|
Spoilers for the film are in this thread, read at your own peril if you have not seen the movie. No more spoiler tags from page 20 |
On December 14 2017 09:47 Plansix wrote: It is an entire galaxy. Did anyone really believe that there wasn't another evil force using dude just waiting to his shot? No, but I can't believe that his story is so utterly boring that he exists solely to be a placeholder for dead Palpatine.
And yes, his story will probably be fleshed out in the next movies. But couldn't we have gotten to the new and interesting stuff before the old rehashed stuff?
|
On December 14 2017 08:29 Uldridge wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2017 06:34 WolfintheSheep wrote: A New Hope has the benefit of having zero context to build off of, and starts in media res. The setting is an entirely blank slate for whatever is required for the ongoing plot.
Force Awakens does have context, and is built entirely from an existing setting.
But really, they could've taken any direction they wanted and made it work, they just didn't. It feels like a reboot that was forced to be a sequel, more or less. Echo'ing this. I'd prefer it if there was an episode 6.5 where they'd build it up, or at least did some new universe building, because it simply falls flat and feels cheap as fuck. ANH had the benefit of dropping you into a new, wondrous environment with all these strange, mystical, exotic things going on. TFA is set in the known universe, so we already know all the stuff, so there shouldn't be all that much exploring to do, but it's basically the exact same journey, trying to give us the exact same moments. It just doesn't work for me. It feels forced and insulting. 1->3 deals with how the strength of the empire was forged; 4->6 was the clash of good and evil and good winning; 7 resets to 4, because they don't have anything original to go. 1->3 is WAY more interesting story wise, even though they completely fucked it up, than TFA. Why not make a movie about the aftermath, with different parties doing different things, a free for all, since the central power is gone with ultimately the new empire or whatever the fuck it was regaining power in secret. You can even follow fucking Han Solo as the main protagonist here. I haven't seen episode 8 yet, but that's a discussion I still can join.
I agree that 1-3 is more interesting story wise, but the resounding core of the backlash at episode 1 was that it "didn't feel like star wars". An era of strife in SW with shifting alliances is definitely up my alley, but isn't just complex/risky, it also requires a lot of things that people didn't like about the sequels (1-3), i.e. intrigue, politics, world-building and morally grey characters.
So I can totally see why Disney decided to just play it safe and basically reboot ANH with some other characters. Besides TFA imo is a good movie in the first half. Ofc there are obvious parallels, but there are also enough differences that it didn't feel too ripped off for me. Sadly the second half just copies ANH very closely. According to wikipedia the script wasn't finished by the original author but by Abrams and another Co-writer, which shows imo.
|
On December 14 2017 12:17 WolfintheSheep wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2017 09:47 Plansix wrote: It is an entire galaxy. Did anyone really believe that there wasn't another evil force using dude just waiting to his shot? No, but I can't believe that his story is so utterly boring that he exists solely to be a placeholder for dead Palpatine. And yes, his story will probably be fleshed out in the next movies. But couldn't we have gotten to the new and interesting stuff before the old rehashed stuff? The emperor was a throw away line in the first film. They can flesh snoke out down the line.
|
On December 14 2017 14:37 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2017 12:17 WolfintheSheep wrote:On December 14 2017 09:47 Plansix wrote: It is an entire galaxy. Did anyone really believe that there wasn't another evil force using dude just waiting to his shot? No, but I can't believe that his story is so utterly boring that he exists solely to be a placeholder for dead Palpatine. And yes, his story will probably be fleshed out in the next movies. But couldn't we have gotten to the new and interesting stuff before the old rehashed stuff? The emperor was a throw away line in the first film. They can flesh snoke out down the line. Yes...? That's what I said?
|
Watched the midnight screening of Episode VIII and actually loved it. I think it's way better than The Force Awakens, not gonna get into details...because...spoilers...
|
Also watched the movie last night with 7 ppl from work, unfortunately we were all disappointed/underwhelmed and pretty much all thought TFA was better.
The way they handled certain key plot points was disappointing, and the amount of deus ex machinas got pretty ridiculous too.
One positive point for me is they added more 'funny' moments, bit like Marvel, I enjoy that.
Seems like the other 2 ppl in here who already watched it thought it was better than TFA which is interesting, curious to read more opinons 
Actually perhaps my biggest annoyance was this:
+ Show Spoiler +Two of the largest questions I'm left with after TFA are: - Who is this Snoke guy and where does he come from? - Who are Rey's parents, is she related to Luke in some way?
