Rant on HBR. - Page 4

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Epicfailguy

Norway893 Posts

December 06 2009 15:19 GMT

#61

ZvP feels really easy on HBR if you ask me, I just lurker contain and autowin.

Mortality

United States4790 Posts

December 07 2009 00:17 GMT

#62

On December 06 2009 11:31 Oystein wrote:

Show nested quote +

On December 06 2009 10:48 iamho wrote:

On December 06 2009 09:02 Oystein wrote:

On December 06 2009 08:28 iamho wrote:

On December 06 2009 08:02 Oystein wrote:

On December 06 2009 07:45 Raptor[eigen]. wrote:

On December 06 2009 07:30 Oystein wrote:
HBR is highly Zerg favored. You get 5 bases from defending 2 spots and one of them being a ridge that is a bitch for P to break, also the 2 points you have to defend are close by so you can always move troops fast to the other spot if P decides to attack the other place. Also Drops are insanely strong on this map since P have to move big distances to protect his main or 5th. In general its heaven for a defensive macro oriented Zerg style of play.

2 big spots, which I meantioned previously. One spot that has two entrances, threw the middle and the side. One of those zerg expansons beside the protoss main. 2 huge spots. Protoss is the aggressor, and uses this very concept to his advantage on this map in mid/late game in my experiences and the vods i have seen. I'm not saying your right im wrong or vice virsa. I'm saying show me how. Show me in a demonstration game on iccup by playing me zvp, or finding a different zerg to play, or a vod of a zvp that does not have zerg getting an advantage in the first 8 minutes. Followed by winning in that way in the mid/late game on hbr.

They are not huge and the one spot you have a ridge helping you tremendously, also that small choke they have to attack through also helps you since they can`t really engage with more than a few units at a time unless they just run in and take tons of lurker damage before attacking. The spot outside your natural you can easily help fortify with adding a few sunks\spores there since you will have creep from your natural there anyway.

If you want an example of defensive macro play there go watch Zero vs Bisu (the queen game, watch how easily he defends Bisus attempts to break any of those spots). Also there is Zero vs Pure if I remember correctly, where he just demolishes Pure with the same kind of defensive macro play that is perfectly suited for this map.

hbr zvp is not good for defensive macro play, yeah you can defend 4 gas with 3 chokes but on most 3/4 player maps you can defend it with 2. hbr is mainly just good for aggressive contains with lurkers/hydras since you need map control to expand.

lol you are clueless, its perfectly suited for defensive macro play (and by defensive I mean take your 4th as soon as you gain map control and then start defending, and you will get some form of map control regardless with what you open with be it mutas, lurkers, hydras etc unless you take some serious damage early on). Its not 3 places you need to defend (unless you are talking about the new one witch nobody plays yet) its 2 spots the ridge covers both entrances to that spot and you can defend 5 bases with 4 gases from 2 spots that is HUGE. You will get early map control pretty much regardless what you open up with, and once you take the expos you start making mass lurkers to hold the 2 spots while you wait for 5base eco to kick in and roll them with ultra\ling\defiler and abuse drops and your greater mobility. If they can`t break any of your 2 choke points within the time you get ultra you should pretty much never lose on hbr.

r u for rela? you can pretty much defend 4 gas on every map with 2 choke points

if you let the zerg play both defensively and have map control at the same time then the problem is you, not the imbalance

Getting 5 bases on 2 choke points with one of them being at a high ground advantage is NOT common lol. Only kind of maps that happens are at special ones like Blue Storm or Andromeda, on normal map you can get 4 bases from 2 chokes but you never get a high ground advantage and a min only on the trade. If you fail to comprehend how big advantage having high ground is in BW I guess there is no sense discussing with you anymore.

It should be added that the two points you're talking about aren't that far apart either, making it easy to simply pick up and move lukers to the right spot for defense. I also find it a really good map for Zerg drops, but not particularly good for Protoss drops. Protoss harrassment options are more limited imo.

Ilikestarcraft

Korea (South)17733 Posts

December 07 2009 00:24 GMT

#63

On December 06 2009 13:24 Sadistx wrote:
Now, we've seen all 3 races whine about HBR...

haha balanced for no race

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