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I am Marine. I manage Impulse eSports. I wanted to make a statement in regards to what has been brought against our team and player PhysicsLee.
I just want to say to everyone that I would never knowingly allow a hacker to be a part of my team, and I hope that at least some people will believe that. I have managed this team for a very long time now. We came up from a clan called xDooMx back at SC2's start. I have always, in my own life and with this team, strived to do my best and what is right every day. I think that is all that anyone can do.
This being said I will also share a bit of a story because I feel it relates to this situation, and may shine a light on how I handle a situation such as this, and how I think we should all look at SC2 a bit more in these types of situations.
About 5 or so years ago I was involved in a bad situation. Someone felt that I was snitching on someone on trial, and began to spread rumors and accusations against me. None of it was true, but I watched as one by one almost everyone I knew began to accuse and shun me. I had a friend, however, who never turned on me, but also let me know if these things were true I should run. Anyways, the documents came out, and they proved that I had never said a damn thing. I will never forget how it felt to have at least one person believe me amidst a sea of accusers.
Because of this, I believe very strongly in “Innocent until proven guilty”. However, I do believe you should be cooperating in an investigation, and searching for the truth in the situation. I have done my best to co-operate with URTL and talk to others in the community. Before this ever grew to this magnitude I looked at some replays, talked to other people in the community, and even Lee’s previous team managers in an attempt to figure out what was going on. I never saw anything I felt was conclusive. I talked to my player, and he has sworn he is innocent. As a team manager I want to believe my player and stand by his side. “Innocent until proven guilty”
In light of all of the new things coming forward, and some people investigating Lee, I have decided to pull him from all competitions and leagues. I fully understand URTL’s decision as I stated before, and I hope that we can get to the truth. I would say to those who believe he is hacking or boosting: gather all your evidence and save it. Then, when you feel you truly have all you need to make a case, do it, outline it, and make something very solid and substantial.
Finally, if Lee is shown to be confirmed guilty, I will be the first one to apologize and go after him. I love this game, and hate hackers that ruin it. But, like I have said, he has sworn he is innocent, and I believe the right thing to do here is trust someone who has never given me reason not to. Maybe I will end up being wrong, but “If you don’t stand for something you will fall for anything”. This is just me trying to do my best in a very difficult situation.
iMpMarine
P.S. If anyone has experience with a situation like this I would welcome any good advice.
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Good post. Glad to hear that you are not going to jump the gun off a few pieces of evidence. Quite honorable that you also stand by your players until the time is right.
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you seem nice. and thats nice.
best of luck to impulse.
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I don't have anything to add, but GL in this tough time. Stay positive and things will work out.
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What is URTL's decision, I saw it mentioned a few times in your post but never saw what it was?
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that's good and all, but for people like me who have no idea what you are talking about, you should have explained the situation or linked to a previous thread :D
Innocent until proven guilty is what most people seem to forget when it comes to (supposed) hackers~
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I feel like the semi-pro scene has a lot of drama and a culture of its own O.o
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who and the what scandal?
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On April 19 2013 04:27 RemarK wrote:
What is URTL's decision, I saw it mentioned a few times in your post but never saw what it was?
First they cleared him. Now they said it is pending review, and he may not play till they come to a conclusion.
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Interesting, yet another post about some drama around some player on some team... without details or a rundown of what happened - other than that "somebody" hacked or something.
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Is there some thread/link containing context for this? I haven't heard anything about this until now.
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Physics is a boosted account - he has a booster play both GM ladder games and clanwars for him. The booster uses a production tab hack but does not maphack, so the replays generally look fine (it's just that he always seems lucky in countering builds). Source: I know the guy who boosts his account and I've been following this situation for some time wondering when it would come to light.
Very, very easy way to prove this for yourself:
Tell physics to send you the replays from the games he played on stream yesterday (where he went 0-8), or any other games where you KNOW 100% that it's him. This would exclude clanwar reps where he all-killed, GM ladder games that are on replay sites like drop.sc, etc.
Compare the two batches of replays in SC2gears. They will be nothing alike.
The booster has good mechanics, but his apm is much lower (200-250 or so). The guy who you know as physics has different hotkeys and much higher apm (300-400+, because he spams a lot) but has much worse mechanics and is a significantly worse player overall.
There, that's it. You can even tell looking at Physics' match history on battlenet. Whenever he's on one of his insane ladder winstreaks, or playing a clanwar game, his apm will be in the 200's. Whenever it's him playing as himself, it will be in the 400's. The pattern will match up 100%.
If you want to discuss further, PM me.
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On April 19 2013 04:48 orangeorange wrote:
Physics is a boosted account - he has a booster play both GM ladder games and clanwars for him. The booster uses a production tab hack but does not maphack, so the replays generally look fine (it's just that he always seems lucky in countering builds). Source: I know the guy who boosts his account and I've been following this situation for some time wondering when it would come to light.
Very, very easy way to prove this for yourself:
Tell physics to send you the replays from the games he played on stream yesterday (where he went 0-8), or any other games where you KNOW 100% that it's him. This would exclude clanwar reps where he all-killed, GM ladder games that are on replay sites like drop.sc, etc.
Compare the two batches of replays in SC2gears. They will be nothing alike.
The booster has good mechanics, but his apm is much lower (200-250 or so). The guy who you know as physics has different hotkeys and much higher apm (300-400+, because he spams a lot) but has much worse mechanics and is a significantly worse player overall.
There, that's it. You can even tell looking at Physics' match history on battlenet. Whenever he's on one of his insane ladder winstreaks, or playing a clanwar game, his apm will be in the 200's. Whenever it's him playing as himself, it will be in the 400's. The pattern will match up 100%.
Pretty much what I thought http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/1ck1vo/physicslee_and_the_impulse_esports_scandal/c9hakk1?context=3
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On April 19 2013 04:48 orangeorange wrote:
Physics is a boosted account - he has a booster play both GM ladder games and clanwars for him. The booster uses a production tab hack but does not maphack, so the replays generally look fine (it's just that he always seems lucky in countering builds). Source: I know the guy who boosts his account and I've been following this situation for some time wondering when it would come to light.
Very, very easy way to prove this for yourself:
Tell physics to send you the replays from the games he played on stream yesterday (where he went 0-8), or any other games where you KNOW 100% that it's him. This would exclude clanwar reps where he all-killed, GM ladder games that are on replay sites like drop.sc, etc.
Compare the two batches of replays in SC2gears. They will be nothing alike.
The booster has good mechanics, but his apm is much lower (200-250 or so). The guy who you know as physics has different hotkeys and much higher apm (300-400+, because he spams a lot) but has much worse mechanics and is a significantly worse player overall.
There, that's it. You can even tell looking at Physics' match history on battlenet. Whenever he's on one of his insane ladder winstreaks, or playing a clanwar game, his apm will be in the 200's. Whenever it's him playing as himself, it will be in the 400's. The pattern will match up 100%.
If you want to discuss further, PM me.
Hey orange I sent you a PM.
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I would suggest trying what orangeorange talks about. I also think physics isn't a maphack abuser at all, just a guy paying the wrong people to level his account. Haven't seen evidence that indicates he himself uses cheats.
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I want to remind everyone that this CHEAT player fake GM "PhysicsLee" is also asking for donations on his stream. This guy is a liar trying to scam people out of money by misleading them about who he is. This guy lost 0-8 while streaming 1v1 yet somehow prior to those 8 games was on a 22 game consecutive win streak in high GM!!!! LOLLLL this guy is a scamming lying piece of trash who deserves severe punishment from the community.
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On April 19 2013 05:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:
I want to remind everyone that this CHEAT player fake GM "PhysicsLee" is also asking for donations on his stream. This guy is a liar trying to scam people out of money by misleading them about who he is. This guy lost 0-8 while streaming 1v1 yet somehow prior to those 8 games was on a 22 game consecutive win streak in high GM!!!! LOLLLL this guy is a scamming lying piece of trash who deserves severe punishment from the community.
Why don't put everything on hold until we get some kawairice level of proof ? :p
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Don't see the need for the thread when the vast majority of readers aren't going to be aware of the "scandal" in the first place.
Would have been more efficient to just apologize on Skype and Battlenet and PMs zzz.
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On April 19 2013 04:48 orangeorange wrote:
Physics is a boosted account - he has a booster play both GM ladder games and clanwars for him. The booster uses a production tab hack but does not maphack, so the replays generally look fine (it's just that he always seems lucky in countering builds). Source: I know the guy who boosts his account and I've been following this situation for some time wondering when it would come to light.
Very, very easy way to prove this for yourself:
Tell physics to send you the replays from the games he played on stream yesterday (where he went 0-8), or any other games where you KNOW 100% that it's him. This would exclude clanwar reps where he all-killed, GM ladder games that are on replay sites like drop.sc, etc.
Compare the two batches of replays in SC2gears. They will be nothing alike.
The booster has good mechanics, but his apm is much lower (200-250 or so). The guy who you know as physics has different hotkeys and much higher apm (300-400+, because he spams a lot) but has much worse mechanics and is a significantly worse player overall.
There, that's it. You can even tell looking at Physics' match history on battlenet. Whenever he's on one of his insane ladder winstreaks, or playing a clanwar game, his apm will be in the 200's. Whenever it's him playing as himself, it will be in the 400's. The pattern will match up 100%.
If you want to discuss further, PM me.
Since you the know guy "boosting" you should get them to make an announcement about it, or out them yourself. Both of them are in the wrong here if it's true, imo.
