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We are extremely close to shutting down this thread for the same reasons the PUA thread was shut down. While some of the time this thread contains actual discussion with people asking help and people giving nice advice, it often gets derailed by rubbish that should not be here. The moderation team will be trying to steer this thread in a different direction from now on.
Posts of the following nature are banned:
1) ANYTHING regarding PUA. If your post contains the words 'alpha' or 'beta' or anything of that sort please don't hit post.
2) Stupid brags. You can tell us about your nice success stories with someone, but posts such as 'lol 50 Tinder matches' are a no-no.
3) Any misogynistic bullshit, including discussion about rape culture.
4) One night stands and random sex. These are basically brags that invariably devolve into gender role discussions and misogynistic comments.
Last chance, guys. This thread is for dating advice and sharing dating stories. While gender roles, sociocultural norms, and our biological imperative to reproduce are all tangentially related, these subjects are not the main purpose of the thread. Please AVOID these discussions. If you want to discuss them at length, go to PMs or start a blog. If you disagree with someone's ideologies, state that you disagree with them and why they won't work from a dating standpoint and move on. We will not tolerate any lengthy derailments that aren't directly about dating. |
On June 03 2016 05:10 IgnE wrote:
its not needy to ask someone out. i cant tell you how many conversations ive had with girls who complain that men cant ask them out in person and then a couple days later they get a friend invite request and a meek date request, or that guys online spend days carrying on inane conversations instead of just asking them out. they are on an online DATING website, they are expecting you to ask them out.
this isnt some pua-ish lemon advice im giving that involves rules about how you MUST ask the girl out after X and before Y. Im giving this advice because the dude was saying that talking forever to someone he hadnt met felt awkward but he didnt know if it was ok to ask them out and end the spiral of lame text conversation. the answer is yes, you can ask someone out way earlier than you think you can in online dating and there is no pressure to continue talking the werk leading up to the date. the worst that usually happens if you ask out too soon is that the girl will say she wants to ask you some more things or whatever.
I hate the be to repeat myself, but like every other personal interaction or situation, it's all case by case.
The first women you liked might like it you ask her out immediately, but you aren't really feeling it (maybe you had a bad day, or you think she's coming on too strong) so you stall and it fades.
The second women might not feel that comfortable yet and you get rejected because you feel like there's a click.
The third one hit the spark immediately and you make plans the night you start your convo.
The fourth one warms up slower and you're okay with that.
First 2 are duds, while they could or couldn't have been a succes if you did succeed in getting to actually meet her
The last 2 are a success in the sense you got to meet them, yet you don't know how it'll evolve.
Obviously it's grossly oversimplified and there are probably some more cases you could identify. It's entirely dependent on what your mindset is on that day (or how it has been for a certain time) and what hers is. Some people are kind of slow to open up, others can't be more open. Some people are in need for someone, while others are fine with where they are, but think it might be time to kinda start getting into it.
There probably could be a magic script that does every action you could make (the right line, the right timing, ..) so you could initiate the perfect relationship based on those things, but the beauty of a relationship (friend or love) is based on the random, coincidental, surprising interaction you have with eachother. You discover things that make you intrigued, while there were things that intrigued you from the start.
It's definitely not easy though, that's why experience is kind of important so you can kind of start to know what the line is for yourself and what the signs are for when you may feel like you could maybe be able to initiate a next step 
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On June 03 2016 03:03 IgnE wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2016 02:07 Volband wrote:
I suppose I can, I just want to be wary not to make the mistake to like them too much before we meet. Dont listen to DPB he has no idea what he's talking about.
DPB has more ideas than you can possibly know, son. DPB is the fucking man. DPB has it all figured out. I don't know you IgnE, but I know that DPB isn't a man to be spoken about in this manner because frankly you couldn't be further from the truth.
