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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
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On September 15 2022 04:12 NewSunshine wrote:
I've noticed that Conservatives are leaning into their victim complexes more than ever. From "we are all domestic terrorists" to Hannity's stroll down the memory lane of crime, to basically every time Tucker Carlson opens his mouth. They think if they exaggerate all the shit that people are saying about them, people will backtrack and show pity or something. "Those stinky Democrats are being so mean to me, they called me by my name".
Of course, the scary part of just admitting everything out loud is that when your brainwashed followers don't bat an eye, you're basically home-free at that point. They're literally calling to instate Christian Nationalism through the use of violence and by ignoring the will of the voters and usurping power for themselves. And at this point the Republican voters don't question it. They're on board.
I finally got a true US conservative to discuss with me. I reached out in a very polite way and got some interesting points of view. One of them was he never saw the US as a democracy, and regarded "dictatorship of a majority" as a horrible thing which was in the way of abolishing slavery. I tried to say that minority rule is worse, but it was no way to get through, especially as the DEMs currently has triple power.
On the flip side, he did not regard the January 7th incident a conservative event, and he did regard parts of the far right as a danger to his values, especially autharian leaders taking away individual freedom.
Sorry I did not have the patience to continue the discussion, but
I feel very happy that we got a sensible conversation going!
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On September 15 2022 06:04 Slydie wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2022 04:12 NewSunshine wrote:
I've noticed that Conservatives are leaning into their victim complexes more than ever. From "we are all domestic terrorists" to Hannity's stroll down the memory lane of crime, to basically every time Tucker Carlson opens his mouth. They think if they exaggerate all the shit that people are saying about them, people will backtrack and show pity or something. "Those stinky Democrats are being so mean to me, they called me by my name".
Of course, the scary part of just admitting everything out loud is that when your brainwashed followers don't bat an eye, you're basically home-free at that point. They're literally calling to instate Christian Nationalism through the use of violence and by ignoring the will of the voters and usurping power for themselves. And at this point the Republican voters don't question it. They're on board. I finally got a true US conservative to discuss with me. I reached out in a very polite way and got some interesting points of view. One of them was he never saw the US as a democracy, and regarded "dictatorship of a majority" as a horrible thing which was in the way of abolishing slavery. I tried to say that minority rule is worse, but it was no way to get through, especially as the DEMs currently has triple power. On the flip side, he did not regard the January 7th incident a conservative event, and he did regard parts of the far right as a danger to his values, especially autharian leaders taking away individual freedom. Sorry I did not have the patience to continue the discussion, but I feel very happy that we got a sensible conversation going! If he doesn't view America as a real democracy and fears the dictatorship of the majority, does that mean he would support election reform, most notably a removal of FPTP to turn the US into a multi party system?
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On September 15 2022 06:04 Slydie wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2022 04:12 NewSunshine wrote:
I've noticed that Conservatives are leaning into their victim complexes more than ever. From "we are all domestic terrorists" to Hannity's stroll down the memory lane of crime, to basically every time Tucker Carlson opens his mouth. They think if they exaggerate all the shit that people are saying about them, people will backtrack and show pity or something. "Those stinky Democrats are being so mean to me, they called me by my name".
Of course, the scary part of just admitting everything out loud is that when your brainwashed followers don't bat an eye, you're basically home-free at that point. They're literally calling to instate Christian Nationalism through the use of violence and by ignoring the will of the voters and usurping power for themselves. And at this point the Republican voters don't question it. They're on board. I finally got a true US conservative to discuss with me. I reached out in a very polite way and got some interesting points of view. One of them was he never saw the US as a democracy, and regarded "dictatorship of a majority" as a horrible thing which was in the way of abolishing slavery. I tried to say that minority rule is worse, but it was no way to get through, especially as the DEMs currently has triple power. On the flip side, he did not regard the January 7th incident a conservative event, and he did regard parts of the far right as a danger to his values, especially autharian leaders taking away individual freedom. Sorry I did not have the patience to continue the discussion, but I feel very happy that we got a sensible conversation going!
