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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51481 Posts
On June 13 2013 16:47 Ragnarork wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:44 gobbledydook wrote:On June 13 2013 16:21 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 15:59 VManOfMana wrote:On June 13 2013 15:15 hzflank wrote:Why are OGN involved in this thing again? WCS Korea, and the WCS finals, would of been so much better if Gretech had done it all. On June 13 2013 14:39 vesicular wrote:
I seem to remember people pissing and moaning about Proleague when they found out the format after it switched to SC2 as well. In fact, you could probably just copy this thread and change "OSL" to "PL" and it would probably be the same thing. People eventually came around.
Like most things, people are just overreacting because they haven't experienced it. OSL is wonderful, tense and dramatic and has been the premier SC tournament for a decade for a reason. We experienced an SC2 OSL last year and it was bad. You can't compare the level of KeSPA players during the first OSL (fresh from dual proleague) and now. The GSL used to use best of 1 in early 2011. It was changed because it is an inferior format. Starcraft 2 in 2011 was a complete joke. Especially the map pool. On June 13 2013 15:23 hzflank wrote:
No idea about what? Ofcourse Gom will do season 3, we already knew that and it is completely irrelevant.
So what do I not have any idea about? Are you trying to tell me that the OSL last year was as good as any of the GSL?
And why should people like me not complain? Gretech has done a great job for the last couple of years and have tweaked their format to make it better for us viewers. OGN is using a format without even considering what the viewers want to see. Best case is the results are the same but we get to watch less games, which makes it lose/lose. Have you considered you are *not* OGN's main target audience? It's not like there was no eSports before SC2 or you came in. So OGN main target audience is BW viewers that switched to SC2 ? And to be sure not to miss this huge core audience, they want to keep a format that involves more luck, in a game that's known to have a bit more luck involved as well than BW ? I completely fail to understand what could possibly justify that. "Conserving uniformity" ? Well, keep your crappy format then. Oh, and the fact that SC2 was a joke in 2011 is completely irrelevant, we talk about production quality. OT: Same as the first SC2 OSL. Will watch a few matches, then wait for the finals, hoping for something interesting to watch.. Either improve, OGN, or please give that back to Gretech. GSL may not have the holy aura of BW behind it. It may not have the huuuuuge audience of OGN by many times. Still, it's been far better watching GSL than OSL so far in SC2. And the massive influx of KeSPA players made it even better. if you don't like it don't watch it. meanwhile let us who like the OSL format enjoy it... I would have been totally fine with it. If it was an OSL, and not a WCS OSL. Yep :/ Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:46 Pandemona wrote:
Best of 1....need gtfo seriously.
What a joke that is fml. Thanks for ruining the RO32 OSL, i appreciate it. I won't be tuning in until the RO16, which will be a lottery.
Expect the likes of Innovation/Soulkey/Flash all to go out in RO32 btw people. Better players don't win BO1s. Look at WCS main event just gone. If BO1 was viable the tournament would of been so different.
Such a joke with BO1 :@
(yeah im pissed >.<) Calm down. Even if Bo1 is more random, it's still quite not expected that Life/Flash/INno don't get through the Ro32...
Just look at ProLeague thats all you need. Soulkey lost the other day in a BO1 format, however i bet he would of whiped the floor with him in a BO3.
I bet at least 2 or 3 big players fall in the RO32, and im not talking mediocre players. BO1 is a lottery, ask any pro. 1 bad scout, 1 miss read 1 build order loss and GG your in the losers game
On June 13 2013 16:50 opterown wrote:
i'm guessing there's an element of pride as well in playing BO1s, fans probably won't like it if you cheese out the favourites to advance, so there's a bit of pressure to try at least a "real" game
Clutching at straws their mr OPTown  i wish that was the case, but when money is on the line no one gives a f...
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Austria24417 Posts
On June 13 2013 16:53 GolemMadness wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:50 DarkLordOlli wrote:On June 13 2013 16:47 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 16:44 gobbledydook wrote:On June 13 2013 16:21 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 15:59 VManOfMana wrote:On June 13 2013 15:15 hzflank wrote:Why are OGN involved in this thing again? WCS Korea, and the WCS finals, would of been so much better if Gretech had done it all. On June 13 2013 14:39 vesicular wrote:
I seem to remember people pissing and moaning about Proleague when they found out the format after it switched to SC2 as well. In fact, you could probably just copy this thread and change "OSL" to "PL" and it would probably be the same thing. People eventually came around.
