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United States42821 Posts
It makes sense for it to be a tax deduction. In case anyone isn't sure how it works, basically when a state taxes away a significant portion of your income you no longer have to pay tax on the income you already paid as taxes because you never got it.
Simplified example
You get paid $100,000
State has a 20% tax rate, you pay the state $20,000
Fed has a 20% tax rate, you pay the Fed $16,000 (($100,000-$20,000)*20%)
Treating taxes as an expense and taxing you on your profits rather than revenue basically.
The alternative is taxing you on your taxes which would mean that to pay a tax bill of $20k you'd need to earn $25k to cover the taxes owed on the taxes.
But sure, in practical terms, it's a deduction that benefits the rich because for lower income families the standard deduction is already going to exceed what they're paying in state taxes.
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United Kingdom13775 Posts
I'll be honest, I don't see what's so bad about this Sessions story given only what is known right now. Flynn was pretty bad; he actively undermined a sitting president with illegal diplomacy. But being a liar and talking to a Russian ambassador about vaguely described topics? I just don't see the same pressure there.
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Well for one it's yet another instance of this administration lying about Russian meetings. More importantly, if confirmed (Trump seems to think it's real...) then Sessions 100% loses his job. This is a boon for the country and continues to isolate Trump by removing allies, though he is doing that himsellf pretty well it seems.
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United Kingdom13775 Posts
I think the "yet another" is part of why it just doesn't have the same oomph as before. We already know our executive is filled to the brim with shitty liars with a tendency to lie about Russia meetings. This just isn't anything special within that reality.
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On July 23 2017 02:48 LegalLord wrote:
I'll be honest, I don't see what's so bad about this Sessions story given only what is known right now. Flynn was pretty bad; he actively undermined a sitting president with illegal diplomacy. But being a liar and talking to a Russian ambassador about vaguely described topics? I just don't see the same pressure there.
Sessions swore before the Senate that he had no contact with Russian officials, then changed his story to say that they did not discuss anything campaign related. If they did, then he perjured himself, which is a pretty big deal for the AG.
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On July 23 2017 02:54 LegalLord wrote:
I think the "yet another" is part of why it just doesn't have the same oomph as before. We already know our executive is filled to the brim with shitty liars with a tendency to lie about Russia meetings. This just isn't anything special within that reality.
In the sense of RussiaGate then yes this is just yet another part of it, but not everything can be another bombshell. Your going to have 'just another' parts.
That doesn't make the potential of an AG committing perjury any less significant.
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Trump needs to learn the glomar response and how his tweets defeat such things.
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On November 04 2012 Danglars wrote:
Actually 4 years in the copilot seat (if, by any stretch of the imagination, the VP occupies this) would be a fitting end to his Presidency. I would be shocked if he accepted that role if it was offered. Maybe Romney would have to stipulate 33 rounds of golf and Mrs. Obama as Special Envoy on Nutrition representing both the Dept. of Education and Dept. of Health and Human Services. The more I think about it, it might even end up being more preferable to me than Romney/Biden, a sort of penance for relishing the spotlight, and a reminder to Romney for all the things he was voted in to NOT be.
On October 16 2012 xDaunt wrote:
I expected Romney to do well and beat Obama, but I did not expect Obama to be as bad as he was. He better put down the golf clubs.
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Someone should be keeping a tracker on how many days he's spent on a golf course, versus how long it's been since his inauguration. Like a presidential death count.
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United States42821 Posts
On July 23 2017 02:48 LegalLord wrote:
I'll be honest, I don't see what's so bad about this Sessions story given only what is known right now. Flynn was pretty bad; he actively undermined a sitting president with illegal diplomacy. But being a liar and talking to a Russian ambassador about vaguely described topics? I just don't see the same pressure there.
So basically a political campaign should not be discussing the kind of benefits that a foreign and hostile government will receive should the campaign win while also accepting aid from that foreign and hostile government. Sessions is the first, Trump Jr. is the second, taken together that's the whole thing.
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On July 23 2017 02:48 LegalLord wrote:
I'll be honest, I don't see what's so bad about this Sessions story given only what is known right now. Flynn was pretty bad; he actively undermined a sitting president with illegal diplomacy. But being a liar and talking to a Russian ambassador about vaguely described topics? I just don't see the same pressure there.
