On July 23 2011 22:01 Grettin wrote: Finnish media is already raising up the gaming history this guy had and comparing it to the school shooters who played also "violent shooting games"...
I find this interesting because there's not a single mention about how video games is involved in norwegian media.
Considering all the money and sparetime norwegian kids have, you'd be hard pressed to not find a person that hasn't played cod or wow etc. That's the exact kind of sensational bullshit the media has avoided this entire case and why it's been such a great thing to see how they handled it.
Personally I've been watching the entire thing online from the bombing started til now, since I live kinda close to the explosion and heard the entire thing, and I'm very impressed by the way our nation is handling this disaster. Great communication and solidarity is the keywords that have been in effect since yesterday.
On July 23 2011 21:25 Ciraxis wrote: Can somebody confirm if this photo: matches with the video:
No idea, doesn't seem so to me. I'd think all the islands coastline looks somewhat similiar if you compare to the birds-view-photos of the islands posted earlier.
It makes me sick that people keep posting those pictures on the Internet, and especially the people filming the dead bodies along the coastline of the island. How little respect must they have in order to do something like that?
Yes, great, let's not care about the bodies and let's get our 15 minutes of fame instead.
On top of that the conspiracy theorists are starting with their bullshit again. Frankly, I want to rip of their heads even more than I want to smash this Anders' brains out.
How about you show some respect to some of the people that actually showed up and helped, like the guys in the boat?
Yes, I bet filming the bodies were of great help...
I'm pretty sure picking up the people dying in the water is of more help than you slamming them on a forum for recording for 29 seconds while searching.
Use your fucking brain and show some respect.
Of course it's of more help than slamming them of the forum, but how the fuck does that justify uploading the film on youtube for the whole world to see?
Take your own advice.
Stop derailing the thread, please.
Yes, sir, sorry. It just sickens me up so much that I have a hard time controlling my temper. Think I should rather get away from the toilet of human kind which is the Internet, and cool off
People taking pictures/making movies of dead people, dying people, starving people, accidents, concentration camps, soldiers dying with their guts out is nothing new and has nothing to do with the toilet internet, it existed before and will exist after. If these guys could have helped instead of filming for a few seconds, I'm sure they'd have done it - and probably were on their way to do it (but even the police got cautious getting to the island, as someone else said, it ain't like you want to rush to it not knowing where the shooter(s) are. I understand you're emotional about it all, we probably all are, but that's something else...
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
To clarify - I totally agree that this guy should get a life sentence - by life I mean literally life. However, I am also pointing out that if we are already presuming that he will get forvaring, then forvaring is basically a useless concept that should be recognised for what it really is - a life sentence.
If forvaring means a reformed criminal who is no longer a threat to society, then it is possible that a murderer who killed one person will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 10 people will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 80 people will be eligible for release under forvaring.
If forvaring just means someone who did something horrific cannot be eligible for release after 21 years of prison then Norwegian politicians should clarify their law and say in effect there is no 21 year limit and they may as well call forvaring a life sentence.
So the point I am making is this - this guy deserves a life sentence. However, I daresay almost everyone who is presuming this guy will get forvaring has no understanding of the concept at all and are basically saying he will get it, even though we have no idea what kind of person he will be in 21 years' time. If he is reformed, then he will not get forvaring. My personal view is forvaring should be abolished and that Norway should just be straight-up and replace it with a life sentence law instead for serious crimes.
No, I understand the system, I just don't understand why the hell you would even consider giving him the opportunity to "not be a threat to society anymore".
This guy murdered 80 kids, thats it, there's nothing to add, and even I, who am a true believer in fair justice, think this guy simply shouldn't get a second chance.
We're not talking about a drunk driver who killed a family and cries every single night before going to sleep, or a husband who killed the man banging his wife when he came home out of pure rage, or even a dude who killed a secretary in a moment of distress whilst robbing a bank because he was poor as fuck and didn't know what to do with his life.
No, this guy killed 80 kids and abused their confidence by dressing up as a policeman to do so, its just some whole other level of violence, and judging him with the conventional system is simply wrong.
