EPTThe Loudness War - Page 2
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ghostWriter
United States3302 Posts
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phosphorylation
United States2935 Posts
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fanatacist
10319 Posts
On September 03 2009 04:05 ghostWriter wrote: I hate when dumbasses install huge speaker systems into their cars and drive around with their bass turned up tp deafening levels. If they want to enjoy their own music, that's cool, whatever. But do they really need to let the entire neighborhood know that they love soulja boy? I love blasting shit with my friends when the song is especially epic and we are baked. However we have taste so we enlighten the neighborhood to the wonders of Russian rap with a classical music beat, and Big Bang/Epik High. | ||
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uglymoose89
United States671 Posts
On September 03 2009 04:13 fanatacist wrote: I love blasting shit with my friends when the song is especially epic and we are baked. However we have taste so we enlighten the neighborhood to the wonders of Russian rap with a classical music beat, and Big Bang/Epik High. That's all good but what if someone just hates the genre. It's not like they can escape the deafening music. | ||
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fanatacist
10319 Posts
On September 03 2009 04:16 uglymoose89 wrote: That's all good but what if someone just hates the genre. It's not like they can escape the deafening music. Then they should have chosen where they lived more carefully by finding out if I live there first. End of story. | ||
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inkblot
United States1250 Posts
On September 03 2009 03:58 nicoaldo wrote: I think u can get better sound quality by recording at a higher volume, because u don´t need to amplify (and distort) the sound if u want to hear it very loud. It doesn't matter what volume the CD is mastered at, it's the output volume of the amplifier/speakers that determines it's distortion. If your stereo is using 10 watts to produce 70dB in your car while playing a CD that's recorded very quiet, it's still going to use 10 watts to produce 70dB playing a loud CD. Yes, you'll set the volume knob differently but the result is the same amount of distortion from the stereo. | ||
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uglymoose89
United States671 Posts
On September 03 2009 04:20 fanatacist wrote: Then they should have chosen where they lived more carefully by finding out if I live there first. End of story. haha w/e. On topic, i'm wondering what will happen when the producing companies finally hit a peak on music quality at that loudness? Will they resort to other forms of music formats? And how is the .aac format in comparison to .mp3? | ||
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Frits
11782 Posts
On September 03 2009 03:20 Hot_Bid wrote: i thought this thread was about that game where you and a friend yell "penis" or some other vulgarity louder and louder in a public place until one person gives up haha this owned in high school | ||
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LeperKahn
Romania1848 Posts
It's annoying to make a playlist that has songs that are MUCH louder than the rest since it causes me to constantly reach for the volume controls or get my ears raped. | ||
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Kong John
Denmark1020 Posts
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Dariush
Romania330 Posts
Btw I completely agree, the sound engineers need to put a stop to this shit, and people need to understand the difference between quality and loudness. I myself have a lot of friends who really believe the louder tracks have better quality :/ | ||
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m3rciless
United States1476 Posts
On September 03 2009 03:20 Hot_Bid wrote: i thought this thread was about that game where you and a friend yell "penis" or some other vulgarity louder and louder in a public place until one person gives up I don't know where you grew up but in my elementary school we just called that "playing penis". | ||
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Dewis
Finland344 Posts
It's really funny if you listen to some band that has played for like 30 years. Use constant volume. Start listening to a song from the first album, then move on to the next album. At some point you'll see a drastic rise in the volume level. | ||
Heyoka
Katowice25012 Posts
(also dewis is right anyone talking about volume is missing the mark - that wiki article doesn't do a very good job of explaining what its actually showing) | ||
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Aegraen
United States1225 Posts
On September 03 2009 07:39 Dewis wrote: Seems like many don't actually get what this really is about. It's not about the volume the end-listener uses, but the dynamics in the music. When records are mastered as loud as possible, the tracks are run through a lot of compressors and limiters which eventually fuck up all the dynamics in music. It's really funny if you listen to some band that has played for like 30 years. Use constant volume. Start listening to a song from the first album, then move on to the next album. At some point you'll see a drastic rise in the volume level. Eh. I guess I never noticed since I listen to genre's that either have very crisp production, or very coarse unadultered rapage (Black Metal). If you don't enjoy the production value then simply don't buy the album or listen to the music. No one is forcing you to pirate or purchase the music, simply look for music that fits your taste (Trust me, there is music out there for everyone). Besides, different production values at least in the music I listen to create a variance in the music that is appreciated... | ||
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Starparty
