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On January 21 2018 08:41 Starlightsun wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2018 08:28 RCCar wrote:On January 20 2018 06:50 SCC-Faust wrote:On January 20 2018 06:31 Saechiis wrote:On January 20 2018 04:34 RCCar wrote:
Nice meme. Its still business. Just that Afreeca has invested too much into SCBW to back out now. They used to almost exclusively have BW streamers and capitalized on their monopoly. Now, BW is getting less popular in Korea, old progamers are starting to play PUBG, and many of them are simultaneously broadcasting to youtube and twitch, ultimately better optimized platforms. Afreeca tried to regulate the migration, but came under heavy fire and had to give up.
They aren't getting back what they invested into BW, and they are too late to jump on the PUBG progaming train, so they have no choice but to pretend they care about their bw streamers more than twitch or youtube does. One of the ways include ASL, which is why they're keeping it up for now though it is inevitably in the red.
None of the parties involved are emotional entities, though they might try to fool people into thinking they are.
Literally Soo-Gil says nothing of substance in his whole plea,
just "hey, we're the good guys, if only Blizzard will give in, we can have this!"
Vise versa holds true. In my opinion, with all the other greedy stunts he's pulled over the years, Afreeca are probably stubborn about something simple so they can protect their ego, and are resorting to mass rage since Blizzard won't take their shit. I'm quoting this because it seems like one of the more levelheaded non-emotional responses in the thread. These are big companies, it's unlikely morality is a point of discussion aside from technical legality and "do we think this will piss people off to a degree that we're going to lose money over it?" I don't completely understand how this is one of the more levelheaded responses when it is far more leaps than most people in this thread are making on top of just being on the other side of the coin in the blame game. People are just wondering exactly how Blizzard can say they want to see more tournaments come up and flourish with the release of Remastered, and then charge such an incredible licensing fee that the most suitable company to do so isn't even able to. I think that is a legitimate concern and question that people have a right to ask, and is not inflammatory in any way or taking anything out of context. It also seems a lot less gratuitous than claiming the Afreeca CEO is on a burning ship and solely wants cheaper rights to keep his platform afloat. Oh, how malicious. How evil. Please charge them up the ass, cause how dare Afreeca want to survive as a company. OK good posts dudes. I think if you tried to analyze the situation with a calmer head you will realize that the post isn't saying afreeca is evil, just that they never had the community's best interest in mind unlike what many posters are wont to believe here. ngl I've seen this crap over and over again in TL since about 2010, where one good gesture towards the game overshadows every other crap they do. Happened with Sonic, happened with the federation, happening with Soo-gil. It truly isn't that hard of a concept to grasp. Nobody is an angel, that doesn't make them the devil either. Its just business. Four top quality tournaments and a streaming platform for top pros is more than just "one good gesture". I don't presume to speak for the entire community's best interest, but I think a lot of us just want to see BW as an e-sport like it was in the Kespa days. Afreeca has given us a lot in that direction. Activision-Blizzard has not contributed anything to that, and has even actively got in the way. This isn't a symmetrical deal.
Streaming platform that actively seeked to ban them for streaming on other platforms hmmm....
Yeah totally great. Only the best interests of the players in mind. Afreeca must only be doing great stuff for the scene.
I understand the "I just want a tournament, whoever is stopping it just give in and let it happen ree" mindset, since the time for SCBW is going away quickly, but at the same time, holy crap its getting overemotional and childish with no other research nor information in play.
Twitter accounts and hashtags? What is this witch hunt off of one side's word?
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Until the other side responds we only have one side's words. Let them respond. I'm all for it. But I don't want to see them kill BW again. How many lives can this game have?
I understand Afreeca is a business and need to make money. I'm a consumer- oddly not of Afreeca products, but of Blizzard products. I want to play Blizzard games and watch tourneys of Blizzard's games, specifically BroodWar. I don't really care who is the producer of these tourneys, but if Blizzard is actually getting in the way of these trouneys happening, then yes I have a problem with that. I'd love to hear Blizzard's side.
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How to Blizzard see our angry? I think we need to vote for ASL5.