Read my God damn post. I don't want to give him the opportunity to ever be released. Norway's legal system gives him the opportunity to be released. From what I've read, forvaring means if you are deemed to not have been rehabilitated, then you can be kept in. If, however, you are rehabilitated, then you are released after 21 years, as that is the maximum penalty.
My position is that Norway should remove the concept of forvaring, and simply introduce a life sentence.
Forvaring will mean life in jail for this guy. Most Norwegians are against the death penalty even for this guy. Its not in our culture. Eye for an eye, and the world goes blind.
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
Like i said before, its because we are a humanitarian society. Stop posting eye for an eye garbage. Thats not how we do it.
But it is what this guy deserves, you can't deny that in a just world he should die for this. I hope he does, the piece of shit.
Obviously, our definitions of justice differ. In order to understand our judicial system, you must understand the values on which our society and welfare state are based on.
Indeed, and I apologize if I overstepped my bounds and if you took any offense to my post. Things like this, no matter where they happen, get me very very upset.
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
To clarify - I totally agree that this guy should get a life sentence - by life I mean literally life. However, I am also pointing out that if we are already presuming that he will get forvaring, then forvaring is basically a useless concept that should be recognised for what it really is - a life sentence.
If forvaring means a reformed criminal who is no longer a threat to society, then it is possible that a murderer who killed one person will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 10 people will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 80 people will be eligible for release under forvaring.
If forvaring just means someone who did something horrific cannot be eligible for release after 21 years of prison then Norwegian politicians should clarify their law and say in effect there is no 21 year limit and they may as well call forvaring a life sentence.
So the point I am making is this - this guy deserves a life sentence. However, I daresay almost everyone who is presuming this guy will get forvaring has no understanding of the concept at all and are basically saying he will get it, even though we have no idea what kind of person he will be in 21 years' time. If he is reformed, then he will not get forvaring. My personal view is forvaring should be abolished and that Norway should just be straight-up and replace it with a life sentence law instead for serious crimes.
No, I understand the system, I just don't understand why the hell you would even consider giving him the opportunity to "not be a threat to society anymore".
This guy murdered 80 kids, thats it, there's nothing to add, and even I, who am a true believer in fair justice, think this guy simply shouldn't get a second chance.
We're not talking about a drunk driver who killed a family and cries every single night before going to sleep, or a husband who killed the man banging his wife when he came home out of pure rage, or even a dude who killed a secretary in a moment of distress whilst robbing a bank because he was poor as fuck and didn't know what to do with his life.
No, this guy killed 80 kids and abused their confidence by dressing up as a policeman to do so, its just some whole other level of violence, and judging him with the conventional system is simply wrong.
Read my God damn post. I don't want to give him the opportunity to ever be released. Norway's legal system gives him the opportunity to be released. From what I've read, forvaring means if you are deemed to not have been rehabilitated, then you can be kept in. If, however, you are rehabilitated, then you are released after 21 years, as that is the maximum penalty.
My position is that Norway should remove the concept of forvaring, and simply introduce a life sentence.
very hung over and misread your post, my apologies. we seem to agree then
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
To clarify - I totally agree that this guy should get a life sentence - by life I mean literally life. However, I am also pointing out that if we are already presuming that he will get forvaring, then forvaring is basically a useless concept that should be recognised for what it really is - a life sentence.
If forvaring means a reformed criminal who is no longer a threat to society, then it is possible that a murderer who killed one person will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 10 people will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 80 people will be eligible for release under forvaring.
If forvaring just means someone who did something horrific cannot be eligible for release after 21 years of prison then Norwegian politicians should clarify their law and say in effect there is no 21 year limit and they may as well call forvaring a life sentence.
So the point I am making is this - this guy deserves a life sentence. However, I daresay almost everyone who is presuming this guy will get forvaring has no understanding of the concept at all and are basically saying he will get it, even though we have no idea what kind of person he will be in 21 years' time. If he is reformed, then he will not get forvaring. My personal view is forvaring should be abolished and that Norway should just be straight-up and replace it with a life sentence law instead for serious crimes.
nonsense. This is not some kind of gang banger hell bent on violence. It's a normal, functional person who just snapped. He looked and acted fine before the murders, he might as well act normal after them as well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikita_Fouganthine
Issei Sagawa (佐川 一政 Sagawa Issei?, born June 11, 1949) is a Japanese man who in 1981 murdered and cannibalized a Dutch woman named Renée Hartevelt. After his release, he became a minor celebrity in Japan and made a living through the public's interest in his crime.
