• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 04:48
CET 10:48
KST 18:48
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!12[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win0Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.175Evil Geniuses - shutting down23ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier7Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins1
StarCraft 2
General
No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? [D] Hacker peak in sc2 ? Liquibets sc2 season 30 Evil Geniuses - shutting down Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win
Tourneys
SC4ALL: II Venue Change Announcement! Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Mondays ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20)
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps Starcraft 2 Advance [D] the control group Simple Questions/Answers
External Content
Mutation # 550 Graveyard Shift The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 549 Endless Sparkles Mutation # 548 Shining Bright
Brood War
General
sOs joins Best's team, Newcatsle University Rollback Netcode in Brood War SC4ALL: II Venue Change Announcement! [Megathread] Daily Funny Videos BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[$1250] International ShieldBattery League [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
Strategy
50,000-Word Terran Builds Memo 2026-10-22 Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stratus: Battle for the sky now on steam Early acc Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Deus Ex 3!?
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Dating: How's your luck? Trading/Investing Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Fan Club Resource Thread Reynor Fan Club The Flash Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Why I built Repalyzer (1.1.…
BlueStar
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8541 users

Community Feedback Update - June 10 - Page 10

Forum Index > SC2 General
254 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 8 9 10 11 12 13 Next All
JimmyJRaynor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada18040 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-06-11 16:31:32
June 11 2016 16:05 GMT
#181
On June 12 2016 00:13 Diabolique wrote:
What about increasing the larvae, but not from 3 to 4, but to some ~3.5 through decreasing energy needed and cooldown? So it would be still 3 larvas, but they would be available after 25 s (instead of 29 s), and would need just 20-21 energy (instead of 25)?


On June 12 2016 00:39 Teoita wrote:
Something like that would be much more reasonable and easy to tune.

+1
yea

it is a good idea. using this thinking the # of larva is a continuous variable rather than a discreet variable.

On June 11 2016 15:42 Ranari wrote:
I watch a lot of SC2 and I don't see Terran OP at all. If anything though, please make mech viable, and I'm not even one of those guys that just wants to see Mech made viable 'cause I have a crush on loving me some mech. I just grow tired of watching MMM being the dominant composition for 3 released in a row (WoL, HotS, and now Lotv). I'd like me some variety to watch!

you should acknowledge that its hard to take your 9 posts seriously when all you talk about are siege tanks. On the odd occasion when my views somewhat align with avilo's its much more credible. I requested a very general thing: weaker Terran air and stronger Terran ground. To some degree this aligned with his constant evangelizing of mech. Whereas, you are pretty much parroting his views.
Ray Kassar To David Crane : "you're no more important to Atari than the factory workers assembling the cartridges"
opisska
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Poland8852 Posts
June 11 2016 16:10 GMT
#182
On June 12 2016 01:05 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 12 2016 00:13 Diabolique wrote:
What about increasing the larvae, but not from 3 to 4, but to some ~3.5 through decreasing energy needed and cooldown? So it would be still 3 larvas, but they would be available after 25 s (instead of 29 s), and would need just 20-21 energy (instead of 25)?


Show nested quote +
On June 12 2016 00:39 Teoita wrote:
Something like that would be much more reasonable and easy to tune.

+1
yea

it is a good idea. using this thinking the # of larva is a continuous variable rather than a discreet variable.


You'd need quite some time to test the results, though. It would take weeks, if not months, for a large volume of people to get really good at injecting again, if you change the cooldown. Good injecting is a subliminal thing. I am not any good in SC2, but even I now get a pretty reliable twitch "I should be injecting any second" without looking at any external source of time and that takes a while to change. Until then, the results will be too unstable to judge the impact.
"Jeez, that's far from ideal." - Serral, the king of mild trashtalk
TL+ Member
MaxTa
Profile Joined February 2016
61 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-06-11 16:17:02
June 11 2016 16:13 GMT
#183
Increasing larvas seems insane... Zerg production is already good with auto injects queue and faster creep spread. Like people are saying, if production is an issue just add a macro hatch after your 3rd... it's already cheaper at 300 mines instead of 400 so why not..? Also, I can't imagine how silly the early game all-ins with banes bust/ drop and ravagers would be with more larvas... Zerg would also easily out macro the other races in worker count and would overpower too quickly if left alone...
JimmyJRaynor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada18040 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-06-11 16:17:17
June 11 2016 16:16 GMT
#184
On June 12 2016 01:10 opisska wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 12 2016 01:05 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
On June 12 2016 00:13 Diabolique wrote:
What about increasing the larvae, but not from 3 to 4, but to some ~3.5 through decreasing energy needed and cooldown? So it would be still 3 larvas, but they would be available after 25 s (instead of 29 s), and would need just 20-21 energy (instead of 25)?


