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We understand this is an issue that has led to a lot of opinions. Please remember above all to keep the discussion respectful and on topic. - This thread is specifically about NaNiwa and GOM and the controversy that occurred between them. It is not about IdrA and Sen in Code S, nor is it about any other players or tournaments. Pleas discuss that here.- This thread is not about the merits of the Blizzard Cup structure, or GOM's foreigner invite system. Please discuss that here.- Finally, this thread is not about Korean culture, Swedish culture, or any other ethnicity or group of people. Keep racism and cultural stereotypes out of this thread. Responsibility for keeping a thread constructive is primarily yours. Please keep that in mind. |
On December 16 2011 00:59 wetcraft wrote:
"It's not whether you win or lose. It's how you play the game."
I don't know. This only applies if you are an unprofessional playing for fun.
These people play for money only. You really think they have fun playing the same damned game every day for 10 hours? Hell no, they don't enjoy it one bit and they probably get really sick of it. The only thing keeping some people from retiring is if they win or not. Losing players never stick around too long because most of them get undetermined by their losses so they just quit since they arent making a solid income. Being a pro is pretty bad after a while. Granted, some pros may still enjoy playing this game but most of them don't enjoy it one bit.
I am not a pro, I can not speak for them but I can only assume this is what they are feeling.
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I watched the game and was a little surprised since I wanted to see a grudge match style game with winner taking some bragging rights away from it. Guess that doesn't mean much.
One thing that is annoying is that the English casters seemed to find the whole situation hilarious. Laughing the whole minute long game and finding the decision great. The Korean commentators seemed a little more serious, which they should be, as this was to be a great match.
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On December 16 2011 08:45 Lebzetu wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 00:59 wetcraft wrote:
"It's not whether you win or lose. It's how you play the game." I don't know. This only applies if you are an unprofessional playing for fun. These people play for money only. You really think they have fun playing the same damned game every day for 10 hours? Hell no, they don't enjoy it one bit and they probably get really sick of it. The only thing keeping some people from retiring is if they win or not. Losing players never stick around too long because most of them get undetermined by their losses so they just quit since they arent making a solid income. Being a pro is pretty bad after a while. Granted, some pros may still enjoy playing this game but most of them don't enjoy it one bit. I am not a pro, I can not speak for them but I can only assume this is what they are feeling.
mr.chae disagree with you, so does boxer, and so does many people who love boxer for the same reason.
and its the same reason why naniwa got so much hate. if that really wasn't the case, other pros wouldn't have left such negative comments on their tweeter. granted, not everyone thinks the same but in this case, those who think money and winning is everything is the minority.
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My take
Blizzcup:
Naniwa throws a game acting a bit unprofessional and selfish, on this most agree.
GOM tv punishes Naniwa by revoking his code S seed.
Majority of the foreigncommunity thinks this is to harsh and thinks fine or warning would have been more appropriate.
People note that seeds are given to players that has done the same in other tournaments(Idra wo, Demuslim worker rush) thinks a double standards are being applied. Further people think he is being unfairly punished without having broken any official rule."nullum lege sine crimen" Some people get mad enough that they email GOM demanding refunds.
The Code S seed
GOM realizes that part of the foreigncommunity is pissed and try to calm things down. In an official statement they say that: although Naniwa didn´t directly break any rule he acted unprofessionaly and would therefore not receive a code S seed. Further they claim that Naniwa never had a Code S spot from providence due to the change in GSL format. He is still free to compete in the GSL and is not banned.
This is of course met by surprise in the community where everyone has assumed that Naniwa had a Code S spot. It´s fairly quickly established that MLG has also announced that on several places on there website. Further GOMTV:s on website states that all winners of MLG circuit events shall receive a Sode S spot, Providence was clearly such an event(recently confirmed by MLG). The announcement of change to GSL structure contained no information of the MLG contract being changed and as Tyler pointed out the new format meant no hindrance for the MLG contract to be carried out so why change it in secret without telling anyone? People believing this is imo just a bit naive.To me and most other people it is now clear that GOM lied about Naniwa not having a seed. That they revoked it without telling anyone including MLG is just not believable.
