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For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A/B level Koreans owning the NA region via online and knocking all the regular and up and coming foreigners out for easy money and points.
But after WCS 2013 and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents a platter of information to study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... and hey, you guessed it, MORE PRACTICE! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results. Retire, get a job, or go to school.
However, after reading the post by Blizzard. I expect 2014 to be a much better year for WCS. They gained a lot of knowledge and experience from 2013.
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On November 22 2013 02:28 Incubus1993 wrote:
For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A&B Koreans (Not the top finishers) owning the NA region through the online qualifiers and knocking all the foreigners out for easy money overnight. It still is a good idea to have a partial region lock, the best would be a residential lock, as in you have to be living (no citizenship) in the region you're playing in. They've changed that mostly for 2014 which is good.
Still, after WCS 2013 being and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents something to study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... hey! More practice! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results, retire and get a job or go to school.
You have a point here sir. Maybe less streaming session and more of "I need to win/get into RO4 to have money". Streaming giving to much easy money and maybe foreigners players count too much on that. (I said MAYBE,plz dont hurt me).
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On November 22 2013 02:33 SinO[Ob] wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 02:28 Incubus1993 wrote:
For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A&B Koreans (Not the top finishers) owning the NA region through the online qualifiers and knocking all the foreigners out for easy money overnight. It still is a good idea to have a partial region lock, the best would be a residential lock, as in you have to be living (no citizenship) in the region you're playing in. They've changed that mostly for 2014 which is good.
Still, after WCS 2013 being and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents something to study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... hey! More practice! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results, retire and get a job or go to school. You have a point here sir. Maybe less streaming session and more of "I need to win/get into RO4 to have money". Streaming giving to much easy money and maybe foreigners players count too much on that. (I said MAYBE,plz dont hurt me).
Does anyone have an idea of how much money streaming really pays (for the regular top streamers)? I have a rough idea but I'm not totally positive. However, I get the impression that it's kind of a greed thing. I'm sure most of the regular and popular players get enough money from their teams and sponsors. I'm not sure if the ridiculous amount of streaming is necessary.
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On November 22 2013 02:28 Incubus1993 wrote:
For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A/B level Koreans (Not the top finishers like Polt or Jaedong) owning the NA region online overnight and knocking all the regular and up and coming foreigners out for easy money and points.
But after WCS 2013 being finished and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents a platter of information study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... and hey, you guessed it, MORE PRACTICE! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results. Retire, get a job, or go to school.
However, after reading the post by Blizzard. I expect 2014 to be a much better year for WCS. They gained a lot of knowledge and experience from 2013.
I agree. To all the people who think that "knocking all the regular and up and coming foreigners out" is "easy money and points", why haven't other foreigners made this yet? Guess it is not so easy after all...
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On November 22 2013 02:33 SinO[Ob] wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 02:28 Incubus1993 wrote:
For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A&B Koreans (Not the top finishers) owning the NA region through the online qualifiers and knocking all the foreigners out for easy money overnight. It still is a good idea to have a partial region lock, the best would be a residential lock, as in you have to be living (no citizenship) in the region you're playing in. They've changed that mostly for 2014 which is good.
Still, after WCS 2013 being and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents something to study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... hey! More practice! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results, retire and get a job or go to school. You have a point here sir. Maybe less streaming session and more of "I need to win/get into RO4 to have money". Streaming giving to much easy money and maybe foreigners players count too much on that. (I said MAYBE,plz dont hurt me).
Sadly, bills and rent are OP and can't be nerfed by Blizzard, so streaming will always be necessary for players, especially of they want sponsors.
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On November 22 2013 02:47 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 02:33 SinO[Ob] wrote:On November 22 2013 02:28 Incubus1993 wrote:
For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A&B Koreans (Not the top finishers) owning the NA region through the online qualifiers and knocking all the foreigners out for easy money overnight. It still is a good idea to have a partial region lock, the best would be a residential lock, as in you have to be living (no citizenship) in the region you're playing in. They've changed that mostly for 2014 which is good.
