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OrangeGarage
Korea (South)319 Posts
On October 08 2017 18:42 nkr wrote: Life , 18 years old, threw 2 games. Savior led a match fixing ring consisting of 11 players. You forgetting all the other players that threw with life? | ||
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FeyFey
Germany10114 Posts
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jubil
United States2602 Posts
As far as tactics go, his signature was the ling runby, which he always seemed to get more value out of than any other zerg - when you watched life his zerglings could completely tip the balance of the game, rather than just being an annoying hassle. He was also never afraid to break out the early aggressive tactics, which made him a tricky and dangerous opponent in the overall metagame. For sure he is one of the signature zerg players of SC2, but I rank him among players like Nestea, DRG, and soO in the history of SC2 zerg rather than alone at the top. (I might be a little biased because I was a huge fan of MKP (who lord knows had similar consistency issues), played terran, and always got tilted off the face of the earth when playing against cheesy zergs.) | ||
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IMSupervisor
Australia138 Posts
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frazzle
United States468 Posts
Can we agree that what savior did was worse than what Life did? At least in terms of the literal actual acts? And can we agree that while Life's actions may have precipitated the end of an era of team Korean SC2 as we knew it, they weren't the sole reason for it's downfall, just the final blow? I think a 2 year ban is sufficient in his case. I was reckless as hell when I was 18. 18 is not a mature age. And his throws were relatively inconsequential (in terms of the actual import of the games) fringe games. If he is remorseful and wants to make up for it, and proves he will, he should be allowed to compete again. Redemption is the ultimate and greatest story line. Maybe the term is half his winnings for 2 years (if any) go to fund tourneys. He has to agree to it to come back. I would love to see him play LotV and have a shot to earn respect again. | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
On-topic, Life had a huge influence on the scene through his years of televised play, but I would say that it was more as an inspiration than through any particular playstyle. While he was undeniably a very skilled player, he didn't revolutionize mainstream Zerg philosophy in the way sAviOr did. Nor was Life, while popular, anything close to the cultural phenomenon that sAviOr was, in that sAviOr defined what it meant to be a bonjwa, both for himself and the players that came before (BoxeR, oov, NaDa). And I don't know how OP thinks that Life is viewed positively. Life is universally hated in Korea, and loathed by a great many in the foreign scene as well. His matchfixing is acknowledged by anyone with any kind of knowledge about the SC2 scene as playing a crippling role in ending Proleague (and therefore the KeSPA teams and the entire professional SC2 infrastructure in Korea). While he does have some diehard fanatic apologists, they are more of an (annoyingly) vocal minority than anything else. The only person I would say is more hated than Life is sAviOr. | ||
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frazzle
United States468 Posts
He was the only Zerg making it happen after the SH nerf late HotS when zergs were getting rekt. And I loved the irony of how this guy, who rarely used SH, beat Parting with SH in GSL 2015 S1 G2 when Parting cannoned three bases. It was glorious. | ||
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KalWarkov
Germany4126 Posts
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Phredxor
New Zealand15076 Posts
On October 09 2017 10:22 frazzle wrote: OP's reddit post that he copied and pasted here made it obvious this was about whether Life should be allowed back. But OK, here's my Life contribution. He was the only Zerg making it happen after the SH nerf late HotS when zergs were getting rekt. And I loved the irony of how this guy, who rarely used SH, beat Parting with SH in GSL 2015 S1 G2 when Parting cannoned three bases. It was glorious. Byul was comfortably the best zerg of that time, not Life. | ||
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Giwl
5 Posts
If blizzard allows a person who knew the consequences of match fixing, and then match-fixed anyway, choosing money over the credibility of the sc2 pro scene, what does it say about the company? Many Koreans hate Life, saying that his actions were some of the factors leading to the disbandment of Proleague, and allowing him back into the pro scene will cause arguably the Korean fans, arguably the backbone of SC2 e-sports to distrust blizzard and quit watching sc2, leading to the death of sc2 e-sports. tl:dr allowing life to be a starcraft pro will destroy sc2 esports | ||
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seopthi
393 Posts
Funnily enough, he's on the TeamLiquid pro team. | ||
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FrostedMiniWheats
United States30730 Posts
On October 09 2017 12:54 Phredxor wrote: On October 09 2017 10:22 frazzle wrote: OP's reddit post that he copied and pasted here made it obvious this was about whether Life should be allowed back. But OK, here's my Life contribution. Byul was comfortably the best zerg of that time, not Life. This is true. In fact, the post-SH era of 2015 was one of Life's low-points in which he struggled to even remain in the top 5 among Zerg. He went out early in back to back seasons of GSL. Granted, he came back briefly at the very end of HotS at Blizzcon when it mattered the most. | ||