People who claims that the contract was changed between Providence and Blizzcup should also ask themself if a prize already given really could be retracted without cause based on a third party agreement between GOM and MLG.
All this of course puts MLG in an awkward spot. On the one hand they have the business partner who have given them the most competitive SC2 tournament outside Korea on the other a player who misbehaved at there own tournament and at Blizzcup. If GOM had just said that they revoked Naniwas seed because of his actions they could simply have stayed out of it. GOM however claims that Naniwa never had a seed and that he broke no rules. People now demands to hear from MLG on the subject and demands are raised for MLG to enforce the contract.
MLG can never claim that Naniwa didn´t receive a code S spot it is allover their website on the other hand they dont want a fight with GOM over this issue. After pondering the issue for 24h it turns out MLG are lucky the contract could apparently be unilaterally changed by one party (as a law student I can confirm the suspicion that this is not the norm.). This effectively lets MLG of the hook, none can demand they takelegal action, they would have no case. That they thought Naniwa received a code S spot was just because GOM had not informed them that the contract between them had been changed.
Hurrah!
So what should be done about all this?
IMO nothing. Perhaps Naniwa was to harshly punished but imo that was still GOM:s decision to make. They based it on Korean norms and likely Korean community opinion and I personally doubt that a Korean player would have been treated any differently. There mistake came later, realizing that large parts of the foreign community thought the decision unfair they tried to lie their way out of it. Stupid, but somewhat understandable and it doesn´t mean they are evil people hating foreigners. Keeping at this issue now will imo accomplish nothing GOM will never change their decision and/or admit to lying.
I do however believe that both they and other tournaments have learnt their lessons. Rules and sanctions need to be made clearer and meaningless games avoided.
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Justifiable and makes rational sense. When you're a player with televised matches to be seen by many people who are there to support you, it's not just for you, but for your fans and viewers. "We gave the seed to Quantic Gaming's protoss pro-gamer NaNiwa, not the Swedish youth Johan Lucchesi who plays the game well." explains the entire situation very well. Get over the drama. Naniwa will be back next GSL.
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Okay this is my 2 cents on what happened. Seriously.
Naniwa was have thought to have cheated because of how he paused the game against NesTea and so on and so forth... Most of you already know this. During an interview with Naniwa, he states that he personally thought NesTea was a genius but he was just in fact an "idiot." But I give Naniwa the benefit of the doubt and I'm not going to assume whether or not it was discovered and if it blew up in Korea or not.
Naniwa was one of the few people that were invited to play in this prestigious Blizzard Cup tournament. The fact that GOMtv was involved was a big deal for they also run the SC2 games for the GSL. Many other players would kill to have this kind of spotlight for a tournament. Even so, during the interview in front of all of the players. interviewers and who knows who else was there; Naniwa said that the Blizzard Cup was "just another tournament."
Just because Naniwa has been doing well does not give him the right to throw his opinions out like that. It could be his personal view on the tournament but that shows lack of sportsmanship and respect to the people who put the time and effort into the tournament and to the fans who have been looking forward to seeing Naniwa play. I'm also pretty confident that many people also were looking forward to watching the NesTea vs. Naniwa game as well.
In addition, during the interview, NesTea basically explains why he was bothered and why he wanted to play Naniwa. He stated that Naniwa paused the game, and started the game without even mentioning it to him. To put more onto that, NesTea said that Naniwa exploited his build during the tournament. When Mr. Chae eventually translated what NesTea had said and told Naniwa, he had a puzzled look on his face. Unfortunately, no one knows if it's really true or not because even though there was an MLG representative with Naniwa's coach in the booth, there seems to be an unsettled rift in the debate there. This increases tension and excitement for viewers and for Naniwa to hurt NesTea's pride (NesTea has been training to beat Naniwa) of all of his hard work like that; it's a show of bad manner and lack of sportsmanship.
