EPTUpcoming Balance Patch (Overseer) - Page 3
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Zenbrez
Canada5973 Posts
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Incognoto
France10239 Posts
On August 27 2013 04:59 TeeTS wrote: tell me one terran unit that shoots air, that is fast enough to catch an overseer with this speedupgrade. I´m curious! And it´s not that I think this breaks the game now. It´s just a totally stupid move, because it won´t solve the actual problem of widow mines being too strong vs zerg. It might just create other problems in the future and I´m not only talking about TvZ here. Just a totally stupid change. It shows pretty much how clueless David Kim is. I hope his days as the head of the balance team are numbered, the job is way too much for him. I think Protoss being easier to scout is a good thing as a whole, but you're blowing things out of perspective, anything you need to scout in a protoss base you do it with Overlords before lair tech. I'm talking all-ins and tech routes. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On August 27 2013 04:59 TeeTS wrote: tell me one terran unit that shoots air, that is fast enough to catch an overseer with this speedupgrade. I´m curious! And it´s not that I think this breaks the game now. It´s just a totally stupid move, because it won´t solve the actual problem of widow mines being too strong vs zerg. It might just create other problems in the future and I´m not only talking about TvZ here. Just a totally stupid change. It shows pretty much how clueless David Kim is. I hope his days as the head of the balance team are numbered, the job is way too much for him. Should i remind you what happened when David Kim was actually nerfing stuff? Now they do not want to nerf, and try to buff. Also, they are supposed to never ever be catched by marines now, that is intended. | ||
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Wertheron
France439 Posts
On August 27 2013 04:59 TeeTS wrote: It shows pretty much how clueless David Kim is. I hope his days as the head of the balance team are numbered, the job is way too much for him. So much hate on this guy. But he give us a game which is relatively balance (100% is impossible), and that's really difficult. You must watch SotG interview of Kim, and you will see he have more knowledge on balance (and patch consequence) than you think. Another head of the balance team would be hated after only 2 weeks, players needs a punching ball. | ||
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Sefer
47 Posts
On August 27 2013 04:58 sunless wrote: meh. like recent top level games were decided by overseer being able to keep up with mutas? it is theoretically making mutas-harrass a bit more viable in ZvT so that's theoretically good for zerg but meh, things will be decided before upgraded pneumatics kick in... the big difference is probably mid/late-game scouting (in every match-up) but has anyone ever said TvZ is broken because Z lacks mid/late-game scouting... Blizzard, your ways are mysterious... Actually, it has very little to do with scouting, and a lot to do with mines. Terrans almost exclusively play the same way, it's not as if there is some tech that is going unscouted causing Zergs to love in the mid-late game. It has to do with mines not because they are necessarily imbalanced, but because they put a heavy micro tax on the zerg, and not so much on the terran. Coupled with the Medivac speed boost and drilling claws, terran are able to play a very aggressive, siege-like style with heavy drops and tons of marines (more so than before because tanks were more expensive and Medivacs weren't retained as much. With decent mine hits Terran can play extremely cost efficient with an extremely cheap army that does some of the best dps of any unit composition. One TINY factor to this is that since mines are invisible (or rather, untargettable) when burrowed Zerg needs overseers, but with their current speed they almost always die every engagement. Adding morphing overseers to the many tasks Zerg now has to deal with may seem irrelevant, but overseers aren't cheap, and there is a huge opportunity cost to not having them. Something this small may be just big enough to make a difference to help out Zergs during the Terran's relentless assault and help even out the stats. | ||
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Sefer
47 Posts
On August 27 2013 05:10 Wertheron wrote: So much hate on this guy. But he give us a game which is relatively balance (100% is impossible), and that's really difficult. You must watch SotG interview of Kim, and you will see he have more knowledge on balance (and patch consequence) than you think. Another head of the balance team would be hated after only 2 weeks, players needs a punching ball. I agree with you in that everyone will just hate whoever is the head of the balance team, and that David Kim is probably much better than people give him credit for, but I disagree that his appearances on SOTG demonstrate this. I have always thought that he dodged questions or gave incorrect or less insightful solutions to problems than did Incontrol or Tyler. | ||
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FosTA
Canada154 Posts
On August 27 2013 04:54 Existor wrote: Here are the small list what also it can change: • Overseers now can escape Stalker following (old Overseer at 2.75 against 2.95 Stalker) • Overseers now can escape Viking following (Viking is still 2.75 speed) • Overseers now can follow Mutalisks 22% easier and faster • Overseers also can follow more normally Roaches / Lings on creep • Stimmarines can run at 3.375 speed, so it means that they will less shoot at escaping Overseer because there are small stop-pauses when Marine shoots I think this should be posted in OP Here are the small list what also it can change: • Overseers now can escape Stalker following (old Overseer at 2.75 against 2.95 Stalker) • Overseers now can escape Viking following (Viking is still 2.75 speed) • Overseers now can follow Mutalisks 22% easier and faster • Overseers also can follow more normally Roaches / Lings on creep • Stimmarines can run at 3.375 speed, so it means that they will less shoot at escaping Overseer because there are small stop-pauses when Marine shoots | ||
