EPTIn-Game Standard Hero Builds Project - Page 107
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
On October 07 2014 02:48 Sn0_Man wrote: well rop cost got changed so yeah that's the reason. probably every hero with rop in the starting items is gonna need adjusted/updated with it being 25 more. Also mek still core on viper? Yeah it's good, but his mana pool really sucks. | ||
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
On October 07 2014 02:53 Nevuk wrote: yeah that's the reason. probably every hero with rop in the starting items is gonna need adjusted/updated with it being 25 more. Also mek still core on viper? Yeah it's good, but his mana pool really sucks. It's still core. He can still manage it and there's no real alternative in any case. | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
EDIT: For the record, I don't think it's right to start with the RoP on mid Viper anyway. The reason you buy it first in sidelanes is to complete Basi without using the courier, except you can't do that mid anyway. Because of that, I don't think starting RoP is really better than Circlet, or 4th branch + extra regen. Starting with the Slippers over filling out on Branches is definitely wrong regardless. | ||
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
On October 07 2014 02:58 Sn0_Man wrote: It's still ur best tank option and ur mana issues aren't too big once u get aghs. Sure u CAN run out of mana but if ur judicious with ur q instead of autocasting (which is wasteful most of the time) then u should have enough mana for an entire fight with just treads/stick/mek/basi(aquila) no problem. Torte's build has phase aquila no stick. (drums/aquila in situational) With basi treads stick it's doable certainly. definitely after agh's. Phase vs treads viper is a little bit preferential. On the skill build also- I'm not like a pro viper player or anything, I just think that the skill build is a little off if you want a standard one. Maxing nethertoxin by 7 isn't really great unless you're pushing towers with no one defending them. Like viper's skill build is always somewhat situational but if you want to go with a standard I think maxing corrosive or poison with just a point in nethertoxin is better. (3 points in corrosive is sufficient to cancel consumables since it meets the 20 magic dmg threshold, can help win trades vs a lot of mids if they're trying to rely on their bottle). Yeah it's nice that poison has 0 CD so it doesnt have to be leveled at level 5 but viper is still a really slow hero and if his ult is down he's gonna be waddling after people trying to hit them if you only have a single point in poison attack. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
Unless there is something I am missing or I am miss understanding how fissure works? | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On October 07 2014 03:08 Plansix wrote: Also, what is the reason for not getting a value point in Enchant Totem on Earth Shaker? I understand that Aftershock is good, but it has 300 range and a lot of the things ES does are out of that range. Its not like the damage or stun on Aftershock is really that impressive that a single point makes a difference. Unless there is something I am missing or I am miss understanding how fissure works? Rank 1 Aftershock isn't long enough for you to Echo->Fissure or Echo->Enchant without a break in the stun for them to interrupt you, while rank 2 is. This is why rank 2 Aftershock specifically is a breakpoint. Whether you get the first rank in Enchant Totem at 2, 4, or 8 depends on the game. On October 07 2014 03:06 Nevuk wrote: Like viper's skill build is always somewhat situational but if you want to go with a standard I think maxing corrosive or poison with just a point in nethertoxin is better. (3 points in corrosive is sufficient to cancel consumables since it meets the 20 magic dmg threshold, can help win trades vs a lot of mids if they're trying to rely on their bottle). Yeah it's nice that poison has 0 CD so it doesnt have to be leveled at level 5 but viper is still a really slow hero and if his ult is down he's gonna be waddling after people trying to hit them if you only have a single point in poison attack. This is correct. "Standard" skill build should be maxed Corrosive by 7. Maxed Nethertoxin requires a player who's very confident in his ability to abuse it during early laning and careful positioning in fights before level 10. Neither of which would be true of someone who needs to follow a skill order from a guide. | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
Remember that damage scaling is fundamentally more valuable the better then AoE of the skill is, and a 450-wide 1400-long line AoE is as good as you can get on a non-ultimate AoE skill. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
The only reason for the value point in Enchant Totem is for when heroes come to you, like PA or Slark. The stun(with after shock) can be situationally useful and I think its worth getting a single point. And its not terrible to farm up a weaker camp for some quick gold on your way back to base. | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
(as in, at level 8 after 4-0-2-1@7 although personally I always get it earlier) | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
Otherwise ur not gonna get to ult->fissure very often so the key benefit of aftershock 2 is limited and the value of a free extra proc + extra dmg from totem seems 100% worth it at 2 or 4 depending on how ur laning phase is going. AKA totem at 8 seems bad for cookie cutter but w/e. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
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babishh
Canada965 Posts
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
On October 07 2014 04:05 babishh wrote: I apologize if this question has been answered many times already, but why not getting enchant totem at lvl 4 instead of aftershock? I'd kick myself if an enemy got away because I didn't have a second stun available to stop him from tporting. On October 07 2014 03:10 TheYango wrote: Rank 1 Aftershock isn't long enough for you to Echo->Fissure or Echo->Enchant without a break in the stun for them to interrupt you, while rank 2 is. This is why rank 2 Aftershock specifically is a breakpoint. Whether you get the first rank in Enchant Totem at 2, 4, or 8 depends on the game. | ||
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babishh
Canada965 Posts
Derp, how did I miss that second part of the post. | ||
Belisarius
Australia6233 Posts
There's so much utility in a 5s cd interrupt, especially in pubs where fights are so scrappy. I feel like that does way more than an extra 50 damage on fissure. Even on aftershock rank 2, opening with ult->fissure before blink seems a pretty unusual situation. Fissure is going to go down first a lot of the time unless my team is stacked with initators. | ||
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