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Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On December 02 2025 02:02 zeo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2025 01:31 Jankisa wrote:
Imagine being a Serbian Putin fan boy who has been predicting Ukraine collapse and accusing everyone of propaganda for almost 4 years now with exactly 0 of his bullshit coming to past.
I can't even imagine how rotten you have to be inside out to take the side of the Russia in every conflict they started, every massacre, every war crime, how close minded and fucked up do you have to be to just dismiss the words of everyone from these countries that have been attacked and brutalized, just a pathetic, brainwashed sad little boy with dreams of big Serbia and big Russia. You seem to be obsessed with Serbia. There are helplines. Edit: I've mentioned Croatia once in last 8 years here, and you crash out over Serbia in every third post. Chill out a bit, nobody cares
Is this any better?
Imagine being a Serbian Putin fan boy who has been predicting Ukraine collapse and accusing everyone of propaganda for almost 4 years now with exactly 0 of his bullshit coming to past.
I can't even imagine how rotten you have to be inside out to take the side of the Russia in every conflict they started, every massacre, every war crime, how close minded and fucked up do you have to be to just dismiss the words of everyone from these countries that have been attacked and brutalized, just a pathetic, brainwashed sad little boy with dreams of big Serbia and big Russia.
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The reason why I keep mentioning the fact that you are a Serbian is because it illustrates you absolute propensity for lapping up fascist propaganda and your dedication to the "Ruski svet" bullshit that you very obviously bought up hook, line and sinker.
Unlike you, I do occasionally mention my country in the context of this and other threads because I am able to live in a reality, I don't mention Serbia in the context of responding to anyone but you, because it's very much relevant to your extremely flawed worldview and your propensity for subjugation, both to subjugate others and to be subjugated by your Putin's Russia.
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On November 30 2025 20:59 maybenexttime wrote:
Ribbentrop-Molotov 2.0.
https://archive.is/9Fg37
More details of the collusion of the US with Russia.
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So, in the past 4 days Ukraine has struck 4 Russian oil tankers. Kinetic sanctions on the shadow fleet.
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On December 03 2025 02:48 Manit0u wrote:
So, in the past 4 days Ukraine has struck 4 Russian oil tankers. Kinetic sanctions on the shadow fleet.
It is an interesting tactic. A HUGE red line has been open international trade. Russian tankers keep going through Nato waters without issues. It was also one of the early agreements, allowing Ukrainian grain trade when Russia was in a better naval position. (Then Russia stopped the agreement and lost a lot of their naval power in the region.)
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United States44394 Posts
The beauty of hitting the shadow fleet is that it is a shadow fleet. Nobody knows who owns the ships, manages the ships, owns the cargo etc. Layers and layers of bureaucracy and deniability. Ukrainian grain is transported in properly flagged and owned ships, if one of those is sabotaged you’ll get a state level response. The owner of the Russian oil has as much recourse as a drug dealer whose stash is stolen.
Russia will, of course, still respond against ships. But Russia is engaging in hybrid warfare already, it’s already sabotaging things. And western nations will continue to respond by sending aid to Ukraine.
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A point made by Anders Puck Nielsen was that Russia retaliating might be good for Ukraine. US flailing around is moving attention away from the war and into Russian favored peace deals to end it. So getting attention back to the war from more actors by increased food prices globally (by Russian actions) is good for Ukraine. Putting the focus on more reasonable short term goals like grain deals.
Not his point: It doesn't matter that much to them if their grain exports get blocked a while, EU is bankrolling the war regardless.
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The environmental cost of this war is astronomical. There are of course more pressing concerns, but just something that is rarely mentioned. Crazy thing is these tankers are just the tip of the iceberg, if even that big.
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To not just be negative on US actions on this Russian war. The sanctions a few months ago leading to decreased Indian and Chinese purchases of Russian oil was good. As far as I know they still do intelligence sharing as well. So they are still a positive actor overall, even if their highest leadership often make them seem to be the opposite. Basically doing a negative PR spin on decent overall actions by letting the focus be on the very very strange peace negotiations instead of what they do well.
I wish they were doing more as it would save them money in the long run but there is a difference between China/Iran and the US in active actions taken around the war. While we often talk as if they are acting the same, even under Trump admin they havn't backslid far enough to be a negative actor yet.
