EPTi generally have like 90%+ zvp there going through ladders and only like 60% pvz t.t
Rant on HBR. - Page 2
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28484 Posts
i generally have like 90%+ zvp there going through ladders and only like 60% pvz t.t | ||
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Raptor[eigen].
Canada18 Posts
If your not busy at the moment, can we play a pvz game on hbr now Drone? Show me how you play has zerg to win on hbr. ~_~ | ||
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Iplaythings
Denmark9110 Posts
Easy third hard fourth seems favorable to me. Only thing that I can think off is that 2 favors sorrounds and backstaps | ||
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
On December 06 2009 07:24 Iplaythings wrote: ok, we all know it supposed to be Z>P but what DOES make it zerg favored?? Easy third hard fourth seems favorable to me. Only thing that I can think off is that 2 favors sorrounds and backstaps It's easy for the Zerg to deny the Protoss the third, and it's hard for the Protoss to break the Zerg's third. Once the Protoss takes the third it gets hard for the Zerg though. | ||
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Oystein
Norway1602 Posts
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Racenilatr
United States2756 Posts
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Severedevil
United States4820 Posts
On December 06 2009 06:55 iamtt1 wrote: contain is useless on hbr because p has easy access to the 2nd exp Uh... I definitely saw lurker contains on HBR in pro matches, succeeding against the world's best Protoss players. The second expo should be easy to block because Protoss has to move through a tiny little choke to reach it. | ||
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TT1
Canada9968 Posts
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asl-ninja
78 Posts
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floor exercise
Canada5847 Posts
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asl-ninja
78 Posts
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lazz
Australia3119 Posts
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Raptor[eigen].
Canada18 Posts
On December 06 2009 07:30 Oystein wrote: HBR is highly Zerg favored. You get 5 bases from defending 2 spots and one of them being a ridge that is a bitch for P to break, also the 2 points you have to defend are close by so you can always move troops fast to the other spot if P decides to attack the other place. Also Drops are insanely strong on this map since P have to move big distances to protect his main or 5th. In general its heaven for a defensive macro oriented Zerg style of play. 2 big spots, which I meantioned previously. One spot that has two entrances, threw the middle and the side. One of those zerg expansons beside the protoss main. 2 huge spots. Protoss is the aggressor, and uses this very concept to his advantage on this map in mid/late game in my experiences and the vods i have seen. I'm not saying your right im wrong or vice virsa. I'm saying show me how. Show me in a demonstration game on iccup by playing me zvp, or finding a different zerg to play, or a vod of a zvp that does not have zerg getting an advantage in the first 8 minutes. Followed by winning in that way in the mid/late game on hbr. | ||
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TT1
Canada9968 Posts
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Oystein
Norway1602 Posts
On December 06 2009 07:45 Raptor[eigen]. wrote: 2 big spots, which I meantioned previously. One spot that has two entrances, threw the middle and the side. One of those zerg expansons beside the protoss main. 2 huge spots. Protoss is the aggressor, and uses this very concept to his advantage on this map in mid/late game in my experiences and the vods i have seen. I'm not saying your right im wrong or vice virsa. I'm saying show me how. Show me in a demonstration game on iccup by playing me zvp, or finding a different zerg to play, or a vod of a zvp that does not have zerg getting an advantage in the first 8 minutes. Followed by winning in that way in the mid/late game on hbr. They are not huge and the one spot you have a ridge helping you tremendously, also that small choke they have to attack through also helps you since they can`t really engage with more than a few units at a time unless they just run in and take tons of lurker damage before attacking. The spot outside your natural you can easily help fortify with adding a few sunks\spores there since you will have creep from your natural there anyway. If you want an example of defensive macro play there go watch Zero vs Bisu (the queen game, watch how easily he defends Bisus attempts to break any of those spots). Also there is Zero vs Pure if I remember correctly, where he just demolishes Pure with the same kind of defensive macro play that is perfectly suited for this map. | ||
Chill
Calgary25951 Posts
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NeO)PhOeNiX
Canada250 Posts
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Raptor[eigen].
Canada18 Posts
On December 06 2009 08:02 Oystein wrote: They are not huge and the one spot you have a ridge helping you tremendously, also that small choke they have to attack through also helps you since they can`t really engage with more than a few units at a time unless they just run in and take tons of lurker damage before attacking. The spot outside your natural you can easily help fortify with adding a few sunks\spores there since you will have creep from your natural there anyway. If you want an example of defensive macro play there go watch Zero vs Bisu (the queen game, watch how easily he defends Bisus attempts to break any of those spots). Also there is Zero vs Pure if I remember correctly, where he just demolishes Pure with the same kind of defensive macro play that is perfectly suited for this map. Well I just finished watching zero vs bisu. Easily is a strong word, perhaps a little too strong for this game. But anyways, this was a good demonstration, I really enjoyed this vod. Killing off those temps before he got to use any of them at the most important moment except for 1 templar really helped A LOT. That's something I will note! =] | ||
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iamho
United States3345 Posts
On December 06 2009 08:02 Oystein wrote: They are not huge and the one spot you have a ridge helping you tremendously, also that small choke they have to attack through also helps you since they can`t really engage with more than a few units at a time unless they just run in and take tons of lurker damage before attacking. The spot outside your natural you can easily help fortify with adding a few sunks\spores there since you will have creep from your natural there anyway. If you want an example of defensive macro play there go watch Zero vs Bisu (the queen game, watch how easily he defends Bisus attempts to break any of those spots). Also there is Zero vs Pure if I remember correctly, where he just demolishes Pure with the same kind of defensive macro play that is perfectly suited for this map. hbr zvp is not good for defensive macro play, yeah you can defend 4 gas with 3 chokes but on most 3/4 player maps you can defend it with 2. hbr is mainly just good for aggressive contains with lurkers/hydras since you need map control to expand. | ||
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Raptor[eigen].
Canada18 Posts
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