Like most things, people are just overreacting because they haven't experienced it. OSL is wonderful, tense and dramatic and has been the premier SC tournament for a decade for a reason. We experienced an SC2 OSL last year and it was bad. You can't compare the level of KeSPA players during the first OSL (fresh from dual proleague) and now. The GSL used to use best of 1 in early 2011. It was changed because it is an inferior format. Starcraft 2 in 2011 was a complete joke. Especially the map pool. On June 13 2013 15:23 hzflank wrote:
No idea about what? Ofcourse Gom will do season 3, we already knew that and it is completely irrelevant.
So what do I not have any idea about? Are you trying to tell me that the OSL last year was as good as any of the GSL?
And why should people like me not complain? Gretech has done a great job for the last couple of years and have tweaked their format to make it better for us viewers. OGN is using a format without even considering what the viewers want to see. Best case is the results are the same but we get to watch less games, which makes it lose/lose. Have you considered you are *not* OGN's main target audience? It's not like there was no eSports before SC2 or you came in. So OGN main target audience is BW viewers that switched to SC2 ? And to be sure not to miss this huge core audience, they want to keep a format that involves more luck, in a game that's known to have a bit more luck involved as well than BW ? I completely fail to understand what could possibly justify that. "Conserving uniformity" ? Well, keep your crappy format then. Oh, and the fact that SC2 was a joke in 2011 is completely irrelevant, we talk about production quality. OT: Same as the first SC2 OSL. Will watch a few matches, then wait for the finals, hoping for something interesting to watch.. Either improve, OGN, or please give that back to Gretech. GSL may not have the holy aura of BW behind it. It may not have the huuuuuge audience of OGN by many times. Still, it's been far better watching GSL than OSL so far in SC2. And the massive influx of KeSPA players made it even better. if you don't like it don't watch it. meanwhile let us who like the OSL format enjoy it... I would have been totally fine with it. If it was an OSL, and not a WCS OSL. Yep :/ That's my problem with this exactly. Let OSL be OSL, whatever. It's their choice if they want a completely random Ro16. But this time they're a qualifier for something that's supposed to be the Masters of SC2. And Bo1 should not ever ever ever at any stage be used as a qualifying format for such an event. If you actually think that Bo1 makes it completely random, then you're basically just saying that Starcraft 2 is a bad game.
WHAT THE FUCK
Tennis isn't decided in one set. Football isn't decided by who scores first. WTF
Randomness would happen in football (soccer) as well if that were how it's decided. Does that make the whole game bad? What a garbage argument is that?
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On June 13 2013 16:44 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:42 GolemMadness wrote:
People are being so ridiculous about this. First of all, just because it's Bo1 doesn't mean that it's "totally random" who's going to win. If it was that random, then inferior players would just cheese every game in a Bo3 as well and it'd still be totally random who'd make it through.
Secondly, what about Proleague? If Bo1 is so stupid and all that happens is the inferior player takes out the better player all the time, why are players like Flash, Bogus, Soulkey, Rain, etc, so dominant in Proleague? Why aren't we seeing them just going 50% because Bo1 is so random?
Thirdly, where exactly is the proof that things are so terrible in a Bo1 format? From the previous OSL, where the better players generally advanced? Or from two years ago, when the game was played completely differently? Calm the shit down and wait to see what happens. My main concern is PvP, all of Rain's HotS losses in Proleague are vsP. He's 100% vs T and Z, PvP is just too build order reliant for bo1's.
theres a time when Rain looked unbeatable when it got to the mid-game onward, isnt it? Whats scarier is that he played that out on purpose. I'd say if Rain does his scouting diligently, nullifies all the shenanigans, hes good to go.
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On June 13 2013 16:53 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:49 rasers wrote:On June 13 2013 16:45 DarkLordOlli wrote:
I'm just gonna state this every time Bo1 format comes up. I could take first place in a Bo1 group by proxy gating 2 times in a row and hoping my opponents build order lose to it. Mindgames man. In a Bo3+ the possibility of that working is infinitely smaller. don't u think that would happen alot if it was that freaking easy? It does happen all the time in PL. Did you see the amount of things proxied this season?
to be honest, in PvP, proxying most stuff shouldn't work against a safe opener.
1) In-base 2 gate proxy: scout your base, don't pull a  Brown and you will be fine.
2) Proxy anything after cyber core: Scout your opponent's base and check for missing pylons. If there are...
2a) Proxy stargate: 2 stalkers in mineral line solves it.