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United States44394 Posts
On December 03 2025 04:47 Billyboy wrote:
The environmental cost of this war is astronomical. There are of course more pressing concerns, but just something that is rarely mentioned. Crazy thing is these tankers are just the tip of the iceberg, if even that big.
They’ve been sinking them empty on the way back to the fuel port. Not fully loaded.
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On December 03 2025 04:58 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2025 04:47 Billyboy wrote:
The environmental cost of this war is astronomical. There are of course more pressing concerns, but just something that is rarely mentioned. Crazy thing is these tankers are just the tip of the iceberg, if even that big. They’ve been sinking them empty on the way back to the fuel port. Not fully loaded.
They haven't sunk any I think. They did strike them, damaging them and forcing them to seek shelter in ports where they need to undergo major repairs.
I think the big thing here is that it not only stops their operation for a moment but also makes it hard for them to find insurance in the future (and no port will admit a ship without insurance) which was already hard for the shadow fleet as they had to go through shady deals and pay exorbitant prices for probably fake insurance.
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On December 03 2025 04:32 Yurie wrote:
A point made by Anders Puck Nielsen was that Russia retaliating might be good for Ukraine. US flailing around is moving attention away from the war and into Russian favored peace deals to end it. So getting attention back to the war from more actors by increased food prices globally (by Russian actions) is good for Ukraine. Putting the focus on more reasonable short term goals like grain deals.
Not his point: It doesn't matter that much to them if their grain exports get blocked a while, EU is bankrolling the war regardless.
It's all rubbish.
If war continues and escalate with the peace deal broke down, then oil price will shoot right back to $80 instead of the $60 ever since Trump started the peace negotiations in Feb.
That's not a great result, unless Europe starts committing and put their own men on the ground.
Combine that with food price going up, what do you think gonna happen? The pressure will always be put on the losing side, Ukraine.
Sweden already calling out about nordic nations paying unfair ratio to Ukraine and unsustainable.
Right wing parties popping up in popularity in many Europe nations.
That alone put a f ton of social/economic cost to political parties in each European nations.
It's also why we had been getting nothing but half assed support from EU.
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Europe could be on the hook for $160 billion to keep Ukraine afloat | Responsible Statecraft https://share.google/6IhQ9dr7eIJyM7YcG
With "economy" on the topic, I have always thought the frozen russuan asset should just be passed onto Ukraine.
But after reading this article, and looking at Europe commitment this year, maybe it's all for the better.
ECB declines to provide emergency liquidity for reparations loan to Ukraine | Euronews https://share.google/X180HxWgtCr6n4fR5
Even then, I am still shocked ECB is not willing to be the backstop, the entire frozen asset will just be a ball to play around in political games
The backstop would most likely needed if Belgium get caught in some large legal cases anyways.
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On December 03 2025 10:36 ETisME wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2025 04:32 Yurie wrote:
A point made by Anders Puck Nielsen was that Russia retaliating might be good for Ukraine. US flailing around is moving attention away from the war and into Russian favored peace deals to end it. So getting attention back to the war from more actors by increased food prices globally (by Russian actions) is good for Ukraine. Putting the focus on more reasonable short term goals like grain deals.
Not his point: It doesn't matter that much to them if their grain exports get blocked a while, EU is bankrolling the war regardless.
It's all rubbish. If war continues and escalate with the peace deal broke down, then oil price will shoot right back to $80 instead of the $60 ever since Trump started the peace negotiations in Feb. That's not a great result, unless Europe starts committing and put their own men on the ground. Combine that with food price going up, what do you think gonna happen? The pressure will always be put on the losing side, Ukraine. Sweden already calling out about nordic nations paying unfair ratio to Ukraine and unsustainable. Right wing parties popping up in popularity in many Europe nations. That alone put a f ton of social/economic cost to political parties in each European nations. It's also why we had been getting nothing but half assed support from EU.
When did we agree that the losing side is Ukraine..?