How many times does the Attorney General of the United States have to get caught lying under oath before you lose faith in his fitness for office? That first time? How about the second time with Franken? How about this third time where it comes out he had a pretty long talk with Kislyak at the Mayflower hotel? What about the next time after his next lying session before a senate committee? Ballpark with me here, how many times does an Attorney General need to get caught lying under oath before it is bad?
EDIT: for transparency, I would say the second time is final. The first time .. yeah there was Alberto Gonzales and his ass certainly got nailed a first time and got to stay on. But this second time should be done for Sessions.
EDIT2: when I say 'lying' here, I mean the casual, human being version of the word. If your son says "I never say that neighbor boy and talked about naughty things", but it turns out he did see the neighbor boy against your wishes but talked about not-naughty things, your son was lying in his statement. The legal standards for perjury are staggering and anyone can lie their asses off and get around them with a few choice qualifiers that allows motivated partisans to split hairs about definitions.
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On July 23 2017 04:03 Wulfey_LA wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2017 02:48 LegalLord wrote:
I'll be honest, I don't see what's so bad about this Sessions story given only what is known right now. Flynn was pretty bad; he actively undermined a sitting president with illegal diplomacy. But being a liar and talking to a Russian ambassador about vaguely described topics? I just don't see the same pressure there. How many times does the Attorney General of the United States have to get caught lying under oath before you lose faith in his fitness for office? That first time? How about the second time with Franken? How about this third time where it comes out he had a pretty long talk with Kislyak at the Mayflower hotel? What about the next time after his next lying session before a senate committee? Ballpark with me here, how many times does an Attorney General need to get caught lying under oath before it is bad? EDIT: for transparency, I would say the second time is final. The first time .. yeah there was Alberto Gonzales and his ass certainly got nailed a first time and got to stay on. But this second time should be done for Sessions.
Wells Fargo was lying to, committing identity theft of, and defrauding millions of customers. Millions of Americans wake up and deposit money into their accounts every month.
Think about that. A bank got caught red handed stealing it's customers money (after the financial sector nearly imploded the economy) and people keep giving them MORE of their money.
If you think a couple convoluted lies are enough I don't think you are familiar with the people who still think this isn't problematic.
EDIT: If Wells Fargo was your best friend/brother you probably would disown him, but if they are your bank, ~80%+ of people think "nah, I'll forgive them, just an honest mistake"
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Whataboutisms usually compare politicians to politicians. Trying to whatabout a non-political entity seems .... uh ... new.
(1) I don't bank with wellsfargo because they are scammers. (2) The Attorney General is held to radically different standards than a public or private corporation. How can you possibility compare these things? What set of standards could apply to both? One if a multinational corporation, the other is the highest legal officer in the country. Under no circumstances does some corporations deceits for profit in anyway excuse or even compare to the lying of a public official under oath.
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On July 23 2017 03:41 Doodsmack wrote:https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/888820846952886274Show nested quote +On November 04 2012 Danglars wrote:
Actually 4 years in the copilot seat (if, by any stretch of the imagination, the VP occupies this) would be a fitting end to his Presidency. I would be shocked if he accepted that role if it was offered. Maybe Romney would have to stipulate 33 rounds of golf and Mrs. Obama as Special Envoy on Nutrition representing both the Dept. of Education and Dept. of Health and Human Services. The more I think about it, it might even end up being more preferable to me than Romney/Biden, a sort of penance for relishing the spotlight, and a reminder to Romney for all the things he was voted in to NOT be. Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 xDaunt wrote:
I expected Romney to do well and beat Obama, but I did not expect Obama to be as bad as he was. He better put down the golf clubs.
Michael Moore and Democrats complained about Bush's vacations. Republicans complained about Obama on the golf course. Democrats/the Left are complaining about Trump's golf/vacation.
Can we just acknowledge that every president takes time off? Probably more than the average worker too, because the presidency is undoubtedly pretty close to a 24/7 job when you're not on vacation.
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On July 23 2017 04:24 Wulfey_LA wrote:
Whataboutisms usually compare politicians to politicians. Trying to whatabout a non-political entity seems .... uh ... new.