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On April 19 2013 07:36 Gamegene wrote:
Don't see the need for the thread when the vast majority of readers aren't going to be aware of the "scandal" in the first place.
Would have been more efficient to just apologize on Skype and Battlenet and PMs zzz.
This is not an apology as that would indicate some level of guilt. It is simply a statement in regards to a Reddit post which is linked at the top.
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On April 19 2013 07:38 iMpMarine wrote:Show nested quote +On April 19 2013 07:36 Gamegene wrote:
Don't see the need for the thread when the vast majority of readers aren't going to be aware of the "scandal" in the first place.
Would have been more efficient to just apologize on Skype and Battlenet and PMs zzz. This is not an apology as that would indicate some level of guilt. It is simply a statement in regards to a Reddit post which is linked at the top.
Then why post this "clarification/statement" here instead of Reddit.
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Papua New Guinea1058 Posts
On April 19 2013 07:40 Gamegene wrote:Show nested quote +On April 19 2013 07:38 iMpMarine wrote:On April 19 2013 07:36 Gamegene wrote:
Don't see the need for the thread when the vast majority of readers aren't going to be aware of the "scandal" in the first place.
Would have been more efficient to just apologize on Skype and Battlenet and PMs zzz. This is not an apology as that would indicate some level of guilt. It is simply a statement in regards to a Reddit post which is linked at the top. Then why post this "clarification/statement" here instead of Reddit.
Because he assumed people here are into sc2 and know of the situation at lower echelons too, seems like reddit is more indepth with the scene.
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On April 19 2013 07:40 Gamegene wrote:Show nested quote +On April 19 2013 07:38 iMpMarine wrote:On April 19 2013 07:36 Gamegene wrote:
Don't see the need for the thread when the vast majority of readers aren't going to be aware of the "scandal" in the first place.
Would have been more efficient to just apologize on Skype and Battlenet and PMs zzz. This is not an apology as that would indicate some level of guilt. It is simply a statement in regards to a Reddit post which is linked at the top. Then why post this "clarification/statement" here instead of Reddit.
reddit r/starcraft staff informed people to move the discussion over too the TL.net hacker thread.
I think the thread is very pertinent to tl.net since the URTL is currently featured on TL.net and iMp is one of the competing teams.
all that being said, it is big of you marine to handle things in such a manner and to reach out for help to the community. I hope this issue can be positively resolved soon for all parties involved.
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On April 19 2013 07:37 NrG.NeverExpo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 19 2013 04:48 orangeorange wrote:
Physics is a boosted account - he has a booster play both GM ladder games and clanwars for him. The booster uses a production tab hack but does not maphack, so the replays generally look fine (it's just that he always seems lucky in countering builds). Source: I know the guy who boosts his account and I've been following this situation for some time wondering when it would come to light.
Very, very easy way to prove this for yourself:
Tell physics to send you the replays from the games he played on stream yesterday (where he went 0-8), or any other games where you KNOW 100% that it's him. This would exclude clanwar reps where he all-killed, GM ladder games that are on replay sites like drop.sc, etc.
Compare the two batches of replays in SC2gears. They will be nothing alike.
The booster has good mechanics, but his apm is much lower (200-250 or so). The guy who you know as physics has different hotkeys and much higher apm (300-400+, because he spams a lot) but has much worse mechanics and is a significantly worse player overall.
There, that's it. You can even tell looking at Physics' match history on battlenet. Whenever he's on one of his insane ladder winstreaks, or playing a clanwar game, his apm will be in the 200's. Whenever it's him playing as himself, it will be in the 400's. The pattern will match up 100%.
If you want to discuss further, PM me. Since you the know guy "boosting" you should get them to make an announcement about it, or out them yourself. Both of them are in the wrong here if it's true, imo.
I completely agree with you about everyone involved being in the wrong. Any such announcement would probably have to come from Physics himself though. Some more information - the "booster" is one of two people who run a leveling service together that's advertised on various hacking websites. They certainly won't make an announcement about Physics themselves, as their whole "business" is based around discretely/anonymously leveling people's accounts for them. People would stop paying them. They've also probably make a nice sum of money from playing for Physics over the past few months and have zero interest (and nothing to gain) in turning on him now.
I could certainly out them over PM (I can't/won't link to a hacking website here, obviously), but it wouldn't do much. The two players are both European terrans but are not "known" players in the scene. They're basically anonymous high master's/borderline low GM players without hacks.
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hmm sounds confusing. Good luck at sorting that stuff out. Quiet happy I play in a region were people doing stuff like this usually pass by or are not good at hiding this so they will get sorted out.
Also good decision to put the suspected one on a break from official clanwars. Imo you handle this situation fairly well. Team can consider themself lucky to have such a dedicated one managing everything.
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Wow, after watching that 1v1 stream, I would certainly agree he is not at a GM level.
And ggtracker is a cool site..i know I am no where near GM level, but apparently some of my games my spending lvl is top GM and my avg is at the lvl I am at (masters)  ....which goes to show that having a top plat spending is quite bad (for a supposed GM player)
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On April 19 2013 08:05 TheGiftedApe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 19 2013 07:40 Gamegene wrote:On April 19 2013 07:38 iMpMarine wrote:On April 19 2013 07:36 Gamegene wrote:
Don't see the need for the thread when the vast majority of readers aren't going to be aware of the "scandal" in the first place.
Would have been more efficient to just apologize on Skype and Battlenet and PMs zzz. This is not an apology as that would indicate some level of guilt. It is simply a statement in regards to a Reddit post which is linked at the top. Then why post this "clarification/statement" here instead of Reddit. reddit r/starcraft staff informed people to move the discussion over too the TL.net hacker thread. I think the thread is very pertinent to tl.net since the URTL is currently featured on TL.net and iMp is one of the competing teams. all that being said, it is big of you marine to handle things in such a manner and to reach out for help to the community. I hope this issue can be positively resolved soon for all parties involved.
then post in that thread instead of wasting valuable bump space with this thread. hardly anyone watches URTL zzz.
User was warned for this post
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drawing huge attention to something no one seemed to know anything about. seems like a bad PR for impulse. hope this gets sorted out though.
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URTL's been hanging around a hundred to two hundred viewers every match. Given that there are at least two a night, that seems like pretty damn decent viewership for a semi-pro league.
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On April 19 2013 09:00 -Switch- wrote:
drawing huge attention to something no one seemed to know anything about. seems like a bad PR for impulse. hope this gets sorted out though.
It is not as much about PR for me as it is about responding to accusations. I think often in the StarCraft 2 scene it is easy for people to say things that are blatantly false or misrepresentations. Either way they spread as rumors through the community that you are a part of, and like a game of telephone you play as a kid many other rumors are branched off. I just wanted to at least make an attempt to put the truth out there in response to the Reddit post that was made against my team.
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Glad to see you handling business as always Marine. Whatever happens here I feel you're going about things the right way, standing by your player until he's been proven guilty that kind of loyalty is admirable in a manager.
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The reddit post has been removed?
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id go with orangeorange on this one.
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A friend of mine was just d/c hacked in wcs bracket. Does anyone know what school the hacker goes to?
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OrangeOrange is correct. I have information (replays where hotkeys match a unknown Polish Terran players - he has a TLPD. - Skype logs from the people orangeorange described saying they play on this account, and more) Apparently Physicslee is playing in WCS today and some of the people who played him are already reporting fishy activity. I have very good evidence on this - but I do not know who to give this too.
EDIT: I'm not in WCS today but I think it would be important for proper admins of it to see this information.
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Everyone and their grandmother knows Physics is a hacker. Can't wait for this filth to be banned.
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You have "evidence"? Then post it, and people can determine whether or not the play is legit. Until then, he is innocent until proven guilty. Stop trying to ruin a players reputation/career because you lost to a superior opponent.
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On April 21 2013 07:43 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Everyone and their grandmother knows Physics is a hacker. Can't wait for this filth to be banned.
Doesn't stop him from taking a WCS spot and knocking people out.
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On April 21 2013 07:45 KalinovSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 07:43 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Everyone and their grandmother knows Physics is a hacker. Can't wait for this filth to be banned. Doesn't stop him from taking a WCS spot and knocking people out.
Because people fail to look into it for themselves and give confirmations. "Oh he does well here, so he must be legit." Lets ignore his overall playstyle, the fact he barely scouts, has diamond level spending, and on top of that, has two different sets of hotkeys when he's laddering and when he's streaming.
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On April 21 2013 07:44 Zoku wrote:
You have "evidence"? Then post it, and people can determine whether or not the play is legit. Until then, he is innocent until proven guilty. Stop trying to ruin a players reputation/career because you lost to a superior opponent.
If you read my post I stated I am not playing in WCS; I merely have this evidence and noticed he was playing in WCS. The point of my post is trying to figure out who to give this information to so they can make the final decision. So maybe you should rethink your aggressive post at me?
Also; my evidence is not about him hacking as much as it is about another player using his account.
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On April 21 2013 07:31 KalinovSC2 wrote:
OrangeOrange is correct. I have information (replays where hotkeys match a unknown Polish Terran players - he has a TLPD. - Skype logs from the people orangeorange described saying they play on this account, and more) Apparently Physicslee is playing in WCS today and some of the people who played him are already reporting fishy activity. I have very good evidence on this - but I do not know who to give this too.
EDIT: I'm not in WCS today but I think it would be important for proper admins of it to see this information.
Hey I got you PM. I would love to see any information that you have. We are working our best to get to the bottom of it. Just get back to me via PM and we can exchange contact info. Thanks.