Obviously there are a lot of Starcraft 2 fans around the world and in Korea. A lot of people were tuning in to seeing this tournament with the top players (including Stephano!) duke it out for prize money. Also since NesTea mentioned his input and situation about Naniwa on air... there was bound to be expectations for his game against Naniwa.
In the end, when Naniwa and NesTea finally played together, they were both 0-3 and unfortunately out of the tournament. Naniwa thinking that he could throw away the game because he was already out is excusable but, the manner in which he did so was very disgusting.
If Naniwa continued to play simply for the sake of losing, he could have done some wack build and had lost or won. The matter of fact is that he did it in a game against NesTea. I personally believe that if it was someone else he would not have done it but with Quantic's official statement (which was revised by the way), there is no actual legitimate reason that anyone can receive but that. Although he did lose, the fact that he was probe rushing with one hand like he didn't care about the prestigious tournament was an insult and a greater slap to the face to NesTea.
I'm myself Korean and I understand the standpoint in which GOMtv has taken. Koreans take great pride in what they do and what Naniwa did was not only an insult to NesTea (who holds great esteem in the Korean community but GOMtv's actions cannot be based off of that fact) but also to the people who put in the work and effort to bring the tournament to the mass, the people who organized the cup, the managers who brought them there, and fellow friends and fans who helped push the pro-gamers to achieve the status they currently have now. What Naniwa did was an insult to what the definition of a pro-gamer is. Professional gamers do not only play for the cash payout but also because of their passion for the game itself, the respect and pride that it brings, and the passionate fans who follow them so. Therefore Naniwa did not only let himself and his reputation down, but also did so to his fans.
The fact that he was only suspended for a GSL Code S seed isn't really much of a bad thing. The reason why Koreans are good at Starcraft is because they beat themselves over the head (maybe a bit tad too much) on what they did wrong and practice it until they get it right. They hone their skills and prove themselves in the SC2 battlefield and reclaim whatever honor, pride and status they may have lost. This is why Korea is one of the most competitive SC2 countries in the world, everyone has the spirit of a winner.
Also, everyone has been saying that the penalty was too harsh but look what happened to SlayerS_CoCa. He's a fan favorite and just because he gave a game to a friend in a KSL weekly for a Code A seed, he was withdrawn from the Code S brackets. He is also currently under SlayerS management and won't be competing for a while until the team finds him capable enough to do so. What CoCa did broke the rules but it did not affect anyone else but him and his friend. What Naniwa did affected a large part of the SC2 community and although Quantic is taking a positive supportive standpoint for Naniwa; the actions they are taking are not as severe as it would have been if Naniwa was in a Korean team.
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On December 15 2011 20:08 peterra wrote:
Prolly the last season ticket I've ever bought of GOMTV.
I think the punishment is absolutely overextended to what Naniwa did. My complete support on naniwa and my money out of gomtv now.
So you pay money to see players in top pro (a privilege to even be there) level probe rush cos they couldn't give a shit?
Seriously need to consider what you are paying for.
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I am honestly happy about the honnesty in Nani's proberush. Nothing that infuriates me more then crappy "I am just playing this game off, but trying to fool you its the real deal". Lets face it this was never going to be an epic Naniwa nestea rematch. It was this or some crappy 4gate. I prefer the proberush, not everybody does, i understand that. I love that i can count on Nani to go all or nothing.
One argument I hear is that he should try his best.
From sports we know that is unlikely to happen at this stage in a tournament in any sport (a game that makes absolutely no difference all is already lost). Upholding a rule that people had to give it there absolute all in every game would yield quiet a lot of guilty verdicts. I don't see it as a realistic rule to have or enforce.
What about its bad for production company's, sponsors, and everyone watching etc.
We can first of all agree it was never gona be an epic game. It was this or some crap 4gate, soo i cant see why they would cast it. Since you realy cant force people to do there absolute best in all situations, you must insted settle for having a standard of minimum effort? This so that the people who dont know anything about starcraft are fooled in to thinking there watching a cut throat highlevel sc2 match, when they where really watching someone throw a game with a crappy 4gate (or whatever the standard is). The problem is the rest of us will somewhere in the game realize that "hey this isent real", and people like me get pissed of they stole 10+ minuets of my time. This has happened more then a few times.
