US Politics Feedback Thread - Page 310
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Gorsameth
Netherlands20757 Posts
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Seeker
Where dat snitch at?36665 Posts
On October 28 2020 13:39 Karis Vas Ryaar wrote: I'd guess people who used to be into starcraft but have moved on from that part of it but still keep up with people in the politics thread for reasons that vary. I almost exclusively post in the abl thread these days although I still follow starcraft. regarding the US thread I used to post in it and it really seemed more and more like it turned into the same people arguing amongst themselves which I became less interested in participating in. which is kind of like the LOL off topic/lounge thread I was into for a while before it moved to discord which I don't really use ever. I'm not sure what locking the thread would accomplish if you leave the other political threads open cause some of the conversation might just migrate over there. anyway I no longer participate in it so I guess my personal feelings are kinda irrelevant lol. We wouldn’t just lock the thread. We would ban politics altogether. So that would mean closing down the USPMT and all other political threads. | ||
tofucake
Hyrule18773 Posts
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micronesia
United States24342 Posts
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Starlightsun
United States1405 Posts
On October 28 2020 22:33 micronesia wrote: It's like State legalization of marijuana. Yeah. But instead of getting chilled and relaxed we get angry and pedantic instead. | ||
Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
Danglars, I'm sorry but I think that you need to take a break from the USPMT. I agree with other people talking about how you refuse to argue in good faith. You can't seem to ever admit the other side is right regardless of how much evidence gets provided to you. It's been an ongoing pattern for a while now, and at some point, we have to step in and say that enough is enough. Republicans filing cases in court and Danglars explaining why they're doing it isn't "right and wrong." No clue what the mods are thinking here. | ||
JimmiC
Canada22814 Posts
On November 02 2020 09:50 Blitzkrieg0 wrote: Republicans filing cases in court and Danglars explaining why they're doing it isn't "right and wrong." No clue what the mods are thinking here. I disagree. When it comes to trying to get rid of 100,000 votes purely because you think most are for the other guy is awful and wrong. Many Republicans are coming out to say the same. And Danglars is particularly bad for sometimes swapping his logic mid conversation or flat out making stuff up. But I also think when people make offensive claims with out backing it up about "western media" misrepresenting Chinas treatment of the Uighurs. Who or which side the claims come from should not matter. | ||
Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
On November 02 2020 10:03 JimmiC wrote: I disagree. When it comes to trying to get rid of 100,000 votes purely because you think most are for the other guy is awful and wrong. Many Republicans are coming out to say the same. And Danglars is particularly bad for sometimes swapping his logic mid conversation or flat out making stuff up. But I also think when people make offensive claims with out backing it up about "western media" misrepresenting Chinas treatment of the Uighurs. Who or which side the claims come from should not matter. The only bad thing here is mis-reading of Danglar's point. If you follow the conversation he pointed out times in the past that court filings have been made purely to count in favor (Bush v Gore 2000, Clinton 2016). Get out of your echo chamber and understand the argument. This goes back to a larger point he makes all the time. Stop seeing doom and gloom in everything. The Republican Supreme Court of Texas refused to throw out the votes. TLDR: This happens all the time. Have more faith in the government because they ruled exactly like you wanted. | ||
Nebuchad
Switzerland11353 Posts
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KwarK
United States40776 Posts
On November 02 2020 14:46 Nebuchad wrote: It's a bit of bad timing for Danglars to get banned, if Trump loses it would have been fun to watch him explain why Trump is right not to leave power. Presumably the first reason would be “it’s not January for another two months”. | ||
Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain17186 Posts
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom8727 Posts
On November 02 2020 21:22 Dangermousecatdog wrote: GH and Nebuchad are apologists for the beheadings of the Islamic terrorist attacks in France. No they aren't, and that you would read what they wrote that way says more about you than it does them. | ||
Jealous
9974 Posts
