Ugh wtf @ changing neo medusa >_<
protosses and terrans can build bunkers, turrets, and cannons in the middle of a map usually, but as soon as zergs are able to do it effectively they have to change it?

Also Shades of Twilight looks pretty sweet

Cpt.beefy

Ireland799 Posts

May 22 2009 23:38 GMT

#86

I agree proxy hatch was a good usage of map dynamic, but it was SoOO gay..

Last Romantic

United States20661 Posts

May 22 2009 23:40 GMT

#87

Seriously? Once Zerg can do something innovated, it gets nerfed?

"All maps have been changed to prevent Protoss cannon rushes"

Sigh.

ZoW

United States3983 Posts

May 22 2009 23:44 GMT

#88

Bisu obviously used methods to influence this change. However, what kind of methods, we don't know. :O

whatusername

Canada1181 Posts

May 22 2009 23:46 GMT

#89

ok now im kind of pissed off at kespa

zerg has had to suffer gay proxy rax -> bunker rushes, proxy factories, cannon rushes, proxy gateways for ages

now that we get to do our own cool thing to do, its "imbalanced"? wtf

koreasilver

9109 Posts

May 22 2009 23:55 GMT

#90

All maps should be changed to prevent 2port wraiths IMO.

Pioneer

994 Posts

May 23 2009 00:14 GMT

#91

On May 23 2009 02:26 Harem wrote:

Show nested quote +

Yeah, because Neo Medusa really fixed a majority of the problems that already existed in tvp/tvz.

Also, Gorush tried to proxy hatch Backho in OSL. Backho breaks out ez.

Backho > Bisu?!?!?!

GoRush did the same strat on outsider that Luxury did vs Sea and Lomo beat it, Lomo > Sea!?!?!?!

More like GoRush is borderline terrible now and his timing is off. Great is a far better player than GoRush is.

And proxy gating is completely different from proxy hatching. and I know the zergs are going to cry that protoss can still cannon rush. For a long time now the mineral placements on most maps have prevented any kind of perfectly walled cannon rush PvZ and no decent zerg would ever allow a protoss to cannon away from the mineral line.

Now that that's out, I don't think proxy hatch is that big of a deal. At least enough to warrant another change to medusa. I don't know why progamers should be any different with a proxy hatch than foreigners and korean amateurs (using reavers with an army). It's difficult to deal with but not impossible.

lol @ zergs crying about no zerg favored maps.

in recent times maps that favor zerg ZvP

Andromeda
Destination
Neo Harmony
Tears of The Moon
Chupung Reyeong
Battle Royale
Holy World
Neo Medusa

maps that have been balanced ZvP
Medusa
RH3
Tau Cross
Outsider
Return of the King

You guys aren't hurting to much

I know ZvT isn't great on these maps but that's not the issue here.

whatusername

Canada1181 Posts

May 23 2009 00:20 GMT

#92

my point was that protoss and terran is able to do so much gay shit to the zerg, and now that zerg has access to something equally homosexual its deemed unbalanced

Pioneer

994 Posts

May 23 2009 00:22 GMT

#93

On May 23 2009 09:20 whatusername wrote:
my point was that protoss and terran is able to do so much gay shit to the zerg, and now that zerg has access to something equally homosexual its deemed unbalanced

What kind of gay shit? Proxy 2 gate. That's about the gayest thing I can think of that's actually semi viable nowadays.

Gay things zerg can do to protoss.

2 hatch muta
2 hatch lurker drop
2 hatch hydra break
3 hatch hydra break
4/5 pool
overpool speed runbye

and that's just openings

Sunken/Spore Lurker turtling is extremely hard for protoss to defend, zergs mobility and ability to shutdown an expo with a few lings and swarm is very difficult to deal with and other things.

infinity2k9

United Kingdom2397 Posts

May 23 2009 00:27 GMT

#94

regular play isnt 'gay shit' lets not just list every build order for both. imo and obviously a lot of other people proxy hatch wasnt an imbalanced strategy, didn't seem to be a reason to change the map because of it. its just a clever strategy that requires a change of play style to counter. but instead of even giving time for toss players to adjust their play against it, they just change the map to 'fix' it which is kind of lame. allowing infested terrans is imbalanced, but proxy hatch? naah.

FragKrag

United States11552 Posts

May 23 2009 00:52 GMT

#95

man, I wanted Central Plains.

Twilight isn't even on the twilight tileset

Cpt.beefy

Ireland799 Posts

May 23 2009 00:55 GMT

#96

this discussion is pointless, the decision has been made.
bisu is now kespa's balance bloke.

arb

Noobville17921 Posts

May 23 2009 01:00 GMT

#97

On May 23 2009 09:14 Pioneer wrote:

Show nested quote +

GoRush did the same strat on outsider that Luxury did vs Sea and Lomo beat it, Lomo > Sea!?!?!?!

More like GoRush is borderline terrible now and his timing is off. Great is a far better player than GoRush is.

.

http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/games/12086_GoRush_vs_great
wait what
EDIT : to add something im really glad the map is gone, as said earlier a map that only one matchup can be played on is fucking boring

Equinox_kr

United States7395 Posts

May 23 2009 01:26 GMT

#98

Thank God they took out Battle Royale, it actually ruined ZvZ for me, it was my most favorite matchup

Avidkeystamper

United States8556 Posts

May 23 2009 01:29 GMT

#99

Really?, BR was made for ZvZ. The general quality of ZvZ on BR is higher than on any other map I can remember.

Shizuru~

Malaysia1676 Posts

May 23 2009 01:40 GMT

#100

Glad the map is gone, especially as an ACE MAP!!!! hated watching ZvZ, for an ACE match is way too hardcore anti-climatic....

So why the hell did they not allow proxy hatchery strategies on medusa anymore? gosh i was so looking forward to the strategy that breaks it, stuff like hallucination+arbiter recall...