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On April 21 2013 07:49 KalinovSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 07:44 Zoku wrote:
You have "evidence"? Then post it, and people can determine whether or not the play is legit. Until then, he is innocent until proven guilty. Stop trying to ruin a players reputation/career because you lost to a superior opponent. If you read my post I stated I am not playing in WCS; I merely have this evidence and noticed he was playing in WCS. The point of my post is trying to figure out who to give this information to so they can make the final decision. So maybe you should rethink your aggressive post at me?
As I said. Post it.
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On April 21 2013 07:51 Zoku wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 07:49 KalinovSC2 wrote:On April 21 2013 07:44 Zoku wrote:
You have "evidence"? Then post it, and people can determine whether or not the play is legit. Until then, he is innocent until proven guilty. Stop trying to ruin a players reputation/career because you lost to a superior opponent. If you read my post I stated I am not playing in WCS; I merely have this evidence and noticed he was playing in WCS. The point of my post is trying to figure out who to give this information to so they can make the final decision. So maybe you should rethink your aggressive post at me? As I said. Post it.
Yeah, there are a bunch of people claiming to know the information that proves PhysicsLee is in the wrong, but they have yet to provide any information. If they are giving the information to Marine then that's fine, but as it is I can't tell whether there is any evidence or if people are simply making it up. Past requests in the thread have simply been ignored. Please, if anyone has information please post it. It will allow tournaments and impulse to investigate specifically.
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I find your whole post slightly ironic after you accused me of maphacking WHILE casting a game of mine, lol.
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EDIT: Nevermind. Sorry for unnecessary post.
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This guy just knocked CatZ out of the winner's bracket in WCS qualifier.
What happened to "In light of all of the new things coming forward, and some people investigating Lee, I have decided to pull him from all competitions and leagues"?
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I am one oh physic's friend. I just wanna tell you guys something, because it seems like lots of people is convinced that he is hacking
-APM is so different each games
-I played lots of 1v1s with him and obs a lot of 1v1s and his APM just tend to vary regradless to the outcome. It might be because he is eating something, or watching something, or chating with someone. Just because someone's apm vary it does not mean they r hacking. I am 100% confidecne that people here has very similar apm every single game
-He is reacting to something unseen
-I've watched the clan war live and as people were accusing him of cheesing, i tried to find anything that seemed suspicious, but i really couldn't find anything. He wasn't reacting to anything that was unseen. The guys from other team say that he defended an unscouted ling run-by, but it was just him leaving some units at his natural. It wasn't like him pretending like he was scouting around the map and cought it. the ling ran into the bio force of physics in front of his base. and in my opinion leaving some units behind for defense is normal.
-He is 22-0 in GM and he suddenly loses every game on stream?
-I asked physics the same question, couple months ago. "hey physics, how do you have such a high winratio on ladder?" He told me that he only ladders after good amount of practicing and when is 100% confidence that he will win the ladder match. I hope that you guys dont believe that a GM terran will only play total of 22 1v1s in almost one whole season. And about a huge losing streak on stream. He was forced to play ladder, when he was not ready with pressure of showing people that he is not hacking and had to play at his highest lvl. It is more then possible to lose 8 games in a row, in a horrible condition with that much pressure and eyes looking at him.
Physics is not that kind of guy who would hack to win. He sometimes feel a bit cocky . but he will choose to lose and rage, then to hack and win. I hope that people who didn't even know him or havnt seen any of his game, to judge him as a hacker to words from a team who was all-killed by physics on a clanwar. I hope his innocence will be proven soon and as Marine said, Physics will be innocent until he is proven guilty.
P.S. excuse my horrible english, i am korean as well
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On April 21 2013 08:59 Megiddosc wrote:
This guy just knocked CatZ out of the winner's bracket in WCS qualifier.
What happened to "In light of all of the new things coming forward, and some people investigating Lee, I have decided to pull him from all competitions and leagues"?
Maybe the manager is in on it
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Pretty sure he meant team league's.
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Wow Impulse better hope this guy isn't a hacker, because if he is there will be a shitstorm after taking out CatZ (and others) in the WCS qual.
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Wtf is boosting? lol and what is this 'scandal?'... Feel so in the dark.
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On April 21 2013 09:05 Zath.erin wrote:
Pretty sure he meant team league's.
No. That's not ALL competitions and leagues.
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On April 21 2013 09:05 Zath.erin wrote:
Pretty sure he meant team league's.
"I have decided to pull him from all competitions and leagues"
I seriously doubt that's what he meant.
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Just looking at his replay in one of the replays linked, his preparation for unseen things seems absurdly fast >_>
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Finally some light on the so-called well known "Impulse eSports scandal". We didn't quite get to the level of SaviOr's matchfixing issue, but I was afraid for a moment. Thanks for clarifying this, much appreciated.
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On April 21 2013 09:07 Megiddosc wrote:No. That's not ALL competitions and leagues.
I'm pretty sure the manager of a team has 0 control over a free to join individual league.
Stop being dense.
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On April 21 2013 09:14 Noobity wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:07 Megiddosc wrote:On April 21 2013 09:05 Zath.erin wrote:
Pretty sure he meant team league's. No. That's not ALL competitions and leagues. I'm pretty sure the manager of a team has 0 control over a free to join individual league. Stop being dense.
You don't think the manager could message MLG about it? I don't think I'm the one being dense here.
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It's definitely inFDejmien playing on the account in today's WCS games. Has anyone notified MLG/Blizzard?
Proof:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/FIOyuDq.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/HDJvZQ1.jpg)
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I tried but I was ignored. (Tried to contact WCS admins - they never responded.)
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This is fucking ridiculous.
He's actually playing in WCS and knocking out players.
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+ Show Spoiler +On April 21 2013 09:20 Doodsmack wrote:It's definitely inFDejmien playing on the account in today's WCS games. Has anyone notified MLG/Blizzard? Proof:
Boom!
I'm messaging MLG again right now!!
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On April 21 2013 09:22 Shin_Gouki wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 21 2013 09:20 Doodsmack wrote:It's definitely inFDejmien playing on the account in today's WCS games. Has anyone notified MLG/Blizzard? Proof: Boom! I'm messaging MLG again right now!!
What do those images represent? Never seen them before?
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I really feel sorry for all the people that had to play him. Ridiculous if he isn't kicked out.
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On April 21 2013 09:26 BoZiffer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:22 Shin_Gouki wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 21 2013 09:20 Doodsmack wrote:It's definitely inFDejmien playing on the account in today's WCS games. Has anyone notified MLG/Blizzard? Proof: Boom! I'm messaging MLG again right now!! What do those images represent? Never seen them before?
That's hotkey analysis.
I didnt open them up but one shows "PhysicsLee" playing a game and one shows "inFDejmien" playing a game. It compares how players are assigning/pressing hotkeys.
They are the same, ergo same player in both games.
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On April 21 2013 09:26 BoZiffer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:22 Shin_Gouki wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 21 2013 09:20 Doodsmack wrote:It's definitely inFDejmien playing on the account in today's WCS games. Has anyone notified MLG/Blizzard? Proof: Boom! I'm messaging MLG again right now!! What do those images represent? Never seen them before?
Hotkey usage.
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I used to be on the team, so here is his hotkeys from practice
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/cuq8A8i.png)
Notice how it's different from the one posted earlier?
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On April 21 2013 09:26 BoZiffer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:22 Shin_Gouki wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 21 2013 09:20 Doodsmack wrote:It's definitely inFDejmien playing on the account in today's WCS games. Has anyone notified MLG/Blizzard? Proof: Boom! I'm messaging MLG again right now!! What do those images represent? Never seen them before?
Graph of hotkey tapping over the course of a game.
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Map hacker in an online tournament. Shit sucks
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If anyone has contact with WCS admins they should link to this thread immediately. Hopefully CatZ can have another shot in this tournament.
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On April 21 2013 09:31 TricksAre4Figs wrote:
If anyone has contact with WCS admins they should link to this thread immediately. Hopefully CatZ can have another shot in this tournament.
realistically, that won't happen. i dont think they can give everyone that this guy beat today another shot, can they?
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Well I don't see how he can argue this one. I'm on the team but I don't know what else to say, Physicslee has also been logging on and off pretty consistently today which kind of lends its self to the idea that someone else would be playing.
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The thing is, there still isn't proof of map hacking, just someone else playing his account.
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I can confirm that he, PhysicsLee, has two entirely diff hotkey setups, from a larger sample size including his stream. Essentially the probable actual PhysicsLee seems to be about mid-high masters, and uses one hotkey setup, whereas the PhysicsLee (never on stream) who plays 1v1 ladder at high masters and wins tourney games uses an entirely different hotkey setup. This latter PhysicsLee also appears to be a hacker.
Message I sent to Marine:
Imgur link w/ 4 hotkey analysisFirst image, you can see from stream how PhysicsLee plays when streaming 2v2: 1 -> Main Army 2 -> Scvs then some other units 3 -> Rax / Other Production 4 -> CC 5 -> Ebay 8,9,0 -> CC spam Then you can see what the hotkey signature looks like in real games, i.e. ladder and teamleagues 1 -> Main Army 2 -> Scvs then some other units 3 -> Rax / Other Production 4 -> May be assigned from 0 to a few times in a game, but never used 5 -> CC 6 -> Ebay 0 -> Random building spam - may be CC, Factory, etc, changes throughout game I also saw a 2v2 of PhysicsLee from 2012 of him playing 2v2, and even back then he used 4 for CC's, so it's a long term habit. Somehow he manages to change between hotkey setups based on whether its team game or teamleague, which is weird to me. Even when he streamed 1v1 when you told him to, he was putting CC on 4 and having CC hotkey assign on 8 through 0.