Still, after WCS 2013 being and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents something to study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... hey! More practice! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results, retire and get a job or go to school. You have a point here sir. Maybe less streaming session and more of "I need to win/get into RO4 to have money". Streaming giving to much easy money and maybe foreigners players count too much on that. (I said MAYBE,plz dont hurt me). Sadly, bills and rent are OP and can't be nerfed by Blizzard, so streaming will always be necessary for players, especially of they want sponsors.
Well you will get more sponsors by kicking asses in tournaments than ladder :>.
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On November 22 2013 03:02 SinO[Ob] wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 02:47 Plansix wrote:On November 22 2013 02:33 SinO[Ob] wrote:On November 22 2013 02:28 Incubus1993 wrote:
For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A&B Koreans (Not the top finishers) owning the NA region through the online qualifiers and knocking all the foreigners out for easy money overnight. It still is a good idea to have a partial region lock, the best would be a residential lock, as in you have to be living (no citizenship) in the region you're playing in. They've changed that mostly for 2014 which is good.
Still, after WCS 2013 being and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents something to study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... hey! More practice! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results, retire and get a job or go to school. You have a point here sir. Maybe less streaming session and more of "I need to win/get into RO4 to have money". Streaming giving to much easy money and maybe foreigners players count too much on that. (I said MAYBE,plz dont hurt me). Sadly, bills and rent are OP and can't be nerfed by Blizzard, so streaming will always be necessary for players, especially of they want sponsors. Well you will get more sponsors by kicking asses in tournaments than ladder :>.
Absolutely, completely, 100% wrong. It has been said more than enough times that this is completely incorrect. Eyes on the player/advertisements are whats important. Whether or not the eyes see that player win a championship matters very little here.
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he is not completely wrong. but there are more factors than named here to get sponsorship and ladder / tournament wins / stream are just little pieces of the pie.
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Belgium716 Posts
On November 21 2013 16:21 tadL wrote:
What Koreans Oo. I see there just player from TL, EG, Axiom and other foreigner Teams. Blame them for bringing Koreans in and not believing in their own foreigner players/playerbase. (I do not like this kind of witch hunt driven by foreigners that try to change a system so they do not have to improve to earn a good chunk of the money pit.)
Damn unfortunately this rings painfully truer to my ears than I would like to admit. (Although I'd had liked you elaborate a bit more on that)
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On November 22 2013 03:13 Noobity wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 03:02 SinO[Ob] wrote:On November 22 2013 02:47 Plansix wrote:On November 22 2013 02:33 SinO[Ob] wrote:On November 22 2013 02:28 Incubus1993 wrote:
For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A&B Koreans (Not the top finishers) owning the NA region through the online qualifiers and knocking all the foreigners out for easy money overnight. It still is a good idea to have a partial region lock, the best would be a residential lock, as in you have to be living (no citizenship) in the region you're playing in. They've changed that mostly for 2014 which is good.
Still, after WCS 2013 being and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents something to study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... hey! More practice! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results, retire and get a job or go to school. You have a point here sir. Maybe less streaming session and more of "I need to win/get into RO4 to have money". Streaming giving to much easy money and maybe foreigners players count too much on that. (I said MAYBE,plz dont hurt me). Sadly, bills and rent are OP and can't be nerfed by Blizzard, so streaming will always be necessary for players, especially of they want sponsors. Well you will get more sponsors by kicking asses in tournaments than ladder :>. Absolutely, completely, 100% wrong. It has been said more than enough times that this is completely incorrect. Eyes on the player/advertisements are whats important. Whether or not the eyes see that player win a championship matters very little here.
So every grand master have 15 sponsors cause they are good in ladder and streaming from time to time? Dont think so.
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Also there's a commun logical fallacy in the idea that because the number of koreans doesn't decrease, the system changes nothing. The system already changed in the fact that the number of koreans won't increase. If you're going by steps, that's already one.
