EPTThings Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine - Page 481
| Forum Index > General Forum |
NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. | ||
|
Billyboy
2545 Posts
| ||
|
Jankisa
Croatia1795 Posts
On September 17 2025 22:47 Billyboy wrote: So, what I have been saying is that no negotiators have died, but that 5 members of "Hamas Leadership" and one member of Qatar security service have died. That is what your sources confirm. So maybe go re read what I've posted, without the made up angry shit in your head and get back to me. Talks have been pointless for a long time and the main players know it. This is why we have multiple agreements made by negotiators only to have nothing actually happen. Israel's position is that Hamas can not remain in power in Gaza, no matter the cost to the Gazan civilians or their infrastructure. Hamas's position is that they give no fucks about the Gazan civilians or their infrastructure and they are not giving up power or even willing to pretend that they are not solely focused the destruction of Israel and death of all its people, Jews, Christians, wrong think Muslims, atheists whoever. And well this thread has been focused on how Israel bombing some Hamas members in Qatar is a obvious sign that they don't want peace with Hamas, some how it was completely missed that Hamas organizing and executing a terror attack in Jerusalem against only civilian targets is an obvious sign that they do not want peace. You are hilarious man. The quote says "leaders involved in negotiations" but according to your obsessive lack of intellectual humility and pathological inability to admit you were wrong those are not negotiators. Then you go on to just regurgitate Nethyanahu's talking points. There was a 3 phase ceasefire in which phase 3 was the end of war and release of all hostages. Israel signed it, 2 phases were done, people were being fed and not bombed until Israel unilaterally broke that. So, you are, once again, lying to play defense for Israel. I know you won't read it or acknowledge it, bu this is not really disputed by anyone. Hamas is in such a state that it's basically a (by now) scattered collection of terrorist cells, one of them executing a terrorist attack is absolutely expected and a direct result of the insane violence IDF is perpetrating on Gaza and the West bank. Get a grip man. | ||
|
Billyboy
2545 Posts
On September 18 2025 04:23 Jankisa wrote: You are hilarious man. The quote says "leaders involved in negotiations" but according to your obsessive lack of intellectual humility and pathological inability to admit you were wrong those are not negotiators. Then you go on to just regurgitate Nethyanahu's talking points. There was a 3 phase ceasefire in which phase 3 was the end of war and release of all hostages. Israel signed it, 2 phases were done, people were being fed and not bombed until Israel unilaterally broke that. So, you are, once again, lying to play defense for Israel. I know you won't read it or acknowledge it, bu this is not really disputed by anyone. Hamas is in such a state that it's basically a (by now) scattered collection of terrorist cells, one of them executing a terrorist attack is absolutely expected and a direct result of the insane violence IDF is perpetrating on Gaza and the West bank. Get a grip man. None of that is opposed to anything that I have said. Had I said Israel wants peace with Hamas, but it is all Hamas fault I could see your argument having merit. But of course I've never actually said that. I'm kind of curious to what you think I've written, but considering it is all written down and if you were at all interested in an actual discussion you would re read it and Please quote me saying one of Netanyahu's talking points (but this will be the 10+ time that when you can't because you just keep making shit up and then believing it even after you can't), that should be hilarious, since I don't know what they are, and my comments are not remotely pro Israel to anyone that is actually pro-Israel. They might be to people who want to see Israel destroyed from river to sea. | ||
|
Jankisa
Croatia1795 Posts
Other things you haven't acknowledged is the fact that you said they weren't targeting negotiators and when I pointed out the absurdity of calming that when I quoted you "leaders involved in negotiations" being targeted by Israel you, once again, ignored that. They might be to people who want to see Israel destroyed from river to sea. Oh, look, one straight out of the Nethyanahu talking points. Hamas's position is that they give no fucks about the Gazan civilians or their infrastructure and they are not giving up power or even willing to pretend that they are not solely focused the destruction of Israel and death of all its people, Jews, Christians, wrong think Muslims, atheists whoever. Look, another one. Hamas agreed to stop hostilities and release hostages. You and Israelis don't care, you just keep quoting stuff from way before October 7th that has nothing to do with stopping this war. This is regurgitating Nethyanahu's words. See, it's very easy to read and reply to what other people tell you. Unfortunately, your fragile ego doesn't allow you to admit that you are blatantly wrong. You came to this thread and started saying dumb shit, got called out and then started your usual passive aggressive bs, deflections, pretending I'm talking about something else + some sprinkled in Israeli talking points. How original. | ||