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On April 21 2013 09:28 Torenhire wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:26 BoZiffer wrote:On April 21 2013 09:22 Shin_Gouki wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 21 2013 09:20 Doodsmack wrote:It's definitely inFDejmien playing on the account in today's WCS games. Has anyone notified MLG/Blizzard? Proof: Boom! I'm messaging MLG again right now!! What do those images represent? Never seen them before? That's hotkey analysis. I didnt open them up but one shows "PhysicsLee" playing a game and one shows "inFDejmien" playing a game. It compares how players are assigning/pressing hotkeys. They are the same, ergo same player in both games.
Interesting. Thanks.
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On April 21 2013 09:32 bcolby20 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:31 TricksAre4Figs wrote:
If anyone has contact with WCS admins they should link to this thread immediately. Hopefully CatZ can have another shot in this tournament. realistically, that won't happen. i dont think they can give everyone that this guy beat today another shot, can they?
I think they can DQ PhysicsLee and have the players he beat play one another. It's a matter of inconvenience more than "can" or "can't" be done IMO.
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On April 21 2013 09:34 TricksAre4Figs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:32 bcolby20 wrote:On April 21 2013 09:31 TricksAre4Figs wrote:
If anyone has contact with WCS admins they should link to this thread immediately. Hopefully CatZ can have another shot in this tournament. realistically, that won't happen. i dont think they can give everyone that this guy beat today another shot, can they? I think they can DQ PhysicsLee and have the players he beat play one another. It's a matter of inconvenience more than "can" or "can't" be done IMO.
this is very true. something should be done or i atleast hope WCS is looking at this if nothing else. those hot key analysis' are pretty damn convincing if you ask me.
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WCS admins should address this issue before it goes any further. PhysicsLee is still alive in this tournament from what I know. Does anyone know if the WCS rulebook has a section regarding cheating/hacking/compromised accounts?
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He just lost to Miya, but to be fair that's not really any surprise hacking or not.
Tweets going back and forth essentially saying that MLG can't solidly prove it, so can't in good conscience do anything about it on a hacking stance.
Incontrol implying the need for blizzard to release warden information
Catz suggesting they DQ him for account sharing.
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According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won.
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Well he just lost to Miya so I'm unsure what the situation is with him. Maybe Catz gets his place in lower bracket? MLG said they're looking into replays and such. Got this from twitter.
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On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won.
yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament
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Is Dejmien registered in WCS EU? If so we have proof that he's playing multiple accounts in WCS.
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On April 21 2013 09:44 Littlemuff wrote:
Well he just lost to Miya so I'm unsure what the situation is with him. Maybe Catz gets his place in lower bracket? MLG said they're looking into replays and such. Got this from twitter.
Perhaps he turned off the hacks to make it seem like he wasn't hacking at all? Cause the games between Catz and the hacker wasn't spectated or casted, meanwhile the game between the hacker and Miya was spectated.
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On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament
This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there.
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On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there.
Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented.
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On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented.
Maybe admins have been told to crack down on the investigations after the Boston Investigation thread went wrong? Bare in mind I dont know how Reddit properly works.
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On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented.
What was originally in it? When I saw it the evidence was pretty weak. There was some sort of evidence pointing towards someone else playing the account, but not really much in the way of map hacking, even now there isn't any glaring evidence of map hack. Maybe if your thread had focus'd on the theory of someone else playing the account rather then map hacking it could have turned out better. I also think you should have got a bit more evidence / proof before coming, starting on something like this prematurely with a lack of evidence never really turns out well.
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On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there.
If you have concrete proof that the player was hacking you should contact Marine with the information. I looked around and couldn't find any proof myself.
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On April 21 2013 09:55 Zath.erin wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented. What was originally in it? When I saw it the evidence was pretty weak. There was some sort of evidence pointing towards someone else playing the account, but not really much in the way of map hacking, even now there isn't any glaring evidence of map hack. Maybe if your thread had focus'd on the theory of someone else playing the account rather then map hacking it could have turned out better. I also think you should have got a bit more evidence / proof before coming, starting on something like this prematurely with a lack of evidence never really turns out well.
In the game vs. Protoss you can see him never scan or scout, all he can see is Collo 2x Forge, without scouting he prepares with lots of Turrets and also at one point as the Shrine is almost complete and he took his 3rd he was banking tons of energy on the CC's - so without scouting the Shrine and considering its timing why is a Terran saving so much energy when they just landed their 3rd instead of dropping a ton of mules?
At one point when the Zealot gets warped in he is monitoring that area intensively, even tho he is pressing the 3rd of the P, then reacts practically immediately on the warp in. His movements seem to also "luckily" favor him before any engagement (even though he lost one massively). Also at one point when the P army is pressing upwards to his 3rd, which he has absolutely no vision of but decides to move his army back even though he was trying to deal with the DT.
Point is you can be really clever in hiding map hacking, i.e. looking only at minimap and reacting at last moment, but this case the several occasions where he could have taken a lot of damage he manages to be in the right positions to stop them even though he has not scanned or scouted.
Looking at his mechanics and play I find it very fishy. I cannot say 100% that he is map hacking, but I cannot overlook how lucky he is despite his abysmal scouting.
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On April 21 2013 10:07 BeyondCtrL wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:55 Zath.erin wrote:On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented. What was originally in it? When I saw it the evidence was pretty weak. There was some sort of evidence pointing towards someone else playing the account, but not really much in the way of map hacking, even now there isn't any glaring evidence of map hack. Maybe if your thread had focus'd on the theory of someone else playing the account rather then map hacking it could have turned out better. I also think you should have got a bit more evidence / proof before coming, starting on something like this prematurely with a lack of evidence never really turns out well. In the game vs. Protoss you can see him never scan or scout, all he can see is Collo 2x Forge, without scouting he prepares with lots of Turrets and also at one point as the Shrine is almost complete and he took his 3rd he was banking tons of energy on the CC's - so without scouting the Shrine and considering its timing why is a Terran saving so much energy when they just landed their 3rd instead of dropping a ton of mules? At one point when the Zealot gets warped in he is monitoring that area intensively, even tho he is pressing the 3rd of the P, then reacts practically immediately on the warp in. His movements seem to also "luckily" favor him before any engagement (even though he lost one massively). Also at one point when the P army is pressing upwards to his 3rd, which he has absolutely no vision of but decides to move his army back even though he was trying to deal with the DT. Point is you can be really clever in hiding map hacking, i.e. looking only at minimap and reacting at last moment, but this case the several occasions where he could have taken a lot of damage he manages to be in the right positions to stop them even though he has not scanned or scouted. Looking at his mechanics and play I find it very fishy. I cannot say 100% that he is map hacking, but I cannot overlook how lucky he is despite his abysmal scouting.
Yeah I'm pretty sure it's at least production tab, I've watched him in several clan wars pretty closely after someone told me they thought he was a maphcker. What I found was he wouldn't see drops coming in advance but always seemed to counter the opponents build so who knows.
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On April 21 2013 09:55 Zath.erin wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented. What was originally in it? When I saw it the evidence was pretty weak. There was some sort of evidence pointing towards someone else playing the account, but not really much in the way of map hacking, even now there isn't any glaring evidence of map hack. Maybe if your thread had focus'd on the theory of someone else playing the account rather then map hacking it could have turned out better. I also think you should have got a bit more evidence / proof before coming, starting on something like this prematurely with a lack of evidence never really turns out well.
The thread was pointing out that, A. Someone else was playing under his account, B. he was a hacker, or both. There was no "concrete proof" (there never is when it comes to production hacks and map hacking), but the amount of blind counters physics had, different hotkeys, and the fact that he'd only stream 2v2s, 3v3s, and 4v4s were odd. We also mentioned his 22-0 GM win streak*, which even top tier players don't get 22 straight wins in a row.
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On April 21 2013 10:11 Zath.erin wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 10:07 BeyondCtrL wrote:On April 21 2013 09:55 Zath.erin wrote:On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented. What was originally in it? When I saw it the evidence was pretty weak. There was some sort of evidence pointing towards someone else playing the account, but not really much in the way of map hacking, even now there isn't any glaring evidence of map hack. Maybe if your thread had focus'd on the theory of someone else playing the account rather then map hacking it could have turned out better. I also think you should have got a bit more evidence / proof before coming, starting on something like this prematurely with a lack of evidence never really turns out well. In the game vs. Protoss you can see him never scan or scout, all he can see is Collo 2x Forge, without scouting he prepares with lots of Turrets and also at one point as the Shrine is almost complete and he took his 3rd he was banking tons of energy on the CC's - so without scouting the Shrine and considering its timing why is a Terran saving so much energy when they just landed their 3rd instead of dropping a ton of mules? At one point when the Zealot gets warped in he is monitoring that area intensively, even tho he is pressing the 3rd of the P, then reacts practically immediately on the warp in. His movements seem to also "luckily" favor him before any engagement (even though he lost one massively). Also at one point when the P army is pressing upwards to his 3rd, which he has absolutely no vision of but decides to move his army back even though he was trying to deal with the DT. Point is you can be really clever in hiding map hacking, i.e. looking only at minimap and reacting at last moment, but this case the several occasions where he could have taken a lot of damage he manages to be in the right positions to stop them even though he has not scanned or scouted. Looking at his mechanics and play I find it very fishy. I cannot say 100% that he is map hacking, but I cannot overlook how lucky he is despite his abysmal scouting. Yeah I'm pretty sure it's at least production tab, I've watched him in several clan wars pretty closely after someone told me they thought he was a maphcker. What I found was he wouldn't see drops coming in advance but always seemed to counter the opponents build so who knows.