But i understand peopel and turnament organisers having a rule to ensure some kind of seriousness in the play. I would rather they dident show meaningless games but if they have to, make a rule that you have to keep some kind of standard of play.
The problem comes when they dont have that rule and get pissed of and punishes the player anyway. What happens ingame is regulated and is expected to be regulated to an extent that they are considered exhaustive rules. For a tournament to say: "ooh yeah, thats bad your not allowed to do that", and going outside of the rulebook and inflicting a punishment for an in-game situation should never happen, and not be tolerated. If for some reason it is not covered in the rules I can imagine it being ok in cases of criminal acts. This isent even close.
For people who say Nani is a douche and that he did something wrong and thereby got what he deserved. I have only one thing to say.
You might be right (I dissagre). But there where no rules against what Nani did. The rule of law is an important one in a society. Its also important in sports. If you want to make a rule about this behaviour please do GOM. But its always wrong to go outside of the rules to punish someone even if the punnichment is resonable and correct according to the general consensus. This goes in society and it goes in sports, and hopefully one day in esports. If you find an offence you cant punish by the rules but you feel should be punished, just tell the guilty party that it wont be tolerated in the future and make new rules next time.
Now it seems Gom is saying that the changed the prize in retrospect, and that thats al nice and good and thereby not any punishment to Nanniwa. For one i don't buy it not being a punishment. Two, this is almost worse. But thats another story.
The GSL has in my eyes lost so much as a professional tournament. Was going to buy a full years membership, not any more.
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On December 16 2011 13:06 narkissos wrote:
People note that seeds are given to players that has done the same in other tournaments(Idra wo, Demuslim worker rush) thinks a double standards are being applied.
wasn't the worker rush thing cleared with the admins of the respective tournament beforehand?
I don't know when or where that happened, but quite a few people claimed that and I hear nor counterarguments.
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On December 16 2011 21:49 JustPassingBy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 13:06 narkissos wrote:
People note that seeds are given to players that has done the same in other tournaments(Idra wo, Demuslim worker rush) thinks a double standards are being applied. wasn't the worker rush thing cleared with the admins of the respective tournament beforehand? I don't know when or where that happened, but quite a few people claimed that and I hear nor counterarguments.
I thought the problem was with disrespecting the fans and your opponent? What have asking the admins to do with that?
With that said GOM is of course free to have a different standard in their tournament and even tho I personally think the punishment to harsh I also think it was their decision to make. My only real problem was lying about it.
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On December 16 2011 21:31 SilverforceX wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 20:08 peterra wrote:
Prolly the last season ticket I've ever bought of GOMTV.
I think the punishment is absolutely overextended to what Naniwa did. My complete support on naniwa and my money out of gomtv now. So you pay money to see players in top pro (a privilege to even be there) level probe rush cos they couldn't give a shit? Seriously need to consider what you are paying for.
QFT
User was warned for this post
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On December 16 2011 21:36 KaptenCulpa wrote:
I am honestly happy about the honnesty in Nani's proberush. Nothing that infuriates me more then crappy "I am just playing this game off, but trying to fool you its the real deal". Lets face it this was never going to be an epic Naniwa nestea rematch. It was this or some crappy 4gate. I prefer the proberush, not everybody does, i understand that. I love that i can count on Nani to go all or nothing.
One argument I hear is that he should try his best.
From sports we know that is unlikely to happen at this stage in a tournament in any sport (a game that makes absolutely no difference all is already lost). Upholding a rule that people had to give it there absolute all in every game would yield quiet a lot of guilty verdicts. I don't see it as a realistic rule to have or enforce.
What about its bad for production company's, sponsors, and everyone watching etc.
