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On July 11 2024 01:30 Fleetfeet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 10 2024 19:37 Magic Powers wrote:On July 10 2024 17:15 WombaT wrote:On July 10 2024 14:25 Introvert wrote:
I seem to recall some dust up over "Brandon" but don't quite remember.
KwarK is an ass and sometimes you have to wonder if he didn't have the hammer would he have been actioned into oblivion by now... but at the same time, so what? You can be snide back. While not my skillset, I've done it (though sometimes I edit those parts out later when I'm less annoyed). I don't know the last time I saw someone actioned for replying to him in kind, and I assume this is not just good luck (feel free to provide receipts). He's not one to keep a conversation going if someone else stops replying, like some people we've seen, though he doesn't forget either.
I think it's fair to ask if he was some other user with his behavior if he would still be here. But bitching about his posting is odd, idk how a thread full of so many people here for so many years still has people complaining instead of ignoring. Maybe I've just never received a level 10 KwarK attack.
I say all this as someone who finds his style grating and counter-productive to civilized discussion (in that sense he will be about as useful in changing hearts and minds as GH is, though somehow I don't think that's his goal). Aye disengaging is a valid and infrequently used option, so I agree there. You end up in a scenario where someone with mod status is embroiled in a consistent back-and-forth, and neither participant gets actioned, as you pointed out. In isolation this is pretty equitable, the mod isn’t shown any kind of favourable treatment in these interactions. But versus other interactions, it’s not an equitable approach. Two regular Joes and Janes bickering will get told to take it PM, warned or temped if it takes over a thread. Happened to myself, JimmyC and one other iirc over in the Palestine thread, and I thought it was a deserved time on the naughty step for all involved. So in that sense it’s something of a parallel approach, not one I’m a massive fan of purely on a basis of consistency. Hell the ‘Hm can we have less bickering?’ feedback posting has now seen a migration of said bickering There were several instances in recent times where, if KwarK wasn't a mod, both he and I would've gotten banned or at the very least received a warning for our behavior. That would be the preferable scenario. I'm very happy to know that I get banned when I cross a line. I want the same thing to be true for everyone who engages in discussion, including KwarK. If we both got banned because of our heated exchanges, that would be a massive improvement. The times that I got banned, it was always either justified or at the very least I had little reason to complain. Most importantly, people getting banned always results in a more productive and less toxic general atmosphere in the forum. It's a good thing that people get banned. The fact that KwarK can't get banned drags everyone else down. In every discussion he's involved, if he dislikes someone strongly enough that he finds himself going to town with them instead of engaging with their argumentation, he will start his usual routine (ad hominems, strawmen, snappy one-liners, etc.) If his target has enough and returns the favor, he'll attack them personally. This doesn't result in a ban (due to obvious hypocrisy if it did), but it is toxic and abusive. As a side effect is also destroys every chance at a productive, meaningful discussion about the topic, because only KwarK-approved people get to laugh at the toxic exchange from the sidelines. No one who disagrees with KwarK gets to argue in peace. And KwarK doesn't realize that this is entirely his doing. He doesn't even realize there's a problem because he can't face consequences. And since this has been going on for years, he now thinks this is normal. When someone points out his toxic and abusive behavior, he acts surprised (perhaps because he is actually surprised after years of normalization). He's a perfect example of someone who's gotten so used to his privileges that he doesn't even notice them anymore. When he says he'd be fine not having mod powers, I don't believe a word. That's literally what he accuses GH of all the time when he says he's not a real revolutionist. I don't believe KwarK when he says he can handle being stripped of his privileges. I think it's 100% a bluff. Do you recognize what intro, BJ etc are saying about being allowed to crack back at KwarK with equal strength, though? If KwarK starts going at you about something, "Oh, Fuck off KwarK" is a legitimate and complete response post (I think?) that would not be legitimate against virtually any other poster on the site. You don't have to engage, and if you do engage you certainly don't have to be as kind about it as you are with other posters. Those are the consequences that KwarK faces, and I'm pretty sure he's okay with them. The discussion we have is whether or not that's just bad for TL in general, and whether or not any of us care enough to ask for change. I don't think it's a bluff btw. I don't think it would change much. I think KwarK not being a mod would change peoples perceptions in interacting with him, but I don't think it would result in him being banned often or anything.
Is the idea that KwarK's behavior is excusable because retaliation doesn't result in bans or warnings?
I can't relate to that idea. I think rules are rules and everyone has to follow them, including the mods. If mods can break the rules at will, what are the rules for? Isn't the point to prevent toxicity and abusive behavior?