I'm glad this is finally coming out (and that people are backing up what I said with concrete proof - Kalinov knows 100% what he's talking about). As I said, I know the guy and I know he production tab hacks. It's easy to look at one replay and say he "got lucky" but if you collect a large enough sample of his GM ladder/tourney replays, you'll see he always makes the correct tech choices (e.g. throwing down double starport if robo bay goes up...), always scans bases at the right time if his opponent is doing some weird tech choice, varies his opening if his opponent does a weird opening, etc. Here's a post that he made on an online hacking forum in connection with his leveling service:
"Production tab is always good in some tourneys, noone of cheeses in BO1 can kill you.
As a bonus I can tell you, that few pros (no need to tell their names) also uses it in online tourneys."
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On April 21 2013 10:24 orangeorange wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 10:11 Zath.erin wrote:On April 21 2013 10:07 BeyondCtrL wrote:On April 21 2013 09:55 Zath.erin wrote:On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented. What was originally in it? When I saw it the evidence was pretty weak. There was some sort of evidence pointing towards someone else playing the account, but not really much in the way of map hacking, even now there isn't any glaring evidence of map hack. Maybe if your thread had focus'd on the theory of someone else playing the account rather then map hacking it could have turned out better. I also think you should have got a bit more evidence / proof before coming, starting on something like this prematurely with a lack of evidence never really turns out well. In the game vs. Protoss you can see him never scan or scout, all he can see is Collo 2x Forge, without scouting he prepares with lots of Turrets and also at one point as the Shrine is almost complete and he took his 3rd he was banking tons of energy on the CC's - so without scouting the Shrine and considering its timing why is a Terran saving so much energy when they just landed their 3rd instead of dropping a ton of mules? At one point when the Zealot gets warped in he is monitoring that area intensively, even tho he is pressing the 3rd of the P, then reacts practically immediately on the warp in. His movements seem to also "luckily" favor him before any engagement (even though he lost one massively). Also at one point when the P army is pressing upwards to his 3rd, which he has absolutely no vision of but decides to move his army back even though he was trying to deal with the DT. Point is you can be really clever in hiding map hacking, i.e. looking only at minimap and reacting at last moment, but this case the several occasions where he could have taken a lot of damage he manages to be in the right positions to stop them even though he has not scanned or scouted. Looking at his mechanics and play I find it very fishy. I cannot say 100% that he is map hacking, but I cannot overlook how lucky he is despite his abysmal scouting. Yeah I'm pretty sure it's at least production tab, I've watched him in several clan wars pretty closely after someone told me they thought he was a maphcker. What I found was he wouldn't see drops coming in advance but always seemed to counter the opponents build so who knows. I'm glad this is finally coming out (and that people are backing up what I said with concrete proof - Kalinov knows 100% what he's talking about). As I said, I know the guy and I know he production tab hacks. It's easy to look at one replay and say he "got lucky" but if you collect a large enough sample of his GM ladder/tourney replays, you'll see he always makes the correct tech choices (e.g. throwing down double starport if robo bay goes up...), always scans bases at the right time if his opponent is doing some weird tech choice, varies his opening if his opponent does a weird opening, etc. Here's a post that he made on an online hacking forum in connection with his leveling service: "Production tab is always good in some tourneys, noone of cheeses in BO1 can kill you. As a bonus I can tell you, that few pros (no need to tell their names) also uses it in online tourneys."
What do you mean no need to tell their names? Cheating is cheating, and cheaters need to be revealed and weeded out. When it comes to cheesing or weird builds the production tab will tell you as much as a map hack, no problem. Blizzard needs to seriously change the way the client works, otherwise these hacks are completely undetectable by Warden.
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On April 21 2013 10:24 orangeorange wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 10:11 Zath.erin wrote:On April 21 2013 10:07 BeyondCtrL wrote:On April 21 2013 09:55 Zath.erin wrote:On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented. What was originally in it? When I saw it the evidence was pretty weak. There was some sort of evidence pointing towards someone else playing the account, but not really much in the way of map hacking, even now there isn't any glaring evidence of map hack. Maybe if your thread had focus'd on the theory of someone else playing the account rather then map hacking it could have turned out better. I also think you should have got a bit more evidence / proof before coming, starting on something like this prematurely with a lack of evidence never really turns out well. In the game vs. Protoss you can see him never scan or scout, all he can see is Collo 2x Forge, without scouting he prepares with lots of Turrets and also at one point as the Shrine is almost complete and he took his 3rd he was banking tons of energy on the CC's - so without scouting the Shrine and considering its timing why is a Terran saving so much energy when they just landed their 3rd instead of dropping a ton of mules? At one point when the Zealot gets warped in he is monitoring that area intensively, even tho he is pressing the 3rd of the P, then reacts practically immediately on the warp in. His movements seem to also "luckily" favor him before any engagement (even though he lost one massively). Also at one point when the P army is pressing upwards to his 3rd, which he has absolutely no vision of but decides to move his army back even though he was trying to deal with the DT. Point is you can be really clever in hiding map hacking, i.e. looking only at minimap and reacting at last moment, but this case the several occasions where he could have taken a lot of damage he manages to be in the right positions to stop them even though he has not scanned or scouted. Looking at his mechanics and play I find it very fishy. I cannot say 100% that he is map hacking, but I cannot overlook how lucky he is despite his abysmal scouting. Yeah I'm pretty sure it's at least production tab, I've watched him in several clan wars pretty closely after someone told me they thought he was a maphcker. What I found was he wouldn't see drops coming in advance but always seemed to counter the opponents build so who knows. I'm glad this is finally coming out (and that people are backing up what I said with concrete proof - Kalinov knows 100% what he's talking about). As I said, I know the guy and I know he production tab hacks. It's easy to look at one replay and say he "got lucky" but if you collect a large enough sample of his GM ladder/tourney replays, you'll see he always makes the correct tech choices (e.g. throwing down double starport if robo bay goes up...), always scans bases at the right time if his opponent is doing some weird tech choice, varies his opening if his opponent does a weird opening, etc. Here's a post that he made on an online hacking forum in connection with his leveling service: "Production tab is always good in some tourneys, noone of cheeses in BO1 can kill you. As a bonus I can tell you, that few pros (no need to tell their names) also uses it in online tourneys."
And whom is this quote from?
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On April 21 2013 10:24 orangeorange wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 10:11 Zath.erin wrote:On April 21 2013 10:07 BeyondCtrL wrote:On April 21 2013 09:55 Zath.erin wrote:On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented. What was originally in it? When I saw it the evidence was pretty weak. There was some sort of evidence pointing towards someone else playing the account, but not really much in the way of map hacking, even now there isn't any glaring evidence of map hack. Maybe if your thread had focus'd on the theory of someone else playing the account rather then map hacking it could have turned out better. I also think you should have got a bit more evidence / proof before coming, starting on something like this prematurely with a lack of evidence never really turns out well. In the game vs. Protoss you can see him never scan or scout, all he can see is Collo 2x Forge, without scouting he prepares with lots of Turrets and also at one point as the Shrine is almost complete and he took his 3rd he was banking tons of energy on the CC's - so without scouting the Shrine and considering its timing why is a Terran saving so much energy when they just landed their 3rd instead of dropping a ton of mules? At one point when the Zealot gets warped in he is monitoring that area intensively, even tho he is pressing the 3rd of the P, then reacts practically immediately on the warp in. His movements seem to also "luckily" favor him before any engagement (even though he lost one massively). Also at one point when the P army is pressing upwards to his 3rd, which he has absolutely no vision of but decides to move his army back even though he was trying to deal with the DT. Point is you can be really clever in hiding map hacking, i.e. looking only at minimap and reacting at last moment, but this case the several occasions where he could have taken a lot of damage he manages to be in the right positions to stop them even though he has not scanned or scouted. Looking at his mechanics and play I find it very fishy. I cannot say 100% that he is map hacking, but I cannot overlook how lucky he is despite his abysmal scouting. Yeah I'm pretty sure it's at least production tab, I've watched him in several clan wars pretty closely after someone told me they thought he was a maphcker. What I found was he wouldn't see drops coming in advance but always seemed to counter the opponents build so who knows. I'm glad this is finally coming out (and that people are backing up what I said with concrete proof - Kalinov knows 100% what he's talking about). As I said, I know the guy and I know he production tab hacks. It's easy to look at one replay and say he "got lucky" but if you collect a large enough sample of his GM ladder/tourney replays, you'll see he always makes the correct tech choices (e.g. throwing down double starport if robo bay goes up...), always scans bases at the right time if his opponent is doing some weird tech choice, varies his opening if his opponent does a weird opening, etc. Here's a post that he made on an online hacking forum in connection with his leveling service: "Production tab is always good in some tourneys, noone of cheeses in BO1 can kill you. As a bonus I can tell you, that few pros (no need to tell their names) also uses it in online tourneys."
Thanks OrangeOrange for initially presenting the needed information to find out it was Dejmien. I can't believe he wouldn't be DQ'd (out now so I guess banned from future tournaments for some time period?) at least for account sharing.