On June 12 2016 00:39 Teoita wrote:
Something like that would be much more reasonable and easy to tune.

+1
yea

it is a good idea. using this thinking the # of larva is a continuous variable rather than a discreet variable.


You'd need quite some time to test the results, though. It would take weeks, if not months, for a large volume of people to get really good at injecting again, if you change the cooldown. Good injecting is a subliminal thing. I am not any good in SC2, but even I now get a pretty reliable twitch "I should be injecting any second" without looking at any external source of time and that takes a while to change. Until then, the results will be too unstable to judge the impact.

good point.

what you can do is alter the # of larva that pop out in the following way.
lets assume 0<x<1 ,

<<inject>>
3+x , because x<1 you hold that in the bank for the next inject.
<<inject>>
3+x+x
if 2x>1 then pump out an additional larva. and we have x-1 larva in bank waiting for the next inject.

this allows Zerg players to maintain their timing and every inject either results in 3 or 4 larva popping out.
Ray Kassar To David Crane : "you're no more important to Atari than the factory workers assembling the cartridges"
pzlama333
Profile Joined April 2013
United States282 Posts
June 11 2016 16:26 GMT
#185
How about keep larva injection for hatchery at 3, but 4 for lair and more for hive?
JimmyJRaynor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada18040 Posts
June 11 2016 16:27 GMT
#186
On June 12 2016 01:26 pzlama333 wrote:
How about keep larva injection for hatchery at 3, but 4 for lair and more for hive?

i think the big complaint is that Zerg is weak early game. This doesn't help it if the problem is early game zerg being too weak.
Ray Kassar To David Crane : "you're no more important to Atari than the factory workers assembling the cartridges"
DalaiiLameR
Profile Joined May 2016
42 Posts
June 11 2016 16:38 GMT
#187
On June 12 2016 01:13 MaxTa wrote:
Increasing larvas seems insane... Zerg production is already good with auto injects queue and faster creep spread. Like people are saying, if production is an issue just add a macro hatch after your 3rd... it's already cheaper at 300 mines instead of 400 so why not..? Also, I can't imagine how silly the early game all-ins with banes bust/ drop and ravagers would be with more larvas... Zerg would also easily out macro the other races in worker count and would overpower too quickly if left alone...


its 350 mins (including the drone) but nvm. i dont see really many pros nowadays build macrohatches. tbh, i dont know why.
Beelzebub1
Profile Joined May 2015
1005 Posts
June 11 2016 17:09 GMT
#188
On June 12 2016 01:26 pzlama333 wrote:
How about keep larva injection for hatchery at 3, but 4 for lair and more for hive?


Problem with this is that Zerg is very powerful at Hive tech and very....fragile, not weak or UP or anything, just very fragile in the early game.

The larvae buff is asinine, I think an easier solution is just to make Queens a slight bit tougher, either give them a very slight damage buff or maybe give them +1 armor naturally, maybe a slight speed boost on creep even. I think making the stock base defense will allow Zergs to not just die to early game attacks so easily and they will still be hilariously weak in the later stages of the game.
tokinho
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States792 Posts
June 11 2016 17:17 GMT
#189
Feels like there is something unjustified in the reasoning here on what the long term plan is. For me, I'd prefer an upgrade so that you are choosing between more queens, ranged, and melee styles as a sort of round robin of build ideas, with the cores being defensive queens, ravager den upgrade, a spawning pool upgrade, drops, and spire units. Maybe the long term plan is with a larvae buff we'll see zergling/ravager/lurker/ultra nerfs. Seems like something unsaid about the styles players are playing and the goals of the buff, with the optimal style not being the one preferred in the racial design. Doesn't fix the difficulty in scouting zerg plans, nor stability in the matchup.

Aside, I notice a lot of the feedback is coming from zerg pros, with little representation from terran and protoss pros.
Smile
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12248 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-06-11 18:09:35
June 11 2016 18:09 GMT
#190
On June 12 2016 02:09 Beelzebub1 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 12 2016 01:26 pzlama333 wrote:
How about keep larva injection for hatchery at 3, but 4 for lair and more for hive?