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showstealer1829
Australia3123 Posts
That's it. | ||
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hitthat
Poland2275 Posts
On October 08 2017 19:37 207aicila wrote: Implying this is my first account or that I haven't been here long before SC2 came out.  Implying that TL was a big deal before 2008, HAHA. On October 08 2017 20:32 207aicila wrote: "Don't pretend like you know about the BW scene better than those of us who were there" kinda reply. Seems only fair to call out bs for the bs that it is. You don't know a shit, before around 2008 or something there were sites that had bigger following than TL. In 2006 it was considered a northern american site with opinion in wich NA players delusioned themselves of being better than they really (at time) were. TL was not always the same as foreign BW community. | ||
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stilt
France2754 Posts
On October 09 2017 18:29 FrostedMiniWheats wrote: Lone Zerg that seemed to have that magical x-factor rarely seen in a lot of players. You just could never count him out in anything. If Nestea was the great innovator of defensive high-econ Zerg, Life was the direct opposite ushering in a highly aggressive and fluid brand of Zerg that dictated the pace of the game. Life to me was like the final form of July, with all the aggressive decisiveness but played with far more intelligence. Only sOs and Taeja could match his dynamic reactionary prowess. This is true. In fact, the post-SH era of 2015 was one of Life's low-points in which he struggled to even remain in the top 5 among Zerg. He went out early in back to back seasons of GSL. Granted, he came back briefly at the very end of HotS at Blizzcon when it mattered the most. I kind of disagree, the post SH area transformed zvp in one the worst balanced mu of all time (3 bases blink responded to every stuffs the zerg could thrown in the midgame hence wild monobuild protoss while the lategame was totally uniwinnable) and zvt was better but still pretty hard with the mecha. Every zergs at that period had troubles except Byul who was godlike agaisnt mech and so could keep up against terran. (while his zergs victories were a bit odds in the gsl s2). The multiple gambles, tricks, chesse and overall extreme agressivity that Life dispslayed at the bllizzcon was thrown because of this particular metagame (Byul tried to play standart and have been demolished, Rogue got stomped), still, against those odds, he managed to get in the final and loses it 3-4, a feat that strangely recalls the mvp's one in the GSL S4 2012. (I could add that he beat Parting, Stats in the kung fu cup) | ||
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beepbeeeeeeep
145 Posts
On October 08 2017 21:56 vidium wrote: What is this campaign lately to make Life great again? Just forget about that cheater and move on. cheating is defined as breaking the rules of a game in order to obtain an unfair advantage in said game. how does intentionally losing a game of sc2 secure life an unfair advantage in said game of sc2? | ||
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Ej_
47656 Posts
While ByuL made 3 combined finals in the 3 consecutive starleagues after that (SSL, GSL, GSL), he wasn't close to winning any of them. | ||
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frazzle
United States468 Posts
On October 09 2017 18:29 FrostedMiniWheats wrote: Lone Zerg that seemed to have that magical x-factor rarely seen in a lot of players. You just could never count him out in anything. If Nestea was the great innovator of defensive high-econ Zerg, Life was the direct opposite ushering in a highly aggressive and fluid brand of Zerg that dictated the pace of the game. Life to me was like the final form of July, with all the aggressive decisiveness but played with far more intelligence. Only sOs and Taeja could match his dynamic reactionary prowess. This is true. In fact, the post-SH era of 2015 was one of Life's low-points in which he struggled to even remain in the top 5 among Zerg. He went out early in back to back seasons of GSL. Granted, he came back briefly at the very end of HotS at Blizzcon when it mattered the most. You're right. For zergs, that was ByuL's year, although unfortunately for him one in which he made his case for the Kong title. Getting 3-0'd in ro16 of Blizzcon was a huge letdown. Life, apart from beating Lilbow, was more or less counted out, making his run that more memorable. In a way during HotS Life was kind of the sOs of zergs. He wasn't necessarily in the top 3 of zergs at any given time, and his play didn't define the zerg meta, but when he turned it on he was the most amazing player to watch. | ||
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stilt
France2754 Posts
On October 09 2017 22:17 Ej_ wrote: Reminder that Life did win GSL after SH nerf, bringing out new builds and cheeses. It was one of the 2 starleagues in all of HotS won by a Zerg player. Admittedly, he did get a bit lucky against herO (the infamous game 7 on Iron Fortress), but that was an extremely impressive run, given the state of Zerg in Korea at the time. While ByuL made 3 combined finals in the 3 consecutive starleagues after that (SSL, GSL, GSL), he wasn't close to winning any of them. No he did not, he won the GSL 2015 S1 and SH was pre nerf (look at the game 2 in the final) | ||
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todespolka
221 Posts
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