EPTNewbie Student Mafia XXIX - Page 13
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43188 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43188 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43188 Posts
On September 09 2018 23:30 Holyflare wrote: Rayn talking about Kelsier posts would also be good. well that's all i have to say about Kelsier. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43188 Posts
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
My read is lynch fast. Because we die. | ||
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Qatol
United States3165 Posts
On September 09 2018 19:39 raynpelikoneet wrote: Well it really doesn't matter anymore what Qatol says in terms of "i need to wait". I was kinda hoping you wouldnt have made that post HF in case youre town as i was kinda hoping Qatol would have used the "i voted Kaley first" as an asnwer to your question if he's mafia. But you kinda blew it there... Why did you decide to vote for Qatol? Instead of Serge? Did you think you would really gather momentum to lynch Qatol over Kaly (who you read as town -- aka you are trying to, or should be, save them)? At least Kelsier would have possibly followed you onto your other scumread. Who did you think will vote for Qatol at that point? Okay let me address this. I hadn't posted on Holyflare's vote because, quite frankly, his argument is ridiculous, mischaracterizes the situation, and causes a distraction. That being said, because people are asking me to respond, let me break things down. (Sorry I couldn't respond sooner, but you waited between 5am and 6am my time, so it wasn't going to happen) On September 09 2018 06:23 Holyflare wrote: + Show Spoiler + On September 09 2018 03:02 Qatol wrote: Getting back to the game, I will say that I am nervous that there hasn't been more pushback regarding Kaley, both by the player themselves and by others. Usually lynching mafia day 1 is like pulling teeth. That hasn't been the experience so far. Plus, we're getting posts like this: Rels, why is Sergio almost a lock? Why do you want to lynch Kaley? Considering there was 30 minutes between your "yo" post and your vote, I'm confused as to why you didn't say more. However, the thing that is most perplexing about the situation is Kaley's insistence on staying in character and getting in a flamewar with rayn rather than providing any real analysis. Kaley, you're spending the time to put together semi-rhymes. Why not at least point to the words rayn has posted that are making you push for him so hard? From what I can tell, your original read came from him stating that he would policy lynch people who posted rp/ms paint. He hadn't even said anything about you before you started trying to aggravate him. As I have mentioned repeatedly, you really haven't posted anything that helps the town. Instead, your posts have been inflammatory and disruptive. As a result, I feel obligated to leave my vote on you. ##vote Qatol This is so contradictory. You can't understand why there is no push back (maybe the fact that Kaley could be town?) so you'll vote Kaley regardless? It's not even a reason to scum read Kaley. Kaley is poking at rayn because rayn's points blatantly pointed towards policy lynching Kaley. You are simply voting the highest wagon (that could well be town) that is currently active under the guise of policy/scum lynch. I do indeed mention that there is no push back on Kaley, which could mean that Kaley is town. If you look back at previous posts I have made, I repeatedly been asked Kaley to post something, anything productive. Instead, she insisted on her "raps" and throwing personal attacks at rayn with no logic. I agree that there not being pushback isn't a reason to scum read Kaley. However, this isn't my first post on Kaley. If you look at my filter, it's actually my 6th post that mentions Kaley. My scumread was based on Kaley doing her best to disrupt and distract the town without actually contributing. Again, in those posts, just like in the one you pointed out, I have been asking Kaley to contribute. Finally, the wagon. I was the first to vote Kaley. As I mentioned above, I also made a large amount of the discussion on Kaley. Hardly a bandwagon vote. In fact, the only votes that could reasonably be considered bandwagon votes are your own vote and Rels (rayn's vote occurred at a time when there was 4 different players with 1 vote for them and thus is more of a vote that pointed us in a direction). You further clarify this point later in the thread by saying this: On September 09 2018 19:12 Holyflare wrote: I didn't realise Qatol had voted Kaley before that post. Regardless, the point still stands. The post you're so worried about clearly states "As a result, I feel obligated to leave my vote on you." You even went through the effort to bold this portion of my post. Are you now trying to state that you took the effort to accuse me based on this post, and even specifically bold this portion of the post but didn't read it? | ||
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Qatol
United States3165 Posts
On September 09 2018 23:30 Holyflare wrote: Now, if we could get back to actually relevant stuff. People that aren't rayn talking about Qatol would be good. Rayn talking about Kelsier posts would also be good. Okay, let me comment one more time on this because you requested it and because you have posted a few other things that simply aren't true. The big one is the reason for my read on Kaley. On September 09 2018 23:22 Holyflare wrote: + Show Spoiler + On September 09 2018 20:42 raynpelikoneet wrote: I agree i was, i am not saying i wasn't. But i also know what i read and i didn't start it. But that's not my point and it is irrelevant. What is relevant is this: You are saying this: When you made this comment i can only assume it is a townread unless: 1) Someone had called Kaley mafia because of him being a dick to me (which imo never happened) 2) Since the above never happened, you think this is a reason for Kaley to be town (it outweighs the reasons for him being mafia). Since you now claim this is not a case, why did you decide to defend your null read based on an argument noone ever made, and you yourself don't think makes him town? About three people called Kaley mafia because they were posting in rhymes and being specifically antagonistic towards you. It's the entire basis for Qatol's scum read even. Just because I don't agree with you or other people that this makes Kaley mafia does not also infer I think Kaley is town nor is it a town read. It's a read that means I don't think that specific point makes that specific person mafia. I don't know why you are trying so hard to put words in my mouth that I never quite said but you should stop. It was not because she was antagonistic towards rayn. It was because she wasn't contributing and was actively trying to distract people from useful conversation. Her first post was a summary of spam. Her second post was an attempt to provoke a policy lynch. Her third post was another summary of spam (after being called out on it) and then attacks on rayn and myself without providing any reasoning. Her posts after that point were basically just a mixture of accusing rayn as mafia (again, without reasoning) and personal attacks on rayn. How is that helpful, pro-town behavior? I also find it amusing that you are worried about other people putting words in your mouth when that's exactly what you just did. | ||