EDIT: For clarity, I don't see the colonialism argument as being an excuse for the actions, more of an explanation and more interesting discussion topic as a whole, especially as opposed to "beheading bad, Muslims also bad?" I don't see GH saying the French people /deserved/ this string of attacks. | ||
JimmiC
Canada22814 Posts
My issue is with the continued breaking of the threads rules about not treating presumptions as facts and showing. He now numerous times has called the absolute travesty happening in Uighur as a western media problem. This is a half step from holocaust denial since it is proven what is happening their and what is happening is absolutely horrible. The problem with zealously, which is the same issue Doodsmack had, is that "their truth" is not grounded in actual facts of what is happening, but rather based on some internal black and whites they have for themselves. It does not allow GH to understand that just because it is bad information about China coming from the west does not make it untrue. People who don't like mod decisions, especially from the right, get ticked off because they see someone consistently breaking the rules and being celebrated by some mods as a different voice (which would be fine if he followed the rules, especially 1,2 and 4) and then when people on the right do it, some linking more "sources" than GH there is consequences. For the most part the Moderation is great, there just is a blind spot with GH where he constantly breaks rules 1,2 and 4 then people get mad and for some reason some of the Mods think GH is the victim rather than the cause. When he says this far off base crap, that is all presumption he should have to back it up, or he simply should not say it. If he continues to be unable to stop himself than he should be actioned like others. The shit disturbing style posts like the early ones on the violence in France are certainly not helpful and just add to his long history of creating drama. But it is the Uighur denial posts (and this holds true to anything horrible that "socialist" by his definition country do) are what is dangerous. Because people think he has some source or knowledge and end up believing it, or thinking it might be true. When it is just pulled from his head since he never produces any back up, or the source is so terrible he knows it would not hold up. The same things he did when Maduro killed indigenous (those food containers might have had guns, totally justify shooting unarmed people in the back) and countless other examples. Make GH follow the rules as well would be the easiest, but if that is not the choice then don't have those rules and then it will at least be "fair". | ||
Jealous
9974 Posts
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
Eh, it wasn't JUST that argument. A bunch of small bad faith arguments have been piling up, basically. The other ones he mostly just ignored any evidence presented from the other side or tweaked his argument slightly so he could ignore them. That one was a massive doozy, though. Comparing a bonkers, unprecedented request to invalidate 100-130k legitimately cast ballots to two recount requests doesn't really make any sense (especially when one was accepted as valid and the other was thrown out and both resulted in no change). Why was the comparison so ridiculous? Recounts change the final margin by, on average, 40 votes. That request was the equivalent of 2,500 average recounts! It's more than a few orders of magnitude different. (The largest margin change ever was by 1,020 points, and almost no others come close to that) https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/a-recount-is-unlikely-to-change-the-north-carolina-governors-race/ Recounts happen in every democracy. Attempt to throw out >100k votes that your party approved of, just because you're afraid of how they voted, is something that only happens in banana republics. Regarding GH: this isn't the EU politics feedback thread, is it? I've not seen any Uighur discussion in the US pol thread in months (I don't participate in EU because I know nothing about the EU's politics). | ||
Liquid`Drone
Norway28263 Posts
Danglars was banned for a week. That stuff happens. GH has served several temp bans. His 'friends in high places' successfully petitioned for a permban to be turned into a 1 month ban. | ||
JimmiC
Canada22814 Posts