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Good work to you too Kalinov
BeyondCtrL - that's not my quote, it's what the "leveler" posted himself on an online forum regarding production tab hacking.
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On April 21 2013 10:37 orangeorange wrote:Good work to you too Kalinov BeyondCtrL - that's not my quote, it's what the "leveler" posted himself on an online forum regarding production tab hacking.
Ah, sorry then, I mistakenly thought there was a lack of quotation marks which made me believe that is was your own statement. My bad.
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United Kingdom10443 Posts
Ok I did some research into some of the games of this physicsLee guy, all I can say is that it is very fishy but not conclusive, he makes some strange decisions without scouting.
vs Viptastic
http://drop.sc/325955
5:30 lots of lings and Bane nest, not scouted
instantly closes depot and brings marines inside
http://drop.sc/325956
2 bunkers go down at 5:48 as the bane nest comes
no scouting,
Vs Duster
http://drop.sc/325945
15:30 turret timing and placement is nicely aligned
16:20 turret placement again
and crazy reactions for basically nothing
http://drop.sc/325946
5:50 moves to intercept MC, inconclusive
9:00 double starport vs quick collosus, no scouting
Hopefully get some more investigation on this, nothing conclusive here so not accusing anyone
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I was on a team with this guy, and i never suspected him of hacking because i thought he was bad. He never practiced, ever. He even quit for like 6 months. He was somehow grandmasters once though, which i thought was fishy. Then he came back, played like 60 games a season and got top 16. At the end of WoL he got rank 1... which i thought was absolutely ridiculous and i talked to people about it and we were all dumbfounded as to that happened. In practice he would suck, in CW's (the once in a blue moon he'd show up for) he would suck. Now I hear he is all killing every team he plays and beating top progamers in WCS...
Sucks, he was a cool guy for the most part. Gone off the deep end though. Blizz really needs to step up their efforts because there's a lot more people doing this kind of stuff and they will probably never get caught.
sorry to everyone affected by this
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What about the account levelers dont they play a role in this?
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Of course. The account levelers are the ones who are doing the alleged map/production tab hacking after all. But they're not going to be known unless Physics or somebody else lets us know. So for now there's not much to do on that end.
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Hopefully this guy is banned from future tournaments if found guilty!
but for now innocent till proven guilty?
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On April 21 2013 11:19 SoOJuuu wrote:
Hopefully this guy is banned from future tournaments if found guilty!
but for now innocent till proven guilty?
The proof is pretty overwhelming by this point - iMpMarine seems like a decent guy who's genuinely trying to get to the bottom of this, but if he's still holding out hope that PhysicsLee 1. is who he says he is, and 2. doesn't have people who hack playing on his account, then iMpMarine must be in denial.
Also, if you look at Catz twitter and the other pros who are tweeting at him, lots of top level NA players are coming out saying they know "he" (i.e., the guy who plays for him in high level games) is a hacker.
Andy Wilson @SabreSC2 40m
@ROOTCatZ @FXOJimRiSiNg played him on ladder when he was in xO, he's a maphacker
Robert Switts @FXOSirRobin 25m
@ROOTCatZ @FXOJimRiSiNg Yeah, I know about him. He's 100% a hacker and has been a known hacker for weeks, months maybe.
Stephen Schnieder @todeskampf 21m
@FXOSirRobin @ROOTCatZ @FXOJimRiSiNg I also can attest to him being a hacker. 150 APM in top gm beating pros lol
Jason Zhang @areaHaneul 2h
@ROOTCatZ @FXOJimRiSiNg I reviewed replays of him provided by high gm friends. He has 2 distinct hotkey setups (!!!!!) and sees the future.
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Its obvious hes a damn hacker.
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Canada1169 Posts
Marines a genuinely good guy dont direct any of your hate to him.
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On April 21 2013 11:35 InsidiA wrote:
Marines a genuinely good guy dont direct any of your hate to him.
Absolutely this. Don't pitchfork the wrong people ;x
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On April 21 2013 11:39 infKelsier wrote:
So apparently PhysicsLee used a drop hack in game 3 vs Duster and then reported the game as a win for him.
Can't win with map/production hacks so has to drop hack instead.
Fucking Joke of a player
someone posted this in the WCS thread just now... if its true oh my god...
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On April 21 2013 11:16 Megiddosc wrote:
Of course. The account levelers are the ones who are doing the alleged map/production tab hacking after all. But they're not going to be known unless Physics or somebody else lets us know. So for now there's not much to do on that end.
well those guys wont be found
But what about the other account levelers in the the SC2 community? Should they be punished too?
After all they are providing the services?(putting Lee's hacking aside)
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On April 21 2013 11:43 TruthMaker wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 11:16 Megiddosc wrote:
Of course. The account levelers are the ones who are doing the alleged map/production tab hacking after all. But they're not going to be known unless Physics or somebody else lets us know. So for now there's not much to do on that end. well those guys wont be found But what about the other account levelers in the the SC2 community? Should they be punished too? After all they are providing the services?(putting Lee's hacking aside)
Account sharing is against the ToS, and also goes against the spirit of competition.
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On April 21 2013 11:43 TruthMaker wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 11:16 Megiddosc wrote:
Of course. The account levelers are the ones who are doing the alleged map/production tab hacking after all. But they're not going to be known unless Physics or somebody else lets us know. So for now there's not much to do on that end. well those guys wont be found But what about the other account levelers in the the SC2 community? Should they be punished too? After all they are providing the services?(putting Lee's hacking aside)
If they're playing for someone else in a major tourney (I'm sure WCS American Qualifiers counts), then yes they should be punished in some way.
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Well isnt one of of the posters in this thread an account leveler?
https://twitter.com/KalinovSC2
Seems to be sponsored by a site called "Sc2 services" (site for leveling)
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Well account leveling is how alot of pros make money no?
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On April 21 2013 11:55 SoOJuuu wrote:
Well account leveling is how alot of pros make money no?
Maybe, but it isn't right none the less imo.
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On April 21 2013 11:55 SoOJuuu wrote:
Well account leveling is how alot of pros make money no?
just because something is profitable, doesn't make it ethical. And to be honest, the business isn't really scale-able because they can only get so many people into GM before there are no spots remaining, so I find it hard to believe they are making a lot of money off it.
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Account leveling is what it is, ladder is fine it's just ladder. Doing it in tournaments is completely different.
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On April 19 2013 08:27 orangeorange wrote:Show nested quote +On April 19 2013 07:37 NrG.NeverExpo wrote:On April 19 2013 04:48 orangeorange wrote:
Physics is a boosted account - he has a booster play both GM ladder games and clanwars for him. The booster uses a production tab hack but does not maphack, so the replays generally look fine (it's just that he always seems lucky in countering builds). Source: I know the guy who boosts his account and I've been following this situation for some time wondering when it would come to light.
Very, very easy way to prove this for yourself:
Tell physics to send you the replays from the games he played on stream yesterday (where he went 0-8), or any other games where you KNOW 100% that it's him. This would exclude clanwar reps where he all-killed, GM ladder games that are on replay sites like drop.sc, etc.
Compare the two batches of replays in SC2gears. They will be nothing alike.
The booster has good mechanics, but his apm is much lower (200-250 or so). The guy who you know as physics has different hotkeys and much higher apm (300-400+, because he spams a lot) but has much worse mechanics and is a significantly worse player overall.
There, that's it. You can even tell looking at Physics' match history on battlenet. Whenever he's on one of his insane ladder winstreaks, or playing a clanwar game, his apm will be in the 200's. Whenever it's him playing as himself, it will be in the 400's. The pattern will match up 100%.
If you want to discuss further, PM me. Since you the know guy "boosting" you should get them to make an announcement about it, or out them yourself. Both of them are in the wrong here if it's true, imo. I completely agree with you about everyone involved being in the wrong. Any such announcement would probably have to come from Physics himself though. Some more information - the "booster" is one of two people who run a leveling service together that's advertised on various hacking websites. They certainly won't make an announcement about Physics themselves, as their whole "business" is based around discretely/anonymously leveling people's accounts for them. People would stop paying them. They've also probably make a nice sum of money from playing for Physics over the past few months and have zero interest (and nothing to gain) in turning on him now. I could certainly out them over PM (I can't/won't link to a hacking website here, obviously), but it wouldn't do much. The two players are both European terrans but are not "known" players in the scene. They're basically anonymous high master's/borderline low GM players without hacks.
Why can't you just out them here? You don't need to link to a hacking website, but it is good to know.
Of you could just out them over PM to me, so I can out them in this thread...
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On April 21 2013 11:53 TruthMaker wrote:Well isnt one of of the posters in this thread an account leveler? https://twitter.com/KalinovSC2Seems to be sponsored by a site called "Sc2 services" (site for leveling)
I think he's just sponsored by them, and doesn't level accounts.
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well I guess we could say
the CatZ
is out of the bag
yyyyYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEAH
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On April 21 2013 12:28 SoOJuuu wrote:
well I guess we could say
the CatZ
is out of the bag
yyyyYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEAH
A for effort lol. I really hope CatZ and other players get a second shot, however unlikely :/
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Is there any replay proof for this? You replay magicians should sort this out!
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On April 21 2013 13:31 EvanC wrote:
Is there any replay proof for this? You replay magicians should sort this out!
See the earlier pages of this thread - people have already done and posted hotkey analyses.
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Ohh this can not end well.
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I feel sooooooo bad for catz. He deserves better.
