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Please keep this thread on topic. It's ok to discuss the professionalism of what happened, but don't turn this thread into personal attacks or it will be closed. |
On December 13 2011 23:04 Lord_J wrote:
I don't think it was how a professional ought to conduct himself, but I'd be lying if I said I was particularly bothered by it.
My feelings exactly.
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On December 14 2011 02:20 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 02:17 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 02:15 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:13 mordk wrote:On December 14 2011 02:11 wei2coolman wrote:
I wonder if there would've been such a shitstorm if Naniwa went for a double gate proxy?
It's okay to cheese, but not proberush? Completely irrelevant. Double-gate proxy can win games. You do it when you think you can win with it. 7 Probe rush loses to anything lol, it's not playing the game. And yes, it's certainly OK to cheese. You can totally win with a 7 probe rush.... It just takes insane micro skills. Again, what league are you in? And yes, I am sure you can win ... if you are master league against gold or bronze or some shit, but as a master league zerg - no you cannot win it is straight up impossible. Regardless of how insane your micro skills are - if the opponent isn't a moron with no skills ... which NesTea isn't. There was 0% chance he could win that game regardless of what NesTea did. That is what people are annoyed about. theoretically a bot can out micro a human, I don't see why a human can't outmicro another human. in pure theory, a 7 probe rush could totally work.
Theoretically I could win the lottery tomorrow and win 150 million.
That is about the same chance as Naniwa winning that game ... probably higher, if you don't include NesTea having a sudden illness leaving him unable to control his units ...
You don't actually believe that he could have won do you? You are just arguing to argue? You cannot possibly be so stupid and ignorant of how the game works that you think he could win?
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On December 14 2011 02:21 FrankWalls wrote:why should you feel sorry for quantic? they knew what they were getting when they got naniwa. everyone knows he's a PR nightmare. they got him because hes a good player, and he showed that today even in his losses.
More like PR treasure chests. Look at Idra and Destiny. It creates giant attention storms, whether good or bad, now they just need a brilliant PR dude to redirect the attention to future projects!
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On December 14 2011 02:22 aebriol wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 02:20 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:17 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 02:15 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:13 mordk wrote:On December 14 2011 02:11 wei2coolman wrote:
I wonder if there would've been such a shitstorm if Naniwa went for a double gate proxy?
It's okay to cheese, but not proberush? Completely irrelevant. Double-gate proxy can win games. You do it when you think you can win with it. 7 Probe rush loses to anything lol, it's not playing the game. And yes, it's certainly OK to cheese. You can totally win with a 7 probe rush.... It just takes insane micro skills. Again, what league are you in? And yes, I am sure you can win ... if you are master league against gold or bronze or some shit, but as a master league zerg - no you cannot win it is straight up impossible. Regardless of how insane your micro skills are - if the opponent isn't a moron with no skills ... which NesTea isn't. There was 0% chance he could win that game regardless of what NesTea did. That is what people are annoyed about. theoretically a bot can out micro a human, I don't see why a human can't outmicro another human. in pure theory, a 7 probe rush could totally work. Theoretically I could win the lottery tomorrow and win 150 million. That is about the same chance as Naniwa winning that game ... probably higher, if you don't include NesTea having a sudden illness leaving him unable to control his units ...
Is it the same chances as Naniwa winning with a double gate?
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Wow, what a minor action blown out of proportion. The Korean response is hillarious and totally unjustified. No one wants to see subpar games out of unmotivated players; we watch tournaments because there's money on the line. If there's no money, the definition of 'professional gamer' doesn't fit. How many pros have come out and said they only play SC2 for the money? This is the result of that.
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On December 14 2011 02:22 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 02:22 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 02:20 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:17 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 02:15 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:13 mordk wrote:On December 14 2011 02:11 wei2coolman wrote:
I wonder if there would've been such a shitstorm if Naniwa went for a double gate proxy?
It's okay to cheese, but not proberush? Completely irrelevant. Double-gate proxy can win games. You do it when you think you can win with it. 7 Probe rush loses to anything lol, it's not playing the game. And yes, it's certainly OK to cheese. You can totally win with a 7 probe rush.... It just takes insane micro skills. Again, what league are you in? And yes, I am sure you can win ... if you are master league against gold or bronze or some shit, but as a master league zerg - no you cannot win it is straight up impossible. Regardless of how insane your micro skills are - if the opponent isn't a moron with no skills ... which NesTea isn't. There was 0% chance he could win that game regardless of what NesTea did. That is what people are annoyed about. theoretically a bot can out micro a human, I don't see why a human can't outmicro another human. in pure theory, a 7 probe rush could totally work. Theoretically I could win the lottery tomorrow and win 150 million. That is about the same chance as Naniwa winning that game ... probably higher, if you don't include NesTea having a sudden illness leaving him unable to control his units ... Is it the same chances as Naniwa winning with a double gate?
