• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 04:28
CET 09:28
KST 17:28
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy5ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book19Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289
Community News
Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool39Weekly Cups (March 9-15): herO, Clem, ByuN win42026 KungFu Cup Announcement6BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled12Blizzard Classic Cup - Tastosis announced as captains18
StarCraft 2
General
Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool Potential Updates Coming to the SC2 CN Server Weekly Cups (March 2-8): ByuN overcomes PvT block Weekly Cups (August 25-31): Clem's Last Straw? Weekly Cups (March 9-15): herO, Clem, ByuN win
Tourneys
https://www.facebook.com/MosqiShock.Mosquito.Zappe World University TeamLeague (500$+) | Signups Open RSL Season 4 announced for March-April Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Team League Season 10
Strategy
Custom Maps
Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026]
External Content
Mutation # 518 Radiation Zone The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 517 Distant Threat Mutation # 516 Specter of Death
Brood War
General
Soulkey's decision to leave C9 JaeDong's form before ASL BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ [ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos ASL21 General Discussion
Tourneys
ASL Season 21 LIVESTREAM with English Commentary [ASL21] Ro24 Group A [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL22] Open Qualifiers & Ladder Tours
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Cricket [SPORT] Formula 1 Discussion Tokyo Olympics 2021 Thread General nutrition recommendations
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Laptop capable of using Photoshop Lightroom?
TL Community
rsvsr How to Keep Reward Chains Rolling in Monopol u4gm What to Do First in MLB The Show 26 Spring The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Money Laundering In Video Ga…
TrAiDoS
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
Shocked by a laser…
Spydermine0240
Unintentional protectionism…
Uldridge
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 3026 users

[OSL] EVER OSL Semi-Final A: Flash vs Calm - Page 122

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 120 121 122
FabledIntegral
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States9232 Posts
January 02 2010 10:17 GMT
#2421
On January 02 2010 11:42 Ideas wrote:


Just once I'd like to see a progamer use guardians to guard something instead of try to attack a natural and die to wraiths.


That's how Guardians are used ~80% of the time in ZvT....

They still die to wraiths...

I don't understand why Zergs don't build just friggin' ONE devour, at least to soak up dmg while more scourge can come, seeing as it has a ton more hp than a guardian, more armor, and slows down the wraith shots and prevents cloak.
writer22816
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States5775 Posts
January 02 2010 11:10 GMT
#2422
I actually don't understand why Zergs build guardians in the first place. Terribly expensive and weak, and they push themselves into range of turrets which ends up killing them T_T
8/4/12 never forget, never forgive.
Caphe
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Vietnam10817 Posts
January 02 2010 12:00 GMT
#2423
On January 02 2010 20:10 writer22816 wrote:
I actually don't understand why Zergs build guardians in the first place. Terribly expensive and weak, and they push themselves into range of turrets which ends up killing them T_T

You only said that because Flash has a very very sick game sense and nutrualize those guardians very quickly.
If not guardians can do tremendous damage and keep Flash off his nat for a good amount of time, by then he will be run over by lings,lurkers and defilers.
Terran
FusionCutter
Profile Joined October 2004
Canada974 Posts
January 02 2010 13:01 GMT
#2424
For all those ppl whining "why didn't calm make guards?"
One word.
GAS.
TwoToneTerran
Profile Joined March 2009
United States8841 Posts
January 02 2010 13:04 GMT
#2425
Also, while Flash was losing lots of Vessels, it was rare that he didn't have 8 or so ready with irradiate. Muta/Guard still would've had trouble with irradiate.

Not to mention if Flash scouted it. :o handful of Valks instarapes it.
Remember Violet.
SimonB
Profile Joined September 2008
United States1088 Posts
January 02 2010 14:00 GMT
#2426
I thought that was the perfect game to break out battlecruisers. 5 bases, well-defended in a stalemate against ultra-ling-defiler.

So I'm a tad disappointed Flash didn't take up that opportunity, but still overwhelmingly happy about the win.
Xiphos
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada7507 Posts
January 02 2010 14:10 GMT
#2427
On January 02 2010 23:00 SimonB wrote:
I thought that was the perfect game to break out battlecruisers. 5 bases, well-defended in a stalemate against ultra-ling-defiler.

So I'm a tad disappointed Flash didn't take up that opportunity, but still overwhelmingly happy about the win.



I'm pretty sure Flash was at max supply with everything he had. Plus he needs to keep up the pressure on Calm's 12 o clock and 9 O clock all the time or else Calm would have a nice timing of opportunity to get the bases full running with that amount of Gas, Calm could've went for Big air like Guardians to destroy the bottom right expansions. Battlecruiser would then come there but Calm can just made more Mutalisk and destroy the BCs.
2014 - ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ Raise your bows brood warriors! ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ
StorkHwaiting
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States3465 Posts
January 03 2010 06:45 GMT
#2428
On January 02 2010 23:00 SimonB wrote:
I thought that was the perfect game to break out battlecruisers. 5 bases, well-defended in a stalemate against ultra-ling-defiler.

So I'm a tad disappointed Flash didn't take up that opportunity, but still overwhelmingly happy about the win.


