EPT[TV] HBO Game of Thrones - Page 1681
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KwarK
United States42773 Posts
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
But not everything can simply be cut, if your explanation for the Dany rescue is that days passed then you have to communicate that somehow. The show didn't do that, i would even say they did the contrary. (it looked like max 24 hours passed) If it's the job of the viewer to make it plausible through headcanon then the writers failed. It's really as easy as that. | ||
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Erasme
Bahamas15899 Posts
They all shouldve died during that dumb expedition. Or it shouldnt have happened | ||
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Odoakar
Croatia1837 Posts
On August 23 2017 08:05 CorsairHero wrote: what about wingspan and length? 737 wingspan is 36m btw ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/x78LMOQ.png) Drogon < 747 < Balerion | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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SC2Toastie
Netherlands5725 Posts
On August 22 2017 04:04 Broetchenholer wrote: If you want to know how they create the script, listen to them talk in those behind the wall segments: D talking about thescene where Vyserion is revived:"that seemed like it was an inherently crowdpleasing oh shit moment!" That's all there is left. What would be the biggest oh shit moment about Cersei and Dany and Jaime and Tyrion? The philosophy of this show went from intense drama, ruthlessness and real peope to this. It's pretty sad to be quite honest. | ||
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aseq
Netherlands3978 Posts
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B.I.G.
3251 Posts
Ned could've gone straight to the right people with news of Cersei's incest babies. But he didn't. Robb could've listened to council and married the Frey girl. But he didn't. Rhaegar Targaryan and Lyanna Stark could've told the North this wasn't an abduction but a change of heart. But they didn't. And the Night King could've speared all three dragons and kill the two most important leaders to his resistance, but again, he didn't. The war could've already ended in so many ways but that's not this story. This is a story of a prolonged war and we have such a close view that we sometimes see people make dumbass decisions, but I guess shit happens. | ||
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Broetchenholer
Germany1944 Posts
Ned had the support of the goldcloaks and Renly, put the Lannisterforces in chains and confronted Cersei with 200 men against Joffreys 3 Kingsguard. Inprisons Cersei but then he decided, you know what, my side is currently too powerful, i will send Renly and his men out of the city because i don't need them and i will let the commander of the goldcloaks negotiate with Cersei as well so she has chance to bribe them properly. This is the level of Logic of the show right now. | ||
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TheTenthDoc
United States9561 Posts
On August 24 2017 21:00 aseq wrote: I think the writers could have avoided a lot of these discussions with only a couple simple shots. A shot when it's dark and the heroes are sitting! on the rock, since there is nothing to do before the ice is strong enough, a shot of Dany getting the message and hopping onto her dragons, another shot of the heroes yawning/being hungry on the rock. They could have simply moved some of the banter from the beginning of the ep to the rock, and it would have felt like a long enough time. The best suggestion I've seen is for Dany to have flown north to the wall pre-emptively to protect Jon and Jorah (or out of anxiety for them) against Tyrion's counsel. Can still have an overnight on the ice since we really got no indication of how far Gendry ran but it easily cuts out 3ish days of Raven/dragon travel that the show didn't utilize or acknowledge anyway. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18004 Posts
On August 24 2017 21:44 B.I.G. wrote: You know the story could've ended much earlier. Ned could've gone straight to the right people with news of Cersei's incest babies. But he didn't. Robb could've listened to council and married the Frey girl. But he didn't. Rhaegar Targaryan and Lyanna Stark could've told the North this wasn't an abduction but a change of heart. But they didn't. And the Night King could've speared all three dragons and kill the two most important leaders to his resistance, but again, he didn't. The war could've already ended in so many ways but that's not this story. This is a story of a prolonged war and we have such a close view that we sometimes see people make dumbass decisions, but I guess shit happens. You know