(1) I don't bank with wellsfargo because they are scammers. (2) The Attorney General is held to radically different standards than a public or private corporation. How can you possibility compare these things? What set of standards could apply to both? One if a multinational corporation, the other is the highest legal officer in the country. Under no circumstances does some corporations deceits for profit in anyway excuse or even compare to the lying of a public official under oath.
I'm not trying to "whataboutism" I'm pointing out that people are terrible at this sort of thing. It's a political calculation in this case. It has very little to do with him lying and much more to do with whether Trump wants him there or not. His lies could be more blatant, and if Trump wanted him there, he'd stay.
That said, pressuring for the AG to go is easier to do politically than pushing for an impeachment, so whatever Republicans left in office with a shred of integrity may apply some pressure (enough to make it not worth Trump's effort). But this is Trump's decision.
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United Kingdom13775 Posts
We all know what kind of person Sessions is and what his brand of justice looks like. But this specifically changes nothing whatsoever.
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On July 23 2017 04:24 mozoku wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2017 03:41 Doodsmack wrote:https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/888820846952886274On November 04 2012 Danglars wrote:
Actually 4 years in the copilot seat (if, by any stretch of the imagination, the VP occupies this) would be a fitting end to his Presidency. I would be shocked if he accepted that role if it was offered. Maybe Romney would have to stipulate 33 rounds of golf and Mrs. Obama as Special Envoy on Nutrition representing both the Dept. of Education and Dept. of Health and Human Services. The more I think about it, it might even end up being more preferable to me than Romney/Biden, a sort of penance for relishing the spotlight, and a reminder to Romney for all the things he was voted in to NOT be. On October 16 2012 xDaunt wrote:
I expected Romney to do well and beat Obama, but I did not expect Obama to be as bad as he was. He better put down the golf clubs. Michael Moore and Democrats complained about Bush's vacations. Republicans complained about Obama on the golf course. Democrats/the Left are complaining about Trump's golf/vacation. Can we just acknowledge that every president takes time off? Probably more than the average worker too, because the presidency is undoubtedly pretty close to a 24/7 job when you're not on vacation.
He's taken off work nearly a quarter of the days he's been in office, and he can't be that busy if every day he's on Twitter and we consistently hear about how he can't be bothered to read reports or go to meetings.
President of the United States is an important job and should be taken seriously. He's not taking it seriously, which is why nothing's getting done. Obama and Bush took it seriously.
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On July 23 2017 04:24 mozoku wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2017 03:41 Doodsmack wrote:https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/888820846952886274On November 04 2012 Danglars wrote:
Actually 4 years in the copilot seat (if, by any stretch of the imagination, the VP occupies this) would be a fitting end to his Presidency. I would be shocked if he accepted that role if it was offered. Maybe Romney would have to stipulate 33 rounds of golf and Mrs. Obama as Special Envoy on Nutrition representing both the Dept. of Education and Dept. of Health and Human Services. The more I think about it, it might even end up being more preferable to me than Romney/Biden, a sort of penance for relishing the spotlight, and a reminder to Romney for all the things he was voted in to NOT be. On October 16 2012 xDaunt wrote:
I expected Romney to do well and beat Obama, but I did not expect Obama to be as bad as he was. He better put down the golf clubs. Michael Moore and Democrats complained about Bush's vacations. Republicans complained about Obama on the golf course. Democrats/the Left are complaining about Trump's golf/vacation. Can we just acknowledge that every president takes time off? Probably more than the average worker too, because the presidency is undoubtedly pretty close to a 24/7 job when you're not on vacation.
I don't mind them taking lots of time off; I just dislike the hypocrisy when people complain about one side doing it but not the other (or themselves), and similar such hypocrisies. it seems reasonable to point out hypocrisies in how people deal with things. not that I'm sure that applies to the specific quotes in here; just on the general principle of the golf issue.
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Assuming he's guilty, how is perjury not a big deal? I seem to recall Republicans feeling very, very strongly about the importance if perjury not too long ago.
If he's not guilty that's another matter, but if you're saying "sure he lied under oath, but nbd," ...isn't that a felony?
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EPT
