EPTPope compares secularism to Nazism - Page 2
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Dgtl
Canada889 Posts
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Kraid
United States6 Posts
On September 19 2010 16:10 stormtemplar wrote: No worries guys, my family used to be catholic. No one listens to the pope. Really this pope is kinda a useless creepy old guy. Not just "useless" and "creepy", also safe-haven for pedophilic priests, of the particularly harmful kind. He's just generally a horrible, evil human being. I miss the only slightly misinformed days of John Paul II. http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/johann-hari/johann-hari-cat...holics-its-you-this-pope-has-abused-2074029.html http://www.slate.com/id/2267098/?from=rss http://www.slate.com/id/2255270/ | ||
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Evil_Monkey_
Denmark296 Posts
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blitzkrieger
United States512 Posts
I mean even if you believe the Catholic Church helped Hitler I don't think anyone believes that Christian values and Nazism have any real similarities. And its in the Christian religion that the Church (organization) can and will become corrupt, it was said be Jesus too. If you take away religion you are just left with natural selection. And people will abuse that to say who is "fit" or not and be even more selfish. I mean WW2 already had that. Life is a FFA where every action is to gain and everyone are really enemies. There is no justification for anything except to further oneself. Things like abortion are already accepted by many and soon we will have designer babies because "its not a life". They already do selective abortion in China for women which is a huge problem, I read there will be 120million bachelors in China in a few years because they aborted so many female babies, wish I had the source... I think atheism is the most dangerous thing out there because it removes all restraints and takes away any morals and inserts nothing. Human beings are selfish and evil and taking off the restraints will unleash the monster. You can justify anything with atheism as long as if further's your own goals. Atheists are only accountable to themselves and can easily change any moral or value. We have already seen it with Hitler, Stalin, and Mao among others. Human beings become expendable and their is no value to life (look at abortion). People are already selfish and apathetic but the rise in militant atheism is going to make it even worse. Most people believe this even though the internet, and gaming are filled with young liberals/atheists for the most part so I'll get like 50 flames for this but I don't care. You can criticize me and the Pope all you want but I should be able to criticize atheism just as well. | ||
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blitzkrieger
United States512 Posts
On September 19 2010 16:06 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Interesting point given the fact that the Church, I'm sure, could make an enormous difference in say building/digging wells, schools, and teaching safe sex in Africa. They do teach safe sex and those other things. Abstinence until marriage is safe sex and its free. | ||
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Half
United States2554 Posts
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blitzkrieger
United States512 Posts
On September 19 2010 16:41 Evil_Monkey_ wrote: If atheists abused 1000's of innocent children like they have, I would listen to what this old troll has to say. Fact is though, that it's him and his followers that have done so. There are actually much less pedophiles in the Church than the general population by quite some amount (20x less?). Again I wish I had a source but I don't. And I don't excuse them for trying to have "damage control" for it either. I'm not even Catholic. | ||
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Half
United States2554 Posts
I think atheism is the most dangerous thing out there because it removes all restraints and takes away any morals and inserts nothing. Human beings are selfish and evil and taking off the restraints will unleash the monster. You can justify anything with atheism as long as if further's your own goals. Atheists are only accountable to themselves and can easily change any moral or value. We have already seen it with Hitler, Stalin, and Mao among others. Human beings become expendable and their is no value to life (look at abortion). People are already selfish and apathetic but the rise in militant atheism is going to make it even worse. Speak for yourself. Humanism, the school of though predominantly responsible for the cultural notion of the intrinsic value of human life, was founded by Atheist and Deist scholars during the enlightenment, and the rebirth of secular thought in the west. Before that, when religion itself dictated human morale, we had the Dark Ages. Though if you need religion to justify being kind towards other human beings, by my guest. Continue to believe in what you do. | ||
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blomsterjohn
Norway463 Posts
I think atheism is the most dangerous thing out there because it removes all restraints and takes away any morals and inserts nothing. Human beings are selfish and evil and taking off the restraints will unleash the monster. This has so much fail in it I barely have words. The pope is the fucking vicor of christ, in contrast to political rhetoric. He should be arrested and locked up for the thousands of continued deaths he has caused in Africa. | ||
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Shatter
United States1401 Posts
He is arguing that without God and belief and whatever, it can lead to, in extreme cases, things such as the Nazi movement. I guess I just don't see what the problem is. He thinks that a world without Christianity would be a bad world, which isn't surprising considering he is the Pope. Do I agree with him? No but I'm not outraged or anything. | ||
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Jakalo
Latvia2350 Posts
