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On October 11 2012 19:31 hctim wrote:
Hey guys, I'm thinking about buying this game after seeing some streams and playing the demo. Just wanted to find out everyone's opinion on the multi-player mode. Is it any good? Could you see it maintaining an active player base?
Not played it myself, but from what I've read it's mostly just an additional part that was slapped on so they could market the game as having multiplayer. XCOM has always been a singleplayer game.
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On October 11 2012 14:16 TotalBiscuit wrote:There's your problem
Been playing it for 12 hours straight now and it IS a much more shallow game than the original.
Dumbed down alot.
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On October 11 2012 20:41 theJob wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 14:16 TotalBiscuit wrote:On October 11 2012 09:22 theJob wrote:
Only played for 30 minutes or so There's your problem Been playing it for 12 hours straight now and it IS a much more shallow game than the original. Dumbed down alot.
No worries, for those who feel it's dumbed down, the original is still there. For those of us who would call it "streamlined", we can enjoy the new game. Everyone is happy :O
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From what i played the game sucks, the endless tutorial is the worst fucking example of tutorial that iv seen in years... It's like "here, take a base... oups your only gonna be allowed to actually use it 10 missions in !!" but i haven't played enough sadly so i guess that problem gets fixed 3 hours in.
I started on hardest difficulty, which is likely not the way they planed a newcomer to the series ( played Alien when i was younger but not XCOM ), the missions was... doable but I had to reload a lot of saves to do it :p.
Than I said to myself that i will play on classic difficulty and just go with the no save route but than i simply go obliterated at the end of my 3rd mission and only got 1 of my squad back.
I'm really thinking now... is the game supposed to have missions where you lose squad members ? Are you just supposed to save and reload if you got a really bad dice roll so your squad won't die ?.
Im half temped to go play last dif again and play it with saves and half tempted to just roll on with classic difficulty.
Still, it seems like such a great game but you pretty much get 1 or 2 shooted by aliens and everything is dice roll based. In addition it seems like ranks are really fucking important. So i just have to pray my veterans won't get shoot at or restart 1000 times per missions ? I don't get how this game wants me to play it and i don't fell like wasting 20 hours of my life to understand.
I believe it will be such a great game and the concept of base management + turn based missions is exactly my cup of tea but why the hell do you add CHANCE TO FUCKING HIT !!?!?
I know it was in the original, but is there any solid argument for this mechanic ( in year 2012, not in the 90s... im sure it was great in the 90s but its been over 12 years ).
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I'm about to install the game i have never played any of that genre before!
Any tips would be greatly appreciated, i will set the bar high as any game and raise the difficulty to its highest!
Therefere as requested, any advices/tips would be greatly appreciated! cheers 
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The original XCOM on harder difficulties was an absolute meat-grinder for the first few levels (hours?) which would seem appropriate given that you're putting your average military dude up against a high tech genetically engineered combat alien. Gotta say I prefer it being this way, at least on Classic. Definitely makes it more challenging.
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On October 11 2012 21:15 Aterons_toss wrote:
From what i played the game sucks, the endless tutorial is the worst fucking example of tutorial that iv seen in years... It's like "here, take a base... oups your only gonna be allowed to actually use it 10 missions in !!" but i haven't played enough sadly so i guess that problem gets fixed 3 hours in.
I started on hardest difficulty, which is likely not the way they planed a newcomer to the series ( played Alien when i was younger but not XCOM ), the missions was... doable but I had to reload a lot of saves to do it :p.
Than I said to myself that i will play on classic difficulty and just go with the no save route but than i simply go obliterated at the end of my 3rd mission and only got 1 of my squad back.
I'm really thinking now... is the game supposed to have missions where you lose squad members ? Are you just supposed to save and reload if you got a really bad dice roll so your squad won't die ?.
Im half temped to go play last dif again and play it with saves and half tempted to just roll on with classic difficulty.
Still, it seems like such a great game but you pretty much get 1 or 2 shooted by aliens and everything is dice roll based. In addition it seems like ranks are really fucking important. So i just have to pray my veterans won't get shoot at or restart 1000 times per missions ? I don't get how this game wants me to play it and i don't fell like wasting 20 hours of my life to understand.
I believe it will be such a great game and the concept of base management + turn based missions is exactly my cup of tea but why the hell do you add CHANCE TO FUCKING HIT !!?!?
I know it was in the original, but is there any solid argument for this mechanic ( in year 2012, not in the 90s... im sure it was great in the 90s but its been over 12 years ).
