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Luepert
United States1933 Posts
On August 17 2011 14:35 ch33psh33p wrote: Nestea Vs Mvp finals at Blizzcon. Nestea V Mvp Gsl finals in Blizzcon. 100% happening. Nestea plays mvp in round of 16 so actually 1 get eliminated b4 round of 8 so thats kind of impossible. | ||
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MattBarry
United States4006 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:25 grandmoose wrote: Who was hard for MVP at MLG? DRG and MMA are the only ones who even remotely come to mind. What top class player did MVP face at GSLWC other than mkp? San is code b now, huk wasn't the top player he is now, July isn't too great still love him though. Now if mop had won I'd be more inclined to count it since he would have beaten mc and MVP | ||
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Zane
Romania3916 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:28 Luepert wrote: Nestea plays mvp in round of 16 so actually 1 get eliminated b4 round of 8 so thats kind of impossible.  The GSL finals that will be held at Blizzcon are for the next GSL, not this one. Anyway, a GSL final consisting of NesTea/Mvp/MC would be too interesting so it won't happen.On August 18 2011 05:29 MattBarry wrote: What top class player did MVP face at GSLWC other than mkp? San is code b now, huk wasn't the top player he is now, July isn't too great still love him though. Now if mop had won I'd be more inclined to count it since he would have beaten mc and MVP What top class opponent did NesTea face in GSL July then? (if you don't consider July top-class you probably don't consider Losira top class either) Or MC in March for that matter? Does that make their championships invalid too? | ||
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HolyArrow
United States7116 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:26 zerious wrote: lol people mad because MC didn't get to Blizzcon, he had his chance and got destroyed by MVP. I'm not mad about that. I'm mad that he didn't get to go due to a perfectly legitimate achievement being discounted. Please don't pretend that the Open seasons are somehow not achievements anymore just because they occurred last year. On paper, MVP has more points in a system that doesn't count an entire GSL win for MC. That's the reality of things, and I guess if you like MVP more than MC, you'll rationalize that for yourself, but if you wanted a truly accurate measure of achievements, I can't think of any argument that would successfully prove that the Open season achievements shouldn't be counted. The only thing keeping them from being counted is an arbitrary cutoff. | ||
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Luepert
United States1933 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:04 MattBarry wrote: MVP is the best Terran in the world. He's absolutely ridiculously good. That doesn't change the fact that GSLWC was only 8 Koreans yeah but they were the best koreans, it like starting at the round of 8, he'd be there anyways so it still the top skill players. | ||
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FrostedMiniWheats
United States30730 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:28 Luepert wrote: Nestea plays mvp in round of 16 so actually 1 get eliminated b4 round of 8 so thats kind of impossible. Err aren't those the finals for next months gsl that will be at blizzcon? August gsl is happening in Korea I thought? | ||
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tuho12345
4482 Posts
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Luepert
United States1933 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:04 MattBarry wrote: MVP is the best Terran in the world. He's absolutely ridiculously good. That doesn't change the fact that GSLWC was only 8 Koreans Hes good but he always loses to bomber, code a championship and team league, its like hes alergic to bomber. | ||
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Luepert
United States1933 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:30 HolyArrow wrote: I'm not mad about that. I'm mad that he didn't get to go due to a perfectly legitimate achievement being discounted. Please don't pretend that the Open seasons are somehow not achievements anymore just because they occurred last year. On paper, MVP has more points in a system that doesn't count an entire GSL win for MC. That's the reality of things, and I guess if you like MVP more than MC, you'll rationalize that for yourself, but if you wanted a truly accurate measure of achievements, I can't think of any argument that would successfully prove that the Open season achievements shouldn't be counted. The only thing keeping them from being counted is an arbitrary cutoff. blizzcon 2011 is only based on 2011 results, i know mc has 2 gsls but one was 2010. | ||
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HolyArrow
United States7116 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:31 Luepert wrote: yeah but they were the best koreans, it like starting at the round of 8, he'd be there anyways so it still the top skill players. How do you know they were the best Koreans? They were the best Koreans on paper, but the actual best Koreans is perfectly up for debate, especially since anyPro was amongst them. MVP's path to winning the WC consisted of beating HuK, Dimaga, San, and MKP, and this was before HuK was considered really good. It's a tough path for sure, but can you really compare it to having to get through the group stage that claims so many good players (MC, MVP, and Nestea have ALL lost in the group stages at some point(s), not to mention other extremely strong players like MKP) or to two whole extra rounds (as is in the Super Tournament and Open seasons), all of which are against Koreans? No matter what, assuming roughly the same pool of players, a smaller tournament is easier than a bigger one simply because there are less games you need to go through to win, and one lacking the group stage is even easier because the group stage is so volatile. | ||