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On January 21 2018 09:46 RCCar wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2018 08:41 Starlightsun wrote:On January 21 2018 08:28 RCCar wrote:On January 20 2018 06:50 SCC-Faust wrote:On January 20 2018 06:31 Saechiis wrote:On January 20 2018 04:34 RCCar wrote:
Nice meme. Its still business. Just that Afreeca has invested too much into SCBW to back out now. They used to almost exclusively have BW streamers and capitalized on their monopoly. Now, BW is getting less popular in Korea, old progamers are starting to play PUBG, and many of them are simultaneously broadcasting to youtube and twitch, ultimately better optimized platforms. Afreeca tried to regulate the migration, but came under heavy fire and had to give up.
They aren't getting back what they invested into BW, and they are too late to jump on the PUBG progaming train, so they have no choice but to pretend they care about their bw streamers more than twitch or youtube does. One of the ways include ASL, which is why they're keeping it up for now though it is inevitably in the red.
None of the parties involved are emotional entities, though they might try to fool people into thinking they are.
Literally Soo-Gil says nothing of substance in his whole plea,
just "hey, we're the good guys, if only Blizzard will give in, we can have this!"
Vise versa holds true. In my opinion, with all the other greedy stunts he's pulled over the years, Afreeca are probably stubborn about something simple so they can protect their ego, and are resorting to mass rage since Blizzard won't take their shit. I'm quoting this because it seems like one of the more levelheaded non-emotional responses in the thread. These are big companies, it's unlikely morality is a point of discussion aside from technical legality and "do we think this will piss people off to a degree that we're going to lose money over it?" I don't completely understand how this is one of the more levelheaded responses when it is far more leaps than most people in this thread are making on top of just being on the other side of the coin in the blame game. People are just wondering exactly how Blizzard can say they want to see more tournaments come up and flourish with the release of Remastered, and then charge such an incredible licensing fee that the most suitable company to do so isn't even able to. I think that is a legitimate concern and question that people have a right to ask, and is not inflammatory in any way or taking anything out of context. It also seems a lot less gratuitous than claiming the Afreeca CEO is on a burning ship and solely wants cheaper rights to keep his platform afloat. Oh, how malicious. How evil. Please charge them up the ass, cause how dare Afreeca want to survive as a company. OK good posts dudes. I think if you tried to analyze the situation with a calmer head you will realize that the post isn't saying afreeca is evil, just that they never had the community's best interest in mind unlike what many posters are wont to believe here. ngl I've seen this crap over and over again in TL since about 2010, where one good gesture towards the game overshadows every other crap they do. Happened with Sonic, happened with the federation, happening with Soo-gil. It truly isn't that hard of a concept to grasp. Nobody is an angel, that doesn't make them the devil either. Its just business. Four top quality tournaments and a streaming platform for top pros is more than just "one good gesture". I don't presume to speak for the entire community's best interest, but I think a lot of us just want to see BW as an e-sport like it was in the Kespa days. Afreeca has given us a lot in that direction. Activision-Blizzard has not contributed anything to that, and has even actively got in the way. This isn't a symmetrical deal. Streaming platform that actively seeked to ban them for streaming on other platforms hmmm.... Yeah totally great. Only the best interests of the players in mind. Afreeca must only be doing great stuff for the scene. I understand the "I just want a tournament, whoever is stopping it just give in and let it happen ree" mindset, since the time for SCBW is going away quickly, but at the same time, holy crap its getting overemotional and childish with no other research nor information in play. Twitter accounts and hashtags? What is this witch hunt off of one side's word?
You do realize that there is clear distinction between attempting monopoly at something, and threatening to end something without plans to replace that content?
AfreecaTV may be untrustworthy in a whole lot of senses but the one thing they could be counted on was to be the lone successful host of competitive and casual Brood War after MBC Game got shut down, and Ongamenet abandoned their decade long legacy with tears from the casters and cringe-worthy Starcraft 2 promotion from Mike Morhaime. Sonic, was a criminal, but a criminal who supported Brood War with his illegal earnings. See my drift here? Here you are focusing on who is more unwholesome between the likes of AfreecaTV and Blizzard, when the main point of focus for many is the fact that the survival of competitive Brood War is at risk.