You were very brave. Not just anyone can look into the box.
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Biden stops a crippling strike from occurring. Big victory I was not expecting to happen. Came really down to the wire but the economy isn't going to collapse.
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On September 16 2022 02:09 Sermokala wrote:
Biden stops a crippling strike from occurring. Big victory I was not expecting to happen. Came really down to the wire but the economy isn't going to collapse.
I'm eager to see how this effects the polls. A nice bump in support from the working class right before the midterms would help a lot.
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The governors of Texas and Florida have been sending illegal immigrants on buses and planes to progressive cities in the Northeast. Really feels like a win-win for everyone. The border states get to lessen the strain that illegal immigration puts on them, the illegal immigrants get access to resources in wealthy cities, and the progressive in those cities get to move beyond virtue signaling and actively help those less fortunate than them that cross the border looking for a better life. Win-win-win.
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United States24813 Posts
Lying to them about where they are going and then intentionally transporting them somewhere that is particularly challenging to support them (e.g., a small summer-focused island in september), without providing any notification ahead of time to the receiving people, is something you support? Just to check.
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On September 17 2022 08:34 micronesia wrote:
Lying to them about where they are going and then intentionally transporting them somewhere that is particularly challenging to support them (e.g., a small summer-focused island in september), without providing any notification ahead of time to the receiving people, is something you support? Just to check.
Don't forget the waste of tax-payer dollars to do this. Conservatives are now spending money to keep illegal immigrants in the US just to own the libs. Truly a party of principles.
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It's incredible to see just human trafficking being considered a win for conservatives. The disgusting fact that a governor in one state paid per head for people to be rounded up and transported in another state, explicitly told them that they were going to post on, and then decided to tell fox news so they would be there as they got off the bus but never notified what they were doing to the locals.
Keep in mind that they trafficed these people to a town that is super seasonal and waited until after the tourist season to ship human beings for a political stunt. Desantis took a 2 year old that had to travel on foot from Venezuela and decided the "win" situation was to use them as a political prop.
Keep in mind this isn't a new strategy for conservatives. The kkk did the same thing, the difference is at least they didn't think it was something to brag about nationally.
Child trafficking blackjack that's what you're supporting.
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Another thing thats scummy as hell is that Desantis specifically targeted Venezuelan asylum seekers that have legal status in the country for 2 more years.
I say again these were not illegal immigrants and they were explicitly "vetted" to be trafficked across the country with no notification to the destination nor to the human beings that were being used as political props. He broke the rules of the budget that was enacted for the state by spending it on asylum seekers in another state. They have repeatedly stated that they expected these areas targeted by them to reject the legally residing asylum seekers and to treat them as poorly as republicans would treat them.
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On September 17 2022 09:46 Sermokala wrote:
It's incredible to see just human trafficking being considered a win for conservatives. The disgusting fact that a governor in one state paid per head for people to be rounded up and transported in another state, explicitly told them that they were going to post on, and then decided to tell fox news so they would be there as they got off the bus but never notified what they were doing to the locals.
Keep in mind that they trafficed these people to a town that is super seasonal and waited until after the tourist season to ship human beings for a political stunt. Desantis took a 2 year old that had to travel on foot from Venezuela and decided the "win" situation was to use them as a political prop.
Keep in mind this isn't a new strategy for conservatives. The kkk did the same thing, the difference is at least they didn't think it was something to brag about nationally.
Child trafficking blackjack that's what you're supporting.
Ever since Obama the only concern has been owning libs. The resentment they felt from Obama will last generations.
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On September 17 2022 12:20 Mohdoo wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2022 09:46 Sermokala wrote:
It's incredible to see just human trafficking being considered a win for conservatives. The disgusting fact that a governor in one state paid per head for people to be rounded up and transported in another state, explicitly told them that they were going to post on, and then decided to tell fox news so they would be there as they got off the bus but never notified what they were doing to the locals.
