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Civilization V + DLC's, G&K, BNW - Page 79

Forum Index > General Games
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NeonFlare
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
Finland1307 Posts
January 26 2013 16:37 GMT
#1561
It depends, sometimes some of the AI that starts far away manages to get lucky with their surroundings and proceed to expand and stomp their neighbours without much interference, in those cases they will get really big. In one of my recent games I had to force some wars early to stay up with two major military powers that were trying to gang up on some wonder rushing one. Managed to get most of the passive AIs lands before they got far and bribed them against each other while assaulting one of them.

I took them down one by one and got massive points from all the cities and stuff but still one of the others amassed wonders AND stomped his neighbours at other side of world, so the world was split in about three parts with me having one, the big AI having one and inbetween bunch of smaller civs that tried to keep up alliance to stay in game and get in my way to let the big AI grow even bigger.

I still haven't finished the game, but the more advantage they have, the bigger the snowballing will be once it begins. In some games none go too far and are struggling in deadlock against eachother or do stupid stuff, but usually it's one or few more civs that get exploding start compared to others and just smother them.
Acrofales
Profile Joined August 2010
Spain18387 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-26 16:44:55
January 26 2013 16:38 GMT
#1562
Play mostly on King, because I find it the best in terms of fairness. However, when I get to lategame I can pretty much always steamroll my opponents (and it gets too easy).

I see people think Japan is garbage. Why exactly? Bushido is rather nice and Samurai are good. It's a bit of a shame that GG aren't as good as they were in vanilla Civ 5 (can't use them to start golden ages). That leaves the Zero as pretty meh, but I can never get off to a lightning start to use something like Jaguars or Slingthrowers anyway, so I prefer having a bad lategame unit to a good earlygame unit that I can't use right.

How do people get enough cities with production out fast enough to compete with the insane advantages of AI on deity?

EDIT: I may be unclear. The two or three games I played on Deity, I get crushed, because there will always be an AI somewhere near and he outproduces army and just smothers me. All the while, that same AI is creating WW and settlers. If I focus on army units, I can defend for a while, but eventually get too far behind in tech and everybody gobbles up the wonders I want, settles land that I want and I generally feel starved and restart at an easier level.
Eishi_Ki
Profile Joined April 2009
Korea (South)1667 Posts
January 26 2013 16:52 GMT
#1563
On January 27 2013 01:38 Acrofales wrote:
Play mostly on King, because I find it the best in terms of fairness. However, when I get to lategame I can pretty much always steamroll my opponents (and it gets too easy).

I see people think Japan is garbage. Why exactly? Bushido is rather nice and Samurai are good. It's a bit of a shame that GG aren't as good as they were in vanilla Civ 5 (can't use them to start golden ages). That leaves the Zero as pretty meh, but I can never get off to a lightning start to use something like Jaguars or Slingthrowers anyway, so I prefer having a bad lategame unit to a good earlygame unit that I can't use right.

How do people get enough cities with production out fast enough to compete with the insane advantages of AI on deity?

EDIT: I may be unclear. The two or three games I played on Deity, I get crushed, because there will always be an AI somewhere near and he outproduces army and just smothers me. All the while, that same AI is creating WW and settlers. If I focus on army units, I can defend for a while, but eventually get too far behind in tech and everybody gobbles up the wonders I want, settles land that I want and I generally feel starved and restart at an easier level.


Place cities intelligently
Build Archers
Build the NC
Scout
Don't overexpand
Don't aggrevate AIs
Try and steal a worker from a city state
Ask yourself why exactly you're aiming for a particular tech
Cut the fat out your build order
Play cautiously
Ignore aspirations of building World Wonders
Maintain relationships
Make money

Just some advice I like to give ^^

Japan is alright, they're just nothing special.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
January 26 2013 17:48 GMT
#1564
Japan is pretty bad. Their UA is only marginally useful against barbs, and Samurai are (imo) one of the worst UUs in the game.

While there is the Landsknecht, Samurai only starts with Shock I and Great General II. GG generation is pretty weak in my opinion (at least against AIs), and Shock I on non-mount melee units is really situational. Furthermore, because it is a Longswordsman replacement, you are most likely just going to build it then immediately upgrade to Musketman because the two units are just 1 tech away from each other. It also requires Iron, unlike some of the other UUs from other civs.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Noizhende
Profile Joined January 2012
Austria328 Posts
January 26 2013 18:34 GMT
#1565
Are you serious?! From my experience Japan rapes every other nation in battles, because their wounded units don't have less attack strength. That's totally imbalanced.
Die neuen Tempel haben schon Risse - künftige Ruinen - einst wächst Gras auch über diese Stadt - über ihre letzte Schicht
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-26 23:05:16
January 26 2013 22:56 GMT
#1566
God the AIs hate me.

[image loading]

I probably spent like 50 turns fending them off at the same time. Gosh.

