On September 15 2022 10:34 orth0dox wrote: What is this about? It's something new to me, where do i look?
Flash and Bisu, among other people, tried to scam their afreeca followers by inciting the people to invest into some shady crypto. Ofc, Flash and Bisu played the fools, saying bunch of nonsense that they didn't know it's a scam while it became clear that not only they knew, but they were quite pro-active in the scheme because it would've been lucrative for them. Just search the forum, I'm sure it's there.
On September 14 2022 20:59 RowdierBob wrote: Death, taxes and Bisu finding a way to bottle it.
You seem to keep reading the game wrong. At what point during that last game was he ahead to be able to bottle it? Yeah he had 3 bases and 4 gases but if the supply is equal Protoss is never ahead.
I might be a little Bisu biased but this series really highlights how ZvP is a Zerg favored match up. Hydra bust and 9 Pool speed all day long.
It’s in reference to the series overall and Bisu’s history going way back. Chill out mate. Stop always trying to pick fights with ppl in these threads.
Then it's a bad reference isn't it? He was at no point leading the series. Also I'm not sure how correcting something wrong can be considered picking fight?
You aren't correcting anyone. The fact that you think the comment author needs 'correcting' is indicative of the generally condescending nature of your input here.
If you don't get the reference that doesn't mean it's necessarily incorrect. Your default tone is cynical, abrasive, and confrontational - and it simply isn't warranted here, in my opinion.
Look. What he said is factually incorrect. Bisu didn't have a lead at any point in the series therefore could not "bottle it". That much is beyond debatable, whether I "get" his "reference" or not.
You don't have to like my tone but saying he read the game wrong is no more cynical than saying something negative about a player. Neither is a personal attack or offensive. Why is the latter commonly accepted but the former not?
I don't think you're right man. I agree with you that he was never ahead in this series and even in that last game he was always on the back foot (altho he could've done better with the 3 gas templar advantage), but I think bottle it could also refer to just him being a better player and bottling it against a player who is by many probably considered the worse player and someone he should be able to beat in this setting.
Soulkey is the better player. He's literally no. 1 on spon games and more importantly has 66% record vs Bisu and above 60% vs any other Protoss.
Anyone thinking Bisu should beat Soulkey in an obvious way is probably disconnected to the modern Korean BW scene.
On September 15 2022 10:34 orth0dox wrote: What is this about? It's something new to me, where do i look?
Flash and Bisu, among other people, tried to scam their afreeca followers by inciting the people to invest into some shady crypto. Ofc, Flash and Bisu played the fools, saying bunch of nonsense that they didn't know it's a scam while it became clear that not only they knew, but they were quite pro-active in the scheme because it would've been lucrative for them. Just search the forum, I'm sure it's there.
if you searched the forum then you would know that theres zero evidence for your claim
Yeah all we know is that Flash invested in this coin and invited Bisu along with others to participate. Among them only Flash mentioned the coin once in his stream, but he never encouraged anyone to invest. Bisu and others didn't even speak about it once.
Among the Korean community, some have already moved on but some would still try to criminalize them. And foreigners, most didn't even look up the incident properly and just believed whatever they were told.
On September 15 2022 10:34 orth0dox wrote: What is this about? It's something new to me, where do i look?
Flash and Bisu, among other people, tried to scam their afreeca followers by inciting the people to invest into some shady crypto. Ofc, Flash and Bisu played the fools, saying bunch of nonsense that they didn't know it's a scam while it became clear that not only they knew, but they were quite pro-active in the scheme because it would've been lucrative for them. Just search the forum, I'm sure it's there.
if you searched the forum then you would know that theres zero evidence for your claim
Correct. The final verdict was that they were just quite ignorant. But I actually thought the original post was referring to the Soulkey incident. He was scammed out of a ton of money and a luxury car buying scheme. Because of this, he skipped playing ASL so he could practice hard and earn money from the more lucrative spon matches. I'm glad Soulkey was able overcome his debt problems enough to show us how good he is in ASL. If he wins this ASL, he will be the second player to win both a GSL and ASL.
Stop saying that FlaSh and Bisu are scammers. We don't know full story and there's no evidence that they knew the scheme was scam. All we can agree that they were greedy trying to get more money and their actions resulted scammers to scam viewers and to get away.
I think the perspective of “famous player so-and-so always finds a way to fail” is pretty misguided. The Ro16 is stacked with great players. Even if you have the competitive fire to maintain your game at top caliber, you’re in there with 15 other players also at top caliber, so your chances to win it all are slim. Failing to win an ASL despite many attempts isn’t some weird personality flaw, it’s the expected outcome.