If AfreecaTV abandons competitive Brood War, what guarantees do we have of competitive Brood War thriving more than ever after being freed from the shackles of AfreecaTV? Let us suppose that Blizzard is completely in the right once further information gets exposed. Does that change the fact that AfreecaTV is struggling to host competitive Brood War due to Blizzard's policies, and how likely it is for nobody to play the role of AfreecaTV for competitive Brood War should AfreecaTV abandon competitive Brood War rather than comply to Blizzard's demands? What good comes out of Blizzard being in the right, and AfreecaTV being in the wrong, if in the end that means competitive Brood War gets held back?
There's nothing more important to me than competitive Brood War being healthy. Unless Blizzard has plans to provide something of substance in place of what they are threatening to remove, they are accountable for what might happen. No amount of pointing fingers towards the flaws of AfreecaTV will change that fact. For all their imperfections, AfreecaTV has been championing Brood War as their premium content for years on end. That, to me, is more important than finding out whether Blizzard is rightful in their actions to stop ASL from taking place. Blizzard can be stopping ASL to find the solution for world peace for all I care. The ends never justify the means if it means the destruction of competitive Brood War. That is the reason for the outrage.
Tell me with a straight face that competitive Brood War will never will get hurt by Blizzard, and this has been all a misunderstanding due to lack of relevant information. Please convince me that this is all a part of Blizzard's plan to make competitive Brood War greater than ever. Placate my over-emotional outbursts with factual evidence of how AfreecaTV isn't vital for the continuation of competitive Brood War, and how there is 100% full-proof guarantee of competitive Brood War being safe from harm should this feud between Blizzard and AfreecaTV turn out for the worst.
Until then, give me a break with that condescending tone of telling people to stop being emotional over something they truly are concerned over, just because you can afford to move on should the worst happen.
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It seems like this is the most unified initiative we are going to scrap together. Twitter and Blizzard forum posts will have to be our medium of attempted communication.
First off, thank you to everybody who is putting some effort into this thing. Anything that has the potential to influence the future of the ASL is important and you are all awesome.
On January 21 2018 09:42 Devolved wrote:Hey, I just made my first twitter account. I made a tweet #HelpOrStepAside. I have no idea if I did it right. Reply to it if you agree or if I did something technically wrong let me know.
You asked for some advice, so please hear me out. The #HelpOrStepAside sounds really aggressive and divisive to me, and I think the message we should be sending should be one of solidarity. I don't think we should be attacking Blizzard or giving them the impression that it is us against them. I think we should be trying to open dialogue so that we can voice our views, and then convince the right people Blizzard that our views actually do matter. Telling them to "step aside" is just... lol man. This is a huge fucking corporation. This is analogous to a homeless man yelling at a 20 story building to "get out my way!" It just sounds too much like an empty threat.
I also think it is important to have ASL or at least something related to Starcraft somewhere in the hashtag, so that people with a casual interest in SC might be more inclined to read about our struggle and be encouraged to help. There are a lot of people who have played this game over the years and might be willing to help us, even if they know nothing about the ASL or professional Starcraft.
Starting your tweet with "Yo Blizzard!" and the general tone of your tweet does not suggest a serious position (no offense, this is imo). It suggests a casual attitude and a lack of respect. Now don't get offended! I am just trying my best to be real about the situation here.
We need to do our best to represent the Starcraft fanbase, because that is actually what we are doing here. As individuals we are powerless, but as a group we command attention. We need Blizzard to think about our position seriously and that won't happen unless we show them at least a little respect... I mean, this is the same company (more or less) that created this beautiful game. We at least owe them a shade of humility when we try to reach out to them.
Lastly, I think people might be focusing too much on their issues with Blizzard and not focusing on what a concerted effort like this could do for our community. There could be huge ramifications that affect not only the fifth ASL, but every Starleague hereafter. This is big boys.
Let us focus on our love for Starcraft, not on our petty hatreds. Let us forget the bullshit semantics and the business politics and realize what our ultimate goal is: To see the fifth ASL underway. That is all that matters, nothing else.
This game has built one of the best communities I have ever been a part of. I fucking love Starcraft and I love watching the best players in the world compete. I know you all feel that love and the strength that flows from it. Let go of your skepticism and start to believe. We can do this!!