Fuck forvaring.
Different society, different moral views and different approaches to justice. Lets get back to the topic at hand.
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
To clarify - I totally agree that this guy should get a life sentence - by life I mean literally life. However, I am also pointing out that if we are already presuming that he will get forvaring, then forvaring is basically a useless concept that should be recognised for what it really is - a life sentence.
If forvaring means a reformed criminal who is no longer a threat to society, then it is possible that a murderer who killed one person will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 10 people will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 80 people will be eligible for release under forvaring.
If forvaring just means someone who did something horrific cannot be eligible for release after 21 years of prison then Norwegian politicians should clarify their law and say in effect there is no 21 year limit and they may as well call forvaring a life sentence.
So the point I am making is this - this guy deserves a life sentence. However, I daresay almost everyone who is presuming this guy will get forvaring has no understanding of the concept at all and are basically saying he will get it, even though we have no idea what kind of person he will be in 21 years' time. If he is reformed, then he will not get forvaring. My personal view is forvaring should be abolished and that Norway should just be straight-up and replace it with a life sentence law instead for serious crimes.
No, I understand the system, I just don't understand why the hell you would even consider giving him the opportunity to "not be a threat to society anymore".
This guy murdered 80 kids, thats it, there's nothing to add, and even I, who am a true believer in fair justice, think this guy simply shouldn't get a second chance.
We're not talking about a drunk driver who killed a family and cries every single night before going to sleep, or a husband who killed the man banging his wife when he came home out of pure rage, or even a dude who killed a secretary in a moment of distress whilst robbing a bank because he was poor as fuck and didn't know what to do with his life.
No, this guy killed 80 kids and abused their confidence by dressing up as a policeman to do so, its just some whole other level of violence, and judging him with the conventional system is simply wrong.
Read my God damn post. I don't want to give him the opportunity to ever be released. Norway's legal system gives him the opportunity to be released. From what I've read, forvaring means if you are deemed to not have been rehabilitated, then you can be kept in. If, however, you are rehabilitated, then you are released after 21 years, as that is the maximum penalty.
My position is that Norway should remove the concept of forvaring, and simply introduce a life sentence.
very hung over and misread your post, my apologies. we seem to agree then
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
To clarify - I totally agree that this guy should get a life sentence - by life I mean literally life. However, I am also pointing out that if we are already presuming that he will get forvaring, then forvaring is basically a useless concept that should be recognised for what it really is - a life sentence.
If forvaring means a reformed criminal who is no longer a threat to society, then it is possible that a murderer who killed one person will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 10 people will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 80 people will be eligible for release under forvaring.
If forvaring just means someone who did something horrific cannot be eligible for release after 21 years of prison then Norwegian politicians should clarify their law and say in effect there is no 21 year limit and they may as well call forvaring a life sentence.
So the point I am making is this - this guy deserves a life sentence. However, I daresay almost everyone who is presuming this guy will get forvaring has no understanding of the concept at all and are basically saying he will get it, even though we have no idea what kind of person he will be in 21 years' time. If he is reformed, then he will not get forvaring. My personal view is forvaring should be abolished and that Norway should just be straight-up and replace it with a life sentence law instead for serious crimes.
nonsense. This is not some kind of gang banger hell bent on violence. It's a normal, functional person who just snapped. He looked and acted fine before the murders, he might as well act normal after them as well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikita_Fouganthine
Issei Sagawa (佐川 一政 Sagawa Issei?, born June 11, 1949) is a Japanese man who in 1981 murdered and cannibalized a Dutch woman named Renée Hartevelt. After his release, he became a minor celebrity in Japan and made a living through the public's interest in his crime.
Fuck forvaring.
Different society, different moral views and different approaches to justice. Lets get back to the topic at hand.
