EPTUS Politics Feedback Thread - Page 312
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KwarK
United States41995 Posts
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GreenHorizons
United States22727 Posts
On May 19 2021 02:52 LegalLord wrote: Is it about time to move the Israel talk into a separate thread? Pages and pages of this discussion on a topic whose relation to US Pol seems tangential at best. The history lesson Kwark provided was certainly helpful for nearly all of us, but my interest was in the US role which I'd think is still a topic for the US politics thread? Like how the US responds to the bombing of the AP offices in Gaza or whatever? | ||
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom9348 Posts
On May 19 2021 05:50 GreenHorizons wrote: The history lesson Kwark provided was certainly helpful for nearly all of us, but my interest was in the US role which I'd think is still a topic for the US politics thread? Like how the US responds to the bombing of the AP offices in Gaza or whatever? The US role is still more appropriate in the Israe/Palestine thread imo. Problem is, any discussion of the subject at all is going to lead to long debates about Israel in general and all the subjects we've just seen. I like the new thread. I can stay out of it instead of getting riled up about the subject. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States22727 Posts
On May 19 2021 05:51 Jockmcplop wrote: The US role is still more appropriate in the Israe/Palestine thread imo. Problem is, any discussion of the subject at all is going to lead to long debates about Israel in general and all the subjects we've just seen. I like the new thread. I can stay out of it instead of getting riled up about the subject. I think the conversation was fine save for JimmiC's posting which is what's been crapping up the thread a lot lately imo. For reference, the discussion started here: https://tl.net/forum/general/532255-us-politics-mega-thread?page=3219 EDIT: Rereading through it MWY wasn't very helpful either. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Broetchenholer
Germany1849 Posts
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Nebuchad
Switzerland11928 Posts
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28560 Posts
Still - it is best to avoid ad hominems. But I'm not gonna insist that you shouldnt be upset or angry - I think you should be both. ☺ | ||
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farvacola
United States18818 Posts
On May 19 2021 21:35 Nebuchad wrote: I think we did fine The point y’all were making came through, for what my reader’s opinion is worth  | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain17852 Posts
And no, I haven't read the thread! | ||
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28560 Posts
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Broetchenholer
Germany1849 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28560 Posts
One thing we can try to keep in mind is - and this is with the goal of hindering 'pile-ons'- which is a real issue, is that.. if others have posted virtually the same thing you intend on posting, you might not have to post it. I get that sometimes a lot of people start their posts within a similar time frame so they might not have seen others' posts before they're done writing their own, so this is kind of a 'this is just the nature of forums'- kind of thing. But sometimes it's actually avoidable, too. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28560 Posts
On May 19 2021 23:22 JimmiC wrote: Of course not, that would be direct. You have not directly said that to anyone. You have left it open ended. But it is clear that many people think I am and when you do that it hits me and others. You also are all about civil conversation and so on, but when Kwark starts talking about promptly fucking my mother you fall silent. Who are the people "solidly on the side of Israel"? And what is their position. I doubt very few people can accurately describe those people positions because instead of using the basic communication model (acknowledge, question, confirm) they use the question piece for attempted gotcha's and they use the confirm to assert a position on the person. There is no mutual understanding so it is people talking beside each other and mostly insulting. It is disturbing how many of you consider yourselves and how proud many of you are at how you are bullying someone online. Well, I'll clarify once and for all. I'm more aligned with you politically than I am with any of the guys you accuse of bullying you, other than I guess myself. GH is revolutionary, I'm not. Neb kinda, too, and he's certainly less about reconciliation and getting together than I am. I'm pretty certain Kwark voted conservatory in the UK - I've voted left of Corbyn every election of my life. It very rarely happens that I read a post of yours and think 'that's a stupid political opinion'. My issues with you are 100% related to how you post, not what you think, and it's the same issue that repeats itself over and over and over, including in this very exchange we're having right now. You make assumptions about what other people think and then you write long posts based on those assumptions and even if confronted on those assumptions being wrong, you double down, insisting that your assumption was the right one even if you get corrected. Further, you're completely incapable of letting stuff go. I'm an