EPT
Here To Stay - Page 4
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vx70GTOJudgexv
United States3161 Posts
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Mobius
Canada1268 Posts
I could go on for more, but I think I’ve made the point rather clearly by now - Jaedong is to Zerg as Nada is to Terran. Totally disagree.. NaDa has totally redefined all terran matchups.. Whereas Jaedong used what others gave him.. Jaedong has upsets left right and center, upsets didnt happen for sAviOr. NaDa has 22 achievements, vs Jaedongs 11. "upset=bisu 3-0" no, that wasn't an upset, that was the beginning of the end. looks like Bisu is yawning in that picture. Jaedong ISNT above Bisu for 2009. The only thing that you could use to argue is that Jaedong was busy carrying his team while playing in the individual leagues, while Bisu was able to focus on his matches. I know a lot of people don't like when people start listing winrates and they don't determine how good a player is, but im going to do it anyways. Bisu 2009 83 wins - 32 losses (72.17%) Bisu PvP 2009 29 wins - 7 losses (80.56%) Jaedong 2009 Record: 98 wins - 45 losses (68.53%) Jaedong 2009 ZvZ 41 wins - 13 losses (75.93%) Bisu vs Jaedong 2009 Record: 4 wins - 3 losses (57.14%) and yes I know im going to get some intense flames from you rabid Jaedong fans. | ||
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fnaticNoname
India858 Posts
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ArnO-
United States258 Posts
Totally disagree.. NaDa has totally redefined all terran matchups.. Whereas Jaedong used what others gave him.. Jaedong repopularized 2 hatch muta in ZvT Jaedong has upsets left right and center, upsets didnt happen for sAviOr. Savior lost in 2 msl finals, meanwhile Jaedong has only lost in 1 starleague finals. NaDa has 22 achievements, vs Jaedongs 11. Nada has been around for a lot longer then Jaedong, give Jaedong a chance to catch up then compare career achievements. Jaedong ISNT above Bisu for 2009. Jaedong has won back to back OSL finals, ro4 of msl, 3rd place in wcg korea, and single handedly carried his team to the proleague finals. Bisu's only individual league achievement this year is wcg korea. 2 OSL's > WCG I know a lot of people don't like when people start listing winrates and they don't determine how good a player is, but im going to do it anyways. Bisu 2009 83 wins - 32 losses (72.17%) Bisu PvP 2009 29 wins - 7 losses (80.56%) Jaedong 2009 Record: 98 wins - 45 losses (68.53%) Jaedong 2009 ZvZ 41 wins - 13 losses (75.93%) Bisu vs Jaedong 2009 Record: 4 wins - 3 losses (57.14%) Jaedong has gone deep in almost every starleague this year, therefore he has been facing harder competition then Bisu who has been getting knocked out of starleagues early. | ||
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FranzF1
Chile1710 Posts
And like always people will defend his favorites players until death (Bisu and Jaedong fans) but u cant say that Bisu and Jaedong are on the same level now, just cant. I didnt saw Jaedong like the Zerg's Nada, but yeah its like him lol. That just remind me of that great player that is Nada... Nada FIGHTING! | ||
cgrinker
United States3824 Posts
 Also are you sure Bisu isn't just yawning in that pic? | ||
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o[twist]
United States4903 Posts
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Count9
China10928 Posts
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keV.
United States3214 Posts
The Nada vs JD comparison is a great one. Not only do they have similar careers, they are also class acts outside of the booth. | ||
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7mk
Germany10157 Posts
On September 19 2009 12:31 Mobius wrote: Totally disagree.. NaDa has totally redefined all terran matchups.. Whereas Jaedong used what others gave him.. Jaedong has upsets left right and center, upsets didnt happen for sAviOr. NaDa has 22 achievements, vs Jaedongs 11. "upset=bisu 3-0" no, that wasn't an upset, that was the beginning of the end. looks like Bisu is yawning in that picture. Jaedong ISNT above Bisu for 2009. The only thing that you could use to argue is that Jaedong was busy carrying his team while playing in the individual leagues, while Bisu was able to focus on his matches. I know a lot of people don't like when people start listing winrates and they don't determine how good a player is, but im going to do it anyways. Bisu 2009 83 wins - 32 losses (72.17%) Bisu PvP 2009 29 wins - 7 losses (80.56%) Jaedong 2009 Record: 98 wins - 45 losses (68.53%) Jaedong 2009 ZvZ 41 wins - 13 losses (75.93%) Bisu vs Jaedong 2009 Record: 4 wins - 3 losses (57.14%) and yes I know im going to get some intense flames from you rabid Jaedong fans. yeah this was basically already answered: Reason why JD is better: JD wins when it matters, Bisu doesn't. Also JD did strongly influence all matchups. ZvZ was considered rock paper scissors before Jaedong, ZvT was already mentioned, ZvP 3 hatch spire -> 5 hatch hydra.. it's not exactly rare you see the build used nowadays is it | ||
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keV.