This thread is another decent starting point: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/starcraft/topic/20760966718
Sorry for the essay again, but this whole thing has me energized and I cannot stop myself.
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^
#WeWantASL5
#WeLoveASL
#BroodWarForThePeople
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maybe a fake bw-twitter account should post #metoo directed to blizz? :>
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On January 21 2018 12:42 Jealous wrote:
^
#WeWantASL5
#WeLoveASL
#BroodWarForThePeople
These are pretty good, and a great start to a brainstorm. What else we got? Maybe we could start a poll and vote for the more popular ones.
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On January 21 2018 13:22 GunSlinger wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2018 12:42 Jealous wrote:
^
#WeWantASL5
#WeLoveASL
#BroodWarForThePeople These are pretty good, and a great start to a brainstorm. What else we got? Maybe we could start a poll and vote for the more popular ones.
I wonder if we should say Afreeca instead to avoid confusion (a/s/l bby?).
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I wish blizzard would have open sourced BW 1.16.1 and gave it to the fans. This is ridiculous. 
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On January 21 2018 02:59 [AS]Rattus wrote:
does Michael Morhaime use twitter or anything? there is a slight chance, that he has no idea what's going on and would make a change for the better :[
i'm grasping at straws.
good joke. He was the one who announced the end of professional BW and told people to move on.
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ALLEYCAT BLUES50640 Posts
On January 21 2018 16:18 Miragee wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2018 02:59 [AS]Rattus wrote:
does Michael Morhaime use twitter or anything? there is a slight chance, that he has no idea what's going on and would make a change for the better :[
i'm grasping at straws. good joke. He was the one who announced the end of professional BW and told people to move on.
He was also the same guy that Wax tweeted when the SSL7 finals was in jeopardy to resolve the issue.
https://twitter.com/mikemorhaime
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BW is dead.
Afreeca makes money from BW streamers, Blizzard want these money, and they want to get on plus from what they put into the remastered version, thats all. Korean ex-progamers seeing that starcraft remastered is sinking ship and they switched to streaming other games - so now there is not enough money from bw fans to afreeca and afreeca cant fund blizzard for tournament fees. That uncertain environment pushes away any potential sponsors. There is no coming back, even with ASL 5 and ATB started, there is no future for profesional Broodwar. Once sponsors and players lost motivation and interest you cant expect a different outcome.
Although this is my favorite game I will never buy remastered version, i play at iccup and enjoy it very much. Blizzard dont deserve my money. As the only good thing they do for broodwar is to release the classic game which i own legally already.
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Everythin is pretty simple, Bisu went to army and bw is dead now since december. Just wait for his comeback.
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On January 21 2018 22:15 _Animus_ wrote:
BW is dead.
Afreeca makes money from BW streamers, Blizzard want these money, and they want to get on plus from what they put into the remastered version, thats all. Korean ex-progamers seeing that starcraft remastered is sinking ship and they switched to streaming other games - so now there is not enough money from bw fans to afreeca and afreeca cant fund blizzard for tournament fees. That uncertain environment pushes away any potential sponsors. There is no coming back, even with ASL 5 and ATB started, there is no future for profesional Broodwar. Once sponsors and players lost motivation and interest you cant expect a different outcome.
Although this is my favorite game I will never buy remastered version, i play at iccup and enjoy it very much. Blizzard dont deserve my money. As the only good thing they do for broodwar is to release the classic game which i own legally already.
If you are talking about 1.16.1 it should be free to dl on the Blizzard homepage
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On January 21 2018 12:18 Letmelose wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2018 09:46 RCCar wrote:On January 21 2018 08:41 Starlightsun wrote:On January 21 2018 08:28 RCCar wrote:On January 20 2018 06:50 SCC-Faust wrote:On January 20 2018 06:31 Saechiis wrote:On January 20 2018 04:34 RCCar wrote:
Nice meme. Its still business. Just that Afreeca has invested too much into SCBW to back out now. They used to almost exclusively have BW streamers and capitalized on their monopoly. Now, BW is getting less popular in Korea, old progamers are starting to play PUBG, and many of them are simultaneously broadcasting to youtube and twitch, ultimately better optimized platforms. Afreeca tried to regulate the migration, but came under heavy fire and had to give up.
