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Macron says new security architecture should give guarantees for Russia (so she can safely continue being an expansionist mafia state)
PARIS, Dec 3 (Reuters) - The West should consider how to address Russia's need for security guarantees if President Vladimir Putin agrees to negotiations about ending the war in Ukraine, French President Emmanuel Macron said in remarks broadcast on Saturday. In an interview with French TV station TF1 recorded during his state visit to the United States last week, Macron said Europe needs to prepare its future security architecture. "This means that one of the essential points we must address - as President Putin has always said - is the fear that NATO comes right up to its doors, and the deployment of weapons that could threaten Russia," Macron said. "That topic will be part of the topics for peace, so we need to prepare what we are ready to do, how we protect our allies and member states, and how to give guarantees to Russia the day it returns to the negotiating table," Macron said. Russia and the United States have both said this week they are open to talks in principle, though U.S. President Joe Biden said he would only talk to Putin if the Kremlin chief showed he was interested in ending the war. Ukraine says negotiations are possible only if Russia stops attacking and pulls out its troops. Many in Ukraine and the West are strongly opposed to any negotiation with Putin that would reward him with concessions after nearly 10 months of war, especially as Ukraine has driven back Russian forces from large areas in the past three months. But Macron's remarks suggested he was sympathetic to Moscow's need for security guarantees - a demand that was the focus of intense but failed diplomacy in the run-up to the war. On Feb. 8, just weeks before Russia's invasion, Putin said at a joint news conference with Macron in Moscow that Russia would keep trying to obtain answers from the West to its main three security demands: no more NATO enlargement; no missile deployments near its borders; and a scaling back of NATO's military infrastructure in Europe to 1997 levels. The United States said at the time that the Russian demands were "non-starters". https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/macron-says-new-security-architecture-should-give-guarantees-russia-2022-12-03/
Britain, we need you back in the EU asap.
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The only guarantees we need to give to Russia is that we will fuck them up if they invade Europe again.
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Macron is either bought and payed for by Russia or an utterly clueless and naïve idiot.
NATO is not a threat if your not interested in invading other countries. Russia is threatened by it because that is the only language they know.
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Doesn't Nato already have shitloads of weapons in place that could threaten Russia? Especially considering that Russia is apparently massively failing in what was considered one of their major strengths, ground war in europe?
Nato could absolutely agree to guarantee that they are not invading Russia, considering Nato has zero interest in doing that. That should be all the "security guarantees" that Russia gets. Russian security gets guaranteed.
Nato should not agree to not help Russias neighbours defend themselves, should they want that. Russia does not get a guaranteed right to fuck over their neighbours. In fact, Nato should say that they are willing to help any country neighbouring Russia in the same way they are currently helping Ukraine.
Nato should not give any credence to the Russian claim that countries willingly joining Nato to no longer be bullied by Russia is somehow a security threat to Russia. It would be an absolute nonissue if Russia wouldn't insist on bullying its neighbours.
Russia doesn't want its security guaranteed. Nukes do that quite well. Russia wants its ability to bully its neighbours guaranteed.
I have no clue why Macron say that nonsense right now.
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Russia literally withdrew its troops from Kaliningrad and borders with Finland and the Baltics. They even moved their air defences from St Petersburg area to Ukraine. That's how threatened by NATO they actually feel. Macron is a moron for playing along with Russia's charade.
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I don't think he's that naive, I think he wants to promote himself as a peacemaker and an independent player instead of a weaker party of American led NATO (or the West in general). He's counting on Putin's willingess to admit limited defeat and wants to build a productive long term relationship with him. This is still naive, but also very egoistic.
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Even if Ukraine recaptures the whole country you still need a negotiated peace. Words are cheap. All you need is for Ukraine to join nato and they are safe. You can give a lot of bullshit guarantees with that to allow Russia to save face.
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On December 04 2022 06:00 CuddlyCuteKitten wrote:
Even if Ukraine recaptures the whole country you still need a negotiated peace. Words are cheap. All you need is for Ukraine to join nato and they are safe. You can give a lot of bullshit guarantees with that to allow Russia to save face.
What Russia means by security guarantees is Ukraine not getting security guarantees/joining NATO. They even go as far as to demand countries like Poland or the Baltics get kicked out of NATO. Russia's demands are incompatible with conditions for lasting peace. The only way to secure lasting peace is through a decisive Russian defeat.
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Its called china. China says that NATO can't invade Russia or its at war with China. That ends the threat to Russia. NATO wasn't in Ukraine before he invaded it, Demanding that Ukraine stay out of NATO is demanding the status quo ante Bellum.
Chinese peacekeepers in the Donbass and Kharkiv wouldn't be a radical concept. Crimea and the donbass was Austria and Czekia, Anything more is poland. I didn't think that France would have forgotten what history has done to the "peace in our time" dude.
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On December 04 2022 10:31 Sermokala wrote:
Its called china. China says that NATO can't invade Russia or its at war with China. That ends the threat to Russia. NATO wasn't in Ukraine before he invaded it, Demanding that Ukraine stay out of NATO is demanding the status quo ante Bellum.
Chinese peacekeepers in the Donbass and Kharkiv wouldn't be a radical concept. Crimea and the donbass was Austria and Czekia, Anything more is poland. I didn't think that France would have forgotten what history has done to the "peace in our time" dude. What would China saying they will defend Russia do exactly that Russia on its own can not? The threat is still the exact same in both cases.
Nukes.
Russia wants to be able to bully its neighbours to force them to stay in its sphere of influence because it has no other way of doing so. It can't entice them with prospects of wealth and prosperity like the West because Russia has no wealth and prosperity outside of the select elite.
That is the reason for this war so any peace deal that stops Russia from bullying Ukraine in the future to prevent them from aligning with the West is unacceptable to Russia.
If Chinese peacekeepers in Donbass prevent Russia from bullying Ukraine then they are unacceptable to Russia.
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China has enough problems on their own turf to get involved anywhere else really.
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Guess this has more to do with morale, as well as spooking the Russians on the other side of the river. Unless this unit was tasked with killing someone in said port. Who knows.
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They seem to wait that infrastructure is restored before striking again, they are running low on ressources but should still be able to be a pain in the ass for as long as they think is necessary. Which by looking at history, seems to be between 4-6 years. After that the war economy crumble totally the country beyond the point of denial.
4-6 years is a long time, and usually during that time, escalation becomes necessary because tactics get more and more dirty, and country helping Ukraine starts to become the new target.
Sadly, all this is autoprofecies. The chances of this happening will force it to happen. Surprise Putin death would change the deal, but new faces won't solve the underlying issue.
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EPT