|
Billyboy
2545 Posts
On September 18 2025 04:56 Jankisa wrote: How fun, I just said you will not acknowledge that talks haven't been pointless, there was a ceasefire and Israel broke it and you just went right on to do exactly that. Other things you haven't acknowledged is the fact that you said they weren't targeting negotiators and when I pointed out the absurdity of calming that when I quoted you "leaders involved in negotiations" being targeted by Israel you, once again, ignored that. Oh, look, one straight out of the Nethyanahu talking points. Look, another one. Hamas agreed to stop hostilities and release hostages. You and Israelis don't care, you just keep quoting stuff from way before October 7th that has nothing to do with stopping this war. This is regurgitating Nethyanahu's words. See, it's very easy to read and reply to what other people tell you. Unfortunately, your fragile ego doesn't allow you to admit that you are blatantly wrong. You came to this thread and started saying dumb shit, got called out and then started your usual passive aggressive bs, deflections, pretending I'm talking about something else + some sprinkled in Israeli talking points. How original. Those are not Netanyahu's words, they are mine and I've yet to see evidence that it is not true. Can you provide evidence that it is true? Or show that they are Netanyahu's words? What do you believe Hamas is about? What have I gotten wrong? I do get called out for imaginary shit, and I've been overly respectful to you up to this point given all your personal attacks. I said they didn't kill the negotiators and they were not harmed. Which is true. I do think (without direct evidence) that Israel hit their intended targets. They have not missed many in Lebanon or Iran. I've said it before that I believe they were sending a message that they can and will hit anyone anywhere. If you actually took the time to read my posts and what I wrote instead of whatever nonsense you do you would probably have issues with it and then I would be happy to reply. The problem is you just make up shit and then expect me to argue it when it isn't even remotely my point. I've tried going down that rabbit hole before but the problem is you just keep coming back believe the shit you made up before no matter how many times it is proven to not exist. You are basically the lefts version of MAGA and impossible to talk to because you are not attached to reality. | ||
|
Jankisa
Croatia1795 Posts
Seriously, you are either completely detached from reality or just incredibly obtuse to the point where there is no point engaging with you. They have hit a meeting where people who negotiate for Hamas were, killing some, some survived, those people are negotiators. I also didn't say the other thing, I do read posts unlike you, I quoted you many articles and quotes, those words are again, Nethyanahu's. You, once again, ignored everything I wrote about actual facts regarding the negotiations process, because you are an incredibly intellectually cowardly person who cries and feigns victim all the time, which is very much consistent with the movement you are trying to paint people you disagree with here. I honestly feel bad for you, you seem like a very lost and sad person. I'd say you are brainwashed, which you are, but that has nothing to do with the way you argue and engage. You are a child, unable to admit when you write blatantly false things even when provided with direct quotes, unable to engage with any actual points, instead just pushing your "clever" comparison. I hope you seek help, I'll continue posting here but I'll just ignore anything you write because you are a very dishonest and not worth spending any time engaging with. | ||
|
WombaT
Northern Ireland27464 Posts
We’ve had multiple nations claim they’ll not participate in Eurovision if Israel is there. We’ve had pro-Palestinian protests at many stages in the Vuelta cycling race in Spain, and indeed the Prime Minister didn’t just not condemn them, but actively support them. We’ve multiple football associations starting to raise the ‘Israel shouldn’t be playing in European’ question. Frankly I think it’s overdue, and I’ll believe it when I see it, but it does seem to be the way the wind is blowing. | ||
|
Jankisa
Croatia1795 Posts