#DPB4Prez
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On June 03 2016 07:57 Jealous wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2016 03:03 IgnE wrote:On June 03 2016 02:07 Volband wrote:
I suppose I can, I just want to be wary not to make the mistake to like them too much before we meet. Dont listen to DPB he has no idea what he's talking about. DPB has more ideas than you can possibly know, son. DPB is the fucking man. DPB has it all figured out. I don't know you IgnE, but I know that DPB isn't a man to be spoken about in this manner because frankly you couldn't be further from the truth. #DPB4Prez
Hahahahaha
1. I miss you  PPL/SSB this summer?
2. I definitely have most things figured out- for myself and for my situation! I'm just doing my best trying to pass on my anecdotal wisdom to others, just like everyone else
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On June 03 2016 07:39 Uldridge wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2016 05:10 IgnE wrote:
its not needy to ask someone out. i cant tell you how many conversations ive had with girls who complain that men cant ask them out in person and then a couple days later they get a friend invite request and a meek date request, or that guys online spend days carrying on inane conversations instead of just asking them out. they are on an online DATING website, they are expecting you to ask them out.
this isnt some pua-ish lemon advice im giving that involves rules about how you MUST ask the girl out after X and before Y. Im giving this advice because the dude was saying that talking forever to someone he hadnt met felt awkward but he didnt know if it was ok to ask them out and end the spiral of lame text conversation. the answer is yes, you can ask someone out way earlier than you think you can in online dating and there is no pressure to continue talking the werk leading up to the date. the worst that usually happens if you ask out too soon is that the girl will say she wants to ask you some more things or whatever. I hate the be to repeat myself, but like every other personal interaction or situation, it's all case by case. The first women you liked might like it you ask her out immediately, but you aren't really feeling it (maybe you had a bad day, or you think she's coming on too strong) so you stall and it fades. The second women might not feel that comfortable yet and you get rejected because you feel like there's a click. The third one hit the spark immediately and you make plans the night you start your convo. The fourth one warms up slower and you're okay with that. First 2 are duds, while they could or couldn't have been a succes if you did succeed in getting to actually meet her The last 2 are a success in the sense you got to meet them, yet you don't know how it'll evolve. Obviously it's grossly oversimplified and there are probably some more cases you could identify. It's entirely dependent on what your mindset is on that day (or how it has been for a certain time) and what hers is. Some people are kind of slow to open up, others can't be more open. Some people are in need for someone, while others are fine with where they are, but think it might be time to kinda start getting into it. There probably could be a magic script that does every action you could make (the right line, the right timing, ..) so you could initiate the perfect relationship based on those things, but the beauty of a relationship (friend or love) is based on the random, coincidental, surprising interaction you have with eachother. You discover things that make you intrigued, while there were things that intrigued you from the start. It's definitely not easy though, that's why experience is kind of important so you can kind of start to know what the line is for yourself and what the signs are for when you may feel like you could maybe be able to initiate a next step
I don't know what this post is about, but it's not about my comments. It sounds more like the conclusion to a New Age dating seminar.
On June 03 2016 08:14 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2016 07:57 Jealous wrote:On June 03 2016 03:03 IgnE wrote:On June 03 2016 02:07 Volband wrote:
I suppose I can, I just want to be wary not to make the mistake to like them too much before we meet. Dont listen to DPB he has no idea what he's talking about. DPB has more ideas than you can possibly know, son. DPB is the fucking man. DPB has it all figured out. I don't know you IgnE, but I know that DPB isn't a man to be spoken about in this manner because frankly you couldn't be further from the truth. #DPB4Prez Hahahahaha 1. I miss you PPL/SSB this summer? 2. I definitely have most things figured out- for myself and for my situation! I'm just doing my best trying to pass on my anecdotal wisdom to others, just like everyone else
So how many online dates have you been on?
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I was mostly responding to the first part of your post. But also to the more general theme your post was based upon: the "when of asking someone out". I guess I shouldn't have quoted you then, my bad.
It's a dating website, sure, but that doesn't mean that dating entails the same thing for everyone, nor does the concept of dating stay the same through time. So I offered some examples why it's entirely a grey area where you should ask someone on the date. So experience is the single most valid parameter you can go on (or luck I guess)
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I agree with Uldridge. Everyone's experience is different, and one shouldn't feel forced into immediately asking someone out on a date after their very first conversation. This is true regardless of whether that first conversation happened in person or online, so having successful dating experience is what's important, regardless of the medium.
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who is feeling forced into immediately asking someone out? did you guys even read volband's post?
next time someone posts: "i just want to have really long conversations for a month or two with women before i even attempt to ask them out, but they keep losing interest" you guys are free to chime in with your "its all a grey area, do whatever you feel" bromides.
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On June 03 2016 10:01 IgnE wrote:
who is feeling forced into immediately asking someone out? did you guys even read volband's post?
next time someone posts: "i just want to have really long conversations for a month or two with women before i even attempt to ask them out, but they keep losing interest" you guys are free to chime in with your "its all a grey area, do whatever you feel" bromides.