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Allscorpion
United Kingdom319 Posts
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chipmonklord17
United States11944 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:30 HolyArrow wrote: I'm not mad about that. I'm mad that he didn't get to go due to a perfectly legitimate achievement being discounted. Please don't pretend that the Open seasons are somehow not achievements anymore just because they occurred last year. On paper, MVP has more points in a system that doesn't count an entire GSL win for MC. That's the reality of things, and I guess if you like MVP more than MC, you'll rationalize that for yourself, but if you wanted a truly accurate measure of achievements, I can't think of any argument that would successfully prove that the Open season achievements shouldn't be counted. The only thing keeping them from being counted is an arbitrary cutoff. This brings up a question, did Nestea REALLY do that well this year? 2 championships being counted (points wise), at least 1 ro32, a semifinals or ro8 vs MVP. This is the first time I realized that Nestea has the most points, WITHOUT his GSL2 win. Also with MKPs 2nd place finish would he have surpassed MVP as well? EDIT: My question about Nestea doing that well was not a blow to Nestea, it was a shock that he did much better this year than I expected (I thought he was first counting his GSL2 win) | ||
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Cloud9157
United States2968 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:25 grandmoose wrote: Who was hard for MVP at MLG? DRG and MMA are the only ones who even remotely come to mind. KiwiKaki took him to game 3. Kiwi is no joke, and is definitely a highly skilled Protoss. Drewbie also took a game off him, but ehh. | ||
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Luepert
United States1933 Posts
When MVP beats Marinekingprime in gsl, it counts When MVP beats Marinekingprime in WC, it doesn't count??? Its the same guy... | ||
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HolyArrow
United States7116 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:35 Luepert wrote: blizzcon 2011 is only based on 2011 results, i know mc has 2 gsls but one was 2010. Yes, I know. That's what my argument is about, dude. I realize that MC just got screwed by the system, but there are all these people that believe that MVP is simply more accomplished than MC overall and refer to the point system as if it's infallible. A more accurate statement would be, "MVP is more accomplished than MC this year". That's why I'm emphasizing my point about "truly accurate" measuring of achievements, because if you make the cutoff point at the start of this year, that's losing some accuracy, no? I'm not saying Blizzcon should count points that way, because it's Blizzcon 2011, so that makes sense. I'm just saying that the current points system isn't a truly accurate representation of achievements. | ||
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HolyArrow
United States7116 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:39 Luepert wrote: I find it funny how people discount the WC, When MVP beats Marinekindprime in gsl, it counts When MVP beats Marinekingprime in WC, it doesn't count??? Its the same guy... That's a pretty shortsighted argument. The WC is one round shorter than Code S, and the missing round is the incredibly volatile group stage, while the WC is 2 rounds shorter than the ST and Open GSLs. By your logic, I could have a one-round GSL with just MVP and MKP, and count that as well if MVP beats MKP again, because "it's the same guy". | ||
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skaban
Chile21 Posts
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Luepert
United States1933 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:40 HolyArrow wrote: Yes, I know. That's what my argument is about, dude. I realize that MC just got screwed by the system, but there are all these people that believe that MVP is simply more accomplished than MC overall and refer to the point system as if it's infallible. A more accurate statement would be, "MVP is more accomplished than MC this year". That's why I'm emphasizing my point about "truly accurate" measuring of achievements, because if you make the cutoff point at the start of this year, that's losing some accuracy, no? I'm not saying Blizzcon should count points that way, because it's Blizzcon 2011, so that makes sense. I'm just saying that the current points system isn't a truly accurate representation of achievements. Its like people still saying fruit dealer is still up there, he got jipped just as mush as MC, 5000, if he had that he would look like a contender too, but obviously he hasnt had much going on in 2011. No matter how inaacurate the system mvp is still better demonstrated by winning mlg and actually beating him. | ||
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zerious
Canada3803 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:39 Cloud9157 wrote: KiwiKaki took him to game 3. Kiwi is no joke, and is definitely a highly skilled Protoss. Drewbie also took a game off him, but ehh. drewbie took a game off MMA | ||
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Luepert
United States1933 Posts
On August 18 2011 05:42 HolyArrow wrote: That's a pretty shortsighted argument. The WC is one round shorter than Code S, and the missing round is the incredibly volatile group stage, while the WC is 2 rounds shorter than the ST and Open GSLs. By your logic, I could have a one-round GSL with just MVP and MKP, and count that as well if MVP beats MKP again, because "it's the same guy". My argument was directed at the people who were saying the WC had no skill in it while the real contenders were actually the same as in the GSLs. | ||
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