If mods are allowed to initiate toxicity and abuse, then the rules are pointless. Rules would then only exist to serve the mods, not the forum users. That leads to a breakdown of the forum culture.
And I'll even admit that one of the reasons why I've retaliated against him (besides it being an expression of frustration) is because I wanted to know if there's a double standard. You're right that there is no double standard, retaliation is apparently allowed. But is that good? No, I think it's terrible. I don't see why that would be good. It's much better if no one, including mods, has the right to break the rules. Especially not in such a deliberate fashion as KwarK does.
Also, I disagree that KwarK wouldn't get banned for this if he wasn't a mod. I remember several ban waves of long sitting forum users just because they (including myself one time) weren't willing to calm down and stop fighting. KwarK's behavior is of that very same nature and sometimes even worse. He would get banned for sure. And he would also receive plenty of warnings.
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United States24493 Posts
Unfortunately the Supreme Court of the United States has ruled that Kwark has immunity for all official acts, which include all posts on TL.
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I redirect all my hatred to micronesia.
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On July 04 2024 00:35 ChristianS wrote:
I do think it might be fun for us all to take a break and just criticize Kwark for a while. Really lay into him, make a day of it. Blow off some steam
I was joking about this for the record
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On July 11 2024 14:52 ChristianS wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2024 00:35 ChristianS wrote:
I do think it might be fun for us all to take a break and just criticize Kwark for a while. Really lay into him, make a day of it. Blow off some steam I was joking about this for the record
With great power comes great responsibility
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On July 11 2024 14:52 ChristianS wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2024 00:35 ChristianS wrote:
I do think it might be fun for us all to take a break and just criticize Kwark for a while. Really lay into him, make a day of it. Blow off some steam I was joking about this for the record
Well that's egg on MY face.
Sheesh.
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Regarding Kwark, I rather enjoy his no nonsense attitude and brash style, more often than not it feels refreshing and honest. Given the fact, as pointed out, that he doesnt ban people for responding in kind, I dont see much problem. End of the day, it is ones choice to engage with Kwark or not.
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On July 12 2024 18:02 Razyda wrote:
Regarding Kwark, I rather enjoy his no nonsense attitude and brash style, more often than not it feels refreshing and honest. Given the fact, as pointed out, that he doesnt ban people for responding in kind, I dont see much problem. End of the day, it is ones choice to engage with Kwark or not.
If only KwarK took his no nonsense attitude and applied it equally to everyone. For some reason he excludes himself from it.
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United States41641 Posts
On July 12 2024 18:29 Magic Powers wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2024 18:02 Razyda wrote:
Regarding Kwark, I rather enjoy his no nonsense attitude and brash style, more often than not it feels refreshing and honest. Given the fact, as pointed out, that he doesnt ban people for responding in kind, I dont see much problem. End of the day, it is ones choice to engage with Kwark or not. If only KwarK took his no nonsense attitude and applied it equally to everyone. For some reason he excludes himself from it.
Weren’t you going to quit this website?
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On July 13 2024 06:05 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2024 18:29 Magic Powers wrote:On July 12 2024 18:02 Razyda wrote:
Regarding Kwark, I rather enjoy his no nonsense attitude and brash style, more often than not it feels refreshing and honest. Given the fact, as pointed out, that he doesnt ban people for responding in kind, I dont see much problem. End of the day, it is ones choice to engage with Kwark or not. If only KwarK took his no nonsense attitude and applied it equally to everyone. For some reason he excludes himself from it. Weren’t you going to quit this website?
As I said, do this shit one more time and I'm gone. I fully expect you to not be able to help yourself. You have no self-control.
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United States41641 Posts
On July 13 2024 20:20 Magic Powers wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2024 06:05 KwarK wrote:On July 12 2024 18:29 Magic Powers wrote:On July 12 2024 18:02 Razyda wrote:
Regarding Kwark, I rather enjoy his no nonsense attitude and brash style, more often than not it feels refreshing and honest. Given the fact, as pointed out, that he doesnt ban people for responding in kind, I dont see much problem. End of the day, it is ones choice to engage with Kwark or not. If only KwarK took his no nonsense attitude and applied it equally to everyone. For some reason he excludes himself from it. Weren’t you going to quit this website? As I said, do this shit one more time and I'm gone. I fully expect you to not be able to help yourself. You have no self-control.
Probably best that you just go now then?