2b) Proxy DT: open robo and get observer.
2c) Proxy robo: who even does that? mamaship core deals with warp prism 4 gate which is the only reason you'd proxy a robo
Essentially, if you are caught pants down by proxy, you are not scouting well enough or playing too greedy.
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Bo1's in the ro32... Horrible decision for a prestigious tournament like WCS OSL.
I do not understand OGN. Well I do, but...
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On June 13 2013 16:53 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:52 GolemMadness wrote:On June 13 2013 16:45 DarkLordOlli wrote:
I'm just gonna state this every time Bo1 format comes up. I could take first place in a Bo1 group by proxy gating 2 times in a row and hoping my opponents build order lose to it. Mindgames man. In a Bo3+ the possibility of that working is infinitely smaller. Yeah, which is why we see all the players go for proxy gates in Proleague and the U&D matches. There's proxy gates all the time in PL, lol.
When was the last time there was a proxy gate in a PvP?
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On June 13 2013 16:53 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:49 rasers wrote:On June 13 2013 16:45 DarkLordOlli wrote:
I'm just gonna state this every time Bo1 format comes up. I could take first place in a Bo1 group by proxy gating 2 times in a row and hoping my opponents build order lose to it. Mindgames man. In a Bo3+ the possibility of that working is infinitely smaller. don't u think that would happen alot if it was that freaking easy? It does happen all the time in PL. Did you see the amount of things proxied this season?
i talk about placing first in a grp with this shit.
also if it's so easy to get 2 wins. why not make ro16 bo5? or u might get an easy 2:0 win.
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France9034 Posts
On June 13 2013 16:54 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:53 GolemMadness wrote:On June 13 2013 16:50 DarkLordOlli wrote:On June 13 2013 16:47 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 16:44 gobbledydook wrote:On June 13 2013 16:21 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 15:59 VManOfMana wrote:On June 13 2013 15:15 hzflank wrote:Why are OGN involved in this thing again? WCS Korea, and the WCS finals, would of been so much better if Gretech had done it all. On June 13 2013 14:39 vesicular wrote:
I seem to remember people pissing and moaning about Proleague when they found out the format after it switched to SC2 as well. In fact, you could probably just copy this thread and change "OSL" to "PL" and it would probably be the same thing. People eventually came around.
Like most things, people are just overreacting because they haven't experienced it. OSL is wonderful, tense and dramatic and has been the premier SC tournament for a decade for a reason. We experienced an SC2 OSL last year and it was bad. You can't compare the level of KeSPA players during the first OSL (fresh from dual proleague) and now. The GSL used to use best of 1 in early 2011. It was changed because it is an inferior format. Starcraft 2 in 2011 was a complete joke. Especially the map pool. On June 13 2013 15:23 hzflank wrote:
No idea about what? Ofcourse Gom will do season 3, we already knew that and it is completely irrelevant.
So what do I not have any idea about? Are you trying to tell me that the OSL last year was as good as any of the GSL?
And why should people like me not complain? Gretech has done a great job for the last couple of years and have tweaked their format to make it better for us viewers. OGN is using a format without even considering what the viewers want to see. Best case is the results are the same but we get to watch less games, which makes it lose/lose. Have you considered you are *not* OGN's main target audience? It's not like there was no eSports before SC2 or you came in. So OGN main target audience is BW viewers that switched to SC2 ? And to be sure not to miss this huge core audience, they want to keep a format that involves more luck, in a game that's known to have a bit more luck involved as well than BW ? I completely fail to understand what could possibly justify that. "Conserving uniformity" ? Well, keep your crappy format then. Oh, and the fact that SC2 was a joke in 2011 is completely irrelevant, we talk about production quality. OT: Same as the first SC2 OSL. Will watch a few matches, then wait for the finals, hoping for something interesting to watch.. Either improve, OGN, or please give that back to Gretech. GSL may not have the holy aura of BW behind it. It may not have the huuuuuge audience of OGN by many times. Still, it's been far better watching GSL than OSL so far in SC2. And the massive influx of KeSPA players made it even better. if you don't like it don't watch it. meanwhile let us who like the OSL format enjoy it... I would have been totally fine with it. If it was an OSL, and not a WCS OSL. Yep :/ That's my problem with this exactly. Let OSL be OSL, whatever. It's their choice if they want a completely random Ro16. But this time they're a qualifier for something that's supposed to be the Masters of SC2. And Bo1 should not ever ever ever at any stage be used as a qualifying format for such an event. If you actually think that Bo1 makes it completely random, then you're basically just saying that Starcraft 2 is a bad game. WHAT THE FUCK Tennis isn't decided in one set. Football isn't decided by who scores first. WTF Randomness would happen in football (soccer) as well if that were how it's decided. Does that make the whole game bad? What a garbage argument is that?
