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Obviously I agree with ruxxar's post on Sulfu.
Alright time to go home, see you in a few hours. (=
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I'll work my way back and refute points from there.
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On June 16 2015 00:46 ruXxar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 23:21 ruXxar wrote:
Im changing my My read on sulfur to town.
I'll explain further when I get home. Here's my reasoning on sulfur: 1. Sulfur under pressure of getting lynched tries to accuse townread trfel of being mafia, and hard defends Rels. This play is so bad that I don't even think a bad mafia would make this play, but still it's possible. 2. After n00bking's epitaph where he recommended to lynch sulfur as #1, moosy went of the offensive. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Maybe me being suspicious of all of them early day 1 will buy me some town cred???? I need some after being afk so long. Don't worry. It looks like Rels -> Sulfurus right now. If both are right, I'm pretty sure we'll have to vote to kill ruXxar and we always have cop to check if necessary. Moosy and kick then both HARD agree that I have to bus rels and sulfur as the only chance to clear my name. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:45 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 07:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Maybe me being suspicious of all of them early day 1 will buy me some town cred???? I need some after being afk so long. Don't worry. It looks like Rels -> Sulfurus right now. If both are right, I'm pretty sure we'll have to vote to kill ruXxar and we always have cop to check if necessary. I'm sorry, why would you vote me out when I agree they are scum? Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:47 Kickstart wrote:On June 15 2015 07:45 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 07:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Maybe me being suspicious of all of them early day 1 will buy me some town cred???? I need some after being afk so long. Don't worry. It looks like Rels -> Sulfurus right now. If both are right, I'm pretty sure we'll have to vote to kill ruXxar and we always have cop to check if necessary. I'm sorry, why would you vote me out when I agree they are scum? Bussing is a known thing friend. That is why you are last in the line. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:48 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 07:42 ruXxar wrote:
Gaaah, my head hurts real bad right now.
I can't understand sulfurs logic at all.
Why would he defend rels so hard yet make such a terrible play to not become a lynch target.
It makes no sense to me.
His actions are so inconsistent.
On one hand he hard defends rel for god knows what reason,
Then he makes a terrible play that I don't think a mafia would do.
I want some second opinions in this. Sulfurus is just plain scum lol. He's trying to play like he usually does but the role of a Mafia teammate is interfering with his play. On June 15 2015 07:45 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 07:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Maybe me being suspicious of all of them early day 1 will buy me some town cred???? I need some after being afk so long. Don't worry. It looks like Rels -> Sulfurus right now. If both are right, I'm pretty sure we'll have to vote to kill ruXxar and we always have cop to check if necessary. I'm sorry, why would you vote me out when I agree they are scum? You have no choice but to agree looking at how everyone is voting against them and there's too much evidence against them. 3. I then push really hard on sulfur to get his thoughts on Rels. He STILL didn't want to change his view on Rels and vote for him. If he was mafia scum, and the #1 suspect by n00bking. Would he not also vote for rels to try to clear his name? Any sane mafia person would.4. If I were mafia together with with sulfur, and our only chance of winning was to bus Rels as the first lynch target, would I not instruct my mafia teammate to also vote on Rels? I can only conclude that Sulfurus is Town
First of all, I don't know if you're trying to accuse me of Mafia or trying to clear Sulfurus. It seems like you're doing both which doesn't matter in any case because I disagree with both.
1. Sulfurus is trying to bring Trfel under the light which is a huge mistake. It makes no sense in any way whatsoever. It's either a very bad play or a weak attempt as Mafia to avoid being lynched. There is actually no way to excuse this attempt.
2. The reason I went on the offensive was to clarify n00bKing's suspicions that you might have been Mafia which you inadequately defended yourself on btw.
- I first asked you whether you thought Rels and Sulfurus were scum. You said they were.
- I then pointed out that this might be a case of busing. You pretended or really didn't know what we were talking about.
- I then pointed out that there's no reason for you to listen to Sulfurus's argument as you just said he was scum. For some reason, you kept on associating yourself with someone you said was scum and tried to listen to the basis of an argument that was unsound from the start. At this point you decided to leave and never replied.
- I won't even mention the fact that you're always following one wagon or another as I'm sure people will be able to look through your filter and see how you were always agreeing with almost every case out there.
3. Both Sulfurus and Rels were under fire. If they immediately began attempting to bus each other, it would most certainly be an assertion that they were Mafia. The only thing that they can do at this point is try and defend each other the best that they can. This point is weak.
4. No because both Sulfurus and Rels were primary suspects and are after n00bKing's post. The only reason why you would be able to get away with busing is because mostly everyone thought that you were town and it would be simplest for you to disassociate yourself from them. Which, I'd like to point out, you do by jumping on the n00bKing wagon immediately. Even now you're only revoking your argument because Rels is here and making a case for Sulfurus.
I don't see why you're so scared to make a stand for yourself and persist in wagoning off of other people's arguments.
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On June 15 2015 23:01 Rels wrote:
Hehe sure. I'm still checking if new posts have come from times to times.
I'm suspicious of moosy and scott voting me over Sulfu and doing so while praising noobking's post. I'm also suspicious of them because even before reading their posts, they were the most likely mafia with kickstart in my mind.
I'm actually reading their filters right now, so I'll see if my suspicions are match by their posts.
@Rels, the reason why I voted you over Sulfurus is because I had already made a case against you and I took n00bKing's epitaph as a confirmation for it.
I also admit, I was a bit excited over the fact that we caught Mafia which is why I linked mine, n00bKing's, and batsnack's arguments to Kickstart, since it seemed that he was wondering what had gone down over the course of the thread. And if anything else, arguments against a certain Mafia is the most important part of the game.