On September 19 2010 16:45 blitzkrieger wrote: If Hitler used the Church for anything it was just that, to use them. I'm pretty sure Japanese aren't a master race according to Hitler (or Italians for that matter) yet he enlisted their aid to accomplish his own goals. If Hitler had won I am sure he would have disposed of not only the Church but also Japan when he saw fit. I mean even if you believe the Catholic Church helped Hitler I don't think anyone believes that Christian values and Nazism have any real similarities. And its in the Christian religion that the Church (organization) can and will become corrupt, it was said be Jesus too. If you take away religion you are just left with natural selection. And people will abuse that to say who is "fit" or not and be even more selfish. I mean WW2 already had that. Life is a FFA where every action is to gain and everyone are really enemies. There is no justification for anything except to further oneself. Things like abortion are already accepted by many and soon we will have designer babies because "its not a life". They already do selective abortion in China for women which is a huge problem, I read there will be 120million bachelors in China in a few years because they aborted so many female babies, wish I had the source... I think atheism is the most dangerous thing out there because it removes all restraints and takes away any morals and inserts nothing. Human beings are selfish and evil and taking off the restraints will unleash the monster. You can justify anything with atheism as long as if further's your own goals. Atheists are only accountable to themselves and can easily change any moral or value. We have already seen it with Hitler, Stalin, and Mao among others. Human beings become expendable and their is no value to life (look at abortion). People are already selfish and apathetic but the rise in militant atheism is going to make it even worse. Most people believe this even though the internet, and gaming are filled with young liberals/atheists for the most part so I'll get like 50 flames for this but I don't care. You can criticize me and the Pope all you want but I should be able to criticize atheism just as well. I dont know laugh or cry.. | ||
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rel
Guam3521 Posts
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hoby2000
United States918 Posts
On September 19 2010 15:40 matjlav wrote: I find this pretty infuriating... the fact that a world leader can get away with making a statement that is not only irrelevant, but also blatantly unhistorical is ridiculous to me. Especially when there are recorded quotes from Hitler that directly prove it false, such as: Uhh wait, what? Since when is the pope a world leader? Does anyone see something wrong with this idea? | ||
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SaDGoWu
United States133 Posts
On September 19 2010 16:35 Dgtl wrote: It's unfortunate that actual intelligent religious people are represented by this guy. Not all religious people are stupid. Is there such a thing as an intelligent religious person? Intelligence is relative. Anyways to the OP, I don't think you cant expect a religious organization or leader for that matter to hold up once scrutinized. I mean how important is research and evidence when there is faith and doctrine. Here is some hope though if you believe a Stanford Binet IQ test is an accurate measure of intelligence; This test clearly shows that despite larger family size and inbreeding, IQ's are going up by 3 points on average per decade. Hopefully that means people will be more self aware and not flock like sheep. | ||
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blitzkrieger
United States512 Posts
On September 19 2010 16:49 Half wrote: Speak for yourself. Humanism, the school of though predominantly responsible for the cultural notion of the intrinsic value of human life, was founded by Atheist and Deist scholars during the enlightenment, and the rebirth of secular thought in the west. Before that, when religion itself dictated human morale, we had the Dark Ages. Though if you need religion to justify being kind towards other human beings, by my guest. Continue to believe in what you do. I hate getting into these arguments because I don't have any sources for anything anymore... but there is no value to human life in atheism at all. Humans are just another animal. If you can profit off the expense of another human thats fine. I also have heard the Dark Ages were full of advances and they are thinknig of changing the name from teh Dark Age to something else. Again I don't have sources for any of this but I do know the Mao, Stalin, Lenin, Hitler were atheists and did horrible acts and that abortion has killed more than all the people in all the wars of all time. Yes I know its wikipedia... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Ages Today it is frequently applied only to the earlier part of the era, the Early Middle Ages[6]. However, most modern scholars who study the era tend to avoid the term altogether for its negative connotations, finding it misleading and inaccurate for any part of the Middle Ages.[7][8] | ||
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blitzkrieger
United States512 Posts
On September 19 2010 16:56 hoby2000 wrote: Uhh wait, what? Since when is the pope a world leader? Does anyone see something wrong with this idea? You do know 1/3 of the population Catholic right? In fact in America, they believe The Church and religion were so powerful they made law against any denomination taking over. Nothing was supposed to control the government. (Might need to extended to corporations/atheism soon). | ||
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Shatter
United States1401 Posts
On September 19 2010 16:58 SaDGoWu wrote: Oh snap. You are so right. If only people could be as smart as you. Starting any argument with insults is the best strategy.Is there such a thing as an intelligent religious person? Intelligence is relative. | ||
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hifriend
China7935 Posts