I think it's coz those 5 bases were spread across the entire map. BC's have real bad mobility and Calm was very VERY active with scourge up until the end. Also, without a lot of tanks to defend, Calm could have been a lot more threatening a lot earlier. And that means he would have secured 9 o'clock.
StorkHwaiting
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States3465 Posts
January 03 2010 06:47 GMT
#2429
On January 02 2010 18:18 OneOther wrote:
just watched the vods, very exciting series indeed. great effort by calm (three zerg players in four words?) but flash is just un fucking believable right now. his mental game, management, and executions are flawless.

that being said movie has a MUCH better chance of topping flash than shine.


haha could say "great effort by.hero calm" and make it four for four.
Warrior Madness
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Canada3791 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-01-08 03:42:21
January 08 2010 03:40 GMT
#2430
I'd hate to bump an old LR thread but I just watched game 4 and I'm wondering why calm lost so easily. I mean... Calm went 12 hatch, fine. And flash looks like he got 2 rax before his academy, so he pushed out earlier with a little more marines (well normal for him). Calm then takes out flash's first m&m group pretty easily (I think he could've taken them out like 10 seconds earlier however). But this apparently buys flash enough time to make a million turrets and m&ms. I would think that losing that first group of m&ms would push flash just SLIGHTLY ahead. How could he afford all those turrets and m&ms?

Then comes flash's monstrous push. Calm simply didn't have anything.... Was his macro just plain bad? I noticed he put down two hatches almost simultaneously which I thought was weird. By the time flash was half way to calm's natural, calm also had about 1000 gas stockpiled. The only satisfactory explanation I can come up with is calm was going to go for guardians again, but 2 things went against him. 1) Spawning position was not on his side. 2) His muta-harass did not do as well as it was supposed to.

After watching game 3 again... Calm's muta's were actually worse in game 3. He lost his first 3 initial mutas. The main difference though is that 1) They spawned at cross positions. 2) Calm got guardians faster in game 3. And he never went over 600 gas during the opening. 3) After flashs's first group of m&m's gets wiped out he sends a second wave in which he loses most of them for nothing to mutas.

It makes me wonder why calm didn't utilize Zero's variation of the 2 hatch build instead. Flash loves getting 2 rax before his academy so it seems like fast mutas, 20 seconds faster than normal is just a good way to punish that. After watching set4 I think the only thing that calm could've done was macro better. His muta control was almost perfect.
The Past: Yellow, Julyzerg, Chojja, Savior, GGplay -- The Present: Luxury, Jae- The Future: -Dong, maGma, Zero, Effort, Hoejja, hyvaa, by.hero, calm, Action ---> SC2 (Ret?? Kolll Idra!! SEN, Cool, ZergBong, Leenock)
green2000
Profile Joined October 2009
Peru79 Posts
January 08 2010 04:05 GMT
#2431
I like calm, but now isnt a rival for the terminator!
Fenix all the way!
Ideas
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States8167 Posts
January 08 2010 04:33 GMT
#2432
On January 02 2010 19:17 FabledIntegral wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 02 2010 11:42 Ideas wrote:


Just once I'd like to see a progamer use guardians to guard something instead of try to attack a natural and die to wraiths.


That's how Guardians are used ~80% of the time in ZvT....

They still die to wraiths...

I don't understand why Zergs don't build just friggin' ONE devour, at least to soak up dmg while more scourge can come, seeing as it has a ton more hp than a guardian, more armor, and slows down the wraith shots and prevents cloak.


i guess I've just missed the dozens of TvZs where guardians are used that way!
Free Palestine
TwoToneTerran
Profile Joined March 2009
United States8841 Posts
January 08 2010 06:26 GMT
#2433
On January 08 2010 13:33 Ideas wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 02 2010 19:17 FabledIntegral wrote:
On January 02 2010 11:42 Ideas wrote:


Just once I'd like to see a progamer use guardians to guard something instead of try to attack a natural and die to wraiths.


That's how Guardians are used ~80% of the time in ZvT....

They still die to wraiths...

I don't understand why Zergs don't build just friggin' ONE devour, at least to soak up dmg while more scourge can come, seeing as it has a ton more hp than a guardian, more armor, and slows down the wraith shots and prevents cloak.


i guess I've just missed the dozens of TvZs where guardians are used that way!


basically, anytime a zerg hive rushes and the terran goes for the standard 9~ minute push, they morph their former mutas into guards real quick to defend, since it's about surviving until defilers rather than hurting the terran. Was very common on outsider with the hive rushing there.
Remember Violet.
Prev 1 120 121 122
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 32m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Livibee 117
ProTech115
StarCraft: Brood War
910 381
Larva 246
NotJumperer 81
Shinee 61
ToSsGirL 59
yabsab 54
Nal_rA 42
ZergMaN 27
Bale 15
GoRush 12
[ Show more ]
Terrorterran 11
SilentControl 7
League of Legends
JimRising 505
Reynor71
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K1252
Other Games
ceh9355
Happy165
Mew2King66
Sick53
ViBE22
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick630
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream131
Other Games
BasetradeTV118
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 9
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• HappyZerGling105
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
32m
Afreeca Starleague
1h 32m
Sharp vs Scan
Rain vs Mong
Wardi Open
3h 32m
Monday Night Weeklies
8h 32m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 1h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 1h
Soulkey vs Ample
JyJ vs sSak
Replay Cast
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
hero vs YSC
Larva vs Shine
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
[ Show More ]
KCM Race Survival
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
WardiTV Team League
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
WardiTV Team League
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Cure vs Zoun
herO vs Rogue
WardiTV Team League
5 days
Platinum Heroes Events
5 days
BSL
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
ByuN vs Maru
MaxPax vs TriGGeR
WardiTV Team League
6 days
BSL
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-03-22
WardiTV Winter 2026
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
BSL Season 22
CSL Elite League 2026
CSL Season 20: Qualifier 1
ASL Season 21
Acropolis #4 - TS6
RSL Revival: Season 4
Nations Cup 2026
NationLESS Cup
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual

Upcoming

2026 Changsha Offline CUP
CSL Season 20: Qualifier 2
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.