There's luck in pretty much all game systems, you use the other variables to improve your odds. People playing in classic difficulty on ironman (no saves) in this topic aren't whining about chance to hit, they are using proper cover and proper tactics to improve their chances. Yeah, you will lose squad members, if you have shitty luck, you might lose all of them... but if you play well, your chances are greatly improved and with proper base management etc you can avert failed missions being a failed game. That's the real skill of the game, knowing what to research, what to manufacture, how to keep your soldiers alive, how to handle risk/reward etc... the skill is not in placing a shot on a specific alien in a specific mission, which is indeed semi-luck based.
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On October 11 2012 21:16 CaM27 wrote:I'm about to install the game i have never played any of that genre before! Any tips would be greatly appreciated, i will set the bar high as any game and raise the difficulty to its highest! Therefere as requested, any advices/tips would be greatly appreciated! cheers
I wouldn't recommend that. Higher difficulty are for people who know what they are doing and want a massive challenge, the game is really unfair on impossible. If you're new enough to ask for advice, that's probably a good sign you should be playing the game on normal.
Hey, it's not like you can't change difficulty later, so why not save the harder difficulty until you know what you're up against?
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Played the older Xcoms but never really hardcore so still learning now but at the higher difficulties its really easy to lose someone who is standing in full cover because of "lucky" shots and with the cost of soldiers its really punishing to lose soldiers.
Atleast in the older Xcoms you could by 10+ soldiers and not really notice it on your bank account but money is way way tighter now.
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On October 11 2012 21:21 Tobberoth wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 21:15 Aterons_toss wrote:
From what i played the game sucks, the endless tutorial is the worst fucking example of tutorial that iv seen in years... It's like "here, take a base... oups your only gonna be allowed to actually use it 10 missions in !!" but i haven't played enough sadly so i guess that problem gets fixed 3 hours in.
I started on hardest difficulty, which is likely not the way they planed a newcomer to the series ( played Alien when i was younger but not XCOM ), the missions was... doable but I had to reload a lot of saves to do it :p.
Than I said to myself that i will play on classic difficulty and just go with the no save route but than i simply go obliterated at the end of my 3rd mission and only got 1 of my squad back.
I'm really thinking now... is the game supposed to have missions where you lose squad members ? Are you just supposed to save and reload if you got a really bad dice roll so your squad won't die ?.
Im half temped to go play last dif again and play it with saves and half tempted to just roll on with classic difficulty.
Still, it seems like such a great game but you pretty much get 1 or 2 shooted by aliens and everything is dice roll based. In addition it seems like ranks are really fucking important. So i just have to pray my veterans won't get shoot at or restart 1000 times per missions ? I don't get how this game wants me to play it and i don't fell like wasting 20 hours of my life to understand.
I believe it will be such a great game and the concept of base management + turn based missions is exactly my cup of tea but why the hell do you add CHANCE TO FUCKING HIT !!?!?
I know it was in the original, but is there any solid argument for this mechanic ( in year 2012, not in the 90s... im sure it was great in the 90s but its been over 12 years ). There's luck in pretty much all game systems, you use the other variables to improve your odds. People playing in classic difficulty on ironman (no saves) in this topic aren't whining about chance to hit, they are using proper cover and proper tactics to improve their chances. Yeah, you will lose squad members, if you have shitty luck, you might lose all of them... but if you play well, your chances are greatly improved and with proper base management etc you can avert failed missions being a failed game. That's the real skill of the game, knowing what to research, what to manufacture, how to keep your soldiers alive, how to handle risk/reward etc... the skill is not in placing a shot on a specific alien in a specific mission, which is indeed semi-luck based.
Well, i guess that I might just restart on impossible than and go with the ironman ( googled that now, didn't notice that advance potion button ) than. Still it would have been much easier if they just told you about it in that 2 hours tutorial instead of having 20 minutes of cheep voice acting cutscenes.
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On October 11 2012 21:27 Gorsameth wrote:
Played the older Xcoms but never really hardcore so still learning now but at the higher difficulties its really easy to lose someone who is standing in full cover because of "lucky" shots and with the cost of soldiers its really punishing to lose soldiers.
Atleast in the older Xcoms you could by 10+ soldiers and not really notice it on your bank account but money is way way tighter now.
