• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 16:03
CEST 22:03
KST 05:03
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach4[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8
Community News
Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double1Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple3BSL Season 2313Weekly Cups (Sep 7-12): SHIN, ByuN, MaxPax double down1StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon105
StarCraft 2
General
Recent patches and the Future StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) How do you feel about the StarCraft shooter announcement at BlizzCon 2026?
Tourneys
2026 GSTL Grand Finals ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20)
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 545 And Drops and Rifts Mutation # 544 Double Trouble Mutation # 543 Enhanced Defenses
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Bot on ladder [ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach PLAYzone Challenge - open offline tour in Prague an AI researcher's take on the ladder bot
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro8 Day 3 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Ro8 Day 2 [ASL22] Ro8 Day 1
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Total Annihilation Zero Nintendo Switch Thread EVE Corporation
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread All you football fans (soccer)!
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
MLB/Baseball 2023 Football (Soccer) Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Violent-Cooperative Play and…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 6719 users

Update on HotS Balance - December 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
469 CommentsPost a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 22 23 24 Next All
Aeromi
Profile Blog Joined August 2012
France14463 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-12-03 18:50:40
December 03 2014 18:18 GMT
#1
[image loading]


Blizzard just released a post about balance.

Hello everyone,

We’ve been assessing the state of Heart of the Swarm balance recently, and while our data shows that balance at lower skill levels is quite even, we’ve noted some concerns at the highest levels of play. We’re seeing that Terran looks slightly stronger than the other two races, and Zerg is underperforming slightly in both matchups.

As suggested by pro players and members of the community, we feel the map pool in Season 3 contributed a lot to these racial differences and we’re going to be making changes next season to help with this. Our goal for the upcoming season is to have a good mix of maps that are balanced as well as some that slightly favor specific races. We’re currently working towards finalizing the 2015 Season 1 map pool and we’re hoping that we can update to the new ladder map pool later this month.

Additionally, we’ve been considering potential balance changes to help address these issues. One area we’ve been keeping close tabs on that we believe we can help improve balance is the strength of the Widow Mine in TvP. We believe the direction of our last balance update was correct, but we wonder if the actual numbers were slightly too much. We’re currently thinking of testing the following change on a balance test map:

Widow mine splash damage decreased from 40 +40 shields to 40 +20 shields.

This will change a few key unit relationships such as Zealots requiring three shots to die from Widow Mine splash damage to four shots and Sentries/Templars would go from one shot to two shots.

We’re currently in the off-season, so we have time to fully test out changes to the game, but we first wanted to hear your thoughts before committing to a balance test map.

Thank you.


Poll: Widow Mine Damage Decreased to 40 + 20 Shields

Like (795)
 
55%

Dislike (353)
 
25%

DREAMPOOL (290)
 
20%

1438 total votes

Your vote: Widow Mine Damage Decreased to 40 + 20 Shields

(Vote): Like
(Vote): Dislike
(Vote): DREAMPOOL




Source : http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/15522792124
Facebook Twitter Reddit
https://twitter.com/DrAeromi | Updates on live tournaments: @StarCrafteSport
HellHound
Profile Joined September 2014
Bulgaria5962 Posts
December 03 2014 18:21 GMT
#2
Huh, blizz actually paying attention to reasonable suggestion and not making big changes.
Let's see how this will play out.
Classic GosoO |sOs| Everyone has to give in, let Life win | Zest Is The Best | Roach Cultist | I recognize the might and wisdom of my Otherworldly overlord | Air vs Air 200/200 SC2 is best SC2 | PRIME has been robbed | Fuck prime go ST | ROACH ROACH ROACH
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46474 Posts
December 03 2014 18:21 GMT
#3
I'm all for this A minor change to a very versatile unit. Nice!
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
The_Templar
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
your Country52798 Posts
December 03 2014 18:22 GMT
#4
Sounds good. Wondering if more balance changes are coming though
ModeratorI am still alive, somehow
TL+ Member
CakeSauc3
Profile Joined February 2011
United States1437 Posts
December 03 2014 18:22 GMT
#5
Would this bring back Templar openings?

Glad they're mostly focusing on maps.
Nebuchad
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Switzerland12535 Posts
December 03 2014 18:23 GMT
#6
I'd rather they change the map pool before they decide that change of WM is needed. Both at the same time seems too much.
No will to live, no wish to die
OtherWorld
Profile Blog Joined October 2013
France17333 Posts
December 03 2014 18:23 GMT
#7
FFS Blizzard when will you learn that changing two variables at the same bad is not a good idea... Start by changing the map pool, then see if the imbalance persists. If it does, try your changes.
Used Sigs - New Sigs - Cheap Sigs - Buy the Best Cheap Sig near You at www.cheapsigforsale.com
Nebuchad
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Switzerland12535 Posts
December 03 2014 18:24 GMT
#8
Also there's something fun in reading "We've noticed that zerg is underperforming, therefore we're offering this TvP change"
No will to live, no wish to die
HoZBlooddrop
Profile Blog Joined December 2013
Italy324 Posts
December 03 2014 18:26 GMT
#9
finally!

good change
Killscreen
Profile Joined February 2012
188 Posts
December 03 2014 18:29 GMT
#10
Kind of odd that they are struggling so much to find the sweet spot for a specific unit. As a masters zerg player I found them so annoying to deal with in the first season of hots that it ultimately led me to quit playing.