Because when I said "a few days" I totally meant "a few months", and when I said that he can totally go for it if they're up for meeting right away, I totally meant the opposite...
I should keep you around for all my translations during Opposite Day. Thanks
You know that you're allowed to offer advice without saying things like "Don't listen to X; he has no idea what he's talking about", right? That also forces you into a corner where you're "supposed" to disagree with them now (because they supposedly have no idea what they're talking about), which doesn't always happen and you end up strawmanning other people's suggestions to try to make it sound like you're the only one with good ideas. You're allowed to have good suggestions, as are other people's... you don't need to shoot down others to make your point
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So volband wants to ask ASAP and doesn't want to engage in further awkward text conversations before the meetup and your advice is:
On June 03 2016 01:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:I'd give it a few days before asking to meet them... have a second and third and possibly fourth conversation. Build up a larger sample size of dialogue If she wants one right away, then go for it! Can't you continue to have normal discussions between the day you set the meeting date and the actual meeting date? Just keep having normal conversation.
You have never been on an online date before and you seemingly haven't really heard Volband's question (i.e. "How soon can I ask someone out on a date? I want to ask now"). Originally I was jesting with you, but now it's just like what are we even talking about? If every conversation in this thread just devolves into "hey try and make conversation and do what feels right and everything will turn out ok eventually if not with this girl than with the next one" then what's the point? I think if you went back and read my posts you'd find they were all measured responses.
Also, dude, strawmanning is not the preferred nomenclature. Hyperbole, please.
Every time someone responds to hyperbole and satire on this site with "you are strawmanning me, we can all be right! why are we fighting?!" I just want to blow my brains out.
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Okay first off, a girl is not missing out an amazing opportunity - you're probably shit for her if she says no and vice versa.
People are either compatible or they are not with shades of grey (50? Giggity). You're not good or bad, you can be just compatible or not, there can be zero ego involved.
And yeah damn you had the connection somewhat online, you better ask her out soon son, it's not about winning or losing here, it's about finding someone that really matches you closely in every way unless you are after a quick fuck or a mediocre relationship with on-off, drama, breaking up getting back together... And there's no way to find out than to actually see her, in person and no online conversation is going to change that.
The girls I've been personally seeing have been out of 1-2 messages on more detailed sites like badoo, and 3-5 on sites like Tinder. And then I realized even that's too ineffective and met my awesome gf IRL
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DPB, your advice, in the context of Volband's post, was straight up awful. 
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What did I say? DPB is so far into the dating game that he is on an epic god S tier of dating. DPB's words on dating are gospel. I won't share personal details but I know for a fact he's had more success in the dating world than you have because you are asking for a quantitative analysis of online dates. His experience is much deeper than that, fam. Back up. Your judgment of "your advice sux because I said so" has no substance whatsoever. Your argument does not hold water. All you're saying is "I don't agree! " and nothing else - why should anyone care what you agree with or do not when you present no backing logic or testament? You're hot air. A breeze would wisp your presence away. Construct a better argument and contend with the man, the myth, the legend, DPB.
EDIT: DPB, this month, something along those lines will go down
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That's not all I said, fam. Check yourself before you wreck yourself.
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On June 03 2016 12:04 Jealous wrote:+ Show Spoiler +What did I say? DPB is so far into the dating game that he is on an epic god S tier of dating. DPB's words on dating are gospel. I won't share personal details but I know for a fact he's had more success in the dating world than you have because you are asking for a quantitative analysis of online dates. His experience is much deeper than that, fam. Back up. Your judgment of "your advice sux because I said so" has no substance whatsoever. Your argument does not hold water. All you're saying is "I don't agree! " and nothing else - why should anyone care what you agree with or do not when you present no backing logic or testament? You're hot air. A breeze would wisp your presence away. Construct a better argument and contend with the man, the myth, the legend, DPB. EDIT: DPB, this month, something along those lines will go down
I'm not even sure if this post is sarcasm or not lol.
Anyway, please let's not devolve this thread into arguments like these, would appreciate more to keep hearing about people's struggles, victories, happiness and sadness in the dating scene. All while a framework of people are trying to give some words to consider, or new ways to look at things.
If Volband wants to play fast ball, he can do that, sure.