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On April 21 2013 12:28 SoOJuuu wrote:
well I guess we could say
the CatZ
is out of the bag
yyyyYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEAH
I practically choked on the food I was eating when i saw this.
Well played sir, well played.
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On April 21 2013 12:43 Shin_Gouki wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 12:28 SoOJuuu wrote:
well I guess we could say
the CatZ
is out of the bag
yyyyYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEAH A for effort lol. I really hope CatZ and other players get a second shot, however unlikely :/
catz is still in the losers bracket.. at least something
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On April 21 2013 12:28 SoOJuuu wrote:
well I guess we could say
the CatZ
is out of the bag
yyyyYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEAH
8/10
Sad that some real players got eliminated by a hacker and there's nothing that will be done 
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Can Blizzard or MLG guarantee that the client cannot be hacked or a player can gain an unfair advantage during the qualifier?
NO. They cannot.
Blizzard and MLG are to blame and are responsible for any player which hacks and gains an unfair advantage.
If they cannot be responsible, and a player is proven as a hacker after the fact, MLG and Blizzard must disqualify the subject hacker and all matches after that must be re played.
If Blizzard or MLG do nothing, their series, their integrity, which in some ways is here nor there already, is called into serious question.
How credible is a tournament series and organiser which allows hackers to play, known, and continue in their series?
This is why you dont have online tournaments. Period.
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On April 21 2013 18:42 pepper_ wrote:
I feel sooooooo bad for catz. He deserves better.
because fuck everyone else who lost to him?
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On April 21 2013 20:16 Grimmyman123 wrote:
Can Blizzard or MLG guarantee that the client cannot be hacked or a player can gain an unfair advantage during the qualifier?
NO. They cannot.
Blizzard and MLG are to blame and are responsible for any player which hacks and gains an unfair advantage.
If they cannot be responsible, and a player is proven as a hacker after the fact, MLG and Blizzard must disqualify the subject hacker and all matches after that must be re played.
If Blizzard or MLG do nothing, their series, their integrity, which in some ways is here nor there already, is called into serious question.
How credible is a tournament series and organiser which allows hackers to play, known, and continue in their series?
This is why you dont have online tournaments. Period.
Last time I checked NA is a pretty small place. Should be easy to get 512 people at the same place at the same time to do their qualifiers.
So yeah, we should NOT have online tournaments. Period.
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On April 21 2013 20:51 turdburgler wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 18:42 pepper_ wrote:
I feel sooooooo bad for catz. He deserves better. because fuck everyone else who lost to him?
How could you possibly interpret that sentiment in that post?
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On April 21 2013 20:54 Littlemuff wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 20:16 Grimmyman123 wrote:
Can Blizzard or MLG guarantee that the client cannot be hacked or a player can gain an unfair advantage during the qualifier?
NO. They cannot.
Blizzard and MLG are to blame and are responsible for any player which hacks and gains an unfair advantage.
If they cannot be responsible, and a player is proven as a hacker after the fact, MLG and Blizzard must disqualify the subject hacker and all matches after that must be re played.
If Blizzard or MLG do nothing, their series, their integrity, which in some ways is here nor there already, is called into serious question.
How credible is a tournament series and organiser which allows hackers to play, known, and continue in their series?
This is why you dont have online tournaments. Period. Last time I checked NA is a pretty small place. Should be easy to get 512 people at the same place at the same time to do their qualifiers. So yeah, we should NOT have online tournaments. Period.
Why so single minded and dense?
Ever heard ot regional qualifiers?
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On April 21 2013 21:00 RaZorwire wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 20:51 turdburgler wrote:On April 21 2013 18:42 pepper_ wrote:
I feel sooooooo bad for catz. He deserves better. because fuck everyone else who lost to him? How could you possibly interpret that sentiment in that post?
because everyone is talking about catz like hes the only one that matters. they need to redo that entire bracket, not just put catz back in.
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On April 21 2013 21:38 turdburgler wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 21:00 RaZorwire wrote:On April 21 2013 20:51 turdburgler wrote:On April 21 2013 18:42 pepper_ wrote:
I feel sooooooo bad for catz. He deserves better. because fuck everyone else who lost to him? How could you possibly interpret that sentiment in that post? because everyone is talking about catz like hes the only one that matters. they need to redo that entire bracket, not just put catz back in.
No... A lot of people in this thread have been saying that it sucks for the others he beats as well. It's just that you see CatZ being mentioned more since he is well known.
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Require a similar anti-Hack program that ICCup used( you connect to a server, checks your comp, no hacks good to go) for all online tourneys and Bs like this doesn't happen.
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United Kingdom14103 Posts
There is a difference between levelling an account and playing in a major online tournament/clan war etc. for a player.
Lower your pitchfork.
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On April 21 2013 22:02 Targe wrote:There is a difference between levelling an account and playing in a major online tournament/clan war etc. for a player. Lower your pitchfork.
Actually, they are equal, in that they breach the TOS in the same way, for the same reason, for the same offense.
Now, morally, the former is much worse than the latter.
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I can assure you I am not a booster and am not affiliated with them in any way. I'm a casual player well into a real life career who's been following the NA/EU SC2 scene for a long time and happen to know some people in it. As I stated earlier, I've known this was going on with Physics for quite a while (and many pros who hit him on ladder have suspected him of hacking for months), but I kept quiet because it was none of my business and nobody would listen to me anyway. But when 1) he does something as egregious as play in a WCS qualifier and knock out deserving players, and 2) people are actually drawing attention to him, I felt like I could contribute something. That's it.
As an additional matter, Kalinov pointed out exactly who it was that has been playing on Physics' account; that's all that should matter for purposes of this thread. Account boosting generally should be a separate discussion IMO (and has been discussed before on TL).
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I pay for MLG HD/VOD access. I pay a subscription to Catz' Twitch channel. I'm a huge fan of the GSL and have watched every match for a long time, and have had a subscription for two years. That means I have spent a couple hundred dollars supporting the SC2 tournament scene.
I hate that drama like this would work its way into a tournament that I enjoy watching and I hope that those responsible take the allegations very seriously and go to any lengths to ensure that the people who were qualifying are given every chance to qualify fairly.
I think the evidence in the thread is very compelling.
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I dont know, which one of boosters you are OrangeOrange. But its funny, that few minuts after i posted those links here you came very quickly to answer to it. And well, shit. Guys, take a look on how many posts/promotions the SC2Services guy made. It looks like we could take few replays from all NA GrandMasters and compare them in sc2gears. Probably 30% of players in GM would have same hotkeys/are boosted :D
But what can we do in that case? Those guys only take a money from that quite a interesting business, mostly they only finish the order for GM and does not care about whats happening with those ACCs (untill they coem back and pay more). You can easy find on google league of legends services etc., same as trading with items from any MMORPG game.
Only Lee is guilty here, because he wanted to much (22-0, rank1GM, clanwars, wcs) he got busted. Blizzard surely wont make anything to those boosters, since for over 10 years people were trading Diablo2 items for forum-cash on one illegal site
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What exactly do you think orangeorange's motivation would be if he was in fact one of the boosters? Your accusations don't really make any sense.
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I responded quickly because I just woke up (I'm on the east coast USA) and I saw new posts in this thread. Look, I don't know how to prove to you I'm not a "booster", but I don't see what difference it would make for purposes of the thread, which is about PhysicsLee. Note that I didn't link anywhere and didn't even name any of the players before Kalinov did, I simply said what the situation was.
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On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented.
Yes, there were lots of evidence. All the evidences were not solid at all, and didn't do anything to prove his guilt. Only things it was doing were making a player in WCS, who is not proven guilty, look bad and uprise a giant scandal on a player, a team, and to a tournament.
Stop this useless debate. I bet more then half of you guys never seen him play, didn't even watch the replay, and doesn't know that guy. Of course, catz is saying that physics hacked. He lost to him. He is just an unprofessional d****, who can't accept his lose, and if this scandal happened to anyone in the tournament that happened to get far, everyone would have been saying something was fishy.
User was warned for this post
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On April 21 2013 23:10 Im_hell wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented. Yes, there were lots of evidence. All the evidences were not solid at all, and didn't do anything to prove his guilt. Only things it was doing were making a player in WCS, who is not proven guilty, look bad and uprise a giant scandal on a player, a team, and to a tournament. Stop this useless debate. I bet more then half of you guys never seen him play, didn't even watch the replay, and doesn't know that guy. Of course, catz is saying that physics hacked. He lost to him. He is just an unprofessional d****, who can't accept his lose, and if this scandal happened to anyone in the tournament that happened to get far, everyone would have been saying something was fishy.
I don't know who you are, but your denial is astounding. The amount of accusations and evidence to back that reddit thread was enough to make people start talking about lee. We had people from xO, FXO, and other teams starting to speak up as well. Physics isn't legit, I posted his hotkeys from practice to further proof someone else's hotkey analysis about how he was sharing the account. Two different spamming signatures.
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On April 21 2013 23:10 Im_hell wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented. Yes, there were lots of evidence. All the evidences were not solid at all, and didn't do anything to prove his guilt. Only things it was doing were making a player in WCS, who is not proven guilty, look bad and uprise a giant scandal on a player, a team, and to a tournament. Stop this useless debate. I bet more then half of you guys never seen him play, didn't even watch the replay, and doesn't know that guy. Of course, catz is saying that physics hacked. He lost to him. He is just an unprofessional d****, who can't accept his lose, and if this scandal happened to anyone in the tournament that happened to get far, everyone would have been saying something was fishy.