Keep in mind that they trafficed these people to a town that is super seasonal and waited until after the tourist season to ship human beings for a political stunt. Desantis took a 2 year old that had to travel on foot from Venezuela and decided the "win" situation was to use them as a political prop.
Keep in mind this isn't a new strategy for conservatives. The kkk did the same thing, the difference is at least they didn't think it was something to brag about nationally.
Child trafficking blackjack that's what you're supporting. Ever since Obama the only concern has been owning libs. The resentment they felt from Obama will last generations.
Well and their schtick can't suddenly stop being "anything to own the libs" now that the black president is out of office. Word might slip out. Republicans are a walking sunk cost fallacy at this point.
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On September 17 2022 12:42 NewSunshine wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2022 12:20 Mohdoo wrote:On September 17 2022 09:46 Sermokala wrote:
It's incredible to see just human trafficking being considered a win for conservatives. The disgusting fact that a governor in one state paid per head for people to be rounded up and transported in another state, explicitly told them that they were going to post on, and then decided to tell fox news so they would be there as they got off the bus but never notified what they were doing to the locals.
Keep in mind that they trafficed these people to a town that is super seasonal and waited until after the tourist season to ship human beings for a political stunt. Desantis took a 2 year old that had to travel on foot from Venezuela and decided the "win" situation was to use them as a political prop.
Keep in mind this isn't a new strategy for conservatives. The kkk did the same thing, the difference is at least they didn't think it was something to brag about nationally.
Child trafficking blackjack that's what you're supporting. Ever since Obama the only concern has been owning libs. The resentment they felt from Obama will last generations. Well and their schtick can't suddenly stop being "anything to own the libs" now that the black president is out of office. Word might slip out. Republicans are a walking sunk cost fallacy at this point.
the GOP has great policies like:
"banning teaching trangender" - what does that mean?
"banning CRT" - oh ok, that college level academic lens, how will that be solved? maybe through better ideas? ... nah just ban it?
"closing the border" - oh ok, so like what we have, nothings changed practically? about the same stopped at the border, amazin.
"stolen election" oh yeah, that one - bye reality
"climate change is a hoax we need good energy" - oh like Texas? and also, climate change is going to be the single biggest issue by the end of this century, but sure, lets just say its a hoax. goodbye reality x1000. if only the scientific community didnt ban all peer reviewed studies showing its a hoax! the childish view of these fucks.
There's no solutions. Cancelling student debt, infrastructure bill, inflation bill, etc. All vote NO. Suggestions? NO. We vote NO for VOTES.
They had 8 fucking years to put forth a better solution to ACA, and when push came to shove, simply cancelling it, leaving tens of millions without coverage was the answer. If only that "not a war hero, i like people who werent shot down and tortured" hadn't nixed it.
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Trump was literally the moment when Republicans got sick of being told they couldn't just be fascists in public. They were sick of having to be merely closet racists, misogynists and homophobes, they wanted to finally stretch their legs out and really flex their glutes, where everyone can see their whole ass. Their entire identity at the moment is just saying fuck you to anyone who asks them to be decent people.
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On September 17 2022 08:34 micronesia wrote:
Lying to them about where they are going and then intentionally transporting them somewhere that is particularly challenging to support them (e.g., a small summer-focused island in september), without providing any notification ahead of time to the receiving people, is something you support? Just to check.
Obviously people shouldn't be lied to. There's some reports that the people that went to Martha's vineyard were misled but the evidence is not great. Most of the migrants in these stunts went via bus and it's clear that most of them went voluntarily and knew where they were going. These migrants are certainly being used as political pawns but they aren't as dumb and helpless as the media is trying to portray them as. CNN reports many are glad to get on the buses
https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/19/us/texas-migrants-bus-washington-dc-new-york/index.html
A telemundo reporter that spoke to the migrant's at Martha's vineyard told MSNBC that they are thanking Governor DeSantis for sending them there.