Bisu is really cool, and I also want to see him win an ASL, but it just isn’t the case that he’s miles ahead of the competition and has a high likelihood to win once he’s in the Ro16. If you’re being generous, his likelihood of converting a Ro16 appearance into a gold medal is maybe 10%. (That is, a percentage bigger than 1/16, but not by that much.)
On September 14 2022 20:59 RowdierBob wrote: Death, taxes and Bisu finding a way to bottle it.
You seem to keep reading the game wrong. At what point during that last game was he ahead to be able to bottle it? Yeah he had 3 bases and 4 gases but if the supply is equal Protoss is never ahead.
I might be a little Bisu biased but this series really highlights how ZvP is a Zerg favored match up. Hydra bust and 9 Pool speed all day long.
couldn't agree more with your last statement..
it's kind of ridiculous how much harder the matchup is for one side.. and it was like this as far as I can remember, too.
On September 14 2022 20:59 RowdierBob wrote: Death, taxes and Bisu finding a way to bottle it.
You seem to keep reading the game wrong. At what point during that last game was he ahead to be able to bottle it? Yeah he had 3 bases and 4 gases but if the supply is equal Protoss is never ahead.
I might be a little Bisu biased but this series really highlights how ZvP is a Zerg favored match up. Hydra bust and 9 Pool speed all day long.
couldn't agree more with your last statement..
it's kind of ridiculous how much harder the matchup is for one side.. and it was like this as far as I can remember, too.
it sucks
I would personally sponsor a map where both main and natural are on the high ground and the natural has a ramp. :D
On September 14 2022 20:59 RowdierBob wrote: Death, taxes and Bisu finding a way to bottle it.
You seem to keep reading the game wrong. At what point during that last game was he ahead to be able to bottle it? Yeah he had 3 bases and 4 gases but if the supply is equal Protoss is never ahead.
I might be a little Bisu biased but this series really highlights how ZvP is a Zerg favored match up. Hydra bust and 9 Pool speed all day long.
couldn't agree more with your last statement..
it's kind of ridiculous how much harder the matchup is for one side.. and it was like this as far as I can remember, too.
it sucks
I don't think it's harder for Protoss in the sense that it's required more skills like apm, micro or multitasking ability.
It's just the matchup has more than one way for the Zerg to get a "cheap" win. And that refers specifically to the hydra bust, and to a lesser extent, the ling all-in. In those situations the Protoss can do no wrong given the information they are allowed to gather, but still lose.
Like when the Zerg pulls what Soulkey pulled in game 1 vs Bisu, there is literally no chance for Protoss to react in time unless he does a blind counter. Now if it was Bisu vs some low level Zerg, Bisu wouldn't lose because he would just build 3 cannons just for safety, take a delay to his timing, and still win the game later because he's much better than the Zerg. But when the two players are on the same level and every bit of resources and every second matters, Protoss can't throw away resources like that.
Obviously the best possible solution is to have the natural on a high ground or in the backyard like Revolver, Ringing Bloom, but it seems to mess with other matchups as well and those maps are never considered standard.
On September 14 2022 20:59 RowdierBob wrote: Death, taxes and Bisu finding a way to bottle it.
You seem to keep reading the game wrong. At what point during that last game was he ahead to be able to bottle it? Yeah he had 3 bases and 4 gases but if the supply is equal Protoss is never ahead.
I might be a little Bisu biased but this series really highlights how ZvP is a Zerg favored match up. Hydra bust and 9 Pool speed all day long.
couldn't agree more with your last statement..
it's kind of ridiculous how much harder the matchup is for one side.. and it was like this as far as I can remember, too.
it sucks
I don't think it's harder for Protoss in the sense that it's required more skills like apm, micro or multitasking ability.
It's just the matchup has more than one way for the Zerg to get a "cheap" win. And that refers specifically to the hydra bust, and to a lesser extent, the ling all-in. In those situations the Protoss can do no wrong given the information they are allowed to gather, but still lose.
Like when the Zerg pulls what Soulkey pulled in game 1 vs Bisu, there is literally no chance for Protoss to react in time unless he does a blind counter. Now if it was Bisu vs some low level Zerg, Bisu wouldn't lose because he would just build 3 cannons just for safety, take a delay to his timing, and still win the game later because he's much better than the Zerg. But when the two players are on the same level and every bit of resources and every second matters, Protoss can't throw away resources like that.
Obviously the best possible solution is to have the natural on a high ground or in the backyard like Revolver, Ringing Bloom, but it seems to mess with other matchups as well and those maps are never considered standard.