Norway isnt gonna be the same society in 21 years either. Also finland seems to be pretty close
Looking at his facebook page, I wouldn't be surprised if death sentence is exactly what he wants. As somebody already said he will no doubt give ideological speech at his trial.
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
To clarify - I totally agree that this guy should get a life sentence - by life I mean literally life. However, I am also pointing out that if we are already presuming that he will get forvaring, then forvaring is basically a useless concept that should be recognised for what it really is - a life sentence.
If forvaring means a reformed criminal who is no longer a threat to society, then it is possible that a murderer who killed one person will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 10 people will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 80 people will be eligible for release under forvaring.
If forvaring just means someone who did something horrific cannot be eligible for release after 21 years of prison then Norwegian politicians should clarify their law and say in effect there is no 21 year limit and they may as well call forvaring a life sentence.
So the point I am making is this - this guy deserves a life sentence. However, I daresay almost everyone who is presuming this guy will get forvaring has no understanding of the concept at all and are basically saying he will get it, even though we have no idea what kind of person he will be in 21 years' time. If he is reformed, then he will not get forvaring. My personal view is forvaring should be abolished and that Norway should just be straight-up and replace it with a life sentence law instead for serious crimes.
nonsense. This is not some kind of gang banger hell bent on violence. It's a normal, functional person who just snapped. He looked and acted fine before the murders, he might as well act normal after them as well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikita_Fouganthine
Issei Sagawa (佐川 一政 Sagawa Issei?, born June 11, 1949) is a Japanese man who in 1981 murdered and cannibalized a Dutch woman named Renée Hartevelt. After his release, he became a minor celebrity in Japan and made a living through the public's interest in his crime.
Fuck forvaring.
Different society, different moral views and different approaches to justice. Lets get back to the topic at hand.
Norway isnt gonna be the same society in 21 years either.
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
To clarify - I totally agree that this guy should get a life sentence - by life I mean literally life. However, I am also pointing out that if we are already presuming that he will get forvaring, then forvaring is basically a useless concept that should be recognised for what it really is - a life sentence.
If forvaring means a reformed criminal who is no longer a threat to society, then it is possible that a murderer who killed one person will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 10 people will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 80 people will be eligible for release under forvaring.
If forvaring just means someone who did something horrific cannot be eligible for release after 21 years of prison then Norwegian politicians should clarify their law and say in effect there is no 21 year limit and they may as well call forvaring a life sentence.
So the point I am making is this - this guy deserves a life sentence. However, I daresay almost everyone who is presuming this guy will get forvaring has no understanding of the concept at all and are basically saying he will get it, even though we have no idea what kind of person he will be in 21 years' time. If he is reformed, then he will not get forvaring. My personal view is forvaring should be abolished and that Norway should just be straight-up and replace it with a life sentence law instead for serious crimes.
nonsense. This is not some kind of gang banger hell bent on violence. It's a normal, functional person who just snapped. He looked and acted fine before the murders, he might as well act normal after them as well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikita_Fouganthine
Issei Sagawa (佐川 一政 Sagawa Issei?, born June 11, 1949) is a Japanese man who in 1981 murdered and cannibalized a Dutch woman named Renée Hartevelt. After his release, he became a minor celebrity in Japan and made a living through the public's interest in his crime.
Fuck forvaring.
Different society, different moral views and different approaches to justice. Lets get back to the topic at hand.
Norway isnt gonna be the same society in 21 years either.
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
Like i said before, its because we are a humanitarian society. Stop posting eye for an eye garbage. Thats not how we do it.
But it is what this guy deserves, you can't deny that in a just world he should die for this. I hope he does, the piece of shit.
Obviously, our definitions of justice differ. In order to understand our judicial system, you must understand the values on which our society and welfare state are based on.
Indeed, and I apologize if I overstepped my bounds and if you took any offense to my post. Things like this, no matter where they happen, get me very very upset.
None taken. I'm just trying to explain that we have nothing to gain and everything to lose by changing our way of life by acting irrationally and letting our emotions rule our decisions.