Landsknecht were actually extremely useful to me this game. They are like zerglings - expendable and tank damage for me.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Scip
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Czech Republic11293 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-26 23:19:06
January 26 2013 23:05 GMT
#1567
Japan isn't that good, compared to the most overpowered civilizations like Mayans (AKA I don't need National College), Ethiopians (Guaranteed ceremonial burial, also triple faith gen of other civs), English (logbows 3 range wat), Arabia (with enough trade partners each luxury resource is worth 8 gpt, let's double that LOL) and to a lesser extent Egypt (my sarcophags made of gold cost no money to maintain, can't explain that) and some other stuff I am probably forgetting. Today I made 10 cities by turn 95 as Ethiopia and was tech leader despite never building NC on Immortal difficulty, you can't really do that with anyone else LOL
edit: Oh yeah, Babylon, because giving the play a great scientist at turn 20 isn't broken at all right? :D
"It may be pleasurable for some of us to imagine being ravished" - Christopher Hitchens in a debate with feminists RIP 2011 Psalm 2:9 You shall break them with a rod of iron
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-26 23:32:50
January 26 2013 23:22 GMT
#1568
On January 27 2013 08:05 Scip wrote:
Japan isn't that good, compared to the most overpowered civilizations like Mayans (AKA I don't need National College), Ethiopians (Guaranteed ceremonial burial, also triple faith gen of other civs), English (logbows 3 range wat), Arabia (with enough trade partners each luxury resource is worth 8 gpt, let's double that LOL) and to a lesser extent Egypt (my sarcophags made of gold cost no money to maintain, can't explain that) and some other stuff I am probably forgetting. Today I made 10 cities by turn 95 as Ethiopia and was tech leader despite never building NC on Immortal difficulty, you can't really do that with anyone else LOL
edit: Oh yeah, Babylon, because giving the play a great scientist at turn 20 isn't broken at all right? :D


Ugh Bablyon. I am so glad I don't have those stupid DLCs.

On January 27 2013 01:52 Eishi_Ki wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 27 2013 01:38 Acrofales wrote:
Play mostly on King, because I find it the best in terms of fairness. However, when I get to lategame I can pretty much always steamroll my opponents (and it gets too easy).

I see people think Japan is garbage. Why exactly? Bushido is rather nice and Samurai are good. It's a bit of a shame that GG aren't as good as they were in vanilla Civ 5 (can't use them to start golden ages). That leaves the Zero as pretty meh, but I can never get off to a lightning start to use something like Jaguars or Slingthrowers anyway, so I prefer having a bad lategame unit to a good earlygame unit that I can't use right.

How do people get enough cities with production out fast enough to compete with the insane advantages of AI on deity?

EDIT: I may be unclear. The two or three games I played on Deity, I get crushed, because there will always be an AI somewhere near and he outproduces army and just smothers me. All the while, that same AI is creating WW and settlers. If I focus on army units, I can defend for a while, but eventually get too far behind in tech and everybody gobbles up the wonders I want, settles land that I want and I generally feel starved and restart at an easier level.


Place cities intelligently
Build Archers
Build the NC
Scout
Don't overexpand
Don't aggrevate AIs
Try and steal a worker from a city state
Ask yourself why exactly you're aiming for a particular tech
Cut the fat out your build order
Play cautiously
Ignore aspirations of building World Wonders
Maintain relationships
Make money

Just some advice I like to give ^^

Japan is alright, they're just nothing special.


Some more numerical stuff:

- Once an AI has researched writing, sell your embassy to him for 25g.
- Sell luxury resources for 240g. If you want to expand fast you need to buy Settlers, so you need as much gold as you can.
-> The AI is always willing to take a lux for 240g... unless, of course, he is mad at you or wants to kill you.
- (situational) Sell Open Border to AI for 50g.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Scip
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Czech Republic11293 Posts
January 27 2013 07:06 GMT
#1569
Just won my first Deity game! Pangea, standard speed and settings, as Inca. Nothing special, just went super tall with 4 cities, dodged some war bullets by luck (just declared everyone friend and opened ALL the borders, LOL). Got my capital to size 34 by turn 201, that's 1 pop every 6 turns son. Some sick research speed right there, had very little military and most of the game my cities were protected by composite bows, but w/e man, a win is a win is a win is a win (as long as you don't play one of the most overpowered civs as stated above)
"It may be pleasurable for some of us to imagine being ravished" - Christopher Hitchens in a debate with feminists RIP 2011 Psalm 2:9 You shall break them with a rod of iron
Noizhende
Profile Joined January 2012
Austria328 Posts
January 27 2013 13:16 GMT
#1570
Which civs are the weakest in your opinion? I try to decide which one to pick. Normally i just roll random, but i hate to get some of the (in my opinion) better ones, or civs which basically force you in one direction of play.
Best thing would be if there were a mode allowing you to disable all the boni, didn't find anything like that...
Die neuen Tempel haben schon Risse - künftige Ruinen - einst wächst Gras auch über diese Stadt - über ihre letzte Schicht
Bleak
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Turkey3059 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-27 13:45:10
January 27 2013 13:43 GMT
#1571
I thought Germany to be pretty weak but I tried out a game with them today and that Landsknecht! It's so cheap to build and if I'm not wrong has the same (or maybe slightly lower) strength as a Swordsman, does not require Iron and has combat bonus versus Mounted Units. That's just super good, I managed to conquer a neighbour fairly easily, I just swarmed them with Landsknechts while my CB did all the work.

