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Keep your off topic discussions out of this thread and show some damn respect! |
On July 25 2011 22:53 Calm wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 22:39 sidesprang wrote:
custody with full isolation to 22. august
regular custody up to 26.september
Ban from letters, visitors, news and any other media for the whole time.
If I got it correcty I'm not sure if anyone is a lawyer in Norway, but trials can take up to a year to start. Does that mean that the accused could be walking the streets again before his trial begins?
Maybe I'm using the wrong word, or that we got two words for custody in norway. But "varetekt" that is what he got now is only used for when you are put to jail while an investigation is ongoing. When the investigation is over it will be another meeting and he will be put to jail again. This is not "varetekt" but something else, not really sure what it's called.
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On July 25 2011 22:53 Calm wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 22:39 sidesprang wrote:
custody with full isolation to 22. august
regular custody up to 26.september
Ban from letters, visitors, news and any other media for the whole time.
If I got it correcty I'm not sure if anyone is a lawyer in Norway, but trials can take up to a year to start. Does that mean that the accused could be walking the streets again before his trial begins?
Yes, a mass murderer who attacked the government of Norway and ha killed over 90 people will, without a doubt, be set free during the invistigation. He will also e released after 21 years.
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On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style.
And piss on our justice system? No thanks sir.
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How could you extract justice for even one of these people from him? his suffering could never equal that of those he killed and their relations even if that was justice. Norway's prisons are not designed to inflict suffering on their inhabitants, but to keep them away from people they could harm.
It's a good system, they are good people. Perhaps even this guy, in some ways, was a good man, but what he did today was monstrous and society can never trust him amongst them again. He should never see freedom again, never have the chance to do what he did again. That's what the prison is for. Not vengeance, just certainty.
Quoting this because its so true, except for the fact that this man had not the tiniest bit of good in him, he was planning this for almost 10 years, noone with the least amount of good in them could do something like that.
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On July 25 2011 23:17 Blessthefall wrote:Show nested quote +
How could you extract justice for even one of these people from him? his suffering could never equal that of those he killed and their relations even if that was justice. Norway's prisons are not designed to inflict suffering on their inhabitants, but to keep them away from people they could harm.
It's a good system, they are good people. Perhaps even this guy, in some ways, was a good man, but what he did today was monstrous and society can never trust him amongst them again. He should never see freedom again, never have the chance to do what he did again. That's what the prison is for. Not vengeance, just certainty.
Quoting this because its so true, except for the fact that this man had not the tiniest bit of good in him, he was planning this for almost 10 years, noone with the least amount of good in them could do something like that.
I am also impressed how the norway posters here handle the case. I have seen many others going into blind rage and bloodlust for revenge when something like this happened in their countries.
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German Newspaper: "Even in their deepest sorrow the norwegians don't get hysterical. They resist the hate. It is amazing to see how politicians and the whole country reacts. They are sad to the deepest thread of their souls. They cry in dignity. But nobody swears to take revenge. Instead they want even more humanity and democracy. That is one of the most remarkable strengths of that little country."
Reading that quote touched me, the whole affair is unreal.
There is hardly anyone wanting revenge for these actions, it is just grief and sorrow. He will get a sentence sometime, but in a small country like this there is always someone who knew someone who is not here anymore.
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On July 25 2011 23:02 Sandermatt wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. What would this achieve, satisfy some revenge instincts? I can understand the desire for it still acting barbarian yourself will not undo what he did. What he did cannot be undone. Just lock him away so that he isn't a danger to anyone anymore.
Maybe as a warning to any future crazy person that feels he needs to make a "hero" of himself for one cause or another?
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On July 25 2011 23:06 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. And piss on our justice system? No thanks sir.
21 years of prison as I read it in this thread... Not sure if word justice applies here.
EDIT: I would bet that prisons in Norway probably let him have a TV and play basketball outside and take him to the doctor for even a smallest injury...
This guy is a monster and deserves a monster's treatment.
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On July 25 2011 23:39 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 23:06 sidesprang wrote:On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. And piss on our justice system? No thanks sir. 21 years of prison as I read it in this thread... Not sure if word justice applies here.
You should keep reading, then. It has been explained many times how this guy's unlikely to be released before his death.
Oh, it won't be of any "Warning" for future people like this. All it will mean is they will kill themselves before being captured. (As suicide bombers, and most shooters do.)
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On July 25 2011 23:38 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 23:02 Sandermatt wrote:On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. What would this achieve, satisfy some revenge instincts? I can understand the desire for it still acting barbarian yourself will not undo what he did. What he did cannot be undone. Just lock him away so that he isn't a danger to anyone anymore. Maybe as a warning to any future crazy person that feels he needs to make a "hero" of himself for one cause or another?
Big punishments dont deter many/any would be criminals (I believe there were links to stuff earlier on), much less any driven by such strong desires and beliefs.
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On July 25 2011 23:38 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 23:02 Sandermatt wrote:On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. What would this achieve, satisfy some revenge instincts? I can understand the desire for it still acting barbarian yourself will not undo what he did. What he did cannot be undone. Just lock him away so that he isn't a danger to anyone anymore. Maybe as a warning to any future crazy person that feels he needs to make a "hero" of himself for one cause or another?
Do you think they wouldn't be ready to die? Do you think this man wasn't ready to die?
