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David Kim's Current Balance Thoughts - Page 55

Forum Index > SC2 General
1229 CommentsPost a Reply
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fishinguy
Profile Joined November 2010
Russian Federation798 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 01:46:59
January 23 2014 01:46 GMT
#1081
How can the game be balanced, when the current GSL code S is 13P 9Z and 2T?
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
January 23 2014 02:17 GMT
#1082
On January 23 2014 09:57 imrusty269 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2014 09:39 Ammanas wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:38 Wombat_NI wrote:
It's not some dichotomy between 'the game is dead' and 'the game is fine'. If you seriously think there aren't issues that could do with addressing, that would actually improve it and bring back some of the people who have left then fair enough. It's not what I'm seeing from people I know or on here

Those issues are not balance related though.


So the game is balanced?

Better balanced than BW, yes.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
vthree
Profile Joined November 2011
Hong Kong8039 Posts
January 23 2014 02:19 GMT
#1083
On January 23 2014 10:35 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2014 09:42 Wombat_NI wrote:
Unless you consider 'amount of effort to win a game' as something immaterial and not worth considering.

lol, you mother fucking Terran idiots always say shit like that and its so stupidly untrue. Get off your high horse, your race isn't harder to play, you just need to adapt. Isn't that what you shit heads were telling Zerg/Toss during GomTvT? Seriously, the Terran pros that have trying new stuff and adapting their play are still winning. It's the idiots that are still doing the exact same thing from WoL beta that are crying about not being able to win.

I've been seeing some Terrans using more hellbat and widow mines in TvP and having very good success with them. Its like the rest of you retards forgot midgame hellbats with blue flame absolutely shit all over Zealots, or that widow mines do bonus damage vs shields. But no, since the same MMM comp that has been used for THREE YEARS has been figured out and Protoss players are FINALLY starting to be consistent with their mechanics and micro, it's obviously P being op.

Jesus dude, you are seriously one of the WORST whiners on this forum, and one of the reasons I have trouble stomaching these forums anymore. If you hate everything so much, go away.

Christ.


Lol, let's see Blizzard make every map like Daedulus and watch how the Protoss Pros adapt...
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
January 23 2014 02:19 GMT
#1084
On January 23 2014 11:17 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2014 09:57 imrusty269 wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:39 Ammanas wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:38 Wombat_NI wrote:
It's not some dichotomy between 'the game is dead' and 'the game is fine'. If you seriously think there aren't issues that could do with addressing, that would actually improve it and bring back some of the people who have left then fair enough. It's not what I'm seeing from people I know or on here

Those issues are not balance related though.


So the game is balanced?

Better balanced than BW, yes.

uh-oh, someone is here to provoke
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
Dragonm_sc2
Profile Joined May 2013
United States15 Posts
January 23 2014 02:19 GMT
#1085
game is statisticaly balanced where the statistics come from no one knows
those who say sc2 is better then bw obviously havnt played it
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 02:25:07
January 23 2014 02:22 GMT
#1086
On January 23 2014 11:19 The_Red_Viper wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2014 11:17 Plansix wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:57 imrusty269 wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:39 Ammanas wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:38 Wombat_NI wrote:
It's not some dichotomy between 'the game is dead' and 'the game is fine'. If you seriously think there aren't issues that could do with addressing, that would actually improve it and bring back some of the people who have left then fair enough. It's not what I'm seeing from people I know or on here

Those issues are not balance related though.


So the game is balanced?

Better balanced than BW, yes.

uh-oh, someone is here to provoke

If you look at the win rates for BW over time, the game was fucked up for way longer periods.

And to be fair, I think terran could use some love in the scouting department. Their main problem is they don't have a way to get the information they need to adjust their builds, IMO. But I don't think the world is ending for terrans.

KrazyTrumpet, you are a brave man and I endores you're rant. There are some great terrans(like little Libbo), but the whiners are among them.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland25258 Posts
January 23 2014 02:37 GMT
#1087
In fairness I am being disingenuous as I am only playing Terran since my return from 6 months, albeit that's for two days. I want to see if I can take games off the other guys in LRSL with having not played in that long lol, so I am not practicing

When I say it's hard, I mean purely the mechanically taxing side of things. Zerg seems hard mechanically too, but it's not my mechanics holding me back with that race, it's just being unfamiliar with how to gauge their burst production, vs the more linear Terran/Protoss styles.
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
vthree
Profile Joined November 2011
Hong Kong8039 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 02:42:47
January 23 2014 02:41 GMT
#1088
On January 23 2014 11:22 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2014 11:19 The_Red_Viper wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:17 Plansix wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:57 imrusty269 wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:39 Ammanas wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:38 Wombat_NI wrote:
It's not some dichotomy between 'the game is dead' and 'the game is fine'. If you seriously think there aren't issues that could do with addressing, that would actually improve it and bring back some of the people who have left then fair enough. It's not what I'm seeing from people I know or on here

Those issues are not balance related though.


So the game is balanced?