I was hoping that TLJ would expand on these topics, but... Snoke is just killed off and we don't know shit about him, Rey's parents/heritage are apparently not important at all. Pretty disappointing
|
8/10
quite liked it, wasn't as hyped this time because I didn't like TFA that much, but man as soon as you see that Star Wars logo and the trumpets go off...
Some expected and some unexpected story lines/ends. Humor was great, battle scenes epic, fighting mediocre and I think it has the best 3D effects I have seen yet.
comments: + Show Spoiler + 1. I don't know what the point is with the asian girl story arc, other from a marketing standpoint for the asia market, kinda like Donnie Yen in Rogue One 2. Surprised that Snoke died so early and they didn't kill Leia off post production as she won't be available for the next movie. 3. The big one: kinda worried that Kylo Ren can carry the big evil role alone after Snoke is dead, seeing that he is still conflicted (wimpy) and didn't receive any further training or something. Even was described as a disappointment to pretty much everyone in the movie (parents, his Sith master, his ex Jedi master, Rey) 4. They tried to give Luke a epic,bad ass send off, but I don't know.... probably comes back as a ghost anyway. 5. Wtf did they do to Yoda.... 6. and wtf is Rey crying like 80% of the time...
|
Am I the only one who's disappointed that there are no cool light saber fights?
|
Is it just me or they are doing away with everything that is holy in the star wars universe, maybe to start anew in the future?
|
Everything that has a beginning has an end, Neo.
and sure, Disney will milk this franchise beyond anything we have ever seen.
|
|
On December 15 2017 00:14 halomonian wrote: Is it just me or they are doing away with everything that is holy in the star wars universe, maybe to start anew in the future? The trap of nostalgia is that it becomes impossible to tell new stories. That moving on to something new is important.
|
On December 15 2017 02:18 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2017 00:14 halomonian wrote: Is it just me or they are doing away with everything that is holy in the star wars universe, maybe to start anew in the future? The trap of nostalgia is that it becomes impossible to tell new stories. That moving on to something new is important.
Still wouldn't hurt to have some badass lightsaber fights. I don't like those for nostalgia reasons, it's just cool.
|
On December 15 2017 02:26 Laurens wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2017 02:18 Plansix wrote:On December 15 2017 00:14 halomonian wrote: Is it just me or they are doing away with everything that is holy in the star wars universe, maybe to start anew in the future? The trap of nostalgia is that it becomes impossible to tell new stories. That moving on to something new is important. Still wouldn't hurt to have some badass lightsaber fights. I don't like those for nostalgia reasons, it's just cool. I like them too. But I haven’t seen the film yet. But I respect writing a script that isn’t trying to check boxes.
|
As usual with Star Wars there's a lot of hype and it's an enjoyable watch, but at the end I'm left with a feeling of "oh, so this was it?" There's just too much deus ex machina for my taste and we're left with a scenario that functionally isn't that different from what we left off with.
Spoilers! + Show Spoiler +Kylo can't hide his inner turmoil yet he can deceive the master of the force they set up Snoke to be? It's not only a huge let down to see a character with such a build-up get killed that casually, it has also done the opposite of what it was supposed to do, namely make Kylo Ren seem like a believable and powerful villain. Kylo Ren comes across as an overpowered and unstable child while Snoke was demoted to a charlatan Sith with a degree of force control.
All-in all it has bothered me how these adolescent characters (Rey, Kylo) seem to randomly have powers that transcend jedi and sith prodigies that have trained their entire lives to wield the force.
Leia instead of imploding in outerspace just casually floats to the ship, really? I made audible sounds of disbelief when that happened.
Luke mind projection fighting Kylo Ren, like, that was a thing? Since when? Kylo can hide his killing intent from Snoke but he can't notice he's fighting a ghost? He's rightfully confused because it makes very little sense. Luke then does the *plop* I'm dead technique he picked up from his master, convenient way to get rid of a character you're done with after deconstructing his legacy to be a paranoid depressed and cynical manchild.
Yoda using lightning to set shit on fire? Not going to help out the resistance with our ghost Jedi elemental mastery but fuck this tree in particular! Makes me think the Jedi were really just pompous assholes that deserved to disappear.
Brienne the shiny stormtrooper, there wasn't any female bad guys so here's a decidedly non sexy antagonist because equality and shit, unfortunately her character is as flat as her boobs and no-one would have noticed if she was omitted from both movies.