Imagine a standard map, but the natural had neutral buildings are blocking all but one hole. Would be nice if the gateway and forge didn't have to be sacrificed to protect the entrance. The buildings can be destroyed to open the entrance up as needed.
Generally, I'm pro-Toss and anti-Zerg, but I thought SK played better by a slight margin. His ling control and multitasking was superb. Bisu also played well to give a close nail-biting series. Sad that one has to lose, but SK deserved the win.
There's still hope for Aiur! I'll be rooting for Snow next. Thanks to him, two pesky Zergs have already been eliminated.
I still do feel PvZ is tougher for Protoss. But except for Arkanoid, this season hasn't really been spoiled by imba-ness. Both mini and Rain has shown how Protoss can really keep up with Zergs at the highest level. I have no issue with a top Zerg taking out another top Protoss even if Zerg has an edge. It's only when a middle-tier Zergs keep hydra-busting top Protosses that spoils my viewing experience.
On September 17 2022 02:28 RKC wrote: Generally, I'm pro-Toss and anti-Zerg, but I thought SK played better by a slight margin. His ling control and multitasking was superb. Bisu also played well to give a close nail-biting series. Sad that one has to lose, but SK deserved the win.
There's still hope for Aiur! I'll be rooting for Snow next. Thanks to him, two pesky Zergs have already been eliminated.
I still do feel PvZ is tougher for Protoss. But except for Arkanoid, this season hasn't really been spoiled by imba-ness. Both mini and Rain has shown how Protoss can really keep up with Zergs at the highest level. I have no issue with a top Zerg taking out another top Protoss even if Zerg has an edge. It's only when a middle-tier Zergs keep hydra-busting top Protosses that spoils my viewing experience.
I too am pro-toss (heh) but I think there are some cases where the top tier tosses just chern out really bad performances. For example, last season, when Snow just botched up getting lurker contained against ggaemo twice.
On September 17 2022 02:28 RKC wrote: Generally, I'm pro-Toss and anti-Zerg, but I thought SK played better by a slight margin. His ling control and multitasking was superb. Bisu also played well to give a close nail-biting series. Sad that one has to lose, but SK deserved the win.
There's still hope for Aiur! I'll be rooting for Snow next. Thanks to him, two pesky Zergs have already been eliminated.
I still do feel PvZ is tougher for Protoss. But except for Arkanoid, this season hasn't really been spoiled by imba-ness. Both mini and Rain has shown how Protoss can really keep up with Zergs at the highest level. I have no issue with a top Zerg taking out another top Protoss even if Zerg has an edge. It's only when a middle-tier Zergs keep hydra-busting top Protosses that spoils my viewing experience.
I too am pro-toss (heh) but I think there are some cases where the top tier tosses just chern out really bad performances. For example, last season, when Snow just botched up getting lurker contained against ggaemo twice.
Guess the margin of error is less forgiving for top Toss. Snow, mini, Bisu, and even Rain all have their own fair share of 'blunders' (not cannoning enough, mismicroing zealot to allow ling flood).
Lurker contain is another semi-abusive strat that's frustrating to watch. I remember few seasons ago Snow got lurker contained badly by Soma on some wonky map that had a high ground terrain outside main cutting off access to rest of map. Ridiculous how placement of 3-4 lurkers can choke an entire Toss army to death.
On September 17 2022 02:28 RKC wrote: Generally, I'm pro-Toss and anti-Zerg, but I thought SK played better by a slight margin. His ling control and multitasking was superb. Bisu also played well to give a close nail-biting series. Sad that one has to lose, but SK deserved the win.
There's still hope for Aiur! I'll be rooting for Snow next. Thanks to him, two pesky Zergs have already been eliminated.
I still do feel PvZ is tougher for Protoss. But except for Arkanoid, this season hasn't really been spoiled by imba-ness. Both mini and Rain has shown how Protoss can really keep up with Zergs at the highest level. I have no issue with a top Zerg taking out another top Protoss even if Zerg has an edge. It's only when a middle-tier Zergs keep hydra-busting top Protosses that spoils my viewing experience.
I too am pro-toss (heh) but I think there are some cases where the top tier tosses just chern out really bad performances. For example, last season, when Snow just botched up getting lurker contained against ggaemo twice.
Guess the margin of error is less forgiving for top Toss. Snow, mini, Bisu, and even Rain all have their own fair share of 'blunders' (not cannoning enough, mismicroing zealot to allow ling flood).
It's really the nature of the race and the matchup. No matter how good you are as a Protoss, there will be a certain number of times where you die to a ling runby or a hydra bust.
Case in point: Flash random Protoss vs Soma in ASL10. Couple of lings got into the main and the game became unrecoverable for Flash.
EPT
Crossing Field