In the case of Israel I think it does matter a bit more, since Israel is still a pluralistic democracy with access to uncensored internet and world media they can see what is happening. They, and by that I mean most Israeli think of themselves as part of the west and they still, to a certain extent think in a way where they feel some semblance of shame when their government does fucked up shit, as can be seen from the protests, so hopefully as they keep on escalating the EU countries give them enough push back that they start understanding and hopefully not embracing their status as a periah state. | ||
|
Billyboy
2545 Posts
On September 18 2025 21:35 Jankisa wrote: You have a problem. Seriously, you are either completely detached from reality or just incredibly obtuse to the point where there is no point engaging with you. They have hit a meeting where people who negotiate for Hamas were, killing some, some survived, those people are negotiators. I also didn't say the other thing, I do read posts unlike you, I quoted you many articles and quotes, those words are again, Nethyanahu's. You, once again, ignored everything I wrote about actual facts regarding the negotiations process, because you are an incredibly intellectually cowardly person who cries and feigns victim all the time, which is very much consistent with the movement you are trying to paint people you disagree with here. I honestly feel bad for you, you seem like a very lost and sad person. I'd say you are brainwashed, which you are, but that has nothing to do with the way you argue and engage. You are a child, unable to admit when you write blatantly false things even when provided with direct quotes, unable to engage with any actual points, instead just pushing your "clever" comparison. I hope you seek help, I'll continue posting here but I'll just ignore anything you write because you are a very dishonest and not worth spending any time engaging with. Words have meaning, I'm sorry that this upsets you. If Hamas killed Netanyahu or Gallant, no one would say Hamas has killed the negotiators. Negotiators are the people in the room during the negotiation. Next both Israel and Hamas have confirmed none of the Negotiators are dead. Next we know 6 people died that 5 were Hamas and one was Qatar security. Hamas has confirmed that none of those were negotiators and Hamas has said none of the delegation was killed. "We confirm the enemy's failure to assassinate our brothers in the negotiating delegation," it said, without providing any evidence. That reality argues with your world view is not my problem. As for the rest of your projection and occasional rage tantrums, they are amusing in the same way it is when someone loses it when they lose a RTS because of IMBA or in team games when it's always their bad teammates. The lack of emotional maturity does make me grin, but it is tiring and pointless. So I hope you follow through with your threat because it is not intellectual dishonesty on my part to not argue positions that are not mine and you have made up for me. It is not intellectually dishonest of me to use actual definitions of words correctly and you to use your own. I sincerely look forward to not having you respond to me. And I also do hope you sort out whatever is going on your life that makes you so angry and go straight to personal attacks every time someone doesn't agree with you completely. | ||
|
WombaT
Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On September 18 2025 23:32 Jankisa wrote: I mean, Russians were banned and ostracized for a while but most of that has been rolled back as far as I've been paying attention. In the case of Israel I think it does matter a bit more, since Israel is still a pluralistic democracy with access to uncensored internet and world media they can see what is happening. They, and by that I mean most Israeli think of themselves as part of the west and they still, to a certain extent think in a way where they feel some semblance of shame when their government does fucked up shit, as can be seen from the protests, so hopefully as they keep on escalating the EU countries give them enough push back that they start understanding and hopefully not embracing their status as a periah state. Especially given well, Israel is not a European state and was extended such invitations as a favour of sorts to begin with. Perhaps it may prove too divisive a move for pan-European organisations, but perhaps we may at least see more forceful unilateral moves moving forwards. Spain or Ireland being among the more likely candidates | ||
|
Jankisa
Croatia1795 Posts
On September 19 2025 02:44 WombaT wrote: Especially given well, Israel is not a European state and was extended such invitations as a favour of sorts to begin with. Perhaps it may prove too divisive a move for pan-European organisations, but perhaps we may at least see more forceful unilateral moves moving forwards. Spain or Ireland being among the more likely candidates I hear that Russia is organizing Intervision, their own version, so maybe Israel can join them since they certainly belong in that group of countries way more then the Eurovision one. | ||