We can first of all agree it was never gona be an epic game. It was this or some crap 4gate, soo i cant see why they would cast it. Since you realy cant force people to do there absolute best in all situations, you must insted settle for having a standard of minimum effort? This so that the people who dont know anything about starcraft are fooled in to thinking there watching a cut throat highlevel sc2 match, when they where really watching someone throw a game with a crappy 4gate (or whatever the standard is). The problem is the rest of us will somewhere in the game realize that "hey this isent real", and people like me get pissed of they stole 10+ minuets of my time. This has happened more then a few times.
But i understand peopel and turnament organisers having a rule to ensure some kind of seriousness in the play. I would rather they dident show meaningless games but if they have to, make a rule that you have to keep some kind of standard of play.
The problem comes when they dont have that rule and get pissed of and punishes the player anyway. What happens ingame is regulated and is expected to be regulated to an extent that they are considered exhaustive rules. For a tournament to say: "ooh yeah, thats bad your not allowed to do that", and going outside of the rulebook and inflicting a punishment for an in-game situation should never happen, and not be tolerated. If for some reason it is not covered in the rules I can imagine it being ok in cases of criminal acts. This isent even close.
For people who say Nani is a douche and that he did something wrong and thereby got what he deserved. I have only one thing to say.
You might be right (I dissagre). But there where no rules against what Nani did. The rule of law is an important one in a society. Its also important in sports. If you want to make a rule about this behaviour please do GOM. But its always wrong to go outside of the rules to punish someone even if the punnichment is resonable and correct according to the general consensus. This goes in society and it goes in sports, and hopefully one day in esports. If you find an offence you cant punish by the rules but you feel should be punished, just tell the guilty party that it wont be tolerated in the future and make new rules next time.
Now it seems Gom is saying that the changed the prize in retrospect, and that thats al nice and good and thereby not any punishment to Nanniwa. For one i don't buy it not being a punishment. Two, this is almost worse. But thats another story.
The GSL has in my eyes lost so much as a professional tournament. Was going to buy a full years membership, not any more.
Good write up. Incredible unprofessionalism showed by GOM and I will not be supporting them further either.
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On December 16 2011 21:36 KaptenCulpa wrote:
I am honestly happy about the honnesty in Nani's proberush. Nothing that infuriates me more then crappy "I am just playing this game off, but trying to fool you its the real deal". Lets face it this was never going to be an epic Naniwa nestea rematch. It was this or some crappy 4gate. I prefer the proberush, not everybody does, i understand that. I love that i can count on Nani to go all or nothing.
One argument I hear is that he should try his best.
From sports we know that is unlikely to happen at this stage in a tournament in any sport (a game that makes absolutely no difference all is already lost). Upholding a rule that people had to give it there absolute all in every game would yield quiet a lot of guilty verdicts. I don't see it as a realistic rule to have or enforce.
What about its bad for production company's, sponsors, and everyone watching etc.
We can first of all agree it was never gona be an epic game. It was this or some crap 4gate, soo i cant see why they would cast it. Since you realy cant force people to do there absolute best in all situations, you must insted settle for having a standard of minimum effort? This so that the people who dont know anything about starcraft are fooled in to thinking there watching a cut throat highlevel sc2 match, when they where really watching someone throw a game with a crappy 4gate (or whatever the standard is). The problem is the rest of us will somewhere in the game realize that "hey this isent real", and people like me get pissed of they stole 10+ minuets of my time. This has happened more then a few times.
But i understand peopel and turnament organisers having a rule to ensure some kind of seriousness in the play. I would rather they dident show meaningless games but if they have to, make a rule that you have to keep some kind of standard of play.
The problem comes when they dont have that rule and get pissed of and punishes the player anyway. What happens ingame is regulated and is expected to be regulated to an extent that they are considered exhaustive rules. For a tournament to say: "ooh yeah, thats bad your not allowed to do that", and going outside of the rulebook and inflicting a punishment for an in-game situation should never happen, and not be tolerated. If for some reason it is not covered in the rules I can imagine it being ok in cases of criminal acts. This isent even close.
For people who say Nani is a douche and that he did something wrong and thereby got what he deserved. I have only one thing to say.
