EPTPolice Brutality At My School - Page 3
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Chibi[OWNS]
United Kingdom10597 Posts
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Chibi[OWNS]
United Kingdom10597 Posts
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Bill307
Canada9103 Posts
I had told myself that I was fully committed to occupying the space as ours, because the obvious exertion of power both by not allowing us to do it in the first place, and the presence of police at a totally non-violent peaceful gathering was unacceptable to me and counter to what I think TU is about. Oh no, police at a totally non-violent peaceful gathering?! Of course the police are going to show up! What, are the university's staff members going to head out there to force the students off themselves? What a stupid way to react to the situation. Does he think that he can do whatever he wants so long as it is non-violent and peaceful? Being non-violent doesn't justify breaking the law in any way. Instead of being courteous and gently moving the equipment, they simply tore the structures down. Many had been staked to the ground, and many were physically ripped from the ground, causing the material to tear and effectively destroyed. Now it is important to realize that it wasn’t like we (the lockdowned SITTING people) were going anywhere. There was no need to hurry, it wasn’t a dangerous or threatening situation in any way. So the logic for such brute force can’t really be rationalized in that way. Well the protesters certainly weren't being very courteous by leaving their tents in the way, were they? Why should the police be forced to go to the extra effort of taking the tents apart? That's not very rational, is it? It wasn’t too long before the first person was violently taken from their peaceful and non-violent community. Like the others that would soon follow, I could not completely see what was happening because it was directly behind me, but I could hear it, and it was intense. The amount of sound that was created as the first one was pried away from their circle was consuming. People were feeling all sorts of different emotions, and it could be hear in their different yells and screams and cries. But collectively we expressed the pain over such an ignorant, cruel, calculated and misguided action. Again, what did he/she expect the police to do? The protesters were not supposed to be there in the first place. The police asked them more than once to move, but they did not. So the only option left was for the police to move in and physically remove them. Given the intentions of the protesters -- the intent to resist movement by forming these circles -- why is it so shocking that violence would be necessary to remove an individual from his/her circle? We all know that one way or another, the police would have to make the protesters suffer to some extent in order to uproot them. So I guess they decided to not waste any time and just pull them out physically without permanently harming them. Granted I haven't seen the video yet, but I don't expect it to be shocking or appalling. The protesters resisted by not complying with the verbal command to move, and they also showed that they were ready to physically resist movement by forming their human circles. So the police did what we all know would have been necessary to make them move. Of course the force used was probably a little more than sufficient for some of the protesters while being necessary for others. But what do you expect? They're not just going to sit there patiently and slowly increase the amount of suffering they inflict: that's just stupid, as it's largely a waste of time. So I'm guessing that they compromised between using ridiculous force and being ridiculously slow and patient. Police have lives and jobs to get on with as well: it's not neither their job nor their obligation to sit patiently and gradually coax every single protester into moving. Besides, other than the first few people to be uprooted, I'm guessing that everyone else still had the chance to get up and leave before the cops used force on them too? Or did the cops get violent with anyone who chose to walk away peacefully as well? If not, then other than the first few unlucky protesters, everyone else knew what was going to happen to them and decided to sit still and take it anyway. | ||
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SoLsiTO
United States573 Posts
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ihatett
United States2289 Posts
btw, <3 bill | ||
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SoLsiTO
United States573 Posts
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ihatett
United States2289 Posts
On April 30 2005 14:01 SoLsiTO wrote: Threaten to fine, or actually fine people who decided to stay there. Actually speak to the representitives of the protest and make a deal with them, which is arguably what they did after they used the cops to scare the shit out of the protesters. 1.) So, keep saying "I'll fine you if you don't move, I'll fine you if you don't move"? Do you think they would give you ID or anything else that would allow you to actually enforce the fine? Are you just going to wait there until they all decide to leave? That is unreasonable to force someone to do that when there are people on their property against their consent. 2.) You shouldn't have to negotiate with someone who won't remove him/herself from your property. | ||
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SoLsiTO
United States573 Posts
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ihatett
United States2289 Posts
Those people knew it was coming, but chose to break the law anyways. Also, when they saw what the police were doing, they still didn't remove themselves from the situation. How can you feel any sympathy for them? | ||
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GosuAmerican
United States347 Posts
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LetMeBeWithYou
Canada4254 Posts
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SoLsiTO
United States573 Posts
On April 30 2005 14:21 ihatett wrote: If someone will not obey the law and move to you non-violent demands, then either violence or the threat of it is needed. Those people knew it was coming, but chose to break the law anyways. Also, when they saw what the police were doing, they still didn't remove themselves from the situation. How can you feel any sympathy for them? I feel sympathy for them because they were not harming anyone. It was clearly unnecessary force, and I believe the university has acknowledged as much. | ||
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secrtagent
United States119 Posts
On April 30 2005 14:43 SoLsiTO wrote: I feel sympathy for them because they were not harming anyone. It was clearly unnecessary force, and I believe the university has acknowledged as much. What would be "necessary" force in your opinion? What should the cops have done physically to disband the protestors? | ||
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SoLsiTO
United States573 Posts
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Chibi[OWNS]
United Kingdom10597 Posts
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Sharkey
668 Posts
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pfff
Belgium1352 Posts
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SoLsiTO
United States573 Posts
I will answer as best I can, as I said before I did not entirely support this protest, or even think it was a good idea. One of the main issues being protested was that students have very little say in matters of university policy, something many students feel should be their right, especially considering the recent hikes in tuition. Furthermore, UC Santa Cruz is set up in a way that students in certain colleges/dorms and disciplines are somewhat cut off from others, making necessary communication more difficult then it needs to be. "Tent University" was suppose to give students, for a week, a place that they could gather and communicate upon ways to improve the university and their education. Moreover, some teachers had agreed to hold classes and lectures at the site, open to whom ever would like to listen or join in. Unfortunately, this part of the event got somewhat diluted with students and alum, what some would call hippies, who were more into drum circles and socializing then actual protesting or getting involved in some of the discussions. All of this was to take place at the most visible entrance to the campus, on university grounds (it is a public university, I am unclear on whether the land itself is considered public as well), and this is where the videos took place. I am also unclear about the curfew, supposedly this particular location is only a free speach zone untill 8 pm; however, a few days before this protest happened there was a labor strike who protested in that location untill 11 pm. In addition to that, currently there is a fundraiser with people staying on a teeter-totter (sp?) for 48 hours straight in the exact same location, so it seems that it is up to the University's discretion as to who can and cannot be there. The University knew for weeks that this event was being planned, and at the last minute offered the protesters a location on campus where they would be able to camp and hold events, but was entirely less visible and less useful for the protest. So I am guessing at around 10 pm the cops (many from Berkeley, which is 1.5 hours away) came and attempted to disperse the crowd. Ultimately, the actions of the cops, the University, and to some extent the "hippies," successfully ruined the protest. On that night there were 200 people there and they slept in the same location, for the following week there was on average about 50 people there, and they slept in a different location. | ||
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Chibi[OWNS]
United Kingdom10597 Posts
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SoLsiTO
United States573 Posts
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