Sweden1963 Posts
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Wangsta
United States776 Posts
again, you cannot just pick a random volume and master a record to that volume. there is a MAXIMUM loudness that you cannot exceed on CDs (or anything else, for that matter). 16-bit audio (aka cd quality) gives you a maximum of roughly 90dB of range. at very max, the quietest sound can be 90dB quieter than the loudest sound. these "loudness war" supporters are mastering CDs by making the loudest sounds on a CD the maximum possible volume (of that 90dB range). This is fine, however, they don't stop there. They are making the quieter sounds louder too. That's where the problem is. How can you make the quieter sounds louder if the loudest sound is already at the maximum volume? Well, the only way you can do that is to reduce the difference between the loudest sound and the quietest sound. You do it by compressing the dynamic range of the music with a limiter/compressor. When you do this, it alters the actual sound waveform that is recorded in a studio. Your audio system and speakers CANNOT undo this change, it is a permanent loss of sound quality. However, if they master the same CD quieter and avoid compression, you can just turn up the volume on your speakers and enjoy the song with much less loss of sound quality of course, you might point out that 24-bit audio is slowly gaining popularity. 24-bit audio does not give you better sound quality than 16-bit audio (this is mathematically provable). However, it does give you a wider dynamic range (i think its 140dB, I dont remember the exact number), which means the difference between the quietest and loudest sounds can be bigger. but thats not a good solution either. if we allow this trend to continue, you can literally reach a point where music is loud enough to cause hearing damage even if you set your ipod/mp3 player to the lowest possible volume. there is absolutely no reason why the loudness war should exist. it doesnt do ANY good whatsoever | ||
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gameguard
Korea (South)2132 Posts
On September 03 2009 07:39 Dewis wrote: Seems like many don't actually get what this really is about. It's not about the volume the end-listener uses, but the dynamics in the music. When records are mastered as loud as possible, the tracks are run through a lot of compressors and limiters which eventually fuck up all the dynamics in music. It's really funny if you listen to some band that has played for like 30 years. Use constant volume. Start listening to a song from the first album, then move on to the next album. At some point you'll see a drastic rise in the volume level. I noticed this recently too. I downloaded songs from 80s/90s and they are all quiet as fuck compared to the new mp3s. This is really annoying when listening to a playlist because you have to constantly aadjust the volume. I ended up using some program to raise the overall dB lvls. You can only do like +3 or +6 dB without causing distortion due to that cap your talking about. | ||
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Wangsta
United States776 Posts
On September 03 2009 08:15 Aegraen wrote: Eh. I guess I never noticed since I listen to genre's that either have very crisp production, or very coarse unadultered rapage (Black Metal). If you don't enjoy the production value then simply don't buy the album or listen to the music. No one is forcing you to pirate or purchase the music, simply look for music that fits your taste (Trust me, there is music out there for everyone). Besides, different production values at least in the music I listen to create a variance in the music that is appreciated... Thats not true, a lot of good music also gets affected by the loudness war. To give you one example, one of my favorite bands of all time, the red hot chili peppers, had one of their best albums (californication) COMPLETELY raped by a studio engineer. its one of my favorite albums of all time, but its also one of the most poorly mastered albums ever, making it almost unlistenable on any remotely decent audio system (unless loud static, clipping, and sibilance don't bother you). there is literally no good recording of that album available on the market I dont care if mainstream rap/pop/etc. goes to hell and becomes unlistenable, but I DO care when good bands get affected and are forced to release poorly recorded albums A lot of people buy CDs because they offer better sound quality than mp3s. If CDs start to sound like compressed pieces of crap, then why bother spending money when mp3s sound the same (or possibly even better, since the high frequency compression can sometimes mask poor mastering) | ||
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skindzer
Chile5114 Posts
On September 03 2009 08:54 Wangsta wrote: Thats not true, a lot of good music also gets affected by the loudness war. To give you one example, one of my favorite bands of all time, the red hot chili peppers, had one of their best albums (californication) COMPLETELY raped by a studio engineer. its one of my favorite albums of all time, but its also one of the most poorly mastered albums ever, making it almost unlistenable on any remotely decent audio system (unless loud static, clipping, and sibilance don't bother you). there is literally no good recording of that album available on the market I dont care if mainstream rap/pop/etc. goes to hell and becomes unlistenable, but I DO care when good bands get affected and are forced to release poorly recorded albums A lot of people buy CDs because they offer better sound quality than mp3s. If CDs start to sound like compressed pieces of crap, then why bother spending money when mp3s sound the same (or possibly even better, since the high frequency compression can sometimes mask poor mastering) Can you provide a way to compare? | ||
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