They aren't getting back what they invested into BW, and they are too late to jump on the PUBG progaming train, so they have no choice but to pretend they care about their bw streamers more than twitch or youtube does. One of the ways include ASL, which is why they're keeping it up for now though it is inevitably in the red.
None of the parties involved are emotional entities, though they might try to fool people into thinking they are.
Literally Soo-Gil says nothing of substance in his whole plea,
just "hey, we're the good guys, if only Blizzard will give in, we can have this!"
Vise versa holds true. In my opinion, with all the other greedy stunts he's pulled over the years, Afreeca are probably stubborn about something simple so they can protect their ego, and are resorting to mass rage since Blizzard won't take their shit. I'm quoting this because it seems like one of the more levelheaded non-emotional responses in the thread. These are big companies, it's unlikely morality is a point of discussion aside from technical legality and "do we think this will piss people off to a degree that we're going to lose money over it?" I don't completely understand how this is one of the more levelheaded responses when it is far more leaps than most people in this thread are making on top of just being on the other side of the coin in the blame game. People are just wondering exactly how Blizzard can say they want to see more tournaments come up and flourish with the release of Remastered, and then charge such an incredible licensing fee that the most suitable company to do so isn't even able to. I think that is a legitimate concern and question that people have a right to ask, and is not inflammatory in any way or taking anything out of context. It also seems a lot less gratuitous than claiming the Afreeca CEO is on a burning ship and solely wants cheaper rights to keep his platform afloat. Oh, how malicious. How evil. Please charge them up the ass, cause how dare Afreeca want to survive as a company. OK good posts dudes. I think if you tried to analyze the situation with a calmer head you will realize that the post isn't saying afreeca is evil, just that they never had the community's best interest in mind unlike what many posters are wont to believe here. ngl I've seen this crap over and over again in TL since about 2010, where one good gesture towards the game overshadows every other crap they do. Happened with Sonic, happened with the federation, happening with Soo-gil. It truly isn't that hard of a concept to grasp. Nobody is an angel, that doesn't make them the devil either. Its just business. Four top quality tournaments and a streaming platform for top pros is more than just "one good gesture". I don't presume to speak for the entire community's best interest, but I think a lot of us just want to see BW as an e-sport like it was in the Kespa days. Afreeca has given us a lot in that direction. Activision-Blizzard has not contributed anything to that, and has even actively got in the way. This isn't a symmetrical deal. Streaming platform that actively seeked to ban them for streaming on other platforms hmmm.... Yeah totally great. Only the best interests of the players in mind. Afreeca must only be doing great stuff for the scene. I understand the "I just want a tournament, whoever is stopping it just give in and let it happen ree" mindset, since the time for SCBW is going away quickly, but at the same time, holy crap its getting overemotional and childish with no other research nor information in play. Twitter accounts and hashtags? What is this witch hunt off of one side's word? You do realize that there is clear distinction between attempting monopoly at something, and threatening to end something without plans to replace that content? AfreecaTV may be untrustworthy in a whole lot of senses but the one thing they could be counted on was to be the lone successful host of competitive and casual Brood War after MBC Game got shut down, and Ongamenet abandoned their decade long legacy with tears from the casters and cringe-worthy Starcraft 2 promotion from Mike Morhaime. Sonic, was a criminal, but a criminal who supported Brood War with his illegal earnings. See my drift here? Here you are focusing on who is more unwholesome between the likes of AfreecaTV and Blizzard, when the main point of focus for many is the fact that the survival of competitive Brood War is at risk. If AfreecaTV abandons competitive Brood War, what guarantees do we have of competitive Brood War thriving more than ever after being freed from the shackles of AfreecaTV? Let us suppose that Blizzard is completely in the right once further information gets exposed. Does that change the fact that AfreecaTV is struggling to host competitive Brood War due to Blizzard's policies, and how likely it is for nobody to play the role of AfreecaTV for competitive Brood War should AfreecaTV abandon competitive Brood War rather than comply to Blizzard's demands? What good comes out of Blizzard being in the right, and AfreecaTV being in the wrong, if in the end that means competitive Brood War gets held back? There's nothing more important to me than competitive Brood War being healthy. Unless Blizzard has plans to provide something of substance in place of what they are threatening to remove, they are accountable for what might happen. No amount of pointing fingers towards the flaws of AfreecaTV will change that fact. For all their imperfections, AfreecaTV has been championing Brood War as their premium content for years on end. That, to me, is more important than finding out whether Blizzard is rightful in their actions to stop ASL from taking place. Blizzard can be stopping ASL to find the solution for world peace for all I care. The ends never justify the means if it means the destruction of competitive Brood War. That is the reason for the outrage. Tell me with a straight face that competitive Brood War will never will get hurt by Blizzard, and this has been all a misunderstanding due to lack of relevant information. Please convince me that this is all a part of Blizzard's plan to make competitive Brood War greater than ever. Placate my over-emotional outbursts with factual evidence of how AfreecaTV isn't vital for the continuation of competitive Brood War, and how there is 100% full-proof guarantee of competitive Brood War being safe from harm should this feud between Blizzard and AfreecaTV turn out for the worst. Until then, give me a break with that condescending tone of telling people to stop being emotional over something they truly are concerned over, just because you can afford to move on should the worst happen.