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On June 15 2015 20:55 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:
##vote Rels
Good job n00bKing you did well. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:09 scott31337 wrote:
What an awesome post, n00b. I haven't felt good about Sulf or Rels, and Rels didn't reply to anything, just went to sleep.
##Vote Rels Hahaha that is so good (= I'm so happy to read these two posts. I think the two posters are scum. Here is why. All the suspicions noobkind put on me start with the premise that Sulfu is town. He himself say to lynch Sulfu first, then IF Sulfu is mafia, to lynch ruxxar or me day 3. He also says than ruxxar would be a better lynch than me day 3. Don't believe me ? Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:
Sulfurus would be my top lynch on Day 2. If he flips Red, is it better to go after ruXxar or Rels next? That's tough. The ties between Sulfurus and ruXxar are definitely stronger than the ties between Sulfurus and Rels. But Rels is being read by more people as being generally scummy right now, so he might be the easier lynch, even if ruXxar could be the more logical lynch.
[...]
If Sulfurus flips Green, then it's back to the drawing board, to some extent. Hopefully that would mean a batsnacks scum team, and he's paired with either Moosy or damdred. But that case is tougher to make than Sulfurus/ruXxar/Rels.
So. Just after this post, noobking dies and here is what happens: 1 - moosy and scott both expressed good feelings about noobking's post. 2 - noobking's post say to lynch Sulfu day 2, and if he flips mafia, to lynch ruxxar and me, ruxxar being the stronger lynch 3 - moosy and scott vote me instead. You know what is even funnier ? Let me quote this moosy post that happens just after his vote to me. Please read it carefully. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:05 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Alright guys, Rels first then Sulfurus. After that, we re-look over n00bKing's post then decide on the next person. I'm inclined to trust him though. That analysis was so good. That "so good analysis" that moosy is talking about says to lynch Sulfu first, and that I'm not mafia unless Sulfu is too. But moosy wants to lynch me first. Then he wants to lynch Sulfu. And finally ruxxar. I can see a scum agenda here. How ? Let's consider this timeline: 1 - we lynch Sulfu, he flips green 2 - if we follow noobking post, we're not lynching me nor ruxxar anymore. Conclusion: we only mislynched once. moosy seems to be pushing for a better timeline for mafia: 1 - we lynch me, I flip green 2 - too bad! Let's follow noobking post again ... mm that's true he asked for sulfu's lynch first. 3 - we lynch sulfu, I flip green Conclusion: two mislynches
Yeh, again, that wasn't my intention. The reason why I voted to lynch you first was because there were already arguments from me, Trfel, batsnacks, and now n00bKing. Comparatively, no one really made any cases against Sulfurus which is why I felt it would be safer to be lynching you.
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Does anyone wish to follow this foolish attempt at lynching me?
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On June 16 2015 02:40 batsnacks wrote:
"Safer" is a weird word.
How so? I thought it would be pretty safe to lynch Rels considering the cases stacked against him.
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It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it.
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On June 16 2015 02:46 batsnacks wrote:
It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it.
In what way?
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On June 16 2015 02:26 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 20:55 Rels wrote:On June 15 2015 07:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:
##vote Rels
Good job n00bKing you did well. On June 15 2015 07:09 scott31337 wrote:
What an awesome post, n00b. I haven't felt good about Sulf or Rels, and Rels didn't reply to anything, just went to sleep.
##Vote Rels Hahaha that is so good (= I'm so happy to read these two posts. I think the two posters are scum. Here is why. All the suspicions noobkind put on me start with the premise that Sulfu is town. He himself say to lynch Sulfu first, then IF Sulfu is mafia, to lynch ruxxar or me day 3. He also says than ruxxar would be a better lynch than me day 3. Don't believe me ? On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:
Sulfurus would be my top lynch on Day 2. If he flips Red, is it better to go after ruXxar or Rels next? That's tough. The ties between Sulfurus and ruXxar are definitely stronger than the ties between Sulfurus and Rels. But Rels is being read by more people as being generally scummy right now, so he might be the easier lynch, even if ruXxar could be the more logical lynch.
[...]
If Sulfurus flips Green, then it's back to the drawing board, to some extent. Hopefully that would mean a batsnacks scum team, and he's paired with either Moosy or damdred. But that case is tougher to make than Sulfurus/ruXxar/Rels.
So. Just after this post, noobking dies and here is what happens: 1 - moosy and scott both expressed good feelings about noobking's post. 2 - noobking's post say to lynch Sulfu day 2, and if he flips mafia, to lynch ruxxar and me, ruxxar being the stronger lynch 3 - moosy and scott vote me instead. You know what is even funnier ? Let me quote this moosy post that happens just after his vote to me. Please read it carefully. On June 15 2015 07:05 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Alright guys, Rels first then Sulfurus. After that, we re-look over n00bKing's post then decide on the next person. I'm inclined to trust him though. That analysis was so good. That "so good analysis" that moosy is talking about says to lynch Sulfu first, and that I'm not mafia unless Sulfu is too. But moosy wants to lynch me first. Then he wants to lynch Sulfu. And finally ruxxar. I can see a scum agenda here. How ? Let's consider this timeline: 1 - we lynch Sulfu, he flips green 2 - if we follow noobking post, we're not lynching me nor ruxxar anymore. Conclusion: we only mislynched once. moosy seems to be pushing for a better timeline for mafia: 1 - we lynch me, I flip green 2 - too bad! Let's follow noobking post again ... mm that's true he asked for sulfu's lynch first. 3 - we lynch sulfu, I flip green Conclusion: two mislynches Yeh, again, that wasn't my intention. The reason why I voted to lynch you first was because there were already arguments from me, Trfel, batsnacks, and now n00bKing. Comparatively, no one really made any cases against Sulfurus which is why I felt it would be safer to be lynching you.
Alright I can accept this explanation. I responded all the cases you mentioned, did that change your read on me ?