Nah double proxy gate I'd expect have a 2-5% chance of winning ... either way, I am done arguing with you, because I cannot combat pure stupidity on this level by reasoned arguments.
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I cannot believe how childish people are being.
The game had no impact on anything, it had no meaning - why should he take it seriously?
You see how many times players forfeit their ranking games at MLGs? Haypro only got his 7th place at Providence because Idra was a no-show for his ranking game. And that is a very common situation, people never show for these matches - because they have no meaning.
So lets treat naniwa the same as all players not trying 100% in pointless games. We don't give a toss.
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On December 14 2011 02:16 Madder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 02:15 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:13 mordk wrote:On December 14 2011 02:11 wei2coolman wrote:
I wonder if there would've been such a shitstorm if Naniwa went for a double gate proxy?
It's okay to cheese, but not proberush? Completely irrelevant. Double-gate proxy can win games. You do it when you think you can win with it. 7 Probe rush loses to anything lol, it's not playing the game. And yes, it's certainly OK to cheese. You can totally win with a 7 probe rush.... It just takes insane micro skills. So by delaying the game by 2 minutes, by doing a double gate proxy, you're somehow no longer in the giant media shitstorm for not trying? what? Exactly this, THANK YOU.
I think that this idea will be central to the disagreement between fans. Personally I wanted to see the match played out more fully just because of the history. But I understand people who feel both ways. I think that if he at least does a 4 gate or something, there's a moment of excitement when their supplies are fairly equal and we at least see engagements/micro, even if Nestea has defended it 10000x before
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Just play the game...Treat it like a training game vs a top zerg player, by doing this Naniwa say "fuck you all"
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It was a quite dumb move by Naniwa. I think he was pretty disappointed and didnt think that through at all.
I don't know why they let Naniwa play Nestea since they didn't play out matches in up&downs when it didnt matter.
It is really dumb and Nani should work on that. But the hate he gets is too much.
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On December 14 2011 02:15 aebriol wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 02:11 wei2coolman wrote:
I wonder if there would've been such a shitstorm if Naniwa went for a double gate proxy?
It's okay to cheese, but not proberush?
Grow up. 1) Yes because cheese CAN win. 2) Please grow up. Understand that what he did was ignoring the rules of the competition, acting like a moron, and whatever he gets out of this - he deserves it. Blatant disrespect towards the GSL, and NesTea. I think he should get banned for a year. It's what he deserves.
If you think he should be banned for a year then it's safe to say that you're either a huge drama queen or a complete retard, sorry...
"the rules of competition"? Please link!
How about you sit in Naniwas chair for a sec, get cheesed 3 games in a row just to play a completely useless game after (it's like losing to cheese 3 games in a row and then Mr Chae approaches u and asks, hey dude u wanna play a showmatch?).
So many ppl just wanting to hurt pro players or create drama, ridicolous.
If anyone here needs to "grow up" as you say, then it's you people who want Naniwa to be punished, you want to PUNSIH such a dedicated players just because he didn't bring YOU greedy guys the game you wanted to see so much.
Grow up yourselves, I say.
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I agree with MC. If you watch a sport and there's nothing on the line you don't get the players come out to the paying fans and one team just sits on the bench for the 90 minutes.
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On December 14 2011 02:22 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 02:22 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 02:20 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:17 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 02:15 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:13 mordk wrote:On December 14 2011 02:11 wei2coolman wrote:
I wonder if there would've been such a shitstorm if Naniwa went for a double gate proxy?
It's okay to cheese, but not proberush? Completely irrelevant. Double-gate proxy can win games. You do it when you think you can win with it. 7 Probe rush loses to anything lol, it's not playing the game. And yes, it's certainly OK to cheese. You can totally win with a 7 probe rush.... It just takes insane micro skills. Again, what league are you in? And yes, I am sure you can win ... if you are master league against gold or bronze or some shit, but as a master league zerg - no you cannot win it is straight up impossible. Regardless of how insane your micro skills are - if the opponent isn't a moron with no skills ... which NesTea isn't. There was 0% chance he could win that game regardless of what NesTea did. That is what people are annoyed about. theoretically a bot can out micro a human, I don't see why a human can't outmicro another human. in pure theory, a 7 probe rush could totally work. Theoretically I could win the lottery tomorrow and win 150 million. That is about the same chance as Naniwa winning that game ... probably higher, if you don't include NesTea having a sudden illness leaving him unable to control his units ... Is it the same chances as Naniwa winning with a double gate?