Obviously, people don't want BW leagues to end here, and in their desperation for this game they lash out against Blizzard with no substance.
#Helporstandaside <- does this hashtag seem like a calm, logical manner in which the main point of focus is survival of BW? It looks to me like just another #BlizzardSux hashtag that you see on every single Facebook post they make.
Just as many are stating the shift be towards the game, not the company, but still, there are a substantial amount of people that would like to close their eyes and ears and shout what they want to. I just want those people to know that they aren't necessarily saying the right stuff. I'm looking at the many one liners going "Yeah fuck Blizzard I never liked them." and Touting Afreeca TV as some sort of emotional entity that knows only compassion and love.
As long as we establish the fact that it is not, then we have nothing to argue about. I'll wait until Blizzard gives more of their stance, and you can go join the twitter hashtag crew and march to Anaheim to demonstrate your love and stuff. (actually though that could be cool) Capiche?
Actually, we do, but off topic, so I'll cut it short.
If a criminal funded something with illegal money, no matter how special it is to me, regardless of how many decades I've been in love with it, I cannot accept that money, nor the criminal. Dirty money should not be involved in the scene any longer.
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On January 22 2018 01:55 RCCar wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2018 22:15 _Animus_ wrote:
BW is dead.
Afreeca makes money from BW streamers, Blizzard want these money, and they want to get on plus from what they put into the remastered version, thats all. Korean ex-progamers seeing that starcraft remastered is sinking ship and they switched to streaming other games - so now there is not enough money from bw fans to afreeca and afreeca cant fund blizzard for tournament fees. That uncertain environment pushes away any potential sponsors. There is no coming back, even with ASL 5 and ATB started, there is no future for profesional Broodwar. Once sponsors and players lost motivation and interest you cant expect a different outcome.
Although this is my favorite game I will never buy remastered version, i play at iccup and enjoy it very much. Blizzard dont deserve my money. As the only good thing they do for broodwar is to release the classic game which i own legally already. If you are talking about 1.16.1 it should be free to dl on the Blizzard homepage
if i'm not mistaken, it's not 1.16.1 but the current version, just without MM and HD-Graphics.
You still need a Blizzard Network Account or whatever that launcher is called.
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#Helporstandaside <- does this hashtag seem like a calm, logical manner in which the main point of focus is survival of BW?
yes.
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On January 22 2018 02:01 RCCar wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2018 12:18 Letmelose wrote:On January 21 2018 09:46 RCCar wrote:On January 21 2018 08:41 Starlightsun wrote:On January 21 2018 08:28 RCCar wrote:On January 20 2018 06:50 SCC-Faust wrote:On January 20 2018 06:31 Saechiis wrote:On January 20 2018 04:34 RCCar wrote:
Nice meme. Its still business. Just that Afreeca has invested too much into SCBW to back out now. They used to almost exclusively have BW streamers and capitalized on their monopoly. Now, BW is getting less popular in Korea, old progamers are starting to play PUBG, and many of them are simultaneously broadcasting to youtube and twitch, ultimately better optimized platforms. Afreeca tried to regulate the migration, but came under heavy fire and had to give up.