The thing about linking your cases to noobking's is still a little, little bit scummy. Obviously it's weak so nobody will lynch you for only this.
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On June 16 2015 02:50 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:26 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 20:55 Rels wrote:On June 15 2015 07:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:
##vote Rels
Good job n00bKing you did well. On June 15 2015 07:09 scott31337 wrote:
What an awesome post, n00b. I haven't felt good about Sulf or Rels, and Rels didn't reply to anything, just went to sleep.
##Vote Rels Hahaha that is so good (= I'm so happy to read these two posts. I think the two posters are scum. Here is why. All the suspicions noobkind put on me start with the premise that Sulfu is town. He himself say to lynch Sulfu first, then IF Sulfu is mafia, to lynch ruxxar or me day 3. He also says than ruxxar would be a better lynch than me day 3. Don't believe me ? On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:
Sulfurus would be my top lynch on Day 2. If he flips Red, is it better to go after ruXxar or Rels next? That's tough. The ties between Sulfurus and ruXxar are definitely stronger than the ties between Sulfurus and Rels. But Rels is being read by more people as being generally scummy right now, so he might be the easier lynch, even if ruXxar could be the more logical lynch.
[...]
If Sulfurus flips Green, then it's back to the drawing board, to some extent. Hopefully that would mean a batsnacks scum team, and he's paired with either Moosy or damdred. But that case is tougher to make than Sulfurus/ruXxar/Rels.
So. Just after this post, noobking dies and here is what happens: 1 - moosy and scott both expressed good feelings about noobking's post. 2 - noobking's post say to lynch Sulfu day 2, and if he flips mafia, to lynch ruxxar and me, ruxxar being the stronger lynch 3 - moosy and scott vote me instead. You know what is even funnier ? Let me quote this moosy post that happens just after his vote to me. Please read it carefully. On June 15 2015 07:05 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Alright guys, Rels first then Sulfurus. After that, we re-look over n00bKing's post then decide on the next person. I'm inclined to trust him though. That analysis was so good. That "so good analysis" that moosy is talking about says to lynch Sulfu first, and that I'm not mafia unless Sulfu is too. But moosy wants to lynch me first. Then he wants to lynch Sulfu. And finally ruxxar. I can see a scum agenda here. How ? Let's consider this timeline: 1 - we lynch Sulfu, he flips green 2 - if we follow noobking post, we're not lynching me nor ruxxar anymore. Conclusion: we only mislynched once. moosy seems to be pushing for a better timeline for mafia: 1 - we lynch me, I flip green 2 - too bad! Let's follow noobking post again ... mm that's true he asked for sulfu's lynch first. 3 - we lynch sulfu, I flip green Conclusion: two mislynches Yeh, again, that wasn't my intention. The reason why I voted to lynch you first was because there were already arguments from me, Trfel, batsnacks, and now n00bKing. Comparatively, no one really made any cases against Sulfurus which is why I felt it would be safer to be lynching you. Alright I can accept this explanation. I responded all the cases you mentioned, did that change your read on me ? The thing about linking your cases to noobking's is still a little, little bit scummy. Obviously it's weak so nobody will lynch you for only this.
If anything, linking my cases to n00bKing's is the opposite of scummy considering that he turned out to be VT as well. Since it seems that no one exactly wants to immediately chop off my head, I'll go back and re-read over everything carefully.
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On June 16 2015 02:48 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:46 batsnacks wrote:
It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it. In what way?
I don't consider this relevant because I feel like I understand what you were trying to say anyway but... It could also be "safer" because since there is more evidence for Rels, there will be less suspicion your way if he flips town. Compared to if you lynched hypothetical town sulfurus for (relatively) less evidence.
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On June 16 2015 02:52 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:50 Rels wrote:On June 16 2015 02:26 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 20:55 Rels wrote:On June 15 2015 07:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:
##vote Rels
Good job n00bKing you did well. On June 15 2015 07:09 scott31337 wrote:
What an awesome post, n00b. I haven't felt good about Sulf or Rels, and Rels didn't reply to anything, just went to sleep.
##Vote Rels Hahaha that is so good (= I'm so happy to read these two posts. I think the two posters are scum. Here is why. All the suspicions noobkind put on me start with the premise that Sulfu is town. He himself say to lynch Sulfu first, then IF Sulfu is mafia, to lynch ruxxar or me day 3. He also says than ruxxar would be a better lynch than me day 3. Don't believe me ? On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:
Sulfurus would be my top lynch on Day 2. If he flips Red, is it better to go after ruXxar or Rels next? That's tough. The ties between Sulfurus and ruXxar are definitely stronger than the ties between Sulfurus and Rels. But Rels is being read by more people as being generally scummy right now, so he might be the easier lynch, even if ruXxar could be the more logical lynch.
[...]
If Sulfurus flips Green, then it's back to the drawing board, to some extent. Hopefully that would mean a batsnacks scum team, and he's paired with either Moosy or damdred. But that case is tougher to make than Sulfurus/ruXxar/Rels.