Rose Tico? It annoys me that they seem to be putting in shallow characters just to steer clear of any SJW criticism. Asian girl falls in love with black guy on the drop of a hat, apparently the previous generations of star wars movies were deemed too white and now we're forcefully (hehe) putting in all possible combinations of gender and race because that's what equality is (there's also a ginger in charge, unfortunately he's incompetent).
When Luke steps out of the mine dramatically Poe *thinks* that he's stalling for time so they can get away? The whole story attempts to demystify the Jedi and the Sith yet Luke can't tell someone what his intentions are? Like, oops the rebels all ran out of the mine to make a dramatic last stand with me and now they're all dead and I'm just a ghost, awkward misunderstanding.
In the end what really happened? The unexplored master Sith and the master Jedi died, next movie: still rebels and jedi versus the evil empire and sith (the fact that Kylo doesn't identify as Sith doesn't change the fact he behaves like one).
|
Going to give my expert opinion. I'll put spoilers below. Overall I thought this movie was awful, 3/10, 4/10 at best. Maybe I grew out of star wars, but I thought it was pretty boring. When I watched TFA I enjoyed it, even though I was disappointed in the direction and reset. If I had the choice between watching The Phantom Menace or The Last Jedi, I would choose The Phantom Menace. The Phantom Menace was my least favorite star wars movie until this one.
+ Show Spoiler + The first thing is there was way to much humor at awful times in the movie. A lot of the serious moments would throw in humor that just didn't fit the scene at all. The very beginning of the movie show cased this against the dreadnought. First he trolls the pilot One x-wing and somehow it single handily takes out all the cannons and then one bomber takes out the dreadnought. It was a lot of bombs but why were there no shields?
The subplots to this movie were down right boring. Finn and chick (don't remember her name) travel to some planet to get a hacker that can get them aboard the enemy ship to disable the light speed tracker. The only part I thought was funny/enjoyable was the little dude who put coins into BB-8 and then jumped in joy at all the money he had.
Leia in space. I actually laughed at how stupid that scene was. How did the writers think this was a good idea to have an explosion destroy the command room, Leia is floating in space and then wakes up, uses the force, flies back on board and survives. What the hell? This is one of, if not the dumbest thing I have ever seen in a star wars movie.
Luke and Rey was extremely disappointing. Luke is pretty much emo, cut himself off from the force and doesn't really train her? He tells her to reach out and explain what she feels with the force and that was the only thing he really taught her. He then dies at the end of the movie after doing a force projection. I was really hoping we'd get to see legitimate badass Luke at least once, but no. The Yoda scene also felt out of place.
Then there is Snoke. He is shown to be extremely powerful in the force, we know absolutely nothing about him and then he dies. Who was he? Where did he come from? How was he so powerful? No answers and now he's dead. I imagine we'll never know more about him.
Last thing I can think of is about the Republic itself. Three planets were destroyed (or was it 5? Can't remember off the top of my head) in the last movie, that can't be the whole Republic fleet. I know they said there were some forces in the outer rim, but now the Republic has been reduced to a handful of people? Just gone?
Easily the worst star wars movie to me and I really wish Disney had never bought Star Wars.
|
United Kingdom13775 Posts
Well... it was convoluted. It also didn't exactly feel like Star Wars as I've come to know it. But I enjoyed it. I'll have to watch it again sometime to actually understand what happened there.
Things I had issues with: + Show Spoiler +1. Criticizing Poe at the beginning for the bombing run. Yeah, he's a bit of a hothead, but he was completely right about that one. The dreadnought was about to destroy the flagship so what the fuck else should they have done? 2. The pointlessness of the Finn and Rose trip to the flagship. They got caught and just so conveniently the folk on the cruiser ended up doing the right thing. 3. And for that matter, the frequency of the goddamn "plot twists" through the movie. It's like the entire point of the movie is to set up a plot point then undo it. The Poe mutiny then it being reversed then turning out that that was for the best, then Finn's sacrifice that ended up not happening then Luke dying like a force ghost then not dying then actually dying, and I know I missed at least like five in between. It gets old after a while. 4. The thief ended up being a bit more one-off than I would have liked. 5. The so easily defeated Republic that has no resources whatsoever to fight back after they lost their homeworld. Do they not have any military whatsoever? 6. I really don't see how they're going to write their way out of Leia being part of the plot without recasting or CGI or something. They might have slightly written themselves into a corner here. 7. Rey is OP for inadequately explored reasons. 8. Biggest problem was just that the pace was just too rapid. Moved between scenes so quickly that it became oversaturated. Ep 7 had more of the charming character development scenes like Rey sitting in the downed walker, whereas this one was just a dogged pursuit from start to finish.