'I can tell you, they're not angry at Ron DeSantis,' Rooney said on Thursday after speaking with some of the migrants. 'They are actually thanking him for having brought them to Martha's Vineyard.'
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/telemundo-reporter-says-migrants-flown-to-martha-s-vineyard-by-ron-desantis-are-glad/ar-AA11V0K1?li=BBnbcA1
So yes I consider it a win. They have been well received and well cared for, how is that not better than being deported or stuck in a detention center in legal purgatory? Is that what you support?
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Considering what these folks have been through a trip to MV must be like a god send. Also when you get there its the most accepting people in all of human kind, who ALSO have nearly the MOST wealth of all people in human kind. What a god send to these folks
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+ Show Spoiler +https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/16/politics/marthas-vineyard-migrants-shelter-desantis/index.html
Oh jeeze they had them sent to a military base, I guess there wasn't enough room in MV after tourist season, no place to put them up.
Seriously though I don't like using people as political tools but that's exactly what the democrats(and others) have done for years, Very unfortunate.
As far as illegal? no idea not a lawyer but it seems the Biden admin has been doing this for the last 2 years.
+ Show Spoiler +https://nypost.com/2021/10/18/biden-secretly-flying-underage-migrants-into-ny-in-dead-of-night/
And the reaction from folks here is pretty much par for the course so far. Personally I think sending people to MV is a stunt. It was only 50 folks, but that's likely 50 too many. That said people being sent to DC and CHI are being met with the same response.
Push open borders ( like the koch brothers) and every Democrat in my lifetime-ish and get this kind of push back. Problem with Neo-libs-cons is that they don't want to reap what they sow.
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United States24813 Posts
On September 17 2022 18:27 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2022 08:34 micronesia wrote:
Lying to them about where they are going and then intentionally transporting them somewhere that is particularly challenging to support them (e.g., a small summer-focused island in september), without providing any notification ahead of time to the receiving people, is something you support? Just to check. Obviously people shouldn't be lied to. There's some reports that the people that went to Martha's vineyard were misled but the evidence is not great. Most of the migrants in these stunts went via bus and it's clear that most of them went voluntarily and knew where they were going. These migrants are certainly being used as political pawns but they aren't as dumb and helpless as the media is trying to portray them as. CNN reports many are glad to get on the buses https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/19/us/texas-migrants-bus-washington-dc-new-york/index.htmlA telemundo reporter that spoke to the migrant's at Martha's vineyard told MSNBC that they are thanking Governor DeSantis for sending them there. Show nested quote +'I can tell you, they're not angry at Ron DeSantis,' Rooney said on Thursday after speaking with some of the migrants. 'They are actually thanking him for having brought them to Martha's Vineyard.' https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/telemundo-reporter-says-migrants-flown-to-martha-s-vineyard-by-ron-desantis-are-glad/ar-AA11V0K1?li=BBnbcA1So yes I consider it a win. They have been well received and well cared for, how is that not better than being deported or stuck in a detention center in legal purgatory? Is that what you support?
Interesting how I'm asking you if you support it, and you identify it as a win. Your repeated attempts to bend or disregard the inconvenient facts and shift the language are telling.
I'm probably wasting my virtual breath, but take a step back and think of all the horrible things you could accomplish with the logic you just tried to use at the end of your post.
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This is literally kidnapping to lie to people to get them on a bus and then ship them somewhere else. What Biden has been doing is actually doing what was promised and belong them.
The legally documented and processed asylum seekers were told wrong information on purpose in order to make it as hard as possible for them to stay in the country.
They were shipped to an emergency disaster shelter on the island that is used when a lot of people need shelter. A blue state has this because they're not monsters and care a kit people.
Republicans support human trafficking and consider it a win. What more can we really accept from these people.
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EPT