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On July 13 2024 23:39 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2024 20:20 Magic Powers wrote:On July 13 2024 06:05 KwarK wrote:On July 12 2024 18:29 Magic Powers wrote:On July 12 2024 18:02 Razyda wrote:
Regarding Kwark, I rather enjoy his no nonsense attitude and brash style, more often than not it feels refreshing and honest. Given the fact, as pointed out, that he doesnt ban people for responding in kind, I dont see much problem. End of the day, it is ones choice to engage with Kwark or not. If only KwarK took his no nonsense attitude and applied it equally to everyone. For some reason he excludes himself from it. Weren’t you going to quit this website? As I said, do this shit one more time and I'm gone. I fully expect you to not be able to help yourself. You have no self-control. Probably best that you just go now then?
Have you accused me of being a Nazi since yesterday?
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United States41641 Posts
On July 14 2024 00:05 Magic Powers wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2024 23:39 KwarK wrote:On July 13 2024 20:20 Magic Powers wrote:On July 13 2024 06:05 KwarK wrote:On July 12 2024 18:29 Magic Powers wrote:On July 12 2024 18:02 Razyda wrote:
Regarding Kwark, I rather enjoy his no nonsense attitude and brash style, more often than not it feels refreshing and honest. Given the fact, as pointed out, that he doesnt ban people for responding in kind, I dont see much problem. End of the day, it is ones choice to engage with Kwark or not. If only KwarK took his no nonsense attitude and applied it equally to everyone. For some reason he excludes himself from it. Weren’t you going to quit this website? As I said, do this shit one more time and I'm gone. I fully expect you to not be able to help yourself. You have no self-control. Probably best that you just go now then? Have you accused me of being a Nazi since yesterday?
No but you haven’t dropped any new gems about your life or opinions since then. If you’d like to share any unusual runic tattoos you may have or some unsavory cosplay you engage in then that’d probably get us there. Maybe you’d like to deny some history that most people wouldn’t. I don’t know, it’s your life, I don’t know what you’ll do next.
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On July 14 2024 01:26 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On July 14 2024 00:05 Magic Powers wrote:On July 13 2024 23:39 KwarK wrote:On July 13 2024 20:20 Magic Powers wrote:On July 13 2024 06:05 KwarK wrote:On July 12 2024 18:29 Magic Powers wrote:On July 12 2024 18:02 Razyda wrote:
Regarding Kwark, I rather enjoy his no nonsense attitude and brash style, more often than not it feels refreshing and honest. Given the fact, as pointed out, that he doesnt ban people for responding in kind, I dont see much problem. End of the day, it is ones choice to engage with Kwark or not. If only KwarK took his no nonsense attitude and applied it equally to everyone. For some reason he excludes himself from it. Weren’t you going to quit this website? As I said, do this shit one more time and I'm gone. I fully expect you to not be able to help yourself. You have no self-control. Probably best that you just go now then? Have you accused me of being a Nazi since yesterday? No but you haven’t dropped any new gems about your life or opinions since then. If you’d like to share any unusual runic tattoos you may have or some unsavory cosplay you engage in then that’d probably get us there. Maybe you’d like to deny some history that most people wouldn’t. I don’t know, it’s your life, I don’t know what you’ll do next.
What are you trying to accomplish with this?
You know exactly that I'm not Nazi sympathizer. You know it, we both know it. My views are almost the exact opposite to those of a Nazi. I'm against everything they stand for. But you are too much of a troll to admit that.
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https://tl.net/forum/general/532255-us-politics-mega-thread?page=4421#88410
On October 01 2024 15:51 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On September 30 2024 23:03 oBlade wrote:Yet the House Budget Committee just announced the US spends at least $150 or as much as $400 billion on illegal immigrants per year. FEMA's #1 strategic coal is "Instill equity (communism) as a foundation of emergency management." recruitment has plummeted because nobody wants to sign up to an incompetent military whose goals are diversity and inclusion instead of defense and invasion. These are the DoD's explicit goals, of this administration. Competence and readiness have been forced so far in the backseat that they would be liable to cause a civil rights protest. Few things here but basically you’ve got fucking brain worms and should drink bleach.I don’t have the number to hand but I can confidently say the US does not spend $400b/year on illegal immigration. I know that because I know that a billion is a lot and $400b is 400 of them. At $100k/year you could put about 4,000,000 men on the southern border. After excluding males over 50 or under 18 l, plus immigrants of course, that’s about 1 in 10 of us. FEMA is not trying to implement communism. That’s some weird Jade Helm remix conspiracy theory. The idea that nobody wants to join an organization because it’s too inclusive is something you should have said out loud to yourself before hitting post. Consider what you’re proposing here. You want to increase membership by making the organization more exclusionary.