So. Just after this post, noobking dies and here is what happens: 1 - moosy and scott both expressed good feelings about noobking's post. 2 - noobking's post say to lynch Sulfu day 2, and if he flips mafia, to lynch ruxxar and me, ruxxar being the stronger lynch 3 - moosy and scott vote me instead. You know what is even funnier ? Let me quote this moosy post that happens just after his vote to me. Please read it carefully. On June 15 2015 07:05 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Alright guys, Rels first then Sulfurus. After that, we re-look over n00bKing's post then decide on the next person. I'm inclined to trust him though. That analysis was so good. That "so good analysis" that moosy is talking about says to lynch Sulfu first, and that I'm not mafia unless Sulfu is too. But moosy wants to lynch me first. Then he wants to lynch Sulfu. And finally ruxxar. I can see a scum agenda here. How ? Let's consider this timeline: 1 - we lynch Sulfu, he flips green 2 - if we follow noobking post, we're not lynching me nor ruxxar anymore. Conclusion: we only mislynched once. moosy seems to be pushing for a better timeline for mafia: 1 - we lynch me, I flip green 2 - too bad! Let's follow noobking post again ... mm that's true he asked for sulfu's lynch first. 3 - we lynch sulfu, I flip green Conclusion: two mislynches Yeh, again, that wasn't my intention. The reason why I voted to lynch you first was because there were already arguments from me, Trfel, batsnacks, and now n00bKing. Comparatively, no one really made any cases against Sulfurus which is why I felt it would be safer to be lynching you. Alright I can accept this explanation. I responded all the cases you mentioned, did that change your read on me ? The thing about linking your cases to noobking's is still a little, little bit scummy. Obviously it's weak so nobody will lynch you for only this. If anything, linking my cases to n00bKing's is the opposite of scummy considering that he turned out to be VT as well. Since it seems that no one exactly wants to immediately chop off my head, I'll go back and re-read over everything carefully.
Now that you just admitted that your case and noobking's were different, I find it more opportunistic than good. That's why I called it a small scum hint.
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+ Show Spoiler +On June 15 2015 15:22 Trfel wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 21:52 ruXxar wrote:
So first off.
I'm very disappointed that the night actually started 1 hour earlier than expected.
It didn't give me enough time to analyze batsnacks accusation even though it made sense when he posted it.
I can't tell you his reasons for doing so, but it felt like such an improvised and irregular post that I don't know what to make of it.
All game I had him as scum, and suddenly he makes this one move which totally breaks with his character so far.
I can't help but feel like i've been fooled.
I want to say that I should've stuck to my gut feeling and not be swayed so easily.
If I disregard that one action of his, then batsnacks is still my top scumread. This makes no sense to me given this post here. Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 06:10 ruXxar wrote:On June 14 2015 05:38 batsnacks wrote:On June 14 2015 05:33 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 14 2015 05:32 batsnacks wrote:
Bat Traps™ mafia traps. The highest quality traps for your scum hunting needs. We'll see how right we are after Sulfurus, Rels, and getrip. You don't understand. geript just claimed mafia. Here is geript saying he will sheep Trfel's amazing case on Rels: + Show Spoiler +On June 14 2015 04:54 geript wrote:
Actually, I think I'm going to sheep too. Here is sulfurus's bold post defending Rels: + Show Spoiler +On June 14 2015 05:00 Sulfurus wrote:I didn't want to say anything about trfel before because his vote on Bats was protecting me but he is just straight up wrong on Rels. He makes a post here where he says rels made a bad town read on ruXxar even though (IMO) ruXx is one of the towniest players in the game. He also keeps saying that Rels is tunneled on Plant's only post and he basically dismisses the rest of his filter when in fact it's really good and shows a town who is focused on trying to solve the game. Here is me saying sulfurus's post is bold, I ask why mafia would post such a thing: + Show Spoiler +On June 14 2015 05:04 batsnacks wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 05:00 Sulfurus wrote:I didn't want to say anything about trfel before because his vote on Bats was protecting me but he is just straight up wrong on Rels. He makes a post here where he says rels made a bad town read on ruXxar even though (IMO) ruXx is one of the towniest players in the game. He also keeps saying that Rels is tunneled on Plant's only post and he basically dismisses the rest of his filter when in fact it's really good and shows a town who is focused on trying to solve the game. This is bold. Why does mafia post this? Here geript explains that sometimes mafia like to defend town poorly. geript knows that Rels is town, yet he would sheep Trfel's case on Rels: + Show Spoiler +On June 14 2015 05:08 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 05:04 batsnacks wrote:On June 14 2015 05:00 Sulfurus wrote:I didn't want to say anything about trfel before because his vote on Bats was protecting me but he is just straight up wrong on Rels. He makes a post here where he says rels made a bad town read on ruXxar even though (IMO) ruXx is one of the towniest players in the game. He also keeps saying that Rels is tunneled on Plant's only post and he basically dismisses the rest of his filter when in fact it's really good and shows a town who is focused on trying to solve the game. This is bold. Why does mafia post this? It's not uncommon for mafia to defend town badly. Especially newer mafia. Wow bats... I'm speechless. I had you and geript as my top two scum. I refuse to believe that you would bus your own scum teammate this hard. You really redeemed yourself here in my eyes. I'll have to change my alignment of you to town and change my vote to geript. ##Unvote batsnacks
##Vote geript Please explain. I'm more interested in this than the case on MoosyDoosy that follows.
MoosyDoosy, I know you've explained this a few times already, but I'm not sure I understand. Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 07:57 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 14 2015 07:37 Damdred wrote:
Also day post is at 18:06 for,me and it's 18:36 now Sooo it's right just sucks.
Anyway, who do you think is town/scum Lol, I don't think anything is certain after this. getrip was fine with suspecting both Sulfurus and Rels when necessary and he even voted for both at some point. Not only that, but both Sulfurus AND Rels were two of our top suspects as Mafia. I can't shake off the feeling that getrip just really screwed up by accident and we were jumping on it for no reason. Either way, I think that everyone should look over everything again. You made this post without knowing that geript flipped his alignment. My impression is that you are less convinced that geript is scum, and your worry for him actually being town caused you to be less convinced that Sulfurus and Rels were scum? Is this correct?
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 01:29 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 01:27 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:18 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 01:08 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:00 WaveofShadow wrote:On June 15 2015 00:56 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 00:55 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 00:53 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 00:03 MoosyDoosy wrote:
[quote]
Alright ruXxar, let's dance this dance of death.