That wasn't even an argument. That was pure provocation.
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Man why wouldnt they choose just a Round Robin, doesnt take as long as 3 Bo5's, and is not as random as Bo1.
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On June 13 2013 16:54 Pandemona wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:47 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 16:44 gobbledydook wrote:On June 13 2013 16:21 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 15:59 VManOfMana wrote:On June 13 2013 15:15 hzflank wrote:Why are OGN involved in this thing again? WCS Korea, and the WCS finals, would of been so much better if Gretech had done it all. On June 13 2013 14:39 vesicular wrote:
I seem to remember people pissing and moaning about Proleague when they found out the format after it switched to SC2 as well. In fact, you could probably just copy this thread and change "OSL" to "PL" and it would probably be the same thing. People eventually came around.
Like most things, people are just overreacting because they haven't experienced it. OSL is wonderful, tense and dramatic and has been the premier SC tournament for a decade for a reason. We experienced an SC2 OSL last year and it was bad. You can't compare the level of KeSPA players during the first OSL (fresh from dual proleague) and now. The GSL used to use best of 1 in early 2011. It was changed because it is an inferior format. Starcraft 2 in 2011 was a complete joke. Especially the map pool. On June 13 2013 15:23 hzflank wrote:
No idea about what? Ofcourse Gom will do season 3, we already knew that and it is completely irrelevant.
So what do I not have any idea about? Are you trying to tell me that the OSL last year was as good as any of the GSL?
And why should people like me not complain? Gretech has done a great job for the last couple of years and have tweaked their format to make it better for us viewers. OGN is using a format without even considering what the viewers want to see. Best case is the results are the same but we get to watch less games, which makes it lose/lose. Have you considered you are *not* OGN's main target audience? It's not like there was no eSports before SC2 or you came in. So OGN main target audience is BW viewers that switched to SC2 ? And to be sure not to miss this huge core audience, they want to keep a format that involves more luck, in a game that's known to have a bit more luck involved as well than BW ? I completely fail to understand what could possibly justify that. "Conserving uniformity" ? Well, keep your crappy format then. Oh, and the fact that SC2 was a joke in 2011 is completely irrelevant, we talk about production quality. OT: Same as the first SC2 OSL. Will watch a few matches, then wait for the finals, hoping for something interesting to watch.. Either improve, OGN, or please give that back to Gretech. GSL may not have the holy aura of BW behind it. It may not have the huuuuuge audience of OGN by many times. Still, it's been far better watching GSL than OSL so far in SC2. And the massive influx of KeSPA players made it even better. if you don't like it don't watch it. meanwhile let us who like the OSL format enjoy it... I would have been totally fine with it. If it was an OSL, and not a WCS OSL. Yep :/ On June 13 2013 16:46 Pandemona wrote:
Best of 1....need gtfo seriously.
What a joke that is fml. Thanks for ruining the RO32 OSL, i appreciate it. I won't be tuning in until the RO16, which will be a lottery.
Expect the likes of Innovation/Soulkey/Flash all to go out in RO32 btw people. Better players don't win BO1s. Look at WCS main event just gone. If BO1 was viable the tournament would of been so different.
Such a joke with BO1 :@
(yeah im pissed >.<) Calm down. Even if Bo1 is more random, it's still quite not expected that Life/Flash/INno don't get through the Ro32... Just look at ProLeague thats all you need. Soulkey lost the other day in a BO1 format, however i bet he would of whiped the floor with him in a BO3. I bet at least 2 or 3 big players fall in the RO32, and im not talking mediocre players. BO1 is a lottery, ask any pro. 1 bad scout, 1 miss read 1 build order loss and GG your in the losers game
flash / rain / parting / drg / mc all breezed through the ro32 / ro16 last year and they were probably the strongest players from the last osl aside from maybe mvp
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On June 13 2013 16:54 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:53 GolemMadness wrote:On June 13 2013 16:50 DarkLordOlli wrote:On June 13 2013 16:47 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 16:44 gobbledydook wrote:On June 13 2013 16:21 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 15:59 VManOfMana wrote:On June 13 2013 15:15 hzflank wrote:Why are OGN involved in this thing again? WCS Korea, and the WCS finals, would of been so much better if Gretech had done it all. On June 13 2013 14:39 vesicular wrote:
I seem to remember people pissing and moaning about Proleague when they found out the format after it switched to SC2 as well. In fact, you could probably just copy this thread and change "OSL" to "PL" and it would probably be the same thing. People eventually came around.