what the main difference is? For the first 2 we actually know a lot about the two people making the decisions, and we have insight into their flawed thought process. Do they make mistakes? Absolutely, but they are completely well-reasoned and understandable mistakes which are adequately explained in the scenes leading up to it. The third is basically ASOIAF's version of Pyramus & Thisbe, Romeo & Juliet, Tristan & Isolde or any other iteration of star-crossed lovers. You don't need to know much more about it than that, because it is immediately obvious how such stories end. Does it make inherent sense? Not really, but at least it's a tried and tested theme, and saying your narrative makes as much sense as Ovid or Shakespeare's do, would generally be seen as high praise. Meanwhile, your last example is problematic, precisely because we cannot follow along his reasoning. We can see he makes a mistake. He knows Jon Snow. He has seen him before (at Hardhome), and presumably knows him to be one of his principal foes. We know he can do frost magic, and simply freeze the lake at any moment (as he did with the sea at Hardhome) to send his massive undead army to slaughter them all. He doesn't for some unknown reason. Next thing, he sees dragons. One in particular, bigger than the others, with a rider on top. Moreover, THAT dragon is sitting still on the ground, and is an incredibly easy target to hurl an ice javelin at. Instead, he picks one of the smaller dragons, that is, additionally, a moving target flying around in the sky. Now clearly the moving target bit doesn't matter, because his aim and throwing force makes him put a patriot missile to shame. But even neglecting the "oh, apparently WWs can do that", it STILL doesn't explain his illogical choice of targets. And because we know nothing about WWs except "they are a bunch of lichs who kill humans whenever they see them", that choice cannot be made sense of within the narrative. It's just an illogical sequence of actions to keep the plot going. And it's exactly what everybody was afraid of: WWs are walking plot devices without any deeper motivation than to kill humans for the sake of plot requirements. | ||
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Pontual
Brazil3038 Posts
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FreakyDroid
Macedonia2616 Posts
https://meduza.io/en/feature/2017/08/22/fantasy-needs-magic On August 24 2017 22:51 Pontual wrote: I don't know, Got is very popular rn, don't think their audience cares as much as we, who are discussing the director's flaws in a forum. Well yeah, but it doesnt mean people still dont have their opinions or dont care about it. My friends are all GoT fans of both the books and show, only a few havent read the books, but we all pretty much unanimously agree that the show isnt as good as before and the main complaint is that the show's internal logic is practically non-existent. The way I see it, when you have tons of people on forums complaining about raven speed and odd choices that characters make, something that shouldnt be put in question ever because you lose consistency, and you have freaking dragons in that show, immortal beings who can raise the dead etc, speaks a lot about how the internal logic of the show works, or rather doesn't work. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
Well we don't know Rhaegar's full motivation yet and the exact circumstances are also kinda hidden. RIght now i would agree that it's definitely weird though. But one also has to remember that Lyanna was like 13/14 years old and running away with the prince she fell in love with might have been her first priority there. But sure i think it's a bit meh, i also expect more details in the following books though tbh. | ||
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KwarK
United States42773 Posts
On August 24 2017 22:40 TheTenthDoc wrote: The best suggestion I've seen is for Dany to have flown north to the wall pre-emptively to protect Jon and Jorah (or out of anxiety for them) against Tyrion's counsel. Can still have an overnight on the ice since we really got no indication of how far Gendry ran but it easily cuts out 3ish days of Raven/dragon travel that the show didn't utilize or acknowledge anyway. Still dumb as hell. The whole wight mission is dumb as hell. The whole Cersei plot still being a fucking thing is dumb as hell. We don't have time for that to be happening, it should have been resolved in the first 3 episodes of this season. Here's your new season. Wights + North forces skirmish a bit Stark reunion Dany fucks Cersei+Jaime the hell up None of that shit with Viking McWantstobangcersei. Where even is Dorne? Cut it. Highgarden still doing fine, #notarlys Jaime + Cersei captured. Dany has to sentence Cersei