Things I thought were done well: + Show Spoiler +1. The way they handled Kylo Ren ditching the mask was well done. 2. The little critters were pretty neat. I thought they'd ruin things but they actually did well. 3. Everything on the rich people island was quite well-done. 4. Visually it was great and I did like the new craft designs. 5. Carrie Fisher did well overall in her role for this movie. I just wonder what will happen next. 6. They cleared that Finn-Rey not-sure-if-love-interest situation. That didn't work at all, and even if the new romance is slightly shoehorned it seems more real. 7. Kylo Ren with the stitched scar looked really good. I wish they kept it with the grey stitch mark but even without it he looks a damn sight more impressive than without it. 8. Despite its flaws it was well done. I lightly clapped as I left the theater, so at the very least it was a good watch.
The scene that struck me the most, though, was + Show Spoiler +The scene were the lady charges at lightspeed into the main cruiser. Actually it was interesting for a few reasons. One, it was done before in the Star Wars Rebels cartoon, which although gimmicky did have a few rather interesting plot points. It was done in a much more effectively dramatic manner though, so props there. But I also started considering the issue of whether or not that was something that could just be done over and over again on any major ship. And then I sort of remembered the Thrawn books, either the new one (named simply "Thrawn") or the old trilogy, in which the titular character talks about how huge overpowered superweapons present a target that cannot be ignored and they are always far more vulnerable than they seem... and actually, it sort of fits because that's exactly what went down here. I don't think it'll get any official acknowledgment but it is quite an interesting connection.
Overall: I liked it. I expect it to be polarizing. There was a lot there that someone might very much dislike.
|
full review in my blog: http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/529461-star-wars-ep-8-my-reactions-review-spoilers
Summary: + Show Spoiler +While a step up from Episode 7 in all areas, Episode 8 suffers from many of the same problems, notably: weak character building, lots of recycled plot points, and disappointing plot advancement. Not a bad movie on its own, but when taken in context as step two of a new trilogy it feels weak and doesn't leave me optimistic for Ep. 9 It continues the Disney trend of providing awesome and gorgeous action sequences (arguably over the top in some areas) while also including plenty of lighthearted humorous moments. However it just doesn't have the same staying power of the original trilogy, and even lacks many of the outstanding individual character performances of the prequels, leaving it overall feeling like its predecessor, a safe bet catered to casual fan service.
Overall score: 5/10
|
On December 15 2017 14:28 blade55555 wrote:Going to give my expert opinion. I'll put spoilers below. Overall I thought this movie was awful, 3/10, 4/10 at best. Maybe I grew out of star wars, but I thought it was pretty boring. When I watched TFA I enjoyed it, even though I was disappointed in the direction and reset. If I had the choice between watching The Phantom Menace or The Last Jedi, I would choose The Phantom Menace. The Phantom Menace was my least favorite star wars movie until this one. + Show Spoiler + The first thing is there was way to much humor at awful times in the movie. A lot of the serious moments would throw in humor that just didn't fit the scene at all. The very beginning of the movie show cased this against the dreadnought. First he trolls the pilot One x-wing and somehow it single handily takes out all the cannons and then one bomber takes out the dreadnought. It was a lot of bombs but why were there no shields?
The subplots to this movie were down right boring. Finn and chick (don't remember her name) travel to some planet to get a hacker that can get them aboard the enemy ship to disable the light speed tracker. The only part I thought was funny/enjoyable was the little dude who put coins into BB-8 and then jumped in joy at all the money he had.
Leia in space. I actually laughed at how stupid that scene was. How did the writers think this was a good idea to have an explosion destroy the command room, Leia is floating in space and then wakes up, uses the force, flies back on board and survives. What the hell? This is one of, if not the dumbest thing I have ever seen in a star wars movie.
Luke and Rey was extremely disappointing. Luke is pretty much emo, cut himself off from the force and doesn't really train her? He tells her to reach out and explain what she feels with the force and that was the only thing he really taught her. He then dies at the end of the movie after doing a force projection. I was really hoping we'd get to see legitimate badass Luke at least once, but no. The Yoda scene also felt out of place.