|
Billyboy
2545 Posts
| ||
|
WombaT
Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On September 19 2025 04:20 Jankisa wrote: I hear that Russia is organizing Intervision, their own version, so maybe Israel can join them since they certainly belong in that group of countries way more then the Eurovision one. I’m gonna assume it’s a Eurovision, but resolutely straight. Good luck with that haha | ||
|
KT_Elwood
Germany1201 Posts
On September 16 2025 03:50 Jankisa wrote: What was Israel up to in Gaza over the weekend: Short video from Al Jazeera More then 1500 homes destroyed. Systematically leveling high rise buildings. Using drones to shoot at a hospital. Displacing 900.000 people ordering them to leave for a camp that does not have enough resources for them. What, exactly does any of this have to do with Hamas? Hamas is always rebuilding from "civilian" infrastructure, they were handed over the control in 2007, kept building rockets from water pipes and diggin tunnels under hospitals and schools and preaching hate to children. Israel is not having it anymore, and as long as they are winning, they going to remove any chances of a Hamas revival - including civilan settlements, that could again fall under Hamas leadership. The world wide response to the IDF is: Crickets and some flags being shown. I was hoping for a hamas capitulation, and a re-education of Gaza - Hamas refuses to give up, they refuse to return hostages as signal for "Good will". Are there racists pigs in Israel. YES. Totally. But I strongly believe that Netanyahu's idea of what a mans life is worth, be it jew or arab is equaly low - a dead arab will give him votes from the right, a dead jew will make voters fearful and give him votes from the left. Hamas leadership is equally cynical. Dead kids: Good for new hate and victimhood, dead jews? Good for motivation. None of the parties is suggesting peace - they still claim the destruction of the opponent is their strategic target here. IDF wins, and continiues, Hamas gets smacked into oblivion.. yet continues. The allies in germany shot any german civilian picking up a wehrmacht rifle. They bombed everything they could to avoid costly and slow urban warfare. They didn't understand why germany wasn't giving up - historians determined that "war" was the last stage of existence for the regime. Their existence would end with the war - so why not pro long it for Months..weeks.. days.. hours. Humans are stupid and cruel. And they somehow build societies that make no sense, make everybody unhappy or dead and yet since "it's the way it is" you seemling have to endure it. That's why all the sociologistsm historians, law experts and psychologist deserve nothing but a kick in the butt. Why, in thousands of years of them researching, haven't they found out how to fix humans? | ||
|
JimmyJRaynor
Canada17939 Posts
On September 18 2025 23:32 Jankisa wrote: I mean, Russians were banned and ostracized for a while but most of that has been rolled back as far as I've been paying attention. the 4 Nations Cup hockey tournament excluded the Russians. Russia is a major hockey power and should've been in the event. On September 19 2025 18:06 KT_Elwood wrote: Why, in thousands of years of them researching, haven't they found out how to fix humans? Humans are not broken. They are behaving congruently to their fundamental nature. Humans are the apex predator of this planet ... or plane if you're a flat-earther. | ||
|
Jankisa
Croatia1795 Posts
Russia invaded Ukraine and Israel took note. Trump did January 6th and got away with it and understood that blatant political violence is now tolerated. Every step of the way humans have been under-reacting to insane shit, and now we are in a state where tens of thousands defenseless people who have nothing to do with Hamas are being slaughtered while people on forums make comparisons to WW2 and argue semantics. People voted for this, people in Israel voted for Nethyanahu and Smotrich and Ben Gvir, I can't do much, but I will not look at Israeli's in the same way ever again. People voted for Putin, time after time after time, they voted for him after he leveled Grozny, they voted for him after he seized Crimea and his "rebbels" downed an airplane full of Europeans, they voted for him after he left hundreds of sailors die horrible deaths in Kursk submarine disaster. People in the US voted for Trump after he was convicted for sexual assault, they voted for him after 2 impeachments and January 6th, they voted for him despite him being "best friends with Epstein". I'll always have love in my life for individuals, but if you are someone