2008 US Presidential Election - Page 5

On January 20 2008 20:39 IntoTheWow wrote:
Shouldn't parties select people for the election based on their abilities and not on their popularity? : [

On January 20 2008 18:37 BlackJack wrote:
Senator's get butchered on their record in general elections. There hasn't been a sitting Senator elected President since Kennedy. It's so much easier to go in as a Governor where you can say you have executive experience and don't have as much history of your position on sensitive issues to attack. McCain vs Hillary would be interesting..

“We currently have reports of over 200 separate incidents of trouble at caucus sites, including doors being closed up to thirty minutes early, registration forms running out so people were turned away, and ID being requested and checked in a non-uniform fashion. This is in addition to the Clinton campaign’s efforts to confuse voters and call into question the at-large caucus sites which clearly had an affect on turnout at these locations. These kinds of Clinton campaign tactics were part of an entire week’s worth of false, divisive, attacks designed to mislead caucus-goers and discredit the caucus itself."

Here's my story:

I got to the location at 10:30am and set up. The Hillary people were already there. In charge of them was a 60-ish woman with a slight Brooklyn accent. Here were the irregularities in my precinct alone:

* The Hillary operative tried to force the doors to close at 11:30am. KK was outside greeting people, and she overheard the Hillary campaign mention that the doors would be closing at 11:30am, and she went to talk to the precinct chair. So we intervened and said that that was absolutely not legal by the rules. She then started screaming at the chair to close the doors. When he read the rules that they were open until 12noon, she said that "that's not what I was told, other campaigns were spreading misinformation." We stood our ground, and the doors remained open.
* A man in a wheelchair came in with his daughter, and said he was an Edwards supporter. When his daughter began to wheel him to the middle of the room, the Hillary operative tapped her on the shoulder, took the wheelchair and took him to the Clinton corner. I rushed over from talking to an undecided voter and objected loudly, but his daughter was a Hillary person. The Clinton operative said, "I don't control what he does; she does." At that point I said to the man, "Nobody controls you. If you want to vote for Edwards, you have every right to go to the center of the room. Do you need help?" He looked at me plaintively, but said nothing as his daughter dragged him farther back into the corner and just shook his head.
* The Clinton operative herself had a Brooklyn accent and I overheard her mention having been from New York. When she stood to be counted in the middle of the room, I objected and asked her if she was actually from Nevada. She said yes. I talked to the chair and asked him to ask her name and find her on the list. He asked her her name and checked the list, and she was not on it. At this point the chair said, "well, I can't ask for ID." I said, "She can't participate if no one will vouch for her." At this point a Hispanic man wearing a Hillary shirt said she was his wife. While that's not impossible, it was also improbable--but I had no way to verify or object further.
* One voter who hadn't even finished registering said that she was undecided, and the Hillary operative physically escorted her to the Hillary side. I went to talk to the woman, but she was immediately surrounded by 3 Hillary supporters who would not let me in, and I had to attend to others registering at that point (our operatives were outnumbered by hers 2-1).
* Hillary supporters were doing check-in, and a Hillary sign was behind them. I forced the sign off the table, and I went to the front desk to verify that everything went according to the rules at checkin--but if nothing else, the necessity of doing so prevented me from doing other needed work.

On January 20 2008 20:39 IntoTheWow wrote:
Shouldn't parties select people for the election based on their abilities and not on their popularity? : [

On January 22 2008 04:54 Hawk wrote:
So I know a lot of you are really dead set on who you're voting for. Suppose your candidate doesn't get in (let's use me for example... Obama) and the one you hate does (clinton, ick), are you gonna support her when it comes down to it? Or is there a chance you'd support the other side, or stick a middle finger to the whole thing and vote for some random independent??

On January 21 2008 14:16 a-game wrote:

"I know of no safe repository of the ultimate power of society but people. And if we think them not enlightened enough, the remedy is not to take the power from them, but to inform them by education." - Thomas Jefferson

i kind of laugh at this quote because the current education system is more likely to leave you dumber rather than smarter at the end of it.

but the idea in principle is still valid, if only the education system wasn't broken as hell :/

ad: and suggesting that we take the power from the people is just annoyingly shortsighted. i'm interested in what your alternative would be (not just "choose the most able", but how specifically would you choose the most able? you realize the choosers themselves would have enormous power)

On January 22 2008 04:56 Servolisk wrote:


I would most probably vote for Hillary. Compared to most of the republicans she is still far better IMO, because of economic reasons and military ones.

On January 22 2008 05:06 Hawk wrote:
Why's that? I really dunno a whole lot bout the republicans honestly =p. Just the religious whackos scare me a tad.

On January 22 2008 05:12 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Seeing as how McCain, Paul, and Huckabee aren't well liked by certain Republican figures/Conservatice names. Like McCain he isn't liked in conservative circles due to some of his actions are deemed liberal. But if it came down to Hillary or McCain i would go for McCain who has a lot more experience imo.

On January 22 2008 05:35 Hawk wrote:


Yeah, from what limited stuff I've read, McCain and Guiliani are the liberal leaning conservatives... if there's such a thing.

On January 22 2008 05:35 Hawk wrote:


Yeah, from what limited stuff I've read, McCain and Guiliani are the liberal leaning conservatives... if there's such a thing.

Paul is just crazy.

I thought huckabee was pretty much your typical conservative?