Better balanced than BW, yes.

uh-oh, someone is here to provoke

If you look at the win rates for BW over time, the game was fucked up for way longer periods.

And to be fair, I think terran could use some love in the scouting department. Their main problem is they don't have a way to get the information they need to adjust their builds, IMO. But I don't think the world is ending for terrans.

KrazyTrumpet, you are a brave man and I endores you're rant. There are some great terrans(like little Libbo), but the whiners are among them.


Yeah, because we all know protoss never whines... Just look at the LR threads when Daedulus is played... Stop try to paint terrans are not willing to adapt while just whining and protoss as players that will always try to adapt and never whine.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 02:46:47
January 23 2014 02:46 GMT
#1089
On January 23 2014 11:41 vthree wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2014 11:22 Plansix wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:19 The_Red_Viper wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:17 Plansix wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:57 imrusty269 wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:39 Ammanas wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:38 Wombat_NI wrote:
It's not some dichotomy between 'the game is dead' and 'the game is fine'. If you seriously think there aren't issues that could do with addressing, that would actually improve it and bring back some of the people who have left then fair enough. It's not what I'm seeing from people I know or on here

Those issues are not balance related though.


So the game is balanced?

Better balanced than BW, yes.

uh-oh, someone is here to provoke

If you look at the win rates for BW over time, the game was fucked up for way longer periods.

And to be fair, I think terran could use some love in the scouting department. Their main problem is they don't have a way to get the information they need to adjust their builds, IMO. But I don't think the world is ending for terrans.

KrazyTrumpet, you are a brave man and I endores you're rant. There are some great terrans(like little Libbo), but the whiners are among them.


Yeah, because we all know protoss never whines... Just look at the LR threads when Daedulus is played... Stop try to paint terrans are not willing to adapt while just whining and protoss as players that will always try to adapt and never whine.

Please, of course they whine all the time about stuff, like maps, PvP and the dreaded swarm host. They all whine, but there have been a rash of "woe was Terran" threads in the last few months.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
January 23 2014 02:46 GMT
#1090
On January 23 2014 11:41 vthree wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2014 11:22 Plansix wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:19 The_Red_Viper wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:17 Plansix wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:57 imrusty269 wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:39 Ammanas wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:38 Wombat_NI wrote:
It's not some dichotomy between 'the game is dead' and 'the game is fine'. If you seriously think there aren't issues that could do with addressing, that would actually improve it and bring back some of the people who have left then fair enough. It's not what I'm seeing from people I know or on here

Those issues are not balance related though.


So the game is balanced?

Better balanced than BW, yes.

uh-oh, someone is here to provoke

If you look at the win rates for BW over time, the game was fucked up for way longer periods.

And to be fair, I think terran could use some love in the scouting department. Their main problem is they don't have a way to get the information they need to adjust their builds, IMO. But I don't think the world is ending for terrans.

KrazyTrumpet, you are a brave man and I endores you're rant. There are some great terrans(like little Libbo), but the whiners are among them.


Yeah, because we all know protoss never whines... Just look at the LR threads when Daedulus is played... Stop try to paint terrans are not willing to adapt while just whining and protoss as players that will always try to adapt and never whine.

exactly, zerg players are the only real men in this community!
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
CutTheEnemy
Profile Joined November 2013
Canada373 Posts
January 23 2014 02:58 GMT
#1091
55 pages in the balance whine thread. That's 55 pages of people limiting themselves :p It's true that there needs to be changes, but this isn't productive anymore.
Can we help spread the word and create pressure to get Rob Pardo to replace Browder as head of Sc2? Pardo led the team for broodwar, frozen throne, and wow/BC. We need to make this a thing before LotV development starts. Think about it.
HolyArrow
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7116 Posts
January 23 2014 02:58 GMT
#1092
On January 23 2014 11:46 The_Red_Viper wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2014 11:41 vthree wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:22 Plansix wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:19 The_Red_Viper wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:17 Plansix wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:57 imrusty269 wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:39 Ammanas wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:38 Wombat_NI wrote:
It's not some dichotomy between 'the game is dead' and 'the game is fine'. If you seriously think there aren't issues that could do with addressing, that would actually improve it and bring back some of the people who have left then fair enough. It's not what I'm seeing from people I know or on here

Those issues are not balance related though.


So the game is balanced?

Better balanced than BW, yes.

uh-oh, someone is here to provoke

If you look at the win rates for BW over time, the game was fucked up for way longer periods.

And to be fair, I think terran could use some love in the scouting department. Their main problem is they don't have a way to get the information they need to adjust their builds, IMO. But I don't think the world is ending for terrans.

KrazyTrumpet, you are a brave man and I endores you're rant. There are some great terrans(like little Libbo), but the whiners are among them.


Yeah, because we all know protoss never whines... Just look at the LR threads when Daedulus is played... Stop try to paint terrans are not willing to adapt while just whining and protoss as players that will always try to adapt and never whine.

exactly, zerg players are the only real men in this community!