Then there is Snoke. He is shown to be extremely powerful in the force, we know absolutely nothing about him and then he dies. Who was he? Where did he come from? How was he so powerful? No answers and now he's dead. I imagine we'll never know more about him.
Last thing I can think of is about the Republic itself. Three planets were destroyed (or was it 5? Can't remember off the top of my head) in the last movie, that can't be the whole Republic fleet. I know they said there were some forces in the outer rim, but now the Republic has been reduced to a handful of people? Just gone?
Easily the worst star wars movie to me and I really wish Disney had never bought Star Wars.
Well hang on now. Disney did give us Rogue One, and Star Wars Rebels.
I agree with most of your points on Episode 8, but I think Disney is playing a longer game with the franchise than just their new trilogy.
|
On December 15 2017 14:42 LegalLord wrote:Well... it was convoluted. It also didn't exactly feel like Star Wars as I've come to know it. But I enjoyed it. I'll have to watch it again sometime to actually understand what happened there. Things I had issues with: + Show Spoiler +1. Criticizing Poe at the beginning for the bombing run. Yeah, he's a bit of a hothead, but he was completely right about that one. The dreadnought was about to destroy the flagship so what the fuck else should they have done? 2. The pointlessness of the Finn and Rose trip to the flagship. They got caught and just so conveniently the folk on the cruiser ended up doing the right thing. 3. And for that matter, the frequency of the goddamn "plot twists" through the movie. It's like the entire point of the movie is to set up a plot point then undo it. The Poe mutiny then it being reversed then turning out that that was for the best, then Finn's sacrifice that ended up not happening then Luke dying like a force ghost then not dying then actually dying, and I know I missed at least like five in between. It gets old after a while. 4. The thief ended up being a bit more one-off than I would have liked. 5. The so easily defeated Republic that has no resources whatsoever to fight back after they lost their homeworld. Do they not have any military whatsoever? 6. I really don't see how they're going to write their way out of Leia being part of the plot without recasting or CGI or something. They might have slightly written themselves into a corner here. 7. Rey is OP for inadequately explored reasons. 8. Biggest problem was just that the pace was just too rapid. Moved between scenes so quickly that it became oversaturated. Ep 7 had more of the charming character development scenes like Rey sitting in the downed walker, whereas this one was just a dogged pursuit from start to finish. Things I thought were done well: + Show Spoiler +1. The way they handled Kylo Ren ditching the mask was well done. 2. The little critters were pretty neat. I thought they'd ruin things but they actually did well. 3. Everything on the rich people island was quite well-done. 4. Visually it was great and I did like the new craft designs. 5. Carrie Fisher did well overall in her role for this movie. I just wonder what will happen next. 6. They cleared that Finn-Rey not-sure-if-love-interest situation. That didn't work at all, and even if the new romance is slightly shoehorned it seems more real. 7. Kylo Ren with the stitched scar looked really good. I wish they kept it with the grey stitch mark but even without it he looks a damn sight more impressive than without it. 8. Despite its flaws it was well done. I lightly clapped as I left the theater, so at the very least it was a good watch. The scene that struck me the most, though, was + Show Spoiler +The scene were the lady charges at lightspeed into the main cruiser. Actually it was interesting for a few reasons. One, it was done before in the Star Wars Rebels cartoon, which although gimmicky did have a few rather interesting plot points. It was done in a much more effectively dramatic manner though, so props there. But I also started considering the issue of whether or not that was something that could just be done over and over again on any major ship. And then I sort of remembered the Thrawn books, either the new one (named simply "Thrawn") or the old trilogy, in which the titular character talks about how huge overpowered superweapons present a target that cannot be ignored and they are always far more vulnerable than they seem... and actually, it sort of fits because that's exactly what went down here. I don't think it'll get any official acknowledgment but it is quite an interesting connection. Overall: I liked it. I expect it to be polarizing. There was a lot there that someone might very much dislike.
rei is op cuz she was left alone when she was a kid and endured a very strong mindset and personality and happens that the force was strong on her,or maybe the force found someone that had the potential to put the balance,any case im convinced that the situations that faced rei made her very strong compared to Luke or Kylo,who had a family a place to live etc,is not for example the case of anakin that was an slave.
So do you mind to tell me why it is so hard for you to acept rei ? .d it is also a big galaxy im pretty sure we will find mb in the future creatures or just people capable to use the force.
|
|
|
|