1. Pulling the noob card
I mean, what can I say? This is completely my fault for not reading things correctly and I realize it more than anyone else. However, if you look at the posts I make cluelessly, you can see that I'm still genuinely attempting to help.
- When I bring up the possibility of 2 Mafia, I'm trying to expand our thought process in case there is more than 1 Mafia. After all, it's a terrible idea to have a confined mindset. Also, a nitpick with this point of yours. If you say that me suggesting there's 2 Mafia is "inexcusable" that's more of an accusation of bad play and not scum-oriented behavior.
- geript flipped as town. Okay, try and follow me here. IF we didn't know that geript was flipped, then my thought process was clear here. IF geript was a Mafia, then his two suspects in Sulfurus and Rels can't be Mafia as well unless he was busing them. Which was unfortunate because Sulfurus and Rels were also our top suspects for Mafia. IF geript was a townie which seems more likely due to the above scenario, we screwed up big time. That's what my thought process was but it turns out geript flipped which means we screwed up.
- Also, I do try and read stuff but some of it just doesn't end up in my brain. If you recall ruXxar, I did point out that we can ask questions in green text which at least displays some reading comprehension. You might want to point that out to show that I haven't completely been pulling out the noob card in every sentence I use.
2. Indecisive, passive play
- Your example where I'm suggesting either Sulfurus or geript to batsnacks is a terrible one. I believe I said it somewhere else before, but it was an attempt for me to set bait. If batsnacks does try to defend himself with either of my suggestions or just makes a good case in general, that means he's town. If he doesn't try, he's scum. In the end, I'd still say I think he's town because he's genuinely been trying to defend himself and used geript as a way out.
- Also, expand more on this if you're going to make it a point. You can't just nitpick things like you did with point #1 too. If we're talking about indecisiveness, cover how I don't really want to place a vote, I come into the thread passive, and I'm generally terrible at pressuring people. If you count all these things in, I'm pretty sure anyone can see that I have a passive playstyle. If you hate my playstyle, sure go for it and make a case off of my passivity, but don't nitpick stuff just to support your own argument.
- Also, I won't answer your other quotes because those are totally irrelevant when looked at in context.
3. Asking about pr roles
- Hm...I can see why you think a Mafia would post that. But don't worry, there was a reason behind that post. If you still want to pressure me on this, feel free to do so as I can't adequately defend myself on this one unless I wish to ruin the game.
Overall? Stop nitpicking stuff bro. Your argument was decent, but your evidence was weak. If you're going to try and kill a townie, you should work harder. The bold part makes me think you have a power role... Actually, I don't just think so, it seems like very strong evidence for a power role. I'm curious if you actually are the medic. (PS : Don't tell us if you are) Then why in blue fuck would you actually discuss this? Just terrible. Fuck.. that was a terrible play by me. I'm retracting my scumread on mossy based on this new information. ruXxar I put that post for a reason. I might be a town role. I might be a townie using it as leverage to keep me alive. I might be Mafia using it to keep myself alive. I might be trying to deceive you. That's not the main issue here, don't let that point blind you. Look at the rest of my actions and judge based on those. It was very enlightening for me to see you defend yourself so hard. I really liked the way you defended yourself with ferocity. I also believe in occams razor. I think that usually the scenario with the least amount of crazy assumptions is most likely to be correct. If you baited me with that piece of information, then good job, but I really liked your spirit in defending yourself, and seen in light of a newbie then it makes sense that you made some ramblings while under pressure. Keeping my townread on you for now. ^.^ I was hoping that someone would pick up on it and to get a solid read based on their reaction. Glad to see you're a townie with us ruXxar. How can you conclude that ruXxar is town based on this? If he's town, it's a bad play to bring it up because it draws attention to it. If he's scum, it's a bad play to bring it up because he would want to keep it secret and just shoot you. And I don't see anything in his tone that gives me a good read.
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 01:39 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:35 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:29 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 01:27 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:18 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 01:08 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:00 WaveofShadow wrote:On June 15 2015 00:56 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 00:55 ruXxar wrote:
[quote]
Actually, I don't just think so, it seems like very strong evidence for a power role.
I'm curious if you actually are the medic.
(PS : Don't tell us if you are) Then why in blue fuck would you actually discuss this? Just terrible. Fuck.. that was a terrible play by me. I'm retracting my scumread on mossy based on this new information. ruXxar I put that post for a reason. I might be a town role. I might be a townie using it as leverage to keep me alive. I might be Mafia using it to keep myself alive. I might be trying to deceive you. That's not the main issue here, don't let that point blind you. Look at the rest of my actions and judge based on those. It was very enlightening for me to see you defend yourself so hard. I really liked the way you defended yourself with ferocity. I also believe in occams razor. I think that usually the scenario with the least amount of crazy assumptions is most likely to be correct. If you baited me with that piece of information, then good job, but I really liked your spirit in defending yourself, and seen in light of a newbie then it makes sense that you made some ramblings while under pressure. Keeping my townread on you for now. ^.^ I was hoping that someone would pick up on it and to get a solid read based on their reaction. Glad to see you're a townie with us ruXxar. I want to hear your opinion on the whole batsnacks trap thing. It seemed like a very big jump from his normal demeanor. Like out of the blue he suddenly makes an irrational action like that. I know you said you didn't have any scumreads right now, but if you wanted to go with a gut feeling, who would you possibly want to know more about? Actually, I think there should be more discussion in general around the batsnacks trap case. Was I the only one that found it a strange change in behavior from him? It was a strange change in behavior. However, using Bat Traps is an indicator of batsnacks being town. Batsnacks looks significantly better after that geript push, despite the result.
Also, wow. Those points that batsnacks raised about Rels are really strong. Rels certainly has a lot to say for himself. ##vote Rels
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 05:50 ruXxar wrote:
Here's some food for thought.
So far we have scum reads on 2 mafia, Rels and Sulfu.