Stop trolling, these 17 threads are garbage enough as it is.
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On December 14 2011 02:23 aebriol wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 02:22 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:22 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 02:20 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:17 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 02:15 wei2coolman wrote:On December 14 2011 02:13 mordk wrote:On December 14 2011 02:11 wei2coolman wrote:
I wonder if there would've been such a shitstorm if Naniwa went for a double gate proxy?
It's okay to cheese, but not proberush? Completely irrelevant. Double-gate proxy can win games. You do it when you think you can win with it. 7 Probe rush loses to anything lol, it's not playing the game. And yes, it's certainly OK to cheese. You can totally win with a 7 probe rush.... It just takes insane micro skills. Again, what league are you in? And yes, I am sure you can win ... if you are master league against gold or bronze or some shit, but as a master league zerg - no you cannot win it is straight up impossible. Regardless of how insane your micro skills are - if the opponent isn't a moron with no skills ... which NesTea isn't. There was 0% chance he could win that game regardless of what NesTea did. That is what people are annoyed about. theoretically a bot can out micro a human, I don't see why a human can't outmicro another human. in pure theory, a 7 probe rush could totally work. Theoretically I could win the lottery tomorrow and win 150 million. That is about the same chance as Naniwa winning that game ... probably higher, if you don't include NesTea having a sudden illness leaving him unable to control his units ... Is it the same chances as Naniwa winning with a double gate? Nah double proxy gate I'd expect have a 2-5% chance of winning ... either way, I am done arguing with you, because I cannot combat pure stupidity on this level by reasoned arguments.
So by increasing his chances of winning from .01% to a 2-5% he's in the all-clear? lol, the hypocrisy.
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Why is everyone comparing a boX series to a round robin? BoX is by definition when you get to the winning number, you stop. Round robin = play everyone regardless of the standings. I'm not saying GOM should've let them play but the argument is just inaccurate
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Get cheeses 3 times in a row? What? Nani went eco 3 times in a row and got punished... Did he think he was playing nr15?
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I'm very disappointed in Naniwa. Circumstances aside, he was playing nestea on stage. Does he not want to beat nestea on stage?
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On December 14 2011 02:19 kafkaesque wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 02:18 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 02:16 kafkaesque wrote:
Oh Jesus, how is this still going on?
Why do you guys care so much about such an inane thing?
Do you feel cheated out of 10 minutes of Starcraft?
Give that guy a fucking break... a lot of people gave him a break after MLG, which in my eyes wasn't really deserved, no reason to let him get away with acting like an idiot all the time. You punish bad behavior because you don't want everyone to act like that. It's that simple. I would expect him to get some sort of punishment, and whatever it is, I agree with it. Again, how exactly does it bother you? I what way does he hurt anyone by throwing away a completely meaningless game?
Since this comment is particularly dumb I will respond. It was a grudge match. Nestea wanted revenge and Naniwa had taunted him beforehand. Nestea loses. Many fans wanted to see the grudge match. Many fans lose. It is also a matter of respect. It is a type of privilege to play on that stage. You show respect to it by playing your matches and at least trying to some extent. Is it really that much to ask that you show by play using a standard strategy (thus not giving away any strategical advantage in the futuregames) for some twenty minutes? Naniwa is only getting what he is asking for. People dislike him for a reason. It's not like they just randomly chose to bully him.
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On December 14 2011 02:17 Poisonblack wrote:
I feel sorry for Quantic... lol
I really do too. I would love to have their take on this incident.
In my opinion Naniwa disrespected sports in general. You never see a professional soccer-team ignore the ball during a soccer match just because they cannot pass the group stage.
It's a sportmans duty to play a game if there are resources being spent toward casting the game.
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Has Starcraft grown so much that the only time a game matters is if there is $50k riding on it? What about playing on the biggest stage of your life against one of if not the best player in the world? If Naniwa chooses to put his tail between his legs and hide in those situations then I'm ok with it and I couldn't care less whether GOM suspends him or does absolutely nothing - it's all the same to me. But you can't honestly tell me what Naniwa did was even close to acting like a professional or hell, even a winner.
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EPT