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WCS America is sadly still gonna be WCS Korea 2.0.
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United States3545 Posts
On November 22 2013 03:13 Noobity wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 03:02 SinO[Ob] wrote:On November 22 2013 02:47 Plansix wrote:On November 22 2013 02:33 SinO[Ob] wrote:On November 22 2013 02:28 Incubus1993 wrote:
For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A&B Koreans (Not the top finishers) owning the NA region through the online qualifiers and knocking all the foreigners out for easy money overnight. It still is a good idea to have a partial region lock, the best would be a residential lock, as in you have to be living (no citizenship) in the region you're playing in. They've changed that mostly for 2014 which is good.
Still, after WCS 2013 being and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents something to study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... hey! More practice! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results, retire and get a job or go to school. You have a point here sir. Maybe less streaming session and more of "I need to win/get into RO4 to have money". Streaming giving to much easy money and maybe foreigners players count too much on that. (I said MAYBE,plz dont hurt me). Sadly, bills and rent are OP and can't be nerfed by Blizzard, so streaming will always be necessary for players, especially of they want sponsors. Well you will get more sponsors by kicking asses in tournaments than ladder :>. Absolutely, completely, 100% wrong. It has been said more than enough times that this is completely incorrect. Eyes on the player/advertisements are whats important. Whether or not the eyes see that player win a championship matters very little here.
lol you really don't think winning affects marketability? Are you nuts? Idra and Destiny are exceptions, not rules.
The foreign scene will never reach the korean scene for the sole reason foreigners aren't winning to move to small ass houses with 2-3 players per bedroom and practice 10 hours a day with a coach overseeing everything and enforcing the practice regime while giving up the rest of their lives in the search for success. (Also this is much harder to do since US/EU doesn't have a Seoul)
I don't blame them, I couldn't do that either. But they shouldn't be rewarded for that imo. I'm glad the Koreans are staying if the money/point are also staying
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On November 22 2013 04:10 Zygno wrote:
WCS America is sadly still gonna be WCS Korea 2.0.
That isn`t what I`d call sad considering those players earned their right to compete in those prelims. If anything foreigners have to pick up the pace and they need more practice against these guys.
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On November 22 2013 03:02 SinO[Ob] wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 02:47 Plansix wrote:On November 22 2013 02:33 SinO[Ob] wrote:On November 22 2013 02:28 Incubus1993 wrote:
For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A&B Koreans (Not the top finishers) owning the NA region through the online qualifiers and knocking all the foreigners out for easy money overnight. It still is a good idea to have a partial region lock, the best would be a residential lock, as in you have to be living (no citizenship) in the region you're playing in. They've changed that mostly for 2014 which is good.
Still, after WCS 2013 being and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents something to study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... hey! More practice! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results, retire and get a job or go to school. You have a point here sir. Maybe less streaming session and more of "I need to win/get into RO4 to have money". Streaming giving to much easy money and maybe foreigners players count too much on that. (I said MAYBE,plz dont hurt me). Sadly, bills and rent are OP and can't be nerfed by Blizzard, so streaming will always be necessary for players, especially of they want sponsors. Well you will get more sponsors by kicking asses in tournaments than ladder :>.
That doesn't really help you if yor rent is due in 2 weeks or you've got some student loans that are due.
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On November 22 2013 04:14 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 04:10 Zygno wrote:
WCS America is sadly still gonna be WCS Korea 2.0. That isn`t what I`d call sad considering those players earned their right to compete in those prelims. If anything foreigners have to pick up the pace and they need more practice against these guys.
Like QxC and Demuslim both have pointed out in interviews and such You don't get any real practice vses these players until these events.... Then its 1 BO3 and you are out ...... You don't get a whole lot of practice against them thats why ALOT of players are ok with them playing in NA or EU as long as they practice there in the first place.....