On September 19 2010 16:45 blitzkrieger wrote: If Hitler used the Church for anything it was just that, to use them. I'm pretty sure Japanese aren't a master race according to Hitler (or Italians for that matter) yet he enlisted their aid to accomplish his own goals. If Hitler had won I am sure he would have disposed of not only the Church but also Japan when he saw fit. I mean even if you believe the Catholic Church helped Hitler I don't think anyone believes that Christian values and Nazism have any real similarities. And its in the Christian religion that the Church (organization) can and will become corrupt, it was said be Jesus too. If you take away religion you are just left with natural selection. And people will abuse that to say who is "fit" or not and be even more selfish. I mean WW2 already had that. Life is a FFA where every action is to gain and everyone are really enemies. There is no justification for anything except to further oneself. Things like abortion are already accepted by many and soon we will have designer babies because "its not a life". They already do selective abortion in China for women which is a huge problem, I read there will be 120million bachelors in China in a few years because they aborted so many female babies, wish I had the source... I think atheism is the most dangerous thing out there because it removes all restraints and takes away any morals and inserts nothing. Human beings are selfish and evil and taking off the restraints will unleash the monster. You can justify anything with atheism as long as if further's your own goals. Atheists are only accountable to themselves and can easily change any moral or value. We have already seen it with Hitler, Stalin, and Mao among others. Human beings become expendable and their is no value to life (look at abortion). People are already selfish and apathetic but the rise in militant atheism is going to make it even worse. Most people believe this even though the internet, and gaming are filled with young liberals/atheists for the most part so I'll get like 50 flames for this but I don't care. You can criticize me and the Pope all you want but I should be able to criticize atheism just as well. It's just sad that you feel that way. If I as an atheist didn't believe in our species capabilities and in good human nature it would all seem rather pointless I guess. If you take away religion you are just left with natural selection. And people will abuse that to say who is "fit" or not and be even more selfish. I mean WW2 already had that. In case you hadn't noticed our entire world basically condemned those actions and you don't have to thank religion for that. I think you should come visit sweden sometime because what in your mind is a largely secularized nation must be very far from reality. And we both know religion has been used to carry out atrocities in the past so can we please stop making stupid assumptions that being atheist/jewish/muslim/christian/budhist in itself leads to various crimes against human rights etc. | ||
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Yttrasil
Sweden651 Posts
On September 19 2010 17:01 blitzkrieger wrote: I hate getting into these arguments because I don't have any sources for anything anymore... but there is no value to human life in atheism at all. Humans are just another animal. If you can profit off the expense of another human thats fine. I also have heard the Dark Ages were full of advances and they are thinknig of changing the name from teh Dark Age to something else. Again I don't have sources for any of this but I do know the Mao, Stalin, Lenin, Hitler were atheists and did horrible acts and that abortion has killed more than all the people in all the wars of all time. Yes I know its wikipedia... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Ages Today it is frequently applied only to the earlier part of the era, the Early Middle Ages[6]. However, most modern scholars who study the era tend to avoid the term altogether for its negative connotations, finding it misleading and inaccurate for any part of the Middle Ages.[7][8] How the hell can you say something like that, I do value life animals' humans also. I'm very much atheist and I would not without thought just do whatever the hell I want just cause there is no code which say to me not to. So I should be evidence enough against your argument if anything. Just because I'm atheist doesn't mean I have no feelings, all humans do to a more or lesser extent and I'll be damned if there are not billions of religious people with less respect for other people than me. Just because there is no God which dictates the value of life to you doesn't mean you can value life by yourself. If so why are there animal flocks and Elephants, Dolphins that have saved humans when they were about to die? It's not religion that's for sure, if they were egoists they would just go about their way and spare whatever energy they could have saved doing something else. | ||
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blitzkrieger
United States512 Posts
On September 19 2010 16:58 SaDGoWu wrote: Is there such a thing as an intelligent religious person? Intelligence is relative. Anyways to the OP, I don't think you cant expect a religious organization or leader for that matter to hold up once scrutinized. I mean how important is research and evidence when there is faith and doctrine. Here is some hope though if you believe a Stanford Binet IQ test is an accurate measure of intelligence; This test clearly shows that despite larger family size and inbreeding, IQ's are going up by 3 points on average per decade. Hopefully that means people will be more self aware and not flock like sheep. I heard Einstein was pretty smart. Newton? A lot of people actually. In fact some monk found out how cells and basic genetics work. Even DARWIN was a priest (or monk forget) when he studied the Galapagos Islands (sp?). In fact people who are religious are people who question and see order and wonder why this is or that is. In fact SCIENCE was originally (and still) is based on the belief that there is order in the universe from God. God made laws so we must find them. I've heard its going down because poor people have more kids and poor people are usually less educated/intelligent. Smart people tend to have less kids and focus on individual pursuits, whether that be business, science, or faith. | ||
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