Lol, yeah. Meat was cheap back then
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On October 11 2012 21:31 Arevall wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 21:27 Gorsameth wrote:
Played the older Xcoms but never really hardcore so still learning now but at the higher difficulties its really easy to lose someone who is standing in full cover because of "lucky" shots and with the cost of soldiers its really punishing to lose soldiers.
Atleast in the older Xcoms you could by 10+ soldiers and not really notice it on your bank account but money is way way tighter now. Lol, yeah. Meat was cheap back then
so it was T_T
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On October 11 2012 21:15 Aterons_toss wrote:
From what i played the game sucks, the endless tutorial is the worst fucking example of tutorial that iv seen in years... It's like "here, take a base... oups your only gonna be allowed to actually use it 10 missions in !!" but i haven't played enough sadly so i guess that problem gets fixed 3 hours in.
I started on hardest difficulty, which is likely not the way they planed a newcomer to the series ( played Alien when i was younger but not XCOM ), the missions was... doable but I had to reload a lot of saves to do it :p.
Than I said to myself that i will play on classic difficulty and just go with the no save route but than i simply go obliterated at the end of my 3rd mission and only got 1 of my squad back.
I'm really thinking now... is the game supposed to have missions where you lose squad members ? Are you just supposed to save and reload if you got a really bad dice roll so your squad won't die ?.
Im half temped to go play last dif again and play it with saves and half tempted to just roll on with classic difficulty.
Still, it seems like such a great game but you pretty much get 1 or 2 shooted by aliens and everything is dice roll based. In addition it seems like ranks are really fucking important. So i just have to pray my veterans won't get shoot at or restart 1000 times per missions ? I don't get how this game wants me to play it and i don't fell like wasting 20 hours of my life to understand.
I believe it will be such a great game and the concept of base management + turn based missions is exactly my cup of tea but why the hell do you add CHANCE TO FUCKING HIT !!?!?
I know it was in the original, but is there any solid argument for this mechanic ( in year 2012, not in the 90s... im sure it was great in the 90s but its been over 12 years ).
Wait so you picked the hard difficulty and are complaining about how hard it is?
really?
If you didnt lose soldiers like in the original I probably wouldnt enjoy the game.
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Well if it's anything like the original, then yea, soldiers die, part of their job. You could take all the safety measures possible and still lose people in even "easy" small UFO recovery missions. All it takes is one reaction shot from an alien and someone went down, no matter what they were wearing.
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On October 11 2012 22:35 PassiveAce wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 21:15 Aterons_toss wrote:
From what i played the game sucks, the endless tutorial is the worst fucking example of tutorial that iv seen in years... It's like "here, take a base... oups your only gonna be allowed to actually use it 10 missions in !!" but i haven't played enough sadly so i guess that problem gets fixed 3 hours in.
I started on hardest difficulty, which is likely not the way they planed a newcomer to the series ( played Alien when i was younger but not XCOM ), the missions was... doable but I had to reload a lot of saves to do it :p.
Than I said to myself that i will play on classic difficulty and just go with the no save route but than i simply go obliterated at the end of my 3rd mission and only got 1 of my squad back.
I'm really thinking now... is the game supposed to have missions where you lose squad members ? Are you just supposed to save and reload if you got a really bad dice roll so your squad won't die ?.
Im half temped to go play last dif again and play it with saves and half tempted to just roll on with classic difficulty.
Still, it seems like such a great game but you pretty much get 1 or 2 shooted by aliens and everything is dice roll based. In addition it seems like ranks are really fucking important. So i just have to pray my veterans won't get shoot at or restart 1000 times per missions ? I don't get how this game wants me to play it and i don't fell like wasting 20 hours of my life to understand.
I believe it will be such a great game and the concept of base management + turn based missions is exactly my cup of tea but why the hell do you add CHANCE TO FUCKING HIT !!?!?
I know it was in the original, but is there any solid argument for this mechanic ( in year 2012, not in the 90s... im sure it was great in the 90s but its been over 12 years ). Wait so you picked the hard difficulty and are complaining about how hard it is? really? If you didnt lose soldiers like in the original I probably wouldnt enjoy the game.
See, people like you, I sometime believe that people like you are the reason that COD is still alive and all the bad things happen in the game industry...
Saying that you'd like to see the dice roll element replaced with another more skill based element is not saying that the game is " too hard". I never said i think it's "too hard" to get 50% hit chance, i said i think it could have been done in a better way where instead of 50% hit chance you have say.... 50% damage reduction.