I work with, be it American, Israeli or Russian, I will judge you based on who you voted for, and if you voted for this I will work with you but I will have no respect for you and will actively work to distance myself as much as possible from you and yours. You guys can keep on yelling Hamas this, Hamas, that, but the vast majority of Palestinians who are dying every fucking day did not vote for this, the last elections in Gaza were held in 2006, all the children and most adults in Gaza (median age is 18) weren't even alive then. This is not about Hamas, they tried to negotiate, they tried to find a way where they survive and give hostages back, there was a done ceasefire deal, Israel broke it. This all could have been over since May 5th. Israel decided against it, because of their, according to most experts, unachievable goal of exterminating an organization that with every murdered child, every tank shell hitting a hospital and killing nurses, responders and journalist, every bomb in a refugee camp, every child sniped at a food gathering point gets more and more recruits. It's a perpetual conflict, and Israel wants it like that. This is not about humans being broken, it's about a number of broken humans trying to kill as many of "the enemy" as they can while caring about absolutely nothing else. | ||
|
Sermokala
United States14211 Posts
The level of cultural damage to the image of russia and Isreal is pretty similar I would say. As much as Trump wanted to make putin his public friend you're not going to get over the warcrimes footage being so plentiful and in such high quality. | ||
|
Billyboy
2545 Posts
On September 19 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote: States go as far as the other, more powerful states allow them to. Russia invaded Ukraine and Israel took note. Trump did January 6th and got away with it and understood that blatant political violence is now tolerated. Every step of the way humans have been under-reacting to insane shit, and now we are in a state where tens of thousands defenseless people who have nothing to do with Hamas are being slaughtered while people on forums make comparisons to WW2 and argue semantics. People voted for this, people in Israel voted for Nethyanahu and Smotrich and Ben Gvir, I can't do much, but I will not look at Israeli's in the same way ever again. People voted for Putin, time after time after time, they voted for him after he leveled Grozny, they voted for him after he seized Crimea and his "rebbels" downed an airplane full of Europeans, they voted for him after he left hundreds of sailors die horrible deaths in Kursk submarine disaster. People in the US voted for Trump after he was convicted for sexual assault, they voted for him after 2 impeachments and January 6th, they voted for him despite him being "best friends with Epstein". I'll always have love in my life for individuals, but if you are someone I work with, be it American, Israeli or Russian, I will judge you based on who you voted for, and if you voted for this I will work with you but I will have no respect for you and will actively work to distance myself as much as possible from you and yours. You guys can keep on yelling Hamas this, Hamas, that, but the vast majority of Palestinians who are dying every fucking day did not vote for this, the last elections in Gaza were held in 2006, all the children and most adults in Gaza (median age is 18) weren't even alive then. This is not about Hamas, they tried to negotiate, they tried to find a way where they survive and give hostages back, there was a done ceasefire deal, Israel broke it. This all could have been over since May 5th. Israel decided against it, because of their, according to most experts, unachievable goal of exterminating an organization that with every murdered child, every tank shell hitting a hospital and killing nurses, responders and journalist, every bomb in a refugee camp, every child sniped at a food gathering point gets more and more recruits. It's a perpetual conflict, and Israel wants it like that. This is not about humans being broken, it's about a number of broken humans trying to kill as many of "the enemy" as they can while caring about absolutely nothing else. There is so much wrong with this post and much of what you post, but you really jumped the shark with Putin being democratically elected. Whatever media you are consuming you need to stop. You might already be to far gone, but if there is hope it will require you to stop all social media and youtube. Good luck! | ||
|
PremoBeats
659 Posts