Korean don't want to do that though because the best place to practice is ..... KOREA! LOL It's definitely the complete definition of a catch 22.
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I hate nationalism and every ideology attached to it. Why does the geographical location of a person's birth matter so much? It is so baffling.
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after reading this i'm thinking that next year isn't going to be much different from this one.
oh shit besides the greatest news iv'e heard in a while GSL GSL GSL
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On November 22 2013 04:13 ffadicted wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2013 03:13 Noobity wrote:On November 22 2013 03:02 SinO[Ob] wrote:On November 22 2013 02:47 Plansix wrote:On November 22 2013 02:33 SinO[Ob] wrote:On November 22 2013 02:28 Incubus1993 wrote:
For quite a while until recently I was angry at the sheer amount of Code A&B Koreans (Not the top finishers) owning the NA region through the online qualifiers and knocking all the foreigners out for easy money overnight. It still is a good idea to have a partial region lock, the best would be a residential lock, as in you have to be living (no citizenship) in the region you're playing in. They've changed that mostly for 2014 which is good.
Still, after WCS 2013 being and looking at the results. I have 0 sympathy for foreigners. Them or their fans shouldn't expect to be given any advantages, direct or indirect. If they aren't getting results, too freaking bad. The money and finishes should go to the best players, buckle the fuck down and practice more if you want to win. Stop streaming all the time and giving your opponents something to study if you want to seriously compete. Despite what some morons say, the overwhelming majority of skill doesn't come from them "being Asian/Korean". It comes from hard work, dedication, and practice..... practice..... hey! More practice! If they don't commit hard to the game then they won't get results, retire and get a job or go to school. You have a point here sir. Maybe less streaming session and more of "I need to win/get into RO4 to have money". Streaming giving to much easy money and maybe foreigners players count too much on that. (I said MAYBE,plz dont hurt me). Sadly, bills and rent are OP and can't be nerfed by Blizzard, so streaming will always be necessary for players, especially of they want sponsors. Well you will get more sponsors by kicking asses in tournaments than ladder :>. Absolutely, completely, 100% wrong. It has been said more than enough times that this is completely incorrect. Eyes on the player/advertisements are whats important. Whether or not the eyes see that player win a championship matters very little here. lol you really don't think winning affects marketability? Are you nuts? Idra and Destiny are exceptions, not rules. The foreign scene will never reach the korean scene for the sole reason foreigners aren't winning to move to small ass houses with 2-3 players per bedroom and practice 10 hours a day with a coach overseeing everything and enforcing the practice regime while giving up the rest of their lives in the search for success. (Also this is much harder to do since US/EU doesn't have a Seoul) I don't blame them, I couldn't do that either. But they shouldn't be rewarded for that imo. I'm glad the Koreans are staying if the money/point are also staying
Facts show that it doesn't mean the world to win. Sponsors definitely aren't lining up to sponsor the best two teams in the world (the top two in Proleague). SouL lost their sponsorship, and Woongjin Stars just have two players. You know the best funded eSports team in SC2? It was built on the marketability of world champions like incontrol, machine, idra and demuslim.
Even if foreigners moved into small ass houses, they wouldn't be able to compete with Koreans. There are no people who have the experience necessary to be coaches. They don't have a culture fostered by 10 years of professional Brood War. They don't have the high skilled player base. They don't have the team atmosphere resulting from competitive team leagues. They most probably will never find a job in eSports once they are too old to compete.
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The prize pools have to change - especially if you're bringing in more NA foreigners. There's no way you can justify paying out he current money to a NA player not named Scarlett [or I guess Polt if we're going by Blizzard's definition]. Korea needs to be bigger - NA smaller - EU is probably fine where it is. I don't think enough people are acknowledging the viewership issues thatau come with less Koreans in the bracket. Sure the TL crowd wants to cheer for the locals - but the casual fan is just going to see a crappy performance and move on. There's no way NA can compete with the talent coming out of EU
Much less ever hope to make a dent running up against Korea.
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EPT