English teacher and I don't want to wrongly use literally, but I think literally every time you've directed a post towards GH in the past.. year? longer?, it's been some kind of stupid, misplaced stab where you want him to criticize China or Venezuela instead of the US. This is why I think it's absolutely laughable to see you complain about Kwark taking your posts out of context and targeting you with 'gotcha' posts, because from my perspective, you are the single poster on the forum most guilty of doing just that. At least out of the 1000 or so posters whose posting habits I have any impression of, anyway. (I actually just checked. In the USPol megathread, you've mentioned Maduro 162 times and Venezuela 255 times and an actual majority of these are attempts at needling GH.) It has made me not want to discuss with you - and this generally makes me avoid responding to you. It's also generally not very interesting to discuss with you, because in terms of political opinion, I hardly ever find myself disagreeing in any meaningful way. This is direct feedback that I give to you because you in the very post I am responding to are essentially accusing me of being indirect in my communication. But no, I can also confirm that when I wrote 'amusingly even the guys solidly on the side of Israel don't support the settlements', then I did not even remotely have you in mind. | ||
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Broetchenholer
Germany1849 Posts
On May 19 2021 23:34 JimmiC wrote: Agreed Broetchenholer, that you are even asking is amazing. Most of the people are so self-righteous, that they would never even consider if they are wrong, or misinterpreted anyone, instead they assume the persons clarification is a lie and continue down their original path. I challenge anyone here who has been piling on Magicpowers to write out his position, that he would agree is his position. If you can't, you don't understand his position. Unlike many people he has not dodged, and he has tried to defend against the accusations. I can't do it, I'm confused on what it is because the whole convo for days now is him saying something and someone else saying he means "x". You mean, what i believe his stance is [b]and[/] what he would agree with what his stance is? That's really tough. I think he believes his stance is that it is complicated, that both sides are shitty but that Israel has no choice but to be shitty. Here is where we started to discuss with him, because that no choice option seemed not logical to us. As to the part about Dresden i think he just messed up. I think he did not know exactly what we meant with Dresden, tried to argue against bombings of Germany in general and when he realized what we actually meant, backpedaled. But i can't say. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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GreenHorizons
United States22727 Posts
On May 19 2021 23:53 Liquid`Drone wrote: + Show Spoiler + Well, I'll clarify once and for all. I'm more aligned with you politically than I am with any of the guys you accuse of bullying you, other than I guess myself. GH is revolutionary, I'm not. Neb kinda, too, and he's certainly less about reconciliation and getting together than I am. I'm pretty certain Kwark voted conservatory in the UK - I've voted left of Corbyn every election of my life. It very rarely happens that I read a post of yours and think 'that's a stupid political opinion'. My issues with you are 100% related to how you post, not what you think, and it's the same issue that repeats itself over and over and over, including in this very exchange we're having right now. You make assumptions about what other people think and then you write long posts based on those assumptions and even if confronted on those assumptions being wrong, you double down, insisting that your assumption was the right one even if you get corrected. Further, you're completely incapable of letting stuff go. I'm an English teacher and I don't want to wrongly use literally, but I think literally every time you've directed a post towards GH in the past.. year? longer?, it's been some kind of stupid, misplaced stab where you want him to criticize China or Venezuela instead of the US. This is why I think it's absolutely laughable to see you complain about Kwark taking your posts out of context and targeting you with 'gotcha' posts, because from my perspective, you are the single poster on the forum most guilty of doing just that. At least out of the 1000 or so posters whose posting habits I have any impression of, anyway. (I actually just checked. In the USPol megathread, you've mentioned Maduro 162 times and Venezuela 255 times and an actual majority of these are attempts at needling GH.) + Show Spoiler + It has made me not want to discuss with you - and this generally makes me avoid responding to you. It's also generally not very interesting to discuss with you, because in terms of political opinion, I hardly ever find myself disagreeing in any meaningful way. This is direct feedback that I give to you because you in the very post I am responding to are essentially accusing me of being indirect in my communication. But no, I can also confirm that when I wrote 'amusingly even the guys solidly on the side of Israel don't support the settlements', then I did not even remotely have you in mind. I knew it was a lot (too many imo) but damn. | ||
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