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graNite
Germany4434 Posts
On August 27 2013 05:03 Existor wrote: Stimmed marine is 3.375 Old overseer with speed is 2.75 read his quote again  | ||
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Assirra
Belgium4169 Posts
On August 27 2013 04:35 TeeTS wrote: very stupid change. makes the overseer basically uncatchable with the upgrade, which will give zerg even easier scouting options, especially against protoss (against terran there is nothing to scout, since there is only one composition to go for). Why not give zerg free vision over the map? edit: This creates more issues than it solves.... well does it solve anything? Terran talking about uncatchable stuff is quite ironic don't you think? | ||
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FosTA
Canada154 Posts
On August 27 2013 05:21 Assirra wrote: Terran talking about uncatchable stuff is quite ironic don't you think? Stim Marines vs speed banes.... Marines get picked up by medi and boosts away... That feeling. | ||
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IdrA
United States11541 Posts
On August 27 2013 05:04 Zenbrez wrote: Late game isn't bad (as long as the zerg is using late game units). It's the transition from mid game to late game that zergs are getting slaughtered in it actually is, zerg is badly outmatched in pretty much every part of the game unless they catch and punish terran being greedy | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On August 27 2013 05:27 IdrA wrote: it actually is, zerg is badly outmatched in pretty much every part of the game unless they catch and punish terran being greedy Even though IdrA has bias, he is kinda... right? | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On August 27 2013 05:27 IdrA wrote: it actually is, zerg is badly outmatched in pretty much every part of the game unless they catch and punish terran being greedy Isn't that every match up for every race? You are outmatched if you don't catch your opponent being greedy and punish them for it in some way. On August 27 2013 05:28 lolfail9001 wrote: Even though IdrA has bias, he is kinda... right? Yeah, but you could say that about ZvZ too. Or PvP. Greed is a good way to outmatch your opponent. Not that I think zerg has an easy time against widow mines. They are super mean and very powerful. | ||
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sunless
62 Posts
On August 27 2013 05:11 Sefer wrote: One TINY factor to this is that since mines are invisible (or rather, untargettable) when burrowed Zerg needs overseers, but with their current speed they almost always die every engagement. Adding morphing overseers to the many tasks Zerg now has to deal with may seem irrelevant, but overseers aren't cheap, and there is a huge opportunity cost to not having them. Something this small may be just big enough to make a difference to help out Zergs during the Terran's relentless assault and help even out the stats. Maybe it will be just enough, but it seems both a very indirect way of addressing mid-game and mid/late game transition TvZ and also a somewhat match-up unspecific change. But sure saving the money and the morphing action and the possible time without detection cannot hurt but there are other tiny changes that would have dealt more directly with the cost-efficiency of the 4M army against muta-ling-banes. Motivations and effects would have been easier to understand and foresee. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On August 27 2013 05:29 Plansix wrote: Isn't that every match up for every race? You are outmatched if you don't catch your opponent being greedy and punish them for it in some way. Well, point is that you cannot really counter it with your own greed i think. | ||
Liquid`Snute
Norway839 Posts
 great stuff | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On August 27 2013 05:32 Liquid`Snute wrote: Nice small change that helps with dealing with the 3CC marine marauder medivac mine train and muta harass great stuffDK can now make a mark on patch: Approved by Pro Zerg. | ||
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Taefox
1533 Posts
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PanN
United States2828 Posts
On August 27 2013 04:30 Bagi wrote: I don't mind the overseer buff. But its really nothing at all. The mech buff they had in mind wasn't ideal, but it was something. Something that could possibly have terran players experiment with different builds besides MMM. But I guess making the game interesting isn't a priority, lets just make every terran player go through the exact same motions every game like they have for months now. I loved watching terran games in WoL, even when they were getting raped by BL/infestor. I root against terran players in HOTS, every game is just MMM spam. It literally says in the first first post of the thread you just posted in "Another popular area you guys bring up these days and that we agree with is making mech more viable. We will continue testing the mech upgrades change, or other changes if needed, in order to really figure out what the best direction for mech is." I understand blizzard bashing from time to time, but this was just dumb. | ||
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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
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