Like most things, people are just overreacting because they haven't experienced it. OSL is wonderful, tense and dramatic and has been the premier SC tournament for a decade for a reason. We experienced an SC2 OSL last year and it was bad. You can't compare the level of KeSPA players during the first OSL (fresh from dual proleague) and now. The GSL used to use best of 1 in early 2011. It was changed because it is an inferior format. Starcraft 2 in 2011 was a complete joke. Especially the map pool. On June 13 2013 15:23 hzflank wrote:
No idea about what? Ofcourse Gom will do season 3, we already knew that and it is completely irrelevant.
So what do I not have any idea about? Are you trying to tell me that the OSL last year was as good as any of the GSL?
And why should people like me not complain? Gretech has done a great job for the last couple of years and have tweaked their format to make it better for us viewers. OGN is using a format without even considering what the viewers want to see. Best case is the results are the same but we get to watch less games, which makes it lose/lose. Have you considered you are *not* OGN's main target audience? It's not like there was no eSports before SC2 or you came in. So OGN main target audience is BW viewers that switched to SC2 ? And to be sure not to miss this huge core audience, they want to keep a format that involves more luck, in a game that's known to have a bit more luck involved as well than BW ? I completely fail to understand what could possibly justify that. "Conserving uniformity" ? Well, keep your crappy format then. Oh, and the fact that SC2 was a joke in 2011 is completely irrelevant, we talk about production quality. OT: Same as the first SC2 OSL. Will watch a few matches, then wait for the finals, hoping for something interesting to watch.. Either improve, OGN, or please give that back to Gretech. GSL may not have the holy aura of BW behind it. It may not have the huuuuuge audience of OGN by many times. Still, it's been far better watching GSL than OSL so far in SC2. And the massive influx of KeSPA players made it even better. if you don't like it don't watch it. meanwhile let us who like the OSL format enjoy it... I would have been totally fine with it. If it was an OSL, and not a WCS OSL. Yep :/ That's my problem with this exactly. Let OSL be OSL, whatever. It's their choice if they want a completely random Ro16. But this time they're a qualifier for something that's supposed to be the Masters of SC2. And Bo1 should not ever ever ever at any stage be used as a qualifying format for such an event. If you actually think that Bo1 makes it completely random, then you're basically just saying that Starcraft 2 is a bad game. WHAT THE FUCK Tennis isn't decided in one set. Football isn't decided by who scores first. WTF Randomness would happen in football (soccer) as well if that were how it's decided. Does that make the whole game bad? What a garbage argument is that?
If you think that Bo1 is completely random, then you're saying that skill means nothing and every single person in the tournament has an equal opportunity to make it through. It's pretty ironic that you mention football, since the super bowl IS a Bo1.
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Austria24417 Posts
On June 13 2013 16:56 GolemMadness wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:53 DarkLordOlli wrote:On June 13 2013 16:52 GolemMadness wrote:On June 13 2013 16:45 DarkLordOlli wrote:
I'm just gonna state this every time Bo1 format comes up. I could take first place in a Bo1 group by proxy gating 2 times in a row and hoping my opponents build order lose to it. Mindgames man. In a Bo3+ the possibility of that working is infinitely smaller. Yeah, which is why we see all the players go for proxy gates in Proleague and the U&D matches. There's proxy gates all the time in PL, lol. When was the last time there was a proxy gate in a PvP?
Why just PvP? There's proxy gates in every matchup, lol. HerO vs Flash, Jaedong vs I forgot who, Stork vs Zest, etcetc.
Btw WCS Finals had sOs proxy gating HerO
Then there was Rain proxy DTing herO, LiquidHerO proxy Stargate'ing a bunch of people, etcetcetcetc.