You might be right (I dissagre). But there where no rules against what Nani did. The rule of law is an important one in a society. Its also important in sports. If you want to make a rule about this behaviour please do GOM. But its always wrong to go outside of the rules to punish someone even if the punnichment is resonable and correct according to the general consensus. This goes in society and it goes in sports, and hopefully one day in esports. If you find an offence you cant punish by the rules but you feel should be punished, just tell the guilty party that it wont be tolerated in the future and make new rules next time.
Now it seems Gom is saying that the changed the prize in retrospect, and that thats al nice and good and thereby not any punishment to Nanniwa. For one i don't buy it not being a punishment. Two, this is almost worse. But thats another story.
The GSL has in my eyes lost so much as a professional tournament. Was going to buy a full years membership, not any more.
Naniwa is very immature and tbh i hope he learns from this incident.
I agree that gom tv subcribers shouldn't be cheated out of a game just because one party doesn't want to play.
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There is a lot of talk about professionalism in this threads, however mixed mainly with opinions... While ethics exists in every relationship, being professional or not, I find it hard to believe that professionalism can be maintained without formal, written rules and contracts. Correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as i understand, there is no rules or contract between GOM.TV and players that describe a certain way the players are supposed to play their games. If a player probe rushes, 6 pools, forgets to send his workers to mine, or for example plays only with the mouse and stands up to stretch, this is not ethic, no doubt about it, but is it an act of non-professionalism, when there are no formal obligations?
There are a lot of comments, how trowing away games is bad for eSports, and makes the viewers unhappy. Well, there are many other things, that follow the same pattern and are formally a way of playing the game. Anyone remember open season 2 and Marine+SCV rushes? These games certainly weren't more exciting, then a probe rush... Was it ethic that players got to the finals with such strategies, and did this kill eSports???
I think, after the incidents with NaNiwa and Coca and after taking such severe and controversy measures, GOM.TV should take the chance to clarify, what obligations a player has, what kind of behavior is not tolerated, and mostly, as with every regulation, what kind of punishment might be expected, when not complying. Every tournament is doomed to face such situations and , without formal regulations, to take controversy actions. Please define formal rules and make clear what players risk, when they don't play the game like you want them to!
My 2 cents.
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On December 16 2011 21:36 KaptenCulpa wrote:
You might be right (I dissagre). But there where no rules against what Nani did. The rule of law is an important one in a society. Its also important in sports. If you want to make a rule about this behaviour please do GOM. But its always wrong to go outside of the rules to punish someone even if the punnichment is resonable and correct according to the general consensus. This goes in society and it goes in sports, and hopefully one day in esports. If you find an offence you cant punish by the rules but you feel should be punished, just tell the guilty party that it wont be tolerated in the future and make new rules next time.
Now it seems Gom is saying that the changed the prize in retrospect, and that thats al nice and good and thereby not any punishment to Nanniwa. For one i don't buy it not being a punishment. Two, this is almost worse. But thats another story.
The GSL has in my eyes lost so much as a professional tournament. Was going to buy a full years membership, not any more.
Except that there are higher courts which can set laws?
New laws can be made to cover up holes and loops that the current ones have.
It is even more important that the laws are doing what its purpose is.
Honestly, you should be glad that nani isn't playing at GSL because at the very least, he isn't going to get anymore hate from the korean side.
when a player comes to a tournament, sit down in a booth and plays the game, they should respect the opponent and viewer, throwing games off like this is quite disrespectful.
SCV and marine rush games are actually possible to lead to win, whereas probe rush, really isn't.
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I'm still waiting for a statement from GOM about this whole mess with the code S seed. They need to explain what has happened and apologize imo. If they don't say anything more then I will assume that they make up rules and punishments on the fly which is really unprofessional.
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On December 17 2011 23:23 Gurgl wrote:
I'm still waiting for a statement from GOM about this whole mess with the code S seed. They need to explain what has happened and apologize imo. If they don't say anything more then I will assume that they make up rules and punishments on the fly which is really unprofessional.