They aren't getting back what they invested into BW, and they are too late to jump on the PUBG progaming train, so they have no choice but to pretend they care about their bw streamers more than twitch or youtube does. One of the ways include ASL, which is why they're keeping it up for now though it is inevitably in the red.
None of the parties involved are emotional entities, though they might try to fool people into thinking they are.
Literally Soo-Gil says nothing of substance in his whole plea,
just "hey, we're the good guys, if only Blizzard will give in, we can have this!"
Vise versa holds true. In my opinion, with all the other greedy stunts he's pulled over the years, Afreeca are probably stubborn about something simple so they can protect their ego, and are resorting to mass rage since Blizzard won't take their shit. I'm quoting this because it seems like one of the more levelheaded non-emotional responses in the thread. These are big companies, it's unlikely morality is a point of discussion aside from technical legality and "do we think this will piss people off to a degree that we're going to lose money over it?" I don't completely understand how this is one of the more levelheaded responses when it is far more leaps than most people in this thread are making on top of just being on the other side of the coin in the blame game. People are just wondering exactly how Blizzard can say they want to see more tournaments come up and flourish with the release of Remastered, and then charge such an incredible licensing fee that the most suitable company to do so isn't even able to. I think that is a legitimate concern and question that people have a right to ask, and is not inflammatory in any way or taking anything out of context. It also seems a lot less gratuitous than claiming the Afreeca CEO is on a burning ship and solely wants cheaper rights to keep his platform afloat. Oh, how malicious. How evil. Please charge them up the ass, cause how dare Afreeca want to survive as a company. OK good posts dudes. I think if you tried to analyze the situation with a calmer head you will realize that the post isn't saying afreeca is evil, just that they never had the community's best interest in mind unlike what many posters are wont to believe here. ngl I've seen this crap over and over again in TL since about 2010, where one good gesture towards the game overshadows every other crap they do. Happened with Sonic, happened with the federation, happening with Soo-gil. It truly isn't that hard of a concept to grasp. Nobody is an angel, that doesn't make them the devil either. Its just business. Four top quality tournaments and a streaming platform for top pros is more than just "one good gesture". I don't presume to speak for the entire community's best interest, but I think a lot of us just want to see BW as an e-sport like it was in the Kespa days. Afreeca has given us a lot in that direction. Activision-Blizzard has not contributed anything to that, and has even actively got in the way. This isn't a symmetrical deal. Streaming platform that actively seeked to ban them for streaming on other platforms hmmm.... Yeah totally great. Only the best interests of the players in mind. Afreeca must only be doing great stuff for the scene. I understand the "I just want a tournament, whoever is stopping it just give in and let it happen ree" mindset, since the time for SCBW is going away quickly, but at the same time, holy crap its getting overemotional and childish with no other research nor information in play. Twitter accounts and hashtags? What is this witch hunt off of one side's word? You do realize that there is clear distinction between attempting monopoly at something, and threatening to end something without plans to replace that content? AfreecaTV may be untrustworthy in a whole lot of senses but the one thing they could be counted on was to be the lone successful host of competitive and casual Brood War after MBC Game got shut down, and Ongamenet abandoned their decade long legacy with tears from the casters and cringe-worthy Starcraft 2 promotion from Mike Morhaime. Sonic, was a criminal, but a criminal who supported Brood War with his illegal earnings. See my drift here? Here you are focusing on who is more unwholesome between the likes of AfreecaTV and Blizzard, when the main point of focus for many is the fact that the survival of competitive Brood War is at risk. If AfreecaTV abandons competitive Brood War, what guarantees do we have of competitive Brood War thriving more than ever after being freed from the shackles of AfreecaTV? Let us suppose that Blizzard is completely in the right once further information gets exposed. Does that change the fact that AfreecaTV is struggling to host competitive Brood War due to Blizzard's policies, and how likely it is for nobody to play the role of AfreecaTV for competitive Brood War should AfreecaTV abandon competitive Brood War rather than comply to Blizzard's demands? What good comes out of Blizzard being in the right, and AfreecaTV being in the wrong, if in the end that means competitive Brood War gets held back? There's nothing more important to me than competitive Brood War being healthy. Unless Blizzard has plans to provide something of substance in place of what they are