Both are newbies.
How likely do you think that all 3 mafia are in the newbie group?
Would it not make sense that at least 1 mafia is part of the veteran group?
People who have played previous newbie games, what is usually the distribution of mafia on newbie/veteran side? Teams are randomized. Plus, it's best to go one lynch at a time.
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:I don't particularly expect to be killed tonight. But just in case that happens, here's where my thoughts are at. Briefly, let's consider what it means if I do get killed. There was one post I made that I backreferenced twice, and is probably the post that would be most strongly associated with me. It was this one: n00bKing wrote:
Situation: 11 players have votes in place, and 2 players are not voting. All 11 of the votes are on either batsnacks or Sulfurus. No one has a vote on anyone else.
At this stage of a Day 1, I'm more used to seeing a smattering of votes on some other miscellaneous players too. Maybe partially because the scum team doesn't want to have all their votes in one place, so they fan out some (and maybe a random Townie or two gets tunneled on their respective targets, and won't budge, even though no one else has any interest in following along).
Theory: This situation makes it pretty likely that one of the two players receiving votes is actually scum, and that we don't have a Town vs. Town situation for our two vote leaders. The scum team has not been able to fan out their votes, because they've needed "all hands on deck" to make sure that the scum player doesn't take a runaway lead in the voting.
Conclusion: Even though there's a lot of time left in the Phase, we may not want to introduce a third lynch target, and should instead stick to trying to pick between these two (since, if the Theory is correct, one of them would flip Red). I didn't have any luck whatsoever trying to get geript out of the noose, and some players (like damdred and batsnacks) have been saying that a lot of my posts can just be safely ignored. Based on all that, I don't think the scum players would kill me, to make it look like they were trying to silence me, to FRAME one of Sulfurus/batsnacks, if they were both actually town. Rather, the scum team would only kill me if my Theory was indeed correct, and one of Sulfurus/batsnacks IS scum. So remember, if the scum team kills me, the Theory is correct. We already know that I still think the Theory is correct, and I've mentioned some possible teammates for batsnacks (damdred, Moosy) if he is the bad guy in this scenario. And I said that I also had some ideas in mind about who could be possible teammates for Sulfurus, if he is the bad guy in this scenario. So here goes. This part of n00bKing's post is rather ironic. But I need to disagree here. N00bKing's lynch theory was hardly the most important contribution he's made to the thread, and I see no reason to believe it. There are several reasons for lynching him, one of them being that he's townread by most everyone in the game and is rather active. This is shown by people being suspicious of him during the night, and that suspicion went nowhere fast. N00bKing was almost certainly not going to be lynched this game. The association case that n00bKing presents is very interesting, but I generally don't like association cases. I have various levels of suspicions about the people that he suspected, though.
Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 13:08 Sulfurus wrote:On June 14 2015 10:20 Trfel wrote:
Sulfurus, you need to say why you are scumreading me. You can't throw around suspicions with nothing behind them.
WaveofShadow, I don't understand how a player of your caliber can just vanish before the lynch and come back after it. You even came back after the later deadline. Can you please explain this? You basically said Rels his scum for changing his position a lot which isn't even alignment indicative. Like if you like at way rels changes his vote he actually does it in a very townie way giving good logic every time he's done. You on the other hand changed your vote to Geript sporadically (without even giving a read on him at any previous point in the thread) simply because Bats found a 'slip'. This read makes no sense. I didn't scumread Rels for changing his position a lot. I created a list of Rels' reads and used that as a basis for the arguments presented below, leaving the initial work there for people to check the evidence themselves. Please read more carefully. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 08:45 Sulfurus wrote:
Can someone besides trfel explain to me why he is being so universally town read? I admit looking back his tunnel on rels is better then I thought but that's it. He has spent all his time on this one player and doesn't have good reads on anyone else yet multiple players have put him at the top of their townlists. Catching ONE scum is enough of a challenge for me, much less catching multiple. If I can find someone who looks really scummy to lynch, that's about as much as I can hope for. I've been asking questions and pushing my suspicions, so I don't really understand how you can say that I've only been pushing one person.
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 09:18 Kickstart wrote:
Cop check on me is only useful in confirming im town. I am not mafia nor is anyone really suspicious of me of being mafia from what I can tell, aside from being somewhat concerned over my afkness, cop should check someone that they think will turn up red. You are awfully concerned with what blue roles we have and what they do and you are quite wrong in what actions they should be taking. Let the blue roles play their roles and stop trying to direct them into bad plays or outing themselves. Posts like this are useless, and give me the feeling that Kickstart isn't invested in this game. He got townread, and then left for a long time. This isn't alignment indicative, but now that he's back, he isn't pushing the thread, or asking questions (which I really would expect, given how much he missed), but he's lurking and only responding when someone called for a cop check on him (right at the start of the day). Why doesn't he simply prove himself through his actions, or find scum? This is a huge contrast to the Kickstart at the start of the game, and the Kickstart I have seen before. And I don't like it one bit. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 11:18 Kickstart wrote:
Of course me coming back after being afk looks bad, good job pointing out the obvious. Would you prefer I stayed afk? I don't need to make excuses cause it comes down to real life stuff which isn't anyone's business. Deal with it or don't. Me apologizing is because I don't think it is fair to everyone that I was afk when I am normally much more active. I should just ignore people commenting on me coming back but it annoyed me.
Wait, MORE of this? I don't understand why town!Kickstart would make these posts that don't provide any content and don't help town at all. Pure excuses, no scumhunting whatsoever.
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 11:38 WaveofShadow wrote:Trfel - First to jump on the wake of Bat's 'discovery.' Eh. On looking through I thought he was on Rels all day and then dropped his amazing case instantly in favor of even after this post: On June 14 2015 04:14 Trfel wrote:
Ugh, I just don't quite feel right about lynching geript or Damdred. They're both incredible players, and it's the weekend, so it's unfair to expect normal activity levels from them.