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On October 11 2012 23:31 Aterons_toss wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2012 22:35 PassiveAce wrote:On October 11 2012 21:15 Aterons_toss wrote:
From what i played the game sucks, the endless tutorial is the worst fucking example of tutorial that iv seen in years... It's like "here, take a base... oups your only gonna be allowed to actually use it 10 missions in !!" but i haven't played enough sadly so i guess that problem gets fixed 3 hours in.
I started on hardest difficulty, which is likely not the way they planed a newcomer to the series ( played Alien when i was younger but not XCOM ), the missions was... doable but I had to reload a lot of saves to do it :p.
Than I said to myself that i will play on classic difficulty and just go with the no save route but than i simply go obliterated at the end of my 3rd mission and only got 1 of my squad back.
I'm really thinking now... is the game supposed to have missions where you lose squad members ? Are you just supposed to save and reload if you got a really bad dice roll so your squad won't die ?.
Im half temped to go play last dif again and play it with saves and half tempted to just roll on with classic difficulty.
Still, it seems like such a great game but you pretty much get 1 or 2 shooted by aliens and everything is dice roll based. In addition it seems like ranks are really fucking important. So i just have to pray my veterans won't get shoot at or restart 1000 times per missions ? I don't get how this game wants me to play it and i don't fell like wasting 20 hours of my life to understand.
I believe it will be such a great game and the concept of base management + turn based missions is exactly my cup of tea but why the hell do you add CHANCE TO FUCKING HIT !!?!?
I know it was in the original, but is there any solid argument for this mechanic ( in year 2012, not in the 90s... im sure it was great in the 90s but its been over 12 years ). Wait so you picked the hard difficulty and are complaining about how hard it is? really? If you didnt lose soldiers like in the original I probably wouldnt enjoy the game. See, people like you, I sometime believe that people like you are the reason that COD is still alive and all the bad things happen in the game industry...
lol k
your the one complaining about difficulty here.
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On October 11 2012 21:04 Tobberoth wrote:
No worries, for those who feel it's dumbed down, the original is still there. For those of us who would call it "streamlined", we can enjoy the new game. Everyone is happy :O
Sorry, but people who have more refined taste aren't "happy" that a new XCOM came out and it's designed for console players. We would be "happy" if the game came out and it actually lived up to the standard set by its predecessor. I don't get the mentality that people with no standards are the ones who deserve to be catered to.
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On October 11 2012 23:31 Aterons_toss wrote:
See, people like you, I sometime believe that people like you are the reason that COD is still alive and all the bad things happen in the game industry...
Saying that you'd like to see the dice roll element replaced with another more skill based element is not saying that the game is " too hard". I never said i think it's "too hard" to get 50% hit chance, i said i think it could have been done in a better way where instead of 50% hit chance you have say.... 50% damage reduction.
The %hit thing is truely part of what makes the risk/reward system in this game so great. Do you take that 40% shot? Or play things safe and just sit in overwatch hoping for a better shot later. Do you spend your turn instead setting up a flank to increase your change at success, hoping there's not more aliens out there to cover that path, or charge forward under suppressive fire to keep their chances to shoot back at you down.
If every shot just hit automatically a lot of the actual strategy would go out the window. You would see the enemy in cover, figure out exactly how many of your guys it would take to kill it, and then move on to the next guy. Overwatch would need to be removed (because it would be TOO good) and suddenly the gameplay starts to fall apart. The strategic and tactical depth gained with %hit adds far more to the game than it takes away. The bonus side is all these classic "that's XCOM, baby!" moments when your soldier misses that 95% chance shot causing your beloved soldiers to start dying, or when you make that 10% shot saving the day.
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RNG does take away from the experience some.
If there is a shot one of my squads can take and I myself can make that shot no problem in real life, it shouldnt miss.
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On October 11 2012 22:46 daemir wrote:
Well if it's anything like the original, then yea, soldiers die, part of their job. You could take all the safety measures possible and still lose people in even "easy" small UFO recovery missions. All it takes is one reaction shot from an alien and someone went down, no matter what they were wearing.
I just replayed the original a bit last week, and the only way i found to reliably end mission without a lot of losses was to just have very good Psi-Ops, and use aliens to scout everything instead of your own soldiers. Before that, yes, you can reduce losses, but never completely negate them. Even when you blow up every single house on the map, that guy will still stand exactly behind the last piece of wall you destroyed, and reactionshot you in the face, then proceed to throw a grenade onto your squad the next turn because the 3 guys who still had time left missed him. I never expected more then half of my squad coming back from terror missions.
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EPT