Telling people to kill themselves is cool now on TL? Nice, can I now say that the entire mod team should drink bleach for never doing anything against KwarK's abuse? If the answer is yes, then fuck this site. We used to be better than this, or at least I think we did.
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United States41641 Posts
Drinking bleach is an established conservative policy. That said, if I’d had any concerns that he would have taken that as a legitimate medical diagnosis and a legitimate medical treatment plan I would not have said it. It was said under the assumption that the reader would not go “well I disagree with KwarK’s politics but I do want to treat the brain worms I’ve been diagnosed with and bleach is the way to go”.
Also you can’t really kill yourself drinking bleach, it’s so corrosive that you immediately vomit it back up. You can kill someone with it but they need to be forced.
That said I’m always extremely open to feedback and so in light of your concerns I’ll edit in a disclaimer noting that what I wrote was not medical advice and not to drink bleach.
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On October 02 2024 00:23 KwarK wrote:
Drinking bleach is an established conservative policy. That said, if I’d had any concerns that he would have taken that as a legitimate medical diagnosis and a legitimate medical treatment plan I would not have said it. It was said under the assumption that the reader would not go “well I disagree with KwarK’s politics but I do want to treat the brain worms I’ve been diagnosed with and bleach is the way to go”.
Also you can’t really kill yourself drinking bleach, it’s so corrosive that you immediately vomit it back up. You can kill someone with it but they need to be forced.
That said I’m always extremely open to feedback and so in light of your concerns I’ll edit in a disclaimer noting that what I wrote was not medical advice and not to drink bleach.
Yes, as it is obvious from my complaint, my concern was purely that he might take it as serious advice and not the fact that it is well below what I presumed to be the conduct that is acceptable on TL.
Yeah, as it is obvious from my complaint my concern was that he might take the advice seriously and not that it is well below what I presumed to be the accepted conduct on TL.
Even if you did not mean it that way, you could have had a moment of self reflection and realised "maybe that was not the way to go, my bad". Instead you chose to double down on acting like a jackass and try to ridicule me. Open to feedback my ass.
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Kwark's posting may be obnoxious but he's harmless (except when he's encouraging SCOTUS grenade attacks), people with legitimate points obviously don't need to talk like that.
On October 02 2024 00:23 KwarK wrote:
Drinking bleach is an established conservative policy. That said, if I’d had any concerns that he would have taken that as a legitimate medical diagnosis and a legitimate medical treatment plan I would not have said it. It was said under the assumption that the reader would not go “well I disagree with KwarK’s politics but I do want to treat the brain worms I’ve been diagnosed with and bleach is the way to go”.
As the registered Republican between us, try to remember what's established in your circles may not be obvious to the rest of us.
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United States41641 Posts
On October 05 2024 16:10 oBlade wrote:Kwark's posting may be obnoxious but he's harmless (except when he's encouraging SCOTUS grenade attacks), people with legitimate points obviously don't need to talk like that. Show nested quote +On October 02 2024 00:23 KwarK wrote:
Drinking bleach is an established conservative policy. That said, if I’d had any concerns that he would have taken that as a legitimate medical diagnosis and a legitimate medical treatment plan I would not have said it. It was said under the assumption that the reader would not go “well I disagree with KwarK’s politics but I do want to treat the brain worms I’ve been diagnosed with and bleach is the way to go”. As the registered Republican between us, try to remember what's established in your circles may not be obvious to the rest of us.
I'm a registered Republican bud.
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On October 06 2024 00:33 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2024 16:10 oBlade wrote:Kwark's posting may be obnoxious but he's harmless (except when he's encouraging SCOTUS grenade attacks), people with legitimate points obviously don't need to talk like that. On October 02 2024 00:23 KwarK wrote:
Drinking bleach is an established conservative policy. That said, if I’d had any concerns that he would have taken that as a legitimate medical diagnosis and a legitimate medical treatment plan I would not have said it. It was said under the assumption that the reader would not go “well I disagree with KwarK’s politics but I do want to treat the brain worms I’ve been diagnosed with and bleach is the way to go”. As the registered Republican between us, try to remember what's established in your circles may not be obvious to the rest of us. I'm a registered Republican bud.
This is an absolute Smithsonian level post.
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EPT