threatening to remove, they are accountable for what might happen. No amount of pointing fingers towards the flaws of AfreecaTV will change that fact. For all their imperfections, AfreecaTV has been championing Brood War as their premium content for years on end. That, to me, is more important than finding out whether Blizzard is rightful in their actions to stop ASL from taking place. Blizzard can be stopping ASL to find the solution for world peace for all I care. The ends never justify the means if it means the destruction of competitive Brood War. That is the reason for the outrage. Tell me with a straight face that competitive Brood War will never will get hurt by Blizzard, and this has been all a misunderstanding due to lack of relevant information. Please convince me that this is all a part of Blizzard's plan to make competitive Brood War greater than ever. Placate my over-emotional outbursts with factual evidence of how AfreecaTV isn't vital for the continuation of competitive Brood War, and how there is 100% full-proof guarantee of competitive Brood War being safe from harm should this feud between Blizzard and AfreecaTV turn out for the worst. Until then, give me a break with that condescending tone of telling people to stop being emotional over something they truly are concerned over, just because you can afford to move on should the worst happen. Obviously, people don't want BW leagues to end here, and in their desperation for this game they lash out against Blizzard with no substance. #Helporstandaside <- does this hashtag seem like a calm, logical manner in which the main point of focus is survival of BW? It looks to me like just another #BlizzardSux hashtag that you see on every single Facebook post they make. Just as many are stating the shift be towards the game, not the company, but still, there are a substantial amount of people that would like to close their eyes and ears and shout what they want to. I just want those people to know that they aren't necessarily saying the right stuff. I'm looking at the many one liners going "Yeah fuck Blizzard I never liked them." and Touting Afreeca TV as some sort of emotional entity that knows only compassion and love. As long as we establish the fact that it is not, then we have nothing to argue about. I'll wait until Blizzard gives more of their stance, and you can go join the twitter hashtag crew and march to Anaheim to demonstrate your love and stuff. (actually though that could be cool) Capiche? Actually, we do, but off topic, so I'll cut it short. If a criminal funded something with illegal money, no matter how special it is to me, regardless of how many decades I've been in love with it, I cannot accept that money, nor the criminal. Dirty money should not be involved in the scene any longer.
Throw away your phones immediately. The cobalt that is used in your batteries are likely to mined by those abusing child labour. Abandon everything that you own that has been created through the illegal suffering of others. Zero tolerance versus illegal activities is your code is it not? Do your part to stay true to your own code.
Blind hatred towards Blizzard may not do jack shit. It's not like we have much leverage here, Blizzard have always been the ones with all the power. That has been the case time and time again. What Blizzard has to say over this matter, and how much information they choose to reveal might clarify matters, and that alone might be to your satisfaction.
AfreecaTV have been hosting competitive Brood War just fine before Blizzard came along, and they have time and time again expressed frustrations over how much more difficult it has been to host tournaments due to Blizzard. While the issue of exactly how and why Blizzard's involvement caused this situation may interest you, others are livid over the potential destruction of competitive Brood War. Your fixation over Blizzard's image being unfairly tainted is your own agenda, as is the fury of Brood War fans who do not want competitive Brood War to end. No matter how beautifully Blizzard explains their reasoning for their actions, it does not do me any good at all if all that is done to explain why they had no choice but to end ASL Season 5.
It is your prerogative to taunt people for caring about competitive Brood War more than you do. However, I personally would placate people terrified and devastated over the potential loss of something they care for deeply by showing convincing facts to show why they shouldn't to so worried, or if you have nothing of substance to offer, by just showing some basic empathy and kindness in the face of tremendous hurt and suffering.
Right now you're just being a mean spirited and doing the very thing you're attempting to halt. Some people care for the game, they truly do. I hope nobody is as condescending to you when the thing that you care for has its very existence threatened. It's easy to stay nonchalant when you personally wouldn't be devastated by what could happen. Pointing that fact out to those who would be? Perhaps do it with a little more tact if you have nothing of substance to offer.
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konadora
Singapore66358 Posts
yeah is anyone surprised by this point lol
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EPT