##vote Rels But he was onto batsnacks as well at one point. It does kinda look as though he almost doesn't believe his own case at times because of his initial dropoff from Rels onto bats, then as bats lost ground back onto rels again and onto Geript. He does put a LOT of effort into his rels push when he is on him though so at the same time it seems doubtful that this is a half-assed push where he was just looking for an out. Not sold either on this one. Also liked his activity around the lynch and his first post after flip. What is the mafia incentive for pushing Rels hard at times, and at other times going with other wagons? That's a lousy way to go about a bus, and if I'm scum and Rels is town, why would I keep jumping around between flipped town geript, likely town batsnacks, and assumed town Rels? Given the lackluster way geript was playing, I was suspicious of him. I didn't want to lynch him for that alone, though, because of the weekend and because of the potential risk. However, when batsnacks caught what I thought was a scumslip, this new information convinced me to lynch geript. If I didn't re-evaluate based on new information, that would be more telling. WaveofShadow, with your geript wagon analysis in mind, what do you think about ruXxar, given that you were townreading him earlier? + Show Spoiler Show nested quote + +On June 15 2015 11:03 WaveofShadow wrote:
Lol also this moosy vs ruxxar business.
I gotta say moosy you're scaring me a little because if I'm going to get burned by one of you it looks like you'd be the one. I can visibly see you improving in the middle of this game and part of me wonders if it's because you were sandbagging all along.
Rels is looking pretty bad, the evidence presented by batsnacks pushes it over the top. Rels hasn't seemed at all interested in defending himself. I'm more than happy to lynch him. Kickstart is also looking quite bad. I just don't understand how a townie can be gone for many important events, then come back and only post saying that "being afk isn't alignment indicative". No scumhunting, no questions, no analysis, just excuses. I just don't know about Sulfurus any more. For scumreading me, he seems uninterested in pushing it, but he's so inactive that I'm not sure if this even applies. I just really hope that power roles or associations sort this out. Would like to see a response from Sulfurus about the flaws I've pointed out in his scumread of me. Damdred still feels off. I can't quite put my finger on it, though, beyond a few tells that are best kept to myself for now. I need to take a careful look at his filter in the near future. Also need to look more closely at MoosyDoosy, ruXxar, and Oatsmaster.
1. Exactly the opposite. If geript had been scum, then my suspicion on Rels and Sulfurus would have been reduced as he had felt free to vote against them at points in the game. However, geript turned out to have flipped which allowed me to relook at Rels and Sulfurus.
2. I thought it was a newbie play on his part to have let it slip by pointing out that line. I was hoping that he would point it out and fall for it and he did. Given n00bKing's argument, I am still inclined to pressure ruXxar especially since he finds it difficult to adequately defend himself and is all over wagons at every given point in time.
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On June 16 2015 02:58 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:52 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:50 Rels wrote:On June 16 2015 02:26 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 20:55 Rels wrote:On June 15 2015 07:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:
##vote Rels
Good job n00bKing you did well. On June 15 2015 07:09 scott31337 wrote:
What an awesome post, n00b. I haven't felt good about Sulf or Rels, and Rels didn't reply to anything, just went to sleep.
##Vote Rels Hahaha that is so good (= I'm so happy to read these two posts. I think the two posters are scum. Here is why. All the suspicions noobkind put on me start with the premise that Sulfu is town. He himself say to lynch Sulfu first, then IF Sulfu is mafia, to lynch ruxxar or me day 3. He also says than ruxxar would be a better lynch than me day 3. Don't believe me ? On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:
Sulfurus would be my top lynch on Day 2. If he flips Red, is it better to go after ruXxar or Rels next? That's tough. The ties between Sulfurus and ruXxar are definitely stronger than the ties between Sulfurus and Rels. But Rels is being read by more people as being generally scummy right now, so he might be the easier lynch, even if ruXxar could be the more logical lynch.
[...]
If Sulfurus flips Green, then it's back to the drawing board, to some extent. Hopefully that would mean a batsnacks scum team, and he's paired with either Moosy or damdred. But that case is tougher to make than Sulfurus/ruXxar/Rels.
So. Just after this post, noobking dies and here is what happens: 1 - moosy and scott both expressed good feelings about noobking's post. 2 - noobking's post say to lynch Sulfu day 2, and if he flips mafia, to lynch ruxxar and me, ruxxar being the stronger lynch 3 - moosy and scott vote me instead. You know what is even funnier ? Let me quote this moosy post that happens just after his vote to me. Please read it carefully. On June 15 2015 07:05 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Alright guys, Rels first then Sulfurus. After that, we re-look over n00bKing's post then decide on the next person. I'm inclined to trust him though. That analysis was so good. That "so good analysis" that moosy is talking about says to lynch Sulfu first, and that I'm not mafia unless Sulfu is too. But moosy wants to lynch me first. Then he wants to lynch Sulfu. And finally ruxxar. I can see a scum agenda here. How ? Let's consider this timeline: 1 - we lynch Sulfu, he flips green 2 - if we follow noobking post, we're not lynching me nor ruxxar anymore. Conclusion: we only mislynched once. moosy seems to be pushing for a better timeline for mafia: 1 - we lynch me, I flip green 2 - too bad! Let's follow noobking post again ... mm that's true he asked for sulfu's lynch first. 3 - we lynch sulfu, I flip green Conclusion: two mislynches Yeh, again, that wasn't my intention. The reason why I voted to lynch you first was because there were already arguments from me, Trfel, batsnacks, and now n00bKing. Comparatively, no one really made any cases against Sulfurus which is why I felt it would be safer to be lynching you. Alright I can accept this explanation. I responded all the cases you mentioned, did that change your read on me ? The thing about linking your cases to noobking's is still a little, little bit scummy. Obviously it's weak so nobody will lynch you for only this. If anything, linking my cases to n00bKing's is the opposite of scummy considering that he turned out to be VT as well. Since it seems that no one exactly wants to immediately chop off my head, I'll go back and re-read over everything carefully. Now that you just admitted that your case and noobking's were different, I find it more opportunistic than good. That's why I called it a small scum hint.