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
To clarify - I totally agree that this guy should get a life sentence - by life I mean literally life. However, I am also pointing out that if we are already presuming that he will get forvaring, then forvaring is basically a useless concept that should be recognised for what it really is - a life sentence.
If forvaring means a reformed criminal who is no longer a threat to society, then it is possible that a murderer who killed one person will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 10 people will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 80 people will be eligible for release under forvaring.
If forvaring just means someone who did something horrific cannot be eligible for release after 21 years of prison then Norwegian politicians should clarify their law and say in effect there is no 21 year limit and they may as well call forvaring a life sentence.
So the point I am making is this - this guy deserves a life sentence. However, I daresay almost everyone who is presuming this guy will get forvaring has no understanding of the concept at all and are basically saying he will get it, even though we have no idea what kind of person he will be in 21 years' time. If he is reformed, then he will not get forvaring. My personal view is forvaring should be abolished and that Norway should just be straight-up and replace it with a life sentence law instead for serious crimes.
nonsense. This is not some kind of gang banger hell bent on violence. It's a normal, functional person who just snapped. He looked and acted fine before the murders, he might as well act normal after them as well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikita_Fouganthine
Issei Sagawa (佐川 一政 Sagawa Issei?, born June 11, 1949) is a Japanese man who in 1981 murdered and cannibalized a Dutch woman named Renée Hartevelt. After his release, he became a minor celebrity in Japan and made a living through the public's interest in his crime.
Fuck forvaring.
Different society, different moral views and different approaches to justice. Lets get back to the topic at hand.
Norway isnt gonna be the same society in 21 years either. Also finland seems to be pretty close
No we aren't. But after this we're gonna focus more on democracy, openness and not let this scare us into fear mongering.
On July 23 2011 22:03 Nqsty wrote: I don't understand how people can still talk about trials, lawyers, 21 years of jailtime, or even life sentence, this guy should be hanged, there should be no fucking question about it. put a bullet through he head and he'd be lucky, if it were an eye for an eye, he'd have 350 through his body.
To clarify - I totally agree that this guy should get a life sentence - by life I mean literally life. However, I am also pointing out that if we are already presuming that he will get forvaring, then forvaring is basically a useless concept that should be recognised for what it really is - a life sentence.
If forvaring means a reformed criminal who is no longer a threat to society, then it is possible that a murderer who killed one person will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 10 people will be eligible for release under forvaring just as a mass murderer who killed 80 people will be eligible for release under forvaring.
If forvaring just means someone who did something horrific cannot be eligible for release after 21 years of prison then Norwegian politicians should clarify their law and say in effect there is no 21 year limit and they may as well call forvaring a life sentence.
So the point I am making is this - this guy deserves a life sentence. However, I daresay almost everyone who is presuming this guy will get forvaring has no understanding of the concept at all and are basically saying he will get it, even though we have no idea what kind of person he will be in 21 years' time. If he is reformed, then he will not get forvaring. My personal view is forvaring should be abolished and that Norway should just be straight-up and replace it with a life sentence law instead for serious crimes.
nonsense. This is not some kind of gang banger hell bent on violence. It's a normal, functional person who just snapped. He looked and acted fine before the murders, he might as well act normal after them as well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikita_Fouganthine
Issei Sagawa (佐川 一政 Sagawa Issei?, born June 11, 1949) is a Japanese man who in 1981 murdered and cannibalized a Dutch woman named Renée Hartevelt. After his release, he became a minor celebrity in Japan and made a living through the public's interest in his crime.
Fuck forvaring.
How does what you linked have any relevance to 'forvaring'?
The subsequent publicity and macabre celebrity of Sagawa likely contributed to the French authorities' decision to have him extradited to Japan. Upon arrival in Japan, he was immediately taken to Matsuzawa hospital, where examining psychologists all found him to be sane but "evil". However, Japanese authorities found it to be legally impossible to hold him, purportedly because they lacked certain important papers from the French court. As a result, Sagawa checked himself out of the mental institution on August 12, 1986, and has been a free man ever since.
EPT
![[image loading]](http://gfx.dagbladet.no/labrador/174/174279/17427969/jpg/active/978x.jpg)