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On June 13 2013 16:56 gobbledydook wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:53 DarkLordOlli wrote:On June 13 2013 16:49 rasers wrote:On June 13 2013 16:45 DarkLordOlli wrote:
I'm just gonna state this every time Bo1 format comes up. I could take first place in a Bo1 group by proxy gating 2 times in a row and hoping my opponents build order lose to it. Mindgames man. In a Bo3+ the possibility of that working is infinitely smaller. don't u think that would happen alot if it was that freaking easy? It does happen all the time in PL. Did you see the amount of things proxied this season? to be honest, in PvP, proxying most stuff shouldn't work against a safe opener. 1) In-base 2 gate proxy: scout your base, don't pull a Brown and you will be fine. 2) Proxy anything after cyber core: Scout your opponent's base and check for missing pylons. If there are... 2a) Proxy stargate: 2 stalkers in mineral line solves it. 2b) Proxy DT: open robo and get observer. 2c) Proxy robo: who even does that? mamaship core deals with warp prism 4 gate which is the only reason you'd proxy a robo Essentially, what this means is a 1 gate robo expand is perfectly safe against all proxies. Essentially, if you are caught pants down by proxy, you are not scouting well enough or playing too greedy.
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Austria24417 Posts
On June 13 2013 16:58 GolemMadness wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:54 DarkLordOlli wrote:On June 13 2013 16:53 GolemMadness wrote:On June 13 2013 16:50 DarkLordOlli wrote:On June 13 2013 16:47 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 16:44 gobbledydook wrote:On June 13 2013 16:21 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 15:59 VManOfMana wrote:On June 13 2013 15:15 hzflank wrote:Why are OGN involved in this thing again? WCS Korea, and the WCS finals, would of been so much better if Gretech had done it all. On June 13 2013 14:39 vesicular wrote:
I seem to remember people pissing and moaning about Proleague when they found out the format after it switched to SC2 as well. In fact, you could probably just copy this thread and change "OSL" to "PL" and it would probably be the same thing. People eventually came around.
Like most things, people are just overreacting because they haven't experienced it. OSL is wonderful, tense and dramatic and has been the premier SC tournament for a decade for a reason. We experienced an SC2 OSL last year and it was bad. You can't compare the level of KeSPA players during the first OSL (fresh from dual proleague) and now. The GSL used to use best of 1 in early 2011. It was changed because it is an inferior format. Starcraft 2 in 2011 was a complete joke. Especially the map pool. On June 13 2013 15:23 hzflank wrote:
No idea about what? Ofcourse Gom will do season 3, we already knew that and it is completely irrelevant.
So what do I not have any idea about? Are you trying to tell me that the OSL last year was as good as any of the GSL?
And why should people like me not complain? Gretech has done a great job for the last couple of years and have tweaked their format to make it better for us viewers. OGN is using a format without even considering what the viewers want to see. Best case is the results are the same but we get to watch less games, which makes it lose/lose. Have you considered you are *not* OGN's main target audience? It's not like there was no eSports before SC2 or you came in. So OGN main target audience is BW viewers that switched to SC2 ? And to be sure not to miss this huge core audience, they want to keep a format that involves more luck, in a game that's known to have a bit more luck involved as well than BW ? I completely fail to understand what could possibly justify that. "Conserving uniformity" ? Well, keep your crappy format then. Oh, and the fact that SC2 was a joke in 2011 is completely irrelevant, we talk about production quality. OT: Same as the first SC2 OSL. Will watch a few matches, then wait for the finals, hoping for something interesting to watch.. Either improve, OGN, or please give that back to Gretech. GSL may not have the holy aura of BW behind it. It may not have the huuuuuge audience of OGN by many times. Still, it's been far better watching GSL than OSL so far in SC2. And the massive influx of KeSPA players made it even better. if you don't like it don't watch it. meanwhile let us who like the OSL format enjoy it... I would have been totally fine with it. If it was an OSL, and not a WCS OSL. Yep :/ That's my problem with this exactly. Let OSL be OSL, whatever. It's their choice if they want a completely random Ro16. But this time they're a qualifier for something that's supposed to be the Masters of SC2. And Bo1 should not ever ever ever at any stage be used as a qualifying format for such an event. If you actually think that Bo1 makes it completely random, then you're basically just saying that Starcraft 2 is a bad game. WHAT THE FUCK Tennis isn't decided in one set. Football isn't decided by who scores first. WTF Randomness would happen in football (soccer) as well if that were how it's decided. Does that make the whole game bad? What a garbage argument is that? If you think that Bo1 is completely random, then you're saying that skill means nothing and every single person in the tournament has an equal opportunity to make it through. It's pretty ironic that you mention football, since the super bowl IS a Bo1.
Soccer. Bo1 in football would be like... the first touchdown wins.