Problem with this is that Zerg is very powerful at Hive tech and very....fragile, not weak or UP or anything, just very fragile in the early game.

The larvae buff is asinine, I think an easier solution is just to make Queens a slight bit tougher, either give them a very slight damage buff or maybe give them +1 armor naturally, maybe a slight speed boost on creep even. I think making the stock base defense will allow Zergs to not just die to early game attacks so easily and they will still be hilariously weak in the later stages of the game.


I strongly disagree with this notion that Zerg is somehow fragile to early game allins, we aren't in 2010 anymore and Zergs don't die all the time to random all-ins that they barely miss scouting. Zerg may well have problems in the midgame vs Terran and lategame vs Protoss, but i think their early game is just fine.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Zulu23
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany132 Posts
June 11 2016 18:53 GMT
#191
How about giving Zerg one of two Larva more at the start of the game. Than they have sooner more income and afford Units of tech sooner as this snowballs quite hard
Fatlao
Profile Joined June 2016
1 Post
June 11 2016 19:35 GMT
#192
If Nerchio say that like give more time to ZVT, I think it is fine. But Snute recently either in steam or in matches performance very badly in ZVT, I don't know why Snute has confident to say that. I think Snute should try some time play games with Kaspa players.
Aunvilgodess
Profile Joined May 2016
954 Posts
June 11 2016 19:40 GMT
#193
On June 11 2016 04:36 Seeker wrote:
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD! WHEN ARE WE GOING TO GET A TVP UPDATE?!!?!?!?


I find your passion out of era.
TheWinks
Profile Joined July 2011
United States572 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-06-11 19:48:10
June 11 2016 19:47 GMT
#194
On June 12 2016 02:09 Beelzebub1 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 12 2016 01:26 pzlama333 wrote:
How about keep larva injection for hatchery at 3, but 4 for lair and more for hive?

The larvae buff is asinine, I think an easier solution is just to make Queens a slight bit tougher, either give them a very slight damage buff or maybe give them +1 armor naturally, maybe a slight speed boost on creep even. I think making the stock base defense will allow Zergs to not just die to early game attacks so easily and they will still be hilariously weak in the later stages of the game.

We do not need a repeat of patch 1.4.3BU.

People need to remember what happened to the game when an extremely powerful late game became almost trivial to reach.
RaFox17
Profile Joined May 2013
Finland4581 Posts
June 11 2016 19:58 GMT
#195
On June 12 2016 04:47 TheWinks wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 12 2016 02:09 Beelzebub1 wrote:
On June 12 2016 01:26 pzlama333 wrote:
How about keep larva injection for hatchery at 3, but 4 for lair and more for hive?

The larvae buff is asinine, I think an easier solution is just to make Queens a slight bit tougher, either give them a very slight damage buff or maybe give them +1 armor naturally, maybe a slight speed boost on creep even. I think making the stock base defense will allow Zergs to not just die to early game attacks so easily and they will still be hilariously weak in the later stages of the game.

We do not need a repeat of patch 1.4.3BU.

People need to remember what happened to the game when an extremely powerful late game became almost trivial to reach.

I agree that we don´t wan´t to see another blink stalker era
Lexender
Profile Joined September 2013
Mexico2665 Posts
June 11 2016 20:02 GMT
#196
On June 11 2016 04:36 Seeker wrote:
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD! WHEN ARE WE GOING TO GET A TVP UPDATE?!!?!?!?


Didn't we already? I mean the MU is basically the same damn thing since 2010 but at least we have LIBERATORS NOW!!
Oh boy ain't that exiting?
Scarlett`
Profile Joined April 2011
Korea (South)2446 Posts
June 11 2016 20:36 GMT
#197
On June 12 2016 03:09 Teoita wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 12 2016 02:09 Beelzebub1 wrote:
On June 12 2016 01:26 pzlama333 wrote:
How about keep larva injection for hatchery at 3, but 4 for lair and more for hive?


Problem with this is that Zerg is very powerful at Hive tech and very....fragile, not weak or UP or anything, just very fragile in the early game.