Also, please share proper links. I'm never going to click on random share links I don't know the destination of
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On December 03 2025 10:36 ETisME wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2025 04:32 Yurie wrote:
A point made by Anders Puck Nielsen was that Russia retaliating might be good for Ukraine. US flailing around is moving attention away from the war and into Russian favored peace deals to end it. So getting attention back to the war from more actors by increased food prices globally (by Russian actions) is good for Ukraine. Putting the focus on more reasonable short term goals like grain deals.
Not his point: It doesn't matter that much to them if their grain exports get blocked a while, EU is bankrolling the war regardless.
It's all rubbish. If war continues and escalate with the peace deal broke down, then oil price will shoot right back to $80 instead of the $60 ever since Trump started the peace negotiations in Feb. That's not a great result, unless Europe starts committing and put their own men on the ground. Combine that with food price going up, what do you think gonna happen? The pressure will always be put on the losing side, Ukraine. Sweden already calling out about nordic nations paying unfair ratio to Ukraine and unsustainable. Right wing parties popping up in popularity in many Europe nations. That alone put a f ton of social/economic cost to political parties in each European nations. It's also why we had been getting nothing but half assed support from EU.
How is the side who have survived 3+ years longer than expected the losing one?
Even if Ukraine were to collapse today, the resulting Russian "victory" would be entirely pyrrhic.
The cope is unreal.
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Also, why would Sweden be calling out that they're doing an unfair amount of aid when they're not even in the top 5 donors?
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Sweden was talking current donations.
Past contributions don't change the strategic situation for the future.
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Also, kind of important to point out: Sweden's foreign minister didn't claim "we are paying too much", his claim is that everyone else is paying too little. He wants the rest of Europe to increase their support, not lower their own. It's entirely the opposite of what ETisME thinks is happening. No one is giving up on Ukraine or claiming they should surrender (other than Trump and Putin). We are here with them until the end. Because fuck Russia and all their sympathizers
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On December 03 2025 17:03 MJG wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2025 10:36 ETisME wrote:On December 03 2025 04:32 Yurie wrote:
A point made by Anders Puck Nielsen was that Russia retaliating might be good for Ukraine. US flailing around is moving attention away from the war and into Russian favored peace deals to end it. So getting attention back to the war from more actors by increased food prices globally (by Russian actions) is good for Ukraine. Putting the focus on more reasonable short term goals like grain deals.
Not his point: It doesn't matter that much to them if their grain exports get blocked a while, EU is bankrolling the war regardless.
It's all rubbish. If war continues and escalate with the peace deal broke down, then oil price will shoot right back to $80 instead of the $60 ever since Trump started the peace negotiations in Feb. That's not a great result, unless Europe starts committing and put their own men on the ground. Combine that with food price going up, what do you think gonna happen? The pressure will always be put on the losing side, Ukraine. Sweden already calling out about nordic nations paying unfair ratio to Ukraine and unsustainable. Right wing parties popping up in popularity in many Europe nations. That alone put a f ton of social/economic cost to political parties in each European nations. It's also why we had been getting nothing but half assed support from EU. How is the side who have survived 3+ years longer than expected the losing one? Even if Ukraine were to collapse today, the resulting Russian "victory" would be entirely pyrrhic. The cope is unreal.
Losing 20% territory is never a win for Ukraine.
But as Dmytro Kuleba said, "The vast majority of wars end either with mutual defeat, or everyone is sure they have won, or other outcomes”
Let's wait till you feel ukraine is winning further, then we can close the argument how much Ukraine or russia is winning
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On December 03 2025 19:02 Excludos wrote:
Also, kind of important to point out: Sweden's foreign minister didn't claim "we are paying too much", his claim is that everyone else is paying too little. He wants the rest of Europe to increase their support, not lower their own. It's entirely the opposite of what ETisME thinks is happening. No one is giving up on Ukraine or claiming they should surrender (other than Trump and Putin). We are here with them until the end. Because fuck Russia and all their sympathizers
Er let's be even more clear.
In the press, she said it is "disproportionate" on Nordic nations and "unsustainable" and that some nations are not contributing enough despite big words and must boost it.
Proportion is a %. Sweden wants a fairer share.
Sweden doesn't see the ratio sustainable.
And Sweden can't dictate how much other European nations can or willing to contribute.
European nations are not fully committing is exactly my point, including incapable to even use frozen russian asset or ECB unwilling to cover for Belgium.
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EPT