United States3214 Posts
On September 19 2009 12:31 Mobius wrote: Totally disagree.. NaDa has totally redefined all terran matchups.. Whereas Jaedong used what others gave him.. Jaedong has upsets left right and center, upsets didnt happen for sAviOr. NaDa has 22 achievements, vs Jaedongs 11. "upset=bisu 3-0" no, that wasn't an upset, that was the beginning of the end. looks like Bisu is yawning in that picture. Jaedong ISNT above Bisu for 2009. The only thing that you could use to argue is that Jaedong was busy carrying his team while playing in the individual leagues, while Bisu was able to focus on his matches. I know a lot of people don't like when people start listing winrates and they don't determine how good a player is, but im going to do it anyways. Bisu 2009 83 wins - 32 losses (72.17%) Bisu PvP 2009 29 wins - 7 losses (80.56%) Jaedong 2009 Record: 98 wins - 45 losses (68.53%) Jaedong 2009 ZvZ 41 wins - 13 losses (75.93%) Bisu vs Jaedong 2009 Record: 4 wins - 3 losses (57.14%) and yes I know im going to get some intense flames from you rabid Jaedong fans. I just wanted to let you know that SnIpEuOuT owned your face. | ||
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uSiN
United States208 Posts
Jaedong is not the most creative player but yet he wins with standard predefined strategies with deadly precision and timing. This just further amazes me that Jaedong's opponents almost know what Jaedong is going to do and yet they have not come up with a counter to stop it. So Jaedong doesn't have to be the creative player. If its not broken why fix it? But for a Jaedong vs Bisu series I only give Jaedong the advantage because I am a huge Jaedong fan and the series can go either way. Jaedong definitely had big influences on StarCraft because he showed us that standard strategies done to nearest perfection is as effective as creative play. | ||
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Mobius
Canada1268 Posts
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jyLee
United States350 Posts
On September 19 2009 12:31 Mobius wrote: Totally disagree.. NaDa has totally redefined all terran matchups.. Whereas Jaedong used what others gave him.. Jaedong has upsets left right and center, upsets didnt happen for sAviOr. NaDa has 22 achievements, vs Jaedongs 11. "upset=bisu 3-0" no, that wasn't an upset, that was the beginning of the end. looks like Bisu is yawning in that picture. Jaedong ISNT above Bisu for 2009. The only thing that you could use to argue is that Jaedong was busy carrying his team while playing in the individual leagues, while Bisu was able to focus on his matches. I know a lot of people don't like when people start listing winrates and they don't determine how good a player is, but im going to do it anyways. Bisu 2009 83 wins - 32 losses (72.17%) Bisu PvP 2009 29 wins - 7 losses (80.56%) Jaedong 2009 Record: 98 wins - 45 losses (68.53%) Jaedong 2009 ZvZ 41 wins - 13 losses (75.93%) Bisu vs Jaedong 2009 Record: 4 wins - 3 losses (57.14%) and yes I know im going to get some intense flames from you rabid Jaedong fans. So from the winrates you posted i see bisu played 28 fewer games than JD and alot of the games JD played were more stressful, high pressure games like ace games in proleague. So from those stats i conclude bisu plays on a super team and mostly comes out in games favorable for him. Im willing to bet JD would have superior winrates if he didnt have to completely carry his team and worry about starleague matches. | ||
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keV.
United States3214 Posts
On September 19 2009 13:16 Mobius wrote: Repopularising and creating are 2 completely different things. and he didnt even repopularise 2hatch muta... 2hatch muta was still commonly used in 2006... Not every zerg in 2006/2007 used 3hatch muta builds, not only that but a lot of progamers still use 3hatch builds sometimes, jaedong and effort included. Jaedong lost in an MSL and OSL 3-0'd by ForGG, and 3-1'd by Therock(lol) You forgot your own point. You said nothing about creating. NaDa didn't create a new matchup, Jaedong did. No one played JvZ before. | ||
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Eeevil
Netherlands359 Posts
On September 19 2009 12:31 Mobius wrote: Totally disagree.. NaDa has totally redefined all terran matchups.. Whereas Jaedong used what others gave him.. Jaedong has upsets left right and center, upsets didnt happen for sAviOr. NaDa has 22 achievements, vs Jaedongs 11. "upset=bisu 3-0" no, that wasn't an upset, that was the beginning of the end. looks like Bisu is yawning in that picture. Jaedong ISNT above Bisu for 2009. The only thing that you could use to argue is that Jaedong was busy carrying his team while playing in the individual leagues, while Bisu was able to focus on his matches. I know a lot of people don't like when people start listing winrates and they don't determine how good a player is, but im going to do it anyways. Bisu 2009 83 wins - 32 losses (72.17%) Bisu PvP 2009 29 wins - 7 losses (80.56%) Jaedong 2009 Record: 98 wins - 45 losses (68.53%) Jaedong 2009 ZvZ 41 wins - 13 losses (75.93%) Bisu vs Jaedong 2009 Record: 4 wins - 3 losses (57.14%) and yes I know im going to get some intense flames from you rabid Jaedong fans. So the fact that Jaedong ran deep into all individual Leagues and won a third OSL and carried Oz to PL finals is refuted by game statistics ? That's weak. I do like how you framed you statistics with flame bait. Here's to a Jaedong-Bisu OSL final  | ||
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Mobius
Canada1268 Posts
On September 19 2009 13:25 Eeevil wrote: So the fact that Jaedong ran deep into all individual Leagues and won a third OSL and carried Oz to PL finals is refuted by game statistics ? That's weak. I do like how you framed you statistics with flame bait. Here's to a Jaedong-Bisu OSL final lol no, Jaedong got 3rd place in wcg.. But Bisu got 1st.. and yes i know he carried his team to finals.. But Bisu won the finals.. | ||
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hyst.eric.al
United States2332 Posts
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ghrur
United States3787 Posts
On September 19 2009 13:28 Mobius wrote: lol no, Jaedong got 3rd place in wcg.. But Bisu got 1st.. and yes i know he carried his team to finals.. But Bisu won the finals.. Troll more. Fantasy won the finals. JD won a starleague, Bisu didn't... he didn't even make it out of the RO16 of the OSL... OSL holds more prestige than WCG. JD didn't need to win WCG either, he just needed to get top 3 =/. And.. um... how far did each make it in the MSL? Who had more wins in Proleague? Who played more matches? Do I hear JD? | ||
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skronch
United States2717 Posts
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