On November 03 2020 00:02 Jealous wrote: Jimmi, can you link some of those posts in particular? I believe it would help paint the picture better. The one I am referencing specifically is this: On October 30 2020 10:11 GreenHorizons wrote: I obviously disagree with the portrayal in western media of China's handling of religious extremism and separatism/regional conflict regarding Uighurs in Xinjiang and don't think it's appropriate to hash that out here. I also consider it naked whataboutism. While I understand the inclination to blame cartoons or freedom (or whatever Macron said), 'surface level' is being overly gracious in description of such an observation imo. With the lame excuse for not getting into it, when the reality is there is nothing to get into because he has made it up. And making up that the absolutely horrible and criminal acts happening the the Uighurs is too much. On August 28 2020 00:34 GreenHorizons wrote: When people use the "Million Uyghurs put in concentration camp" I always wonder whether it's supposed to be the same million from a couple years ago or those ones are all dead in some mass graves somewhere and it's a new million or what? I also wonder if people have seen a US prison (or the rubble where some Palestinian's home used to be) lately when they look at the conditions afforded Uyghurs in so called concentration camps facilitating genocide. But the biggest red flag has got to be how invested the right wing is in selling the idea that they give a damn about Muslims, let alone Muslims that aren't even US citizens or able to act as a vassal oil/resource regime. He even so much says it. Since the "right wing" to him means everyone except China/USSR and so on. Or it comes off as such since the entire free world knows that what China is doing is horribly wrong. And it is not just the Uighurs, anything bad about Dems are true (see his responses on Tara Reade and the dems electing a rapist, or on all the hunter stuff) and all the information bad about his preferred type of socialism is false. Otherwise it is just how he posts on most topics you can just randomly click on his posts and many of them will turn up as rule breakers. On October 13 2020 09:42 GreenHorizons wrote: Democrats are like the town in the Boy Who Cried Wolf except the boy has grown to be a congress of septuagenarian man-children who they still go running toward every time they cry wolf (or "compromise"). At some point you have to wonder what the hell is wrong with that town. On October 16 2020 03:02 GreenHorizons wrote: Hunter's issue is that it is run of the mill nepotistic influence selling. How much influence is bought with pseudo jobs like his is more tertiary to me than whether or not he took a job like that. Also if Hunter was Black and not Biden's son he'd have had him locked up long ago. On October 28 2020 04:37 GreenHorizons wrote: It was worse really + Show Spoiler + Jair Bolsonaro, who was elected President of Brazil on promises to end crime, right the economy, and “make Brazil great,” has spent his career gleefully offending women, black people, environmentalists, and gays. “I would be incapable of loving a homosexual son,” he has said. “I would prefer that my son die in an accident than show up with some guy with a mustache.” As a national legislator, he declared one political rival, Maria do Rosário, “not worth raping.” Immigrants are “scum.” The United Nations is “a bunch of communists.” He supports the torture of drug dealers, the use of firing squads, and the empowerment of a hyper-aggressive police force. “A policeman who doesn’t kill,” he has said, “isn’t a policeman.” www.newyorker.com There's also constant US interference in South American elections/politics in support of right wing demagogues. It is not hard to find. I've been responding in the thread to the more egregious ones and asking for him to follow the rules and explain, but he never does. And no that is not because he is ignoring me, since there are plenty of other topics he engages in. It is just that unlike posters from the right he given latitude to just throw out what he calls "presumptions" and the rest of people call BS. When someone like doodsmack does it every mod has a problem with it. When GH does it certain Mods think it is OK. If the rules were enforced more equally I don't think people would have as many complaints. TLDR: I'm fine with the Danglars ban (especially given that he loves the Drama and does a ton of reporting himself, live by the sword die by it). I just think that if others are only going to live by "their truth" and won't argue in good faith than they also deserve it. I don't think Neb deserves a ban or close too. He actually has the knowledge and takes the time to give an actual perspective on GH's posts. If GH posted like that I would have no problem with him. Neb also does not plainly disregard facts simply because they are "bad for his side". While he does treat some situations a little good vs evil, he does it within the rules of the threads with proper backing and full explanations of his posts. When he is not super angry he is one of the best posters on TL and shouldn't be dragged in with GH just because they have some similar politics. Basically Neb is a Socialist, and GH is zealot communist. | ||
Nebuchad
Switzerland11353 Posts
On November 02 2020 14:53 KwarK wrote: Presumably the first reason would be “it’s not January for another two months”. Fair enough, he'll have to say whether he accepts the results or not pretty soon tho, correct? For the rest, keep me out of this bs please. | ||
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