to death. Jaime insists on standing with her. Tyrion pleads for clemency on behalf of his brother but Dany insists that she has to burn Cersei up 'cause there can only be one queen. Tyrion is all like "if you do this you're as bad as your father" but Dany goes "so be it, dracarys". That replaces the whole Tarly Tyrion Dany scene only it has a billion times the emotional significance because we actually give a shit about the relationships at stake. Like seriously, this is the emotional climax of the Jaime storyline, the Tyrion storyline, and the Dany storyline. Jaime deciding ultimately to stand with Cersei in death. It's this whole thing. Dany is willing to spare Jaime at Tyrion's request but, quite logically, explains that Cersei has to die. Cersei tells Jaime to take the deal but Jaime won't do it. Tyrion is shouting, crying, begging Dany not to torch them both. Cersei is like "oh shit, I led us on this path, I killed us, sorry Jaime" and Jaime goes "the things we do for love" and then the two of them stoically face down the dragonfire, Dany is torn inside but she knows that she can't spare Cersei. Dany kinda mad queeny now but it still makes sense why she did what she did and why she had to, even though it's Tyrion's brother. Bronn + Tyrion reunion Dany turns towards the north loyal houses who are all pretty busy Jon shows up and also won't bend the knee and explains that there is an apocalypse going on All sorts of "will she torch him, won't she torch him" Penultimate episode, huge battle on the wall like the one with the Wildling attack a few seasons ago. This time WW do some magic because they're ice monsters with magic powers over ice. The wall collapses. Shit just got real. Bran sends a letter dropping some knowledge, Tyrion gets it. FINAL EPISODE EPIC SHIT TIME Tyrion releases Jon from his cell (which used to be Tyrion's cell) in King's Landing (which is where Dany is) and tells her he's the king. Tyrion says "we gotta leave man" but Jon goes "no, I believe in her, we need her help" so they use the passages Tyrion used before to kill Tywin and show up in her room and go "hey so this is why I'm your nephew and shit" Dany takes them prisoner and calls Tyrion a traitor a bunch because she's all mad queeny right now Big scene in the throne room with everyone there where Tyrion explains that Jon is the true king and is a legitimate son of Rhaegar and that they have no reason to fight but Dany don't want to hear that shit and she has her dragon bathe Tyrion + Jon in dragonfire. Tyrion dies horribly. Jon just walks the fuck out of it with his Stark wolf fur mantle burning away while he's untouched, jumps onto the back of the nearest dragon and peaces out. END SEASON | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
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VHbb
689 Posts
On August 24 2017 23:24 KwarK wrote: Still dumb as hell. The whole wight mission is dumb as hell. The whole Cersei plot still being a fucking thing is dumb as hell. We don't have time for that to be happening, it should have been resolved in the first 3 episodes of this season. Here's your new season. Wights + North forces skirmish a bit Stark reunion Dany fucks Cersei+Jaime the hell up None of that shit with Viking McWantstobangcersei. Where even is Dorne? Cut it. Highgarden still doing fine, #notarlys Jaime + Cersei captured. Dany has to sentence Cersei to death. Jaime insists on standing with her. Tyrion pleads for clemency on behalf of his brother but Dany insists that she has to burn Cersei up 'cause there can only be one queen. Tyrion is all like "if you do this you're as bad as your father" but Dany goes "so be it, dracarys". That replaces the whole Tarly Tyrion Dany scene only it has a billion times the emotional significance because we actually give a shit about the relationships at stake. Like seriously, this is the emotional climax of the Jaime storyline, the Tyrion storyline, and the Dany storyline. Jaime deciding ultimately to stand with Cersei in death. It's this whole thing. Dany is willing to spare Jaime at Tyrion's request but, quite logically, explains that Cersei has to die. Cersei tells Jaime to take the deal but Jaime won't do it. Tyrion is shouting, crying, begging Dany not to torch them both. Cersei is like "oh shit, I led us on this path, I killed us, sorry Jaime" and Jaime goes "I choose this" or whatever and then the two of them stoically face down the dragonfire, Dany is torn inside but she knows that she can't spare Cersei. Dany kinda mad queeny now but it still makes sense why she did what she did and why she had to, even though it's Tyrion's brother. Bronn + Tyrion reunion Dany turns towards the north loyal houses who are all pretty busy Jon shows up and also won't bend the knee and explains that there