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51481 Posts
On June 13 2013 16:57 killer1nz wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:54 Pandemona wrote:On June 13 2013 16:47 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 16:44 gobbledydook wrote:On June 13 2013 16:21 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 15:59 VManOfMana wrote:On June 13 2013 15:15 hzflank wrote:Why are OGN involved in this thing again? WCS Korea, and the WCS finals, would of been so much better if Gretech had done it all. On June 13 2013 14:39 vesicular wrote:
I seem to remember people pissing and moaning about Proleague when they found out the format after it switched to SC2 as well. In fact, you could probably just copy this thread and change "OSL" to "PL" and it would probably be the same thing. People eventually came around.
Like most things, people are just overreacting because they haven't experienced it. OSL is wonderful, tense and dramatic and has been the premier SC tournament for a decade for a reason. We experienced an SC2 OSL last year and it was bad. You can't compare the level of KeSPA players during the first OSL (fresh from dual proleague) and now. The GSL used to use best of 1 in early 2011. It was changed because it is an inferior format. Starcraft 2 in 2011 was a complete joke. Especially the map pool. On June 13 2013 15:23 hzflank wrote:
No idea about what? Ofcourse Gom will do season 3, we already knew that and it is completely irrelevant.
So what do I not have any idea about? Are you trying to tell me that the OSL last year was as good as any of the GSL?
And why should people like me not complain? Gretech has done a great job for the last couple of years and have tweaked their format to make it better for us viewers. OGN is using a format without even considering what the viewers want to see. Best case is the results are the same but we get to watch less games, which makes it lose/lose. Have you considered you are *not* OGN's main target audience? It's not like there was no eSports before SC2 or you came in. So OGN main target audience is BW viewers that switched to SC2 ? And to be sure not to miss this huge core audience, they want to keep a format that involves more luck, in a game that's known to have a bit more luck involved as well than BW ? I completely fail to understand what could possibly justify that. "Conserving uniformity" ? Well, keep your crappy format then. Oh, and the fact that SC2 was a joke in 2011 is completely irrelevant, we talk about production quality. OT: Same as the first SC2 OSL. Will watch a few matches, then wait for the finals, hoping for something interesting to watch.. Either improve, OGN, or please give that back to Gretech. GSL may not have the holy aura of BW behind it. It may not have the huuuuuge audience of OGN by many times. Still, it's been far better watching GSL than OSL so far in SC2. And the massive influx of KeSPA players made it even better. if you don't like it don't watch it. meanwhile let us who like the OSL format enjoy it... I would have been totally fine with it. If it was an OSL, and not a WCS OSL. Yep :/ On June 13 2013 16:46 Pandemona wrote:
Best of 1....need gtfo seriously.
What a joke that is fml. Thanks for ruining the RO32 OSL, i appreciate it. I won't be tuning in until the RO16, which will be a lottery.
Expect the likes of Innovation/Soulkey/Flash all to go out in RO32 btw people. Better players don't win BO1s. Look at WCS main event just gone. If BO1 was viable the tournament would of been so different.
Such a joke with BO1 :@
(yeah im pissed >.<) Calm down. Even if Bo1 is more random, it's still quite not expected that Life/Flash/INno don't get through the Ro32... Just look at ProLeague thats all you need. Soulkey lost the other day in a BO1 format, however i bet he would of whiped the floor with him in a BO3. I bet at least 2 or 3 big players fall in the RO32, and im not talking mediocre players. BO1 is a lottery, ask any pro. 1 bad scout, 1 miss read 1 build order loss and GG your in the losers game flash / rain / parting / drg / mc all breezed through the ro32 / ro16 last year and they were probably the strongest players from the last osl aside from maybe mvp
Was a year ago though sir. Lots changed then like KESPA players been training a whole year solidly on SC2. Plus like i said you just have to look at the ProLeague. KESPA training for the players on a map they know agaisnt a race they know. CHEESE fest, especially these new maps they bring out lately xD
Also DRG/MC not so good atm are they ;_;
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France9034 Posts
On June 13 2013 17:00 Kal_rA wrote:
FvF finals.. Calling it.
Flash | FantaSy ?
Welp, it's happening right now in the PL, might better have a peek then !