Just had a flashback to the first GSL Open when all the Zergs were whining
imrusty269
Profile Joined January 2014
United States1404 Posts
January 23 2014 03:39 GMT
#1093
Bomber 3-0 Jim. See, terranes can win. Game is balanced, WR is 50%.
Bbyong | MMA | Polt | Dream | Maru | Mvp
dargul
Profile Joined May 2010
Russian Federation125 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 06:57:01
January 23 2014 06:56 GMT
#1094
Just some stats from GSL.

There were 14 TvP bo3, T won in 1 ... so P vs T on GSL 13-1
If we talking about sets PvT is 28-6 ...

The only terran which passed in code S Bbyong - didn't played any TvP he won TvT and TvZ.
So right now all terran players who faced Protoss in group matches didn't pass to code S.

If Supernova will pass(he is playing right now) then again keep in mind that it is because of his TvZ his TvP he has lost already.
In Stim We Trust
hansonslee
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States2027 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 07:08:00
January 23 2014 07:07 GMT
#1095
On January 23 2014 15:56 dargul wrote:
Just some stats from GSL.

There were 14 TvP bo3, T won in 1 ... so P vs T on GSL 13-1
If we talking about sets PvT is 28-6 ...

The only terran which passed in code S Bbyong - didn't played any TvP he won TvT and TvZ.
So right now all terran players who faced Protoss in group matches didn't pass to code S.

If Supernova will pass(he is playing right now) then again keep in mind that it is because of his TvZ his TvP he has lost already.


At least, that TvP was entertaining with mech and carriers! But still, I really hope DK is putting his nose out of statistics and watches the VODs to see how much Terran are struggling in a series against Protoss.
Seed's # 1 fan!!! #ForVengeance
GolemMadness
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Canada11044 Posts
January 23 2014 07:08 GMT
#1096
Let's all go crazy over a small sample size of games from the GSL! Meanwhile, terran has a 64% win rate in Proleague, while protoss has a win rate of 44%.
http://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=FLABREZU
dargul
Profile Joined May 2010
Russian Federation125 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 07:16:30
January 23 2014 07:13 GMT
#1097
On January 23 2014 16:08 GolemMadness wrote:
Let's all go crazy over a small sample size of games from the GSL! Meanwhile, terran has a 64% win rate in Proleague, while protoss has a win rate of 44%.

Yeh 1week of proleage where terrans won is enough to postpone any toss nerf for another couple months. But Mass slaughter of terrans on GSL - suddenly is a too small sample size...

May be when there will be no terrans in Ro8 Gsl they will start thinking

And yeh 44% winrate isn't the same thing as 17.5% winrate which we have now in TvP GSL
In Stim We Trust
xelnaga_empire
Profile Joined March 2012
627 Posts
January 23 2014 07:16 GMT
#1098
On January 23 2014 15:56 dargul wrote:
Just some stats from GSL.

There were 14 TvP bo3, T won in 1 ... so P vs T on GSL 13-1
If we talking about sets PvT is 28-6 ...


Those stats are horrible and the sample size is large enough. Maybe David Kim will do something. Or maybe David Kim will buff the Oracle again.
Chaggi
Profile Joined August 2010
Korea (South)1936 Posts
January 23 2014 07:21 GMT
#1099
On January 23 2014 11:46 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2014 11:41 vthree wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:22 Plansix wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:19 The_Red_Viper wrote:
On January 23 2014 11:17 Plansix wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:57 imrusty269 wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:39 Ammanas wrote:
On January 23 2014 09:38 Wombat_NI wrote:
It's not some dichotomy between 'the game is dead' and 'the game is fine'. If you seriously think there aren't issues that could do with addressing, that would actually improve it and bring back some of the people who have left then fair enough. It's not what I'm seeing from people I know or on here

Those issues are not balance related though.


So the game is balanced?

Better balanced than BW, yes.

uh-oh, someone is here to provoke

If you look at the win rates for BW over time, the game was fucked up for way longer periods.

And to be fair, I think terran could use some love in the scouting department. Their main problem is they don't have a way to get the information they need to adjust their builds, IMO. But I don't think the world is ending for terrans.

KrazyTrumpet, you are a brave man and I endores you're rant. There are some great terrans(like little Libbo), but the whiners are among them.


Yeah, because we all know protoss never whines... Just look at the LR threads when Daedulus is played... Stop try to paint terrans are not willing to adapt while just whining and protoss as players that will always try to adapt and never whine.

Please, of course they whine all the time about stuff, like maps, PvP and the dreaded swarm host. They all whine, but there have been a rash of "woe was Terran" threads in the last few months.


Maybe, just MAYBE there's a reason behind that...
HMMMM
Not all whine is a baseless cry for free wins
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
January 23 2014 07:28 GMT
#1100
On January 23 2014 11:58 CutTheEnemy wrote:
55 pages in the balance whine thread. That's 55 pages of people limiting themselves :p It's true that there needs to be changes, but this isn't productive anymore.


it never was.
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