is an apocalypse going on All sorts of "will she torch him, won't she torch him" Penultimate episode, huge battle on the wall like the one with the Wildling attack a few seasons ago. This time WW do some magic because they're ice monsters with magic powers over ice. The wall collapses. Shit just got real. Bran sends a letter dropping some knowledge, Tyrion gets it, releases Jon, says Dany don't give a fuck 'bout no son's of Rhaegar, she's just really into queening and shit FINAL EPISODE EPIC SHIT TIME Tyrion releases Jon from his cell (which used to be Tyrion's cell) King's Landing (which is where Dany is) Tyrion says "we gotta leave man" but Jon goes "no, I believe in her, we need her help" so they use the passages Tyrion used before to kill Tywin and show up in her room and go "hey so this is why I'm your nephew and shit" Dany takes them prisoner and calls Tyrion a traitor a bunch because she's all mad queeny right now Big scene in the throne room with everyone there where Tyrion explains that Jon is the true king and is a legitimate son of Rhaegar and that they have no reason to fight but Dany don't want to hear that shit and she has her dragon bathe Tyrion + Jon in dragonfire. Tyrion dies horribly. Jon just walks the fuck out of it with his Stark wolf fur mantle burning away while he's untouched, jumps onto the back of the nearest dragon and peaces out. END SEASON This is just bad bad, lazy writing. Laughable, soooo poorly written, it's honestly just sad. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9390 Posts
Here's your new season. I agree with some of your ideas, but I would change the Cersei plot in a different way. Instead, I think Cersei should have attacked the Tyrells and stolen their money in episode 1 --> Used that money to buy mercanaries. Afterwards we get actual battles between the lannisters + Iron Island vs Dany. This way we could have gotten an actual and somewhat more equal battle engagements between the 2 armies. The current Cersei plot is so absurd and so many levels and the worst thing is that the writers had all the freedoms in the world to create whatever alliances for the plot and strenght of the different sides to make sense. | ||
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Pontual
Brazil3038 Posts
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KwarK
United States42773 Posts
On August 24 2017 23:29 VHbb wrote: This is just bad bad, lazy writing. Laughable, soooo poorly written, it's honestly just sad. It gets the story where it needs to be. Tidies up the bits of the story we don't need anymore in a meaningful way (Cersei, Tyrion, Jaime etc), advances Dany's Mad Queen storyline a shitton while keeping it all within character and rational, sets Jon up at where he ought to be for the last season with a dragon and knowing who he is, gets the WW to finally do fucking something. There has to be an end game for the Lannister storyline. We've spent six seasons setting this up so that Jaime is torn between his love for his sister and his duty, his sister has destroyed everything she loves in a futile quest for power, Tyrion is on the other side of it advising Dany while loving his brother, and Dany is about to sweep everything away. They're not setting Cersei up to win, but that's fine, that's not the point of them in this part of the story. The Lannisters lose. What matters for the storyline is what it means that the Lannisters lose, and we have everything we need for that to be the turning point in Dany's character arc. It is time for the Lannister storyline to payoff, and that payoff is in terms of how it changes the characters who continue into the end game. This "defeat their army in battle then make peace with them" shit is treading water. Think about this series in terms of emotional weight. When the pirate captured Sand Snakes and gang, did you give a shit? When Highgarden was suddenly defeated out of nowhere, did you give a shit? When the Tarlys were toasted, did you give a shit? When Cersei does her poison revenge plan, did you give a shit? When Grey Worm and Missandei hooked up, did you give a shit? When Jaime fell in the river, did you give a shit? When Jon fell in the lake, did you give a shit? When Benjen had a dramatic return and then died, did you give a shit? When Casterly Rock fell, did you give a shit? When Cersei decided she was pregnant, did you give a shit? They're afraid to touch anything that matters and so they tread water. If they didn't have the books to work from Ned would probably still be alive. They refuse to develop anything with the core cast so they keep introducing new bullshit around the periphery and then immediately discard it. But it's been six seasons now. It's time for the payoff. | ||
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