won't happen, otherwise you wouldn't exist. i'm not really all that interested in time travel, it's all theory and can't be in any way proven and is constantly disproven by science and logic. that's just my opinion on it ;x
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EPT