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On June 13 2013 16:58 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:56 GolemMadness wrote:On June 13 2013 16:53 DarkLordOlli wrote:On June 13 2013 16:52 GolemMadness wrote:On June 13 2013 16:45 DarkLordOlli wrote:
I'm just gonna state this every time Bo1 format comes up. I could take first place in a Bo1 group by proxy gating 2 times in a row and hoping my opponents build order lose to it. Mindgames man. In a Bo3+ the possibility of that working is infinitely smaller. Yeah, which is why we see all the players go for proxy gates in Proleague and the U&D matches. There's proxy gates all the time in PL, lol. When was the last time there was a proxy gate in a PvP? Why just PvP? There's proxy gates in every matchup, lol. HerO vs Flash, Jaedong vs I forgot who, Stork vs Zest, etcetc. Btw WCS Finals had sOs proxy gating HerO
So basically, a few times a month? But since Bo1 is so random, why doesn't the inferior player just go for a proxy gate every single game so that they have a completely equal chance of winning?
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ahahaha typical OGN. They screwed up last OSL (which Rain won), and now theyre using the shitty format again????
Whats even more joke is that theyre using completely new maps (Gwanganli beach and Anaconda) in these bo1s... lol
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1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On June 13 2013 16:58 GolemMadness wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2013 16:54 DarkLordOlli wrote:On June 13 2013 16:53 GolemMadness wrote:On June 13 2013 16:50 DarkLordOlli wrote:On June 13 2013 16:47 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 16:44 gobbledydook wrote:On June 13 2013 16:21 Ragnarork wrote:On June 13 2013 15:59 VManOfMana wrote:On June 13 2013 15:15 hzflank wrote:Why are OGN involved in this thing again? WCS Korea, and the WCS finals, would of been so much better if Gretech had done it all. On June 13 2013 14:39 vesicular wrote:
I seem to remember people pissing and moaning about Proleague when they found out the format after it switched to SC2 as well. In fact, you could probably just copy this thread and change "OSL" to "PL" and it would probably be the same thing. People eventually came around.
Like most things, people are just overreacting because they haven't experienced it. OSL is wonderful, tense and dramatic and has been the premier SC tournament for a decade for a reason. We experienced an SC2 OSL last year and it was bad. You can't compare the level of KeSPA players during the first OSL (fresh from dual proleague) and now. The GSL used to use best of 1 in early 2011. It was changed because it is an inferior format. Starcraft 2 in 2011 was a complete joke. Especially the map pool. On June 13 2013 15:23 hzflank wrote:
No idea about what? Ofcourse Gom will do season 3, we already knew that and it is completely irrelevant.
So what do I not have any idea about? Are you trying to tell me that the OSL last year was as good as any of the GSL?
And why should people like me not complain? Gretech has done a great job for the last couple of years and have tweaked their format to make it better for us viewers. OGN is using a format without even considering what the viewers want to see. Best case is the results are the same but we get to watch less games, which makes it lose/lose. Have you considered you are *not* OGN's main target audience? It's not like there was no eSports before SC2 or you came in. So OGN main target audience is BW viewers that switched to SC2 ? And to be sure not to miss this huge core audience, they want to keep a format that involves more luck, in a game that's known to have a bit more luck involved as well than BW ? I completely fail to understand what could possibly justify that. "Conserving uniformity" ? Well, keep your crappy format then. Oh, and the fact that SC2 was a joke in 2011 is completely irrelevant, we talk about production quality. OT: Same as the first SC2 OSL. Will watch a few matches, then wait for the finals, hoping for something interesting to watch.. Either improve, OGN, or please give that back to Gretech. GSL may not have the holy aura of BW behind it. It may not have the huuuuuge audience of OGN by many times. Still, it's been far better watching GSL than OSL so far in SC2. And the massive influx of KeSPA players made it even better. if you don't like it don't watch it. meanwhile let us who like the OSL format enjoy it... I would have been totally fine with it. If it was an OSL, and not a WCS OSL. Yep :/ That's my problem with this exactly. Let OSL be OSL, whatever. It's their choice if they want a completely random Ro16. But this time they're a qualifier for something that's supposed to be the Masters of SC2. And Bo1 should not ever ever ever at any stage be used as a qualifying format for such an event. If you actually think that Bo1 makes it completely random, then you're basically just saying that Starcraft 2 is a bad game. WHAT THE FUCK Tennis isn't decided in one set. Football isn't decided by who scores first. WTF Randomness would happen in football (soccer) as well if that were how it's decided. Does that make the whole game bad? What a garbage argument is that? If you think that Bo1 is completely random, then you're saying that skill means nothing and every single person in the tournament has an equal opportunity to make it through. It's pretty ironic that you mention football, since the super bowl IS a Bo1.
I was on your side (sort of) until you thought football = hand-egg
I am on their side now, your loss
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EPT