The WM has to be the unit that has been adjusted most often? Or maybe the infestor?
Ragnarork
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
France9034 Posts
December 03 2014 18:30 GMT
#11
Damn, just saw the tweet and thought I'd post it, but sniped by 10 minutes by Aeromi.
LiquipediaWanderer
Genesis_443
Profile Joined December 2012
Scotland52 Posts
December 03 2014 18:31 GMT
#12
On December 04 2014 03:24 Nebuchad wrote:
Also there's something fun in reading "We've noticed that zerg is underperforming, therefore we're offering this TvP change"


There is something else fun in noticing they said that the map pool is what they believe to have contributed the most to the balance, and not having a knee jerk reaction and nerfing/buffing units. Good call by Blizz to take a minimalist approach, can't wait to see if this works out.
Supersamu
Profile Joined November 2014
Germany296 Posts
December 03 2014 18:32 GMT
#13
On December 04 2014 03:24 Nebuchad wrote:
Also there's something fun in reading "We've noticed that zerg is underperforming, therefore we're offering this TvP change"


But they are also changing the mappool.

What I don't understand is the following:
"Our goal for the upcoming season is to have a good mix of maps that are balanced as well as some that slightly favor specific races."

Obviously it is virtually impossible to ever achieve perfect balance with the races and the maps, but I hope they aim for perfect balance in each individual map and don't try to design a map to have a particular imbalance. I guess if they balance their map imbalances, then everything is balanced again, but that is also a lot of work.
johnbongham
Profile Joined April 2014
451 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-12-03 18:34:48
December 03 2014 18:33 GMT
#14
wrong thread
[PkF] Wire
Profile Joined March 2013
France24239 Posts
December 03 2014 18:33 GMT
#15
Ohhhhhh, at last. This was long overdue and I'm happy Protoss will be able to open chargelots templars again. I'm happy to hear they understand a lot of the balance problems are due to maps too. I hope maps like Nimbus or Catallena are never to be seen again.
PinoKotsBeer
Profile Joined February 2014
Netherlands1387 Posts
December 03 2014 18:33 GMT
#16
The only decent unit vs toss gets a nerf, hope they will consider to buff the tank (shield damage)
http://www.twitch.tv/pinokotsbeer
Ctesias
Profile Joined December 2012
4595 Posts
December 03 2014 18:34 GMT
#17
Would rather have seen how the new maps would affect balance before they start number tuning, but that might be due to my love for watching Protoss units die to Widow mines.

On December 04 2014 03:29 Killscreen wrote:The WM has to be the unit that has been adjusted most often? Or maybe the infestor?

The bunker.
Flash | Mvp
Enigmasc
Profile Joined February 2014
United Kingdom147 Posts
December 03 2014 18:36 GMT
#18
nice to see that there taking the moderate approach and just looking at making maps less T sideded
i kinda like the widowmine change aswell, there still good and will still be usefull aggressivley ( widowmine drops etc) but this might be enough that Ht openings arnt 100% dead
collossus play is getin stale

Nebuchad
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Switzerland12535 Posts
December 03 2014 18:36 GMT
#19
Now that I think about it it's technically the right approach: changing the maps, and doing some tests with the widow mines in case the map change isn't enough.
No will to live, no wish to die
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
December 03 2014 18:38 GMT
#20
Not sure if that's enough but they're addressing the right issue. Can always scale it up/down from there. Reassuring to know that they're aware of what the issues for PvT are though!
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
1 2 3 4 5 22 23 24 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Monday Night Weeklies
16:00
#65
RotterdaM998
TaKeTV 328
TKL 286
IndyStarCraft 188
ZombieGrub104
BRAT_OK 92
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 998
TKL 286
IndyStarCraft 188
MaxPax 161
ZombieGrub104
BRAT_OK 92
JuggernautJason51
Nathanias 49
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 599
White-Ra 149
firebathero 78
910 44
Killer 25
Trap 22
yabsab 7
Counter-Strike
Fnx 782
Super Smash Bros
C9.Mang0176
Heroes of the Storm
Grubby10341
crisheroes1814
Liquid`Hasu1702
Trikslyr71
Other Games
Liquid`RaSZi5490
summit1g5316
singsing1297
Beastyqt813
shahzam495
B2W.Neo323
ArmadaUGS131
KnowMe124
Pyrionflax82
UpATreeSC61
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream412
Other Games
BasetradeTV180
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• kabyraGe 205
• Reevou 3
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 32
• Azhi_Dahaki17
• FirePhoenix9
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV133
League of Legends
• TFBlade864
Other Games
• imaqtpie639
• Shiphtur313
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
13h 58m
Afreeca Starleague
13h 58m
Leta vs Soulkey
PiGosaur Cup
1d 3h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 14h
The PondCast
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
Online Event
4 days
FEL
4 days
BSL: Ladder Tournament
4 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
BSL Open Qualifier
5 days
BSL Open Qualifier
5 days
WardiTV Weekly
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-09-27
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Calamity Invitational

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Custodian Cup
Copium Cup
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.