If he's not completely comfortable with that, he shouldn't play fast ball.
Ofcourse everything that isn't comfortable at first, can become comfortable, that's why getting out of his comfort zone can be so expanding, yet it can still be that even after he got the experience (of let's say asking out people after 1-2 messages, just to take Lemon's example); that this is just not his cup of tea. Maybe he's not as straightforward as Lemon. And that's completely fine.
What he does have to try to do, however, is try to find his own sweet spot, where he can kinda know/tell when the time is right to ask her out. If that's in the first message, or after the second or even n-th. Sometimes it'll be extremely fast, sometimes it'll take a while longer. If he doesn't want to wait, he doesn't have to, ofcourse.
It's just so hard to judge a social situation like this and give a hard defined answer. Because there isn't one. If there was one magical answer, every single person on the planet would use it, to great effect. And we can all agree that's not the case, I think 
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On June 03 2016 10:47 IgnE wrote:
you seemingly haven't really heard Volband's question (i.e. "How soon can I ask someone out on a date?
My reply to him was a direct response. You didn't like the response, but that doesn't mean I didn't give an answer to his question.
Also, dude, strawmanning is not the preferred nomenclature. Hyperbole, please.
While hyperbole was the changing of days to months (although that's certainly not satire because you were serious... so don't critique someone's nomenclature if you're then going to use the wrong term ), you completely ignoring the other half of my response (regarding that he can still feel free to date right away) and attacking the opposite is a strawman. And then you basically just declared a similar position for yourself after hating on me, which is the funniest part.
That's an entire post of yours? At this point, you're just leading the conversation astray, which is helpful to no one. Can we please get back to asking questions about dating and answering them? To quote the mod banner above this thread: "If you disagree with someone's ideologies, state that you disagree with them and why they won't work from a dating standpoint and move on." Move on please
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I object to your assertion that satire isn't serious.
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It's funny because both of you were pretty much saying "ask her to meet when you feel comfortable from the conversation" and somehow that spun into a huge ideological difference. I'm looking to stock up on more good date ideas in or around Toronto. We've done go karting, an escape room, movies, hikes, dinner, etc. We're planning on doing salsa and the Toronto Islands. I know there must be a lot of good things to do in Toronto but any of the sources I've read seem more like commercials or ridiculous. Anyone here living in Toronto know any good spots?
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I feel like I'm in crazy town right now. This:
On June 03 2016 01:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:I'd give it a few days before asking to meet them... have a second and third and possibly fourth conversation. Build up a larger sample size of dialogue If she wants one right away, then go for it!
is a direct recommendation to "give it a few days before asking to meet them" in response to Volband's post, where he explicitly stated that he felt comfortable enough to meet. Then it goes off into a non-sequitur about how "if she wants one right away, then go for it!" How on earth is he going to know if she wants one right away if he doesn't go for it first?? If he is supposed to go for it then why would you suggest waiting "a few days before asking to meet them"??
In no world is that "pretty much saying 'ask her to meet when you feel comfortable from the conversation'". It's actually quite actionable, specific advice with an odd, unintelligible addendum.
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On June 03 2016 13:54 WarSame wrote:
It's funny because both of you were pretty much saying "ask her to meet when you feel comfortable from the conversation" and somehow that spun into a huge ideological difference. I'm looking to stock up on more good date ideas in or around Toronto. We've done go karting, an escape room, movies, hikes, dinner, etc. We're planning on doing salsa and the Toronto Islands. I know there must be a lot of good things to do in Toronto but any of the sources I've read seem more like commercials or ridiculous. Anyone here living in Toronto know any good spots?
I don't recommend movies because that forces you to sit silently facing the screen for 2+ hours with no direct interaction. Sitting and watching a movie is not doing something with one another. Find out what she likes to do then do that. Do what you like (if it's interactive) and that's a date. Date -> Dinner -> GG
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On June 03 2016 03:03 IgnE wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2016 02:07 Volband wrote:
I suppose I can, I just want to be wary not to make the mistake to like them too much before we meet. Dont listen to DPB he has no idea what he's talking about. Ask out the girl as quickly as you feel comfortable, decide on time and place, then say "lokking forward to it" or equivalent and you dont have to say anything else until the day of when you can make sure everything is still a go.
Not sure if this is serious, or if IgnE is trolling Lemon.
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EPT
