on a 4 player map:
when you scout, you scout the closest position to your base. If he is not there, you go to the corss position (closest to your scouting probe). Since you got your scouting probe around 8, when you reach the cross position you should be around 11-12 population. So, you'll either find him (and go 1 gate tech) or not, so he is near you in the last scouting place (and can assume 2 gate - pressure).

Equinox_kr

United States7395 Posts

June 10 2007 09:13 GMT

#43

Oh well, least this isn't as bad as the "lol" bumps :O

Zoan

United States53 Posts

June 10 2007 09:24 GMT

#44

To break lurker contains I prefer to just run past them with Speedlots. Usually the Zerg only puts around 4-5 lurkers outside your base, all spread-out, and just expands and techs back at his base, expecting you to get hit by the lurker spines and just retreat until you get goons/obs. But, running speedlots past the lurkers allows you to ravage newly built Zerg expos and makes the Zerg either retreat the lurkers or sends his main army to attack the speedlots. Then, you can run your main army (if your lots was your main army then skip this) into the Zerg's main base since he's preoccupied with the speedlots raping his drones at expansions and rape everything up in his main base, granted he did unburrow his lurks.

Inj0i

8 Posts

June 10 2007 09:48 GMT

#45

Chill, the second question was, If playing on a two player map, how would you then know if you want to 2 or 1 gate? Because thats a different scouting scenario than a 4 player map

Equinox_kr

United States7395 Posts

June 10 2007 11:10 GMT

#46

Play according to your instincts; if you see something oddly wrong with his build (very few Drones, or something like that) then you'd go 2 Gateway. If you see a normal 12 Hatchery / 11 Spawning Pool, then a 1 Gateway build is better and wastes less time for your teching.

When I play PvZ, I always try to put high pressure on the Zerg early on; I go on a 2 Gateway Zealot pressure build about 60% of the time to hunt Zerglings down, kill some Drones, and force him to commit some minerals into building Sunken Colonies, where 90% of the time aren't well placed and still allows you to take down his Extractor or something and delay Lair tech. Then if the Zerg is still alive by then I have a Corsair to see what he's doing; Hydralisk Den, Spire, or mass Speedlings (although I've only seen this once in an East pub game :O).

Piano

Korea (South)401 Posts

June 16 2007 04:00 GMT

#47

this thread is art! thank you for the guide

i'm trying to improve my PvZ

Slayer91

Ireland23335 Posts

June 16 2007 04:06 GMT

#48

Scouting cross position first is because 2 gate sucks if they are cross, so if you scout it first, just 1 gate if they are cross, 2 if they are not.

hasuprotoss

United States4611 Posts

June 16 2007 04:17 GMT

#49

Man, how could I have missed this thread. Thank you for whoever bumped this.

Thanks RiSe for posting this as well, I feel like I learned at least a few basic things that I would do but not know the reason for doing!

Piano

Korea (South)401 Posts

June 16 2007 04:25 GMT

#50

On June 16 2007 13:17 hasuprotoss wrote:
Man, how could I have missed this thread. Thank you for whoever bumped this.

Thanks RiSe for posting this as well, I feel like I learned at least a few basic things that I would do but not know the reason for doing!

.JuniOr.

United States25 Posts

June 19 2007 23:43 GMT

#51

Thanks for the bump, and thanks for the thread. PvZ is my worst matchup and I just keep getting curb stomped.

LastWish

2013 Posts

June 20 2007 00:43 GMT

#52

Imo the guide isn't too good, it doesn't tell anything important.

Playing PvZ from both sides is the best way to learn it.

You must realize that on some maps(luna for example) it is almost impossible to beat ultra+ling+defiler(if you didn't get a advantage before hivetech).

Best way to get a advantage in PvZ is to kill drones - best way to mass kill drones is a Storm drop.

Pads

England3228 Posts

June 20 2007 01:21 GMT

#53

decent guide ^^ ;]

Person514cs

1004 Posts

June 20 2007 05:14 GMT

#54

Alot of you say fast expand is not very good for toss. But it seems that it's the popular build noww days and what are some of the zerg counters to that build?

Purind

Canada3562 Posts

June 20 2007 05:59 GMT

#55

I normally get my Cyber at ~17 if I'm 1 gating. I get it at 20-something if I scout a pool first build (going zeal zeal then core to block zergling rushes), but if they FE, It's perfectly safe to go 17 cyber, get your gas/tech much faster and everything just sorta flows from there.

And I think FE is not that hard to pull off. If you really want to be safe, just follow it up with a stargate, go sair and it'll play pretty similarly to a 1 gate game (how you react to what you see is somewhat similar, only now, both players are richer). I guess more things can possibly go wrong with FE, but if you just lose in 4 different ways, and adjust your gameplan every time (ie. learn from your mistakes), it's not hard to learn. I mean, every build is like this, you learn from getting owned in a way you did not prepare for.