They don't make up rules on the fly, Naniwa did disrespect his opponent, and there shouldn't even have to be a rule in the first place.
Anything "makes up punishments on the fly" when a player acts so incredibly idiotically that no one could have predicted such an occurrence, committees usually hold hearings. As there's no real need to understand why Naniwa rushed his probes other than being mad and not thinking about anything, there's no need for a hearing.
Other than that, I'm surprised Gom was so lenient on Naniwa. I'm just glad the Blizzcup finals were so great and they made the HQ stream definitely worth the money. I almost thought I had wasted my money because Naniwa v Nestea turned out to be worthless, MC threw away a game with carriers, Stephano got elim'd in a game he wasn't playing, and Hero just got crushed.
I'm not as annoyed at Naniwa now over the probe rush, since Gom was kind of able to make up for the lack of Naniwa v Nestea. I still want to see Naniwa v Nestea and now I'm going to have to wait forever (few tournaments over the Holidays, Naniwa removed from code S, longer format so Nestea has less chances to go to foreign tournaments).
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On December 17 2011 23:39 boxturtle wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2011 23:23 Gurgl wrote:
I'm still waiting for a statement from GOM about this whole mess with the code S seed. They need to explain what has happened and apologize imo. If they don't say anything more then I will assume that they make up rules and punishments on the fly which is really unprofessional. They don't make up rules on the fly, Naniwa did disrespect his opponent, and there shouldn't even have to be a rule in the first place. Anything "makes up punishments on the fly" when a player acts so incredibly idiotically that no one could have predicted such an occurrence, committees usually hold hearings. As there's no real need to understand why Naniwa rushed his probes other than being mad and not thinking about anything, there's no need for a hearing. Other than that, I'm surprised Gom was so lenient on Naniwa. I'm just glad the Blizzcup finals were so great and they made the HQ stream definitely worth the money. I almost thought I had wasted my money because Naniwa v Nestea turned out to be worthless, MC threw away a game with carriers, Stephano got elim'd in a game he wasn't playing, and Hero just got crushed. I'm not as annoyed at Naniwa now over the probe rush, since Gom was kind of able to make up for the lack of Naniwa v Nestea. I still want to see Naniwa v Nestea and now I'm going to have to wait forever (few tournaments over the Holidays, Naniwa removed from code S, longer format so Nestea has less chances to go to foreign tournaments).
I think this whole situation clearly shows why there needs to be rules for situations like this, with clearly defined punishments. If GOM had a rule saying players must play their best in every game, otherwise they lose their position in any of GOMs leagues, there would be no need for all these speculations regarding Naniwas punishment.
Then there's the whole mess about the code S seed which is a big scandal imo, even it was all a lie to cover up the punishment of Naniwa.
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GOM.TV nearly destroyed an individual E-Sport career, they nearly destroyed a persons life. And this based on vague rules and emotional behavior... this is disgusting. I can't hate GOM more.
If GOM want to be a respected organisation they have to have RULES and stick to them. Then we can talk.
They are talking about the respect regarding competitions and their holy tourney, which is a honour to play in.
GOM and GSL just showed that they run their organisation in a way that couldn't be respected.
GOM.TV couldn't be respected anymore by any western player or e-sports organisation, without rules they stick to.
edit: GOM is treating MLG poorly, treating Naniwa poorly, treating the community poorly.
And then they punish one person in the name of "respect" nearly to throw his career? STFU GOM
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GOM hosted an entertainment show and hoped it would be competitive. They actually need to host a proper tournament with a competitive format instead of choosing a format and expect the players to make it competitive. They need to treat players as players and not as entertainers.
I didn't think of it at the time because it wasn't it didn't matter but in hindsight Rain's ban from the GSL is outrageous. Rain and Idra both withdrew from the GSL. Neither got replaced yet Rain got banned for not telling them beforehand. They are competitors not actors. I agree that players should behave decently but GOM punishes players based on moral viewpoints instead of actual rules. I can't agree with the way GOM handles things.
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EPT