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Qatol
United States3165 Posts
I see another post I'd like to discuss. On September 09 2018 05:45 Koshi wrote: No. Kaley is fine. But after that it is HF and not Sergio. Because Sergio is linked to hf. And he tried. Koshi, please explain your logic around when the voting ended. I understand you have a scum read on HolyFlare and a town read on Sergio. This post makes it seem like you were also okay with the Kaley lynch. My question is why did you leave your vote where you did? It was pretty obvious at the time that HolyFlare was unlikely to be the lynch. You seem to acknowledge that yourself. So why leave your vote on HolyFlare, making a last second vote switch from Kaley to someone you don't want to see lynched, such as Sergio, more likely? | ||
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Qatol
United States3165 Posts
On September 09 2018 01:57 Vivax wrote: I don't think Sergio is mafia. But he seems to be a bit of a dick if he asks rayn to play nice then proceeds to call Koshis posts trash. I think Koshi is rather townie. I think we should lynch RoL, cause RoL always flips mafia. ##Vote RoL So you have town reads on Sergio and Koshi. Your filter reveals you wanting to refrain from scumreading anyone. You softly defend Kaley and softly scumread me here: On September 08 2018 01:31 Vivax wrote: I think Sergio is overanalyzing early game stuff, but not in a necessarily scummy way, he may just be overeager townie. That makes me unable to agree with him on his points. I believe he shouldn't give so much weight to what Koshi did so far. I think kaley is town. Btw I never was able to like rap/hip-hop. Hard for me to explain this read, mostly gut and that he's going after rayn of all people. Not a big fan of a Qatols version as a summary is the best that anyone could have delivered on early game banter and I see the opportunity for mafia here to jump on a kaley lynch after rayn (if town) said he would p-lynch for the rap. I'll ultimately refrain from scumreading Qatol here as pushing arguments early here is a good thing for town and not necessary for mafia, but I don't agree with them. But then you back off from it here: On September 08 2018 16:16 Vivax wrote: I really don't like how I was talked into making my kaley read appear stronger than it was. It was a crappy feels-read coupled with the rayn vote which I would describe as ballsy. That said, it makes me feel entrapped that everyone is riding this train of thought that I'm mafia for that read after making me talk so much about it which really isn't something that felt that important to me. That said, I was expecting more fleshed out "raps" afterwards or at least that kaley would start posting normally, and the latest one isn't very informative as Qatol points out above. So I don't see a reason to still mantain that read. I'll be waiting for more content before scumreading anyone however. But then, out of nowhere, you decide to vote for RoL, someone who hasn't even posted, has no votes on him, and is thus extremely unlikely to be lynched. Why? Just so your vote won't matter? How do you think that helps? You're just making it easier for the mafia to influence the vote. Especially in a game that's this as inactive as this one has been, this vote sticks out, considering you have been actively posting in the thread. This vote looks to me like you are afraid to take a stand against anyone. This really looks to me like you could be mafia who is pleased with how the lynch is going and didn't want to be accused of making a bandwagon vote. So please explain. | ||
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
On September 10 2018 03:46 Qatol wrote: Okay, hopefully everything is explained and we can move on to useful conversation, though I do still want to know how it could happen that Holyflare didn't read a portion of my post that he took the time to bold. I see another post I'd like to discuss. Koshi, please explain your logic around when the voting ended. I understand you have a scum read on HolyFlare and a town read on Sergio. This post makes it seem like you were also okay with the Kaley lynch. My question is why did you leave your vote where you did? It was pretty obvious at the time that HolyFlare was unlikely to be the lynch. You seem to acknowledge that yourself. So why leave your vote on HolyFlare, making a last second vote switch from Kaley to someone you don't want to see lynched, such as Sergio, more likely? I dont tr Sergio. Because if HF is mafia Sergio is likely as well. And I think HF is mafia. | ||
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
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Sergiovan
90 Posts
In post #168 you say that HF is scum for playing intentionally anti town but, unless I’m much mistaken, isn’t that what you are claiming to be doing? Why would town!koshi accuse HF of being scum for exhibiting the same behaviors that town!koshi is exhibiting. In response to #172 I guess I didn’t explain it well but I was responding to the same behavior you were in #168. HF was playing in a clearly bad way which means he is either a) bad b) mafia c) playing intentionally badly. From the above I still lean towards Koshi being scum with the caveat that I have seen town players play intentionally anti-town D1 and then shape up having ‘succeeded’ at using their bad play to help them understand the game state. | ||
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Sergiovan
90 Posts
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Sergiovan
90 Posts
More importantly though in the above mentioned post you say that “there is no way” that Koshi is scum. Go read my cases against him and explain how that is possible. I freely admit I don’t think he is a slam dunk 100% confirmed mafia but I fail to see how he is confirmed town. what is your read on Kelsier? I can’t decipher it from your post #241. In that same post why are you so quick to defend me? | ||
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Sergiovan
90 Posts
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Sergiovan
90 Posts
HF is saying that your claim that there was no pushback on Kaley is scummy and your defense is “I said that there was pushback” and you say “there not being pushback isn't a reason to scum read Kaley.” But isn’t that actually a reason to have a town read on Kaley? You said so in your previous post. You are have a big post to defend yourself which relies on its length rather than its quality to achieve that defense. Qatol, based on the above post moves to the red column. | ||
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Sergiovan
90 Posts
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