The larvae buff is asinine, I think an easier solution is just to make Queens a slight bit tougher, either give them a very slight damage buff or maybe give them +1 armor naturally, maybe a slight speed boost on creep even. I think making the stock base defense will allow Zergs to not just die to early game attacks so easily and they will still be hilariously weak in the later stages of the game.


I strongly disagree with this notion that Zerg is somehow fragile to early game allins, we aren't in 2010 anymore and Zergs don't die all the time to random all-ins that they barely miss scouting. Zerg may well have problems in the midgame vs Terran and lategame vs Protoss, but i think their early game is just fine.

only because we open overlord speed every game in zvp and zvt (which is very expensive for how early you need to get it)
Progamer一条咸鱼
Empirimancer
Profile Joined July 2011
Canada1024 Posts
June 11 2016 20:46 GMT
#198
Who are these Zerg Kespa pros and why are they clueless?
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12248 Posts
June 11 2016 20:48 GMT
#199
On June 12 2016 05:36 Scarlett` wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 12 2016 03:09 Teoita wrote:
On June 12 2016 02:09 Beelzebub1 wrote:
On June 12 2016 01:26 pzlama333 wrote:
How about keep larva injection for hatchery at 3, but 4 for lair and more for hive?


Problem with this is that Zerg is very powerful at Hive tech and very....fragile, not weak or UP or anything, just very fragile in the early game.

The larvae buff is asinine, I think an easier solution is just to make Queens a slight bit tougher, either give them a very slight damage buff or maybe give them +1 armor naturally, maybe a slight speed boost on creep even. I think making the stock base defense will allow Zergs to not just die to early game attacks so easily and they will still be hilariously weak in the later stages of the game.


I strongly disagree with this notion that Zerg is somehow fragile to early game allins, we aren't in 2010 anymore and Zergs don't die all the time to random all-ins that they barely miss scouting. Zerg may well have problems in the midgame vs Terran and lategame vs Protoss, but i think their early game is just fine.

only because we open overlord speed every game in zvp and zvt (which is very expensive for how early you need to get it)


Then why do they start changing the cost of that?
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Tankz123
Profile Joined December 2011
Denmark228 Posts
June 11 2016 21:05 GMT
#200
On June 12 2016 05:02 Lexender wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2016 04:36 Seeker wrote:
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD! WHEN ARE WE GOING TO GET A TVP UPDATE?!!?!?!?


Didn't we already? I mean the MU is basically the same damn thing since 2010 but at least we have LIBERATORS NOW!!
Oh boy ain't that exiting?


but protoss got ADEPTS!11!111
Prev 1 8 9 10 11 12 13 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 12m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 3140
FanTaSy 516
Calm 377
ZerO 235
actioN 226
Leta 134
Killer 114
Mind 109
Free 91
Sharp 89
[ Show more ]
NaDa 34
Stork 33
scan(afreeca) 32
soO 28
Bale 23
zelot 17
ajuk12(nOOB) 14
Terrorterran 12
yabsab 12
Counter-Strike
fl0m2998
Super Smash Bros
Westballz42
Other Games
summit1g10844
JimRising 477
Lowko296
Fuzer 195
Mew2King91
NeuroSwarm58
ViBE23
Railgan19
ZerO(Twitch)8
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick450
Counter-Strike
PGL111
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 31
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• LUISG 17
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Laughngamez YouTube
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• ChaeLyn 7
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Stunt462
Upcoming Events
IntoTheTV X SOOP
1h 12m
Reynor vs Solar
ByuN vs SHIN
Clem vs MaxPax
herO vs Rogue
IPSL
7h 12m
WorsT vs nOmaD
Dewalt vs andersOn
AI Arena Tournament
9h 12m
IntoTheTV X SOOP
1d 1h
IPSL
1d 7h
Azhi_Dahaki vs ggnore13
Double vs WIZARD
Replay Cast
1d 13h
Replay Cast
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
YoungYakov vs Lambo
SHIN vs TBD
Percival vs Shameless
Solar vs TBD
PiGosaur Cup
3 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
5 days
KCM Race Survival
5 days
WardiTV Invitational
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-11-05
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
International ShieldBattery League
BSL Season 23
IPSL Winter 2026-27
Calamity Cup Div. A Season 8
IEM Beijing 2026
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026

Upcoming

Sector 951
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Underdog Cup 2026 Div 2-3
PGL Bucharest 2027
BLAST Bounty Winter 2027
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.