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On July 25 2011 23:38 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 23:02 Sandermatt wrote:On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. What would this achieve, satisfy some revenge instincts? I can understand the desire for it still acting barbarian yourself will not undo what he did. What he did cannot be undone. Just lock him away so that he isn't a danger to anyone anymore. Maybe as a warning to any future crazy person that feels he needs to make a "hero" of himself for one cause or another?
Yeah, i'm sure the death penalty as a warning works brilliantly. Thank god America, China and so on have been crimefree for the past 50 years.
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On July 25 2011 23:40 Phenny wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 23:38 -Archangel- wrote:On July 25 2011 23:02 Sandermatt wrote:On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. What would this achieve, satisfy some revenge instincts? I can understand the desire for it still acting barbarian yourself will not undo what he did. What he did cannot be undone. Just lock him away so that he isn't a danger to anyone anymore. Maybe as a warning to any future crazy person that feels he needs to make a "hero" of himself for one cause or another? Big punishments dont deter many/any would be criminals (I believe there were links to stuff earlier on), much less any driven by such strong desires and beliefs.
Depends on what kind of big punishment we are talking about. Death sentence I agree will not help much, probably only make the person have a gunfight with the police. But making their life a living hell just might make some of them think twice..
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On July 25 2011 23:28 MentalM wrote:
German Newspaper: "Even in their deepest sorrow the norwegians don't get hysterical. They resist the hate. It is amazing to see how politicians and the whole country reacts. They are sad to the deepest thread of their souls. They cry in dignity. But nobody swears to take revenge. Instead they want even more humanity and democracy. That is one of the most remarkable strengths of that little country."
Reading that quote touched me, the whole affair is unreal.
There is hardly anyone wanting revenge for these actions, it is just grief and sorrow. He will get a sentence sometime, but in a small country like this there is always someone who knew someone who is not here anymore.
my eyes filled with tears after reading that, as they sporadically have since friday
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On July 25 2011 23:39 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 23:06 sidesprang wrote:On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. And piss on our justice system? No thanks sir. 21 years of prison as I read it in this thread... Not sure if word justice applies here.
Read again, there's also something called forvaring, he will also be deemed a sicko and will never see the light again. the justice system has worked sofar. and i really doubt it will fail, eather way the guy is dead eather in prison or before hes sentenced. the guy that kills him is going to be called a national hero, end of story.
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Did he already release an official statement? If yes maybe it should be posted in the main post.
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On July 25 2011 23:41 IMLegend wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 23:38 -Archangel- wrote:On July 25 2011 23:02 Sandermatt wrote:On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. What would this achieve, satisfy some revenge instincts? I can understand the desire for it still acting barbarian yourself will not undo what he did. What he did cannot be undone. Just lock him away so that he isn't a danger to anyone anymore. Maybe as a warning to any future crazy person that feels he needs to make a "hero" of himself for one cause or another? Yeah, i'm sure the death penalty as a warning works brilliantly. Thank god America, China and so on have been crimefree for the past 50 years.
Maybe read my post again, I said death penalty would be too easy for him. I am sure he is not ready for torture, nobody is.
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On July 25 2011 23:42 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 23:40 Phenny wrote:On July 25 2011 23:38 -Archangel- wrote:On July 25 2011 23:02 Sandermatt wrote:On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. What would this achieve, satisfy some revenge instincts? I can understand the desire for it still acting barbarian yourself will not undo what he did. What he did cannot be undone. Just lock him away so that he isn't a danger to anyone anymore. Maybe as a warning to any future crazy person that feels he needs to make a "hero" of himself for one cause or another? Big punishments dont deter many/any would be criminals (I believe there were links to stuff earlier on), much less any driven by such strong desires and beliefs. Depends on what kind of big punishment we are talking about. Death sentence I agree will not help much, probably only make the person have a gunfight with the police. But making their life a living hell just might make some of them think twice..
All it will mean is they will kill themselves before being captured. (As suicide bombers, and most shooters do.)
They must frustrate you to no end.
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On July 25 2011 23:40 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 23:38 -Archangel- wrote:On July 25 2011 23:02 Sandermatt wrote:On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. What would this achieve, satisfy some revenge instincts? I can understand the desire for it still acting barbarian yourself will not undo what he did. What he did cannot be undone. Just lock him away so that he isn't a danger to anyone anymore. Maybe as a warning to any future crazy person that feels he needs to make a "hero" of himself for one cause or another? Do you think they wouldn't be ready to die? Do you think this man wasn't ready to die?
In the manifest there was even a passage about him getting swarmed by the 'system protectors' (Police) while he shot a few people, and that when he would get shot that he would enter the kingdom, or something like that. He knew clearly that it would be possible for him to die during the 'operation' .
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On July 25 2011 23:43 GLLvz wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 23:39 -Archangel- wrote:On July 25 2011 23:06 sidesprang wrote:On July 25 2011 22:47 -Archangel- wrote:
Although personally I am against a death sentence, in the case of people like this guy I would make an exception. Actually death would be too easy, maybe some waterboarding each day until the rest of his life would suit him better. And a solitary for the rest of the time. And maybe some flaying Bolton style. And piss on our justice system? No thanks sir. 21 years of prison as I read it in this thread... Not sure if word justice applies here. Read again, there's also something called forvaring, he will also be deemed a sicko and will never see the light again. the justice system has worked sofar. and i really doubt it will fail, eather way the guy is dead eather in prison or before hes sentenced. the guy that kills him is going to be called a national hero, end of story.
Hardly, the guy that kills him will probably get some years in prison as well unless it is a government sanctioned murder.
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EPT