Don't think I'm going to win that game though, so I'll give it another try. -25% maintenance for land units is just really good too.

I won a Science Victory with Isabella today, Immortal difficulty and Standard speed. It was pretty close, I won it with something like 5-10 turns of advantage. China was going both Cultural and Scientific Vict, and they needed just one part while I built all the parts in a span of 8 turns from all my cities. Together with the Hubble Telescope I made it, but it was close man, William took the lands I conquered from Carthage and had a strong army with nukes. Thankfully, I had Stealth Bombers and Giant Death Robots so even if the game went longer I think I would have got my lands back if I had to build units instead of the spaceship parts.

I think India is the weakest civ, managing happiness isn't hard, especially after the expansion. There are so many ways you can get your happiness up, which means a UA which discourages expanding and gives you just more happiness is just not good at all.
"I am a beacon of knowledge blazing out across a black sea of ignorance. "
Eishi_Ki
Profile Joined April 2009
Korea (South)1667 Posts
January 27 2013 14:26 GMT
#1572
India is the weakest. Their UA has become more of a hinderance since G+K.

On paper, Polynesia should be really weak but for some reason, in all my games, they seem to get super big and I have no idea why.... a real peculiarity.

Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
January 27 2013 19:34 GMT
#1573
But India basically saves happiness for you in every city after it has 6 pop. Also India's UU is war chariot on steroid without needing horses - for all intents and purposes you get composite bows in ancient era.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
January 27 2013 19:38 GMT
#1574
On January 27 2013 16:06 Scip wrote:
Just won my first Deity game! Pangea, standard speed and settings, as Inca. Nothing special, just went super tall with 4 cities, dodged some war bullets by luck (just declared everyone friend and opened ALL the borders, LOL). Got my capital to size 34 by turn 201, that's 1 pop every 6 turns son. Some sick research speed right there, had very little military and most of the game my cities were protected by composite bows, but w/e man, a win is a win is a win is a win (as long as you don't play one of the most overpowered civs as stated above)

It is incredible how much easier the game is when you have a food rich capital.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
January 28 2013 00:35 GMT
#1575
I got backstabbed by Catherine two games in a row. I JUST GAVE YOUR SETTLER BACK TO YOU WHY DID YOU DOW ME?!?!?!?!
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Scip
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Czech Republic11293 Posts
January 28 2013 01:07 GMT
#1576
Yeah, either food rich capital, or Incas, terrace farms too stronk (well, they have nothing else going for them, so they aren't exactly OP...) About the weakest civ, pre-patch it was Danish imo, hard to tell now. All civs have something really good about them. But yeah, if I had to pick one now, it would be Germany.
"It may be pleasurable for some of us to imagine being ravished" - Christopher Hitchens in a debate with feminists RIP 2011 Psalm 2:9 You shall break them with a rod of iron
Divine-Sneaker
Profile Joined August 2010
Denmark1225 Posts
January 28 2013 02:29 GMT
#1577
On January 28 2013 09:35 Sufficiency wrote:
I got backstabbed by Catherine two games in a row. I JUST GAVE YOUR SETTLER BACK TO YOU WHY DID YOU DOW ME?!?!?!?!


In every single game I play where she is present, she will either declare me war extremely quickly after finding me, or backstab me after half a game of loyalty towards her. By now it's become such a clear pattern that I know to expect it and can prepare. But god she's a bitch.
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
January 28 2013 03:28 GMT
#1578
[image loading]
Yes, Hiawatha. Your time has come.

The 12 aircraft in Adrianople are Great War Bombers that I rush-bought in one turn (money is OP). With those, and my 7 artillery, I should be able to butcher and steamroll whatever Hiawatha sends my way. The only problem with this war is that Hiawatha has the damned Great Wall, and his capital city where it was built is like six cities away or so. We're pretty much identical in tech, though he is starting to run away with his damned monstrous empire, which is why I'm invading.

A few other miscellaneous details about the game -- The Incans and Byzantines double-DoW'd me just as I started producing my first couple camel archers. Needless to say, their timing was unfortunate, I ended up slaughtering both of them. My empire is funny-shaped because I have a gigantic friggin mountain range right in the middle of my land, which is generally poor. My capital is pretty awesome though -- 2 corns, 3 crabs, and marble with lots of hills. Difficulty is immortal.
Sub40APM
Profile Joined August 2010
6336 Posts
January 28 2013 04:08 GMT
#1579
Great Wall becomes obsolete with Dynamite and since you have artillery...
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
January 28 2013 04:13 GMT
#1580
On January 28 2013 13:08 Sub40APM wrote:
Great Wall becomes obsolete with Dynamite and since you have artillery...

I think it might be when the holder has dynamite. I definitely am still dealing with the movement penalty as of that screenshot.
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