Where did I say mine and n00bKing's cases were different? I was just saying that if you're linking mine and n00bKing's cases together, it would only show that I'm not scum because n00bKing turned out to be VT.
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I did vote ruxxar btw I just didn't post it. I do consider him an excellent lynch. Dude votes and scum reads me for 99% of the day only to sheep me hard onto a town wagon for reasons that he himself says were bad and a mistake.
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On June 16 2015 02:54 batsnacks wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:48 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:46 batsnacks wrote:
It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it. In what way? I don't consider this relevant because I feel like I understand what you were trying to say anyway but... It could also be "safer" because since there is more evidence for Rels, there will be less suspicion your way if he flips town. Compared to if you lynched hypothetical town sulfurus for (relatively) less evidence.
Lol, which is not what I was trying to say, say no.
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On June 16 2015 03:02 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:54 batsnacks wrote:On June 16 2015 02:48 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:46 batsnacks wrote:
It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it. In what way? I don't consider this relevant because I feel like I understand what you were trying to say anyway but... It could also be "safer" because since there is more evidence for Rels, there will be less suspicion your way if he flips town. Compared to if you lynched hypothetical town sulfurus for (relatively) less evidence. Lol, which is not what I was trying to say, say no.
Sometimes human beings accidentally reveal their intentions with their word choices. But it seriously doesn't matter you could have afked all day today and still not been the lynch.
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On June 16 2015 03:00 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:58 Rels wrote:On June 16 2015 02:52 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:50 Rels wrote:On June 16 2015 02:26 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 20:55 Rels wrote:On June 15 2015 07:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:
##vote Rels
Good job n00bKing you did well. On June 15 2015 07:09 scott31337 wrote:
What an awesome post, n00b. I haven't felt good about Sulf or Rels, and Rels didn't reply to anything, just went to sleep.
##Vote Rels Hahaha that is so good (= I'm so happy to read these two posts. I think the two posters are scum. Here is why. All the suspicions noobkind put on me start with the premise that Sulfu is town. He himself say to lynch Sulfu first, then IF Sulfu is mafia, to lynch ruxxar or me day 3. He also says than ruxxar would be a better lynch than me day 3. Don't believe me ? On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:
Sulfurus would be my top lynch on Day 2. If he flips Red, is it better to go after ruXxar or Rels next? That's tough. The ties between Sulfurus and ruXxar are definitely stronger than the ties between Sulfurus and Rels. But Rels is being read by more people as being generally scummy right now, so he might be the easier lynch, even if ruXxar could be the more logical lynch.
[...]
If Sulfurus flips Green, then it's back to the drawing board, to some extent. Hopefully that would mean a batsnacks scum team, and he's paired with either Moosy or damdred. But that case is tougher to make than Sulfurus/ruXxar/Rels.
So. Just after this post, noobking dies and here is what happens: 1 - moosy and scott both expressed good feelings about noobking's post. 2 - noobking's post say to lynch Sulfu day 2, and if he flips mafia, to lynch ruxxar and me, ruxxar being the stronger lynch 3 - moosy and scott vote me instead. You know what is even funnier ? Let me quote this moosy post that happens just after his vote to me. Please read it carefully. On June 15 2015 07:05 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Alright guys, Rels first then Sulfurus. After that, we re-look over n00bKing's post then decide on the next person. I'm inclined to trust him though. That analysis was so good. That "so good analysis" that moosy is talking about says to lynch Sulfu first, and that I'm not mafia unless Sulfu is too. But moosy wants to lynch me first. Then he wants to lynch Sulfu. And finally ruxxar. I can see a scum agenda here. How ? Let's consider this timeline: 1 - we lynch Sulfu, he flips green 2 - if we follow noobking post, we're not lynching me nor ruxxar anymore. Conclusion: we only mislynched once. moosy seems to be pushing for a better timeline for mafia: 1 - we lynch me, I flip green 2 - too bad! Let's follow noobking post again ... mm that's true he asked for sulfu's lynch first. 3 - we lynch sulfu, I flip green Conclusion: two mislynches Yeh, again, that wasn't my intention. The reason why I voted to lynch you first was because there were already arguments from me, Trfel, batsnacks, and now n00bKing. Comparatively, no one really made any cases against Sulfurus which is why I felt it would be safer to be lynching you. Alright I can accept this explanation. I responded all the cases you mentioned, did that change your read on me ? The thing about linking your cases to noobking's is still a little, little bit scummy. Obviously it's weak so nobody will lynch you for only this. If anything, linking my cases to n00bKing's is the opposite of scummy considering that he turned out to be VT as well. Since it seems that no one exactly wants to immediately chop off my head, I'll go back and re-read over everything carefully. Now that you just admitted that your case and noobking's were different, I find it more opportunistic than good. That's why I called it a small scum hint. Where did I say mine and n00bKing's cases were different? I was just saying that if you're linking mine and n00bKing's cases together, it would only show that I'm not scum because n00bKing turned out to be VT.
I'm not linking your case to noobking's. You did it yourself.
On June 16 2015 02:22 MoosyDoosy wrote:
[...]
I also admit, I was a bit excited over the fact that we caught Mafia which is why I linked mine, n00bKing's, and batsnack's arguments to Kickstart, since it seemed that he was wondering what had gone down over the course of the thread. And if anything else, arguments against a certain Mafia is the most important part of the game.
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EPT