On September 14 2025 00:19 Nebuchad wrote: If you want to come back to the conversation, answer why you think that having good food and being hospitable, when you also want to oppress women and kill infidels and minorities, makes you morally "good but not as good as the West", as opposed to, you know, "evil". No, I don't want to come back to this conversation, as I explained everything I had to say to you in the post you circumcised once again. As others understand my POV, I am content with that post and if you are still not able to grasp what I am saying, there is nothing I can do. Plus, as you already admitted to only accepting Islamophobia as my motive and are only discussing with me to set traps as you wrote before, I don't see much sense in talking to you. On September 14 2025 02:18 Magic Powers wrote: I'm arguing the inverse. I'm not trying to justify Palestinian terrorism such as that of Hamas. I am trying to show that the alleged "superior morality" is more of a myth, because I think it's a consequence of the circumstances (or the lack of certain circumstances). The immoral fraction of a population is revealed under certain pressures. Sometimes the pressure is real and tangible, other times it's propaganda that causes radicalism. Sometimes both. When we don't observe the immorality of a population, that's what I consider the true oddity. Many people are immoral, and the chance of a person developing immoral values is equal given that the circumstances are also equal. So why don't we see equal immorality in every population? It is an oddity, not a normality. It could be that people are well fed when growing up in a wealthier region and thus have less reason to act out. It could be that they're less exposed to lies and misinformation of a propaganda campaign. Or sometimes we don't notice their immorality because we're blind to it (e.g. it remains unreported or we close our eyes to it), but the people exist nonetheless. I believe in something akin to the tabula rasa. The realization that a population doesn't show the same immorality as some other populations makes me understand that immorality is created, not born. I get what you’re saying, though I’m still not sure about calling the outcome a “myth” even if it’s shaped by circumstances. The same as in your IQ example, the manager’s higher score may be due to upbringing or environment, but the difference is still a real outcome we have to deal with. I feel the same with morality - even if context explains it, the results aren’t just an illusion. On non-immorality being an “oddity,” I tend to be a bit more optimistic. We see plenty of cooperation and kindness in everyday life, so I’d consider that the norm rather than the exception. That said, I really agree with you that context is crucial for understanding why practices exist and how to change them. Since you’re not using it as an excuse, I don’t see a conflict. I’d just be curious how you see the role of individual responsibility if immorality is mainly circumstance-driven. On September 17 2025 17:21 Jankisa wrote: You can, as you often do, insult people who disagree with you Although not directed at me, this is pretty rich coming from someone who equated me to a holocaust denier a couple of pages ago, don't you think? Jankisa wrote: There was a 3 phase ceasefire in which phase 3 was the end of war and release of all hostages. Israel signed it, 2 phases were done, people were being fed and not bombed until Israel unilaterally broke that. So, you are, once again, lying to play defense for Israel. There was no consensus or completed agreement to move into phase 2. Hamas and Israel rejected proposals each side viewed as deviations and phase 1 expired without phase 2 being actually agreed upon. I think it would be more accurate to say that Israel made decisions after phasr 1 ended when Hamas did not agree to some terms or where Israel saw no agreed phase 2 under its conditions. Both side accuse the other of violations, but the agreement was conditional from the start and was not put on paper completely until phase 3. It was a process in stages, but each step was build on the other. Phase 2 should include a permanent ceasefire... as that was never agreed upon, I don't understand how phase 2 should have ended successfully. And to simply give you a glimpse of the "fairness" of this agreement: 33 Israeli hostages (25 alive, 8 dead) were released in return for 2k - in part life long - prisoners. Mind you, the faction who got a much better deal is the massively losing side in this war, that they started. | ||
|
Nebuchad
Switzerland12582 Posts
On September 20 2025 02:25 PremoBeats wrote: No, I don't want to come back to this conversation, as I explained everything I had to say to you in the post you circumcised once again. As others understand my POV, I am content with that post and if you are still not able to grasp what I am saying, there is nothing I can do. Plus, as you already admitted to only accepting Islamophobia as my motive and are only discussing with me to set traps as you wrote before, I don't see much sense in talking to you. Then don't do it, I can't stop you and wouldn't want to. This is, once again, you, talking to me. | ||
| ||