Listen up son. Your boy PhysicsLee tried to stream legit 1v1 and got demolished 0-8 and then turned off stream. We have, in this thread, substantial evidence of account sharing/hacking. Are you even reading the evidence in this thread. You call CatZ an "unprofessional d****" but how do you think CatZ feels getting KO from WCS by a highly suspicious player?
ALSO! DuSter, one of the people Physics' played in WCS yesterday, said he got deSync drophacked by Physics in a 20 minute WCS match. WTF? Physics drophacking in WCS match now? Another accusation against Physics....
The Reddit thread started with some good evidence to start taking a serious look at PhysicsLee. The thread was beginning to reveal more evidence UNTIL! it was closed by Reddit admin. It was a bullshit move by the admin because, as everyone now knows, there is overwhelming evidences and accusations against this player! Teamliquid admins have allowed this thread to go on thankfully, even with people trying to downplay this situation. Again, Reddit has done a disservice to the community by helping to coverup this situation while TeamLiquid has helped to bring this situation to the attention of SERIOUS GAMERS who are competing in a very prominent online tournament. Thankyou TL and shame on Reddit for closing the thread after a mere 2 hours when we just started to get the facts coming in...
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On April 22 2013 03:35 TricksAre4Figs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 23:10 Im_hell wrote:On April 21 2013 09:51 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 21 2013 09:50 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 21 2013 09:46 .kv wrote:On April 21 2013 09:43 Megiddosc wrote:
According to MLGAdam, he lost to Miya. Thank god. Would have hated if he had won. yeah but what about catz and the others that faced physicslee...this just unfortunate this investigation happens to happen in the middle of the entire tournament This was originally exposed on Reddit with plenty of evidence. For the record, Reddit admins felt the need to close the thread for a "lack of evidence" when actually there was plenty. This could have potentially come out in full days ago, however I feel Reddit admins did a disservice to the community by closing the original thread there. Yea, it was depressing when they shut down the thread, despite the amount of evidence was there. If anything, it should have stayed up because multiple people were coming out, and information was being spread all over the place. This literally could have been prevented. Yes, there were lots of evidence. All the evidences were not solid at all, and didn't do anything to prove his guilt. Only things it was doing were making a player in WCS, who is not proven guilty, look bad and uprise a giant scandal on a player, a team, and to a tournament. Stop this useless debate. I bet more then half of you guys never seen him play, didn't even watch the replay, and doesn't know that guy. Of course, catz is saying that physics hacked. He lost to him. He is just an unprofessional d****, who can't accept his lose, and if this scandal happened to anyone in the tournament that happened to get far, everyone would have been saying something was fishy. Listen up son. Your boy PhysicsLee tried to stream legit 1v1 and got demolished 0-8 and then turned off stream. We have, in this thread, substantial evidence of account sharing/hacking. Are you even reading the evidence in this thread. You call CatZ an "unprofessional d****" but how do you think CatZ feels getting KO from WCS by a highly suspicious player? ALSO! DuSter, one of the people Physics' played in WCS yesterday, said he got deSync drophacked by Physics in a 20 minute WCS match. WTF? Physics drophacking in WCS match now? Another accusation against Physics.... The Reddit thread started with some good evidence to start taking a serious look at PhysicsLee. The thread was beginning to reveal more evidence UNTIL! it was closed by Reddit admin. It was a bullshit move by the admin because, as everyone now knows, there is overwhelming evidences and accusations against this player! Teamliquid admins have allowed this thread to go on thankfully, even with people trying to downplay this situation. Again, Reddit has done a disservice to the community by helping to coverup this situation while TeamLiquid has helped to bring this situation to the attention of SERIOUS GAMERS who are competing in a very prominent online tournament. Thankyou TL and shame on Reddit for closing the thread after a mere 2 hours when we just started to get the facts coming in...
A serious +1 to this post. And +2 to the TL admins for not immediately closing down this thread. If reddit would have kept that thread up, physics probably wouldn't have even bothered participating in the WCS, and if he did, then anyone who saw him (thanks to the reddit thread staying up) would have instantly reported that clown.
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On April 21 2013 22:43 Purple Haze wrote:
What exactly do you think orangeorange's motivation would be if he was in fact one of the boosters? Your accusations don't really make any sense.
One motivation could be that he wants more of the booster business/money. Or he doesn't want boosters to become associated with cheating, which might cut into their business. Just sayin. At the very least, it would be strange for orange to know all this shit about who the boosters are, but not actually know them himself.
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How is this guy have so much evidence against him and still nothing towards him has happened, and why was he even allowed into anything tournament wise without a investigation. No one can go on a winning streak as he did and be so in the dark about it. Its stupid how blizzard allows all this to happen when they see all the proof but they just decide to wait ill the last moment.
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I used to play with INNPhysics (physicslee). He was kicked off our team after we reviewed replays after he nearly lost to one of our plat members as a Grand-master player. He clearly map hacked in every single one of the replays we reviewed. Damn shame I didn't report this earlier to the forums. Kid deserves the fullest of punishments.
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well since hacking and account boosting is so frequent these days, I think Blizzard should outsource or inhouse an Anti-Cheat system for players during online qualifiers, where players can link their blizzard accounts to their anti cheat system account for custom games, and also where players can sign in for their matches and what not. Have the anti cheat monitor IP address, so lets say that if your originally playing in then United States, you wont have an IP address from China or somewhere. That also the anti-cheat system takes screen shots of your screens randomly and uploads those photos to the blizzard database and that the anti cheat monitor your processes to spot for malicious activities. and also have replays upload to the Blizzard or third party organizer automatically, so that players cannot modify their replays to show that they arent hacking.
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On April 22 2013 03:50 WaK_Boom_Headshot wrote:
How is this guy have so much evidence against him and still nothing towards him has happened, and why was he even allowed into anything tournament wise without a investigation. No one can go on a winning streak as he did and be so in the dark about it. Its stupid how blizzard allows all this to happen when they see all the proof but they just decide to wait ill the last moment.
Because he doesn't look in FoW like a complete idiot and tries hard to hide the fact that he know something is happening until the last moment. Looking at his mechanics he is quite bad, additionally he has some of the worst scouting I have ever seen and yet always manages to use the right compositions and reacts to drops and hidden tech instantly, never taking any serious damage. When you have such bad scouting but are never, or rarely, found out of position for anything then it's a big tell of MH. The problem is that the private and good map hacks that have lots of features like production tabs, etc. are all undetectable by Warden, because they are overlays and do not write anything into the game memory, thus getting actual proof is extremely difficult on the software side and we rely on replay analysis.
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On April 22 2013 04:04 lethal111 wrote:
well since hacking and account boosting is so frequent these days, I think Blizzard should outsource or inhouse an Anti-Cheat system for players during online qualifiers, where players can link their blizzard accounts to their anti cheat system account for custom games, and also where players can sign in for their matches and what not. Have the anti cheat monitor IP address, so lets say that if your originally playing in then United States, you wont have an IP address from China or somewhere. That also the anti-cheat system takes screen shots of your screens randomly and uploads those photos to the blizzard database and that the anti cheat monitor your processes to spot for malicious activities. and also have replays upload to the Blizzard or third party organizer automatically, so that players cannot modify their replays to show that they arent hacking.
wait.. you want blizzard to spend more money on a game that doesnt really bring in extra revenue?
ha! last i heard they had "a" guy working on an anti-hack.
Thats as much as theyre going to give us.
i bet its an intern/new guy trying to make a extra impression on his superiors.
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At least the doofus has finally been D/Q'd. Too bad this won't spark blizzard to be more cautious about hacks Zzz.
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Do we know why though? Will there be any re-games?
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On April 22 2013 04:30 Dr.Sin wrote:
Do we know why though? Will there be any re-games?
There will most likely not be any re-games, there seldom are when cheaters are discovered in any sport,
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I played against INNphysics about 8months ago (i dont remember exactly). I went for an 8pool and he went 10p. But he left his lings in his base without any scouting info at all which clearly indicates some kind of hack.
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On April 22 2013 04:33 Sokrates wrote:
I played against INNphysics about 8months ago (i dont remember exactly). I went for an 8pool and he went 10p. But he left his lings in his base without any scouting info at all which clearly indicates some kind of hack.
Most things point towards some kind of production tab hack
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Well it looks like it truly is the begining of the end for him.
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I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S.
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On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S.
Like a lot of hackers he is probably desperate for attention. Now that he should be blacklisted by the community when can go back to ignoring his pointless existence.
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On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S.
Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead.
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http://drop.sc/164717
Here is the replay, clearly obvious maphack (not just productiontabhack). Solid evidence!
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On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world.
Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day.
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On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day.
Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers.
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On April 22 2013 04:56 Fluffboll wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day. Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers.
There's not a lot of evidence to support your claim. I could be a brilliant person, that one day decided I wanted to hack. This doesn't suddenly decrease my IQ by 30, whether I made an effort to hide my hacking or not.
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He said generally, the thing is that a lot of hackers denie the hacking and make up stupid argument why they did this and that. That is not an indicator for high intelligence, rather low intelligence since they think the other people are so stupid that they cant figure this out.
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On April 22 2013 04:56 Fluffboll wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day. Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers.
that doesn't make much sense, given how hard it is to catch hackers, how productive it can be to hack, and how lenient the community is about everything there's no reason for smart people not to hack, and we'd probably never know if they do. the only thing stopping anyone is that you can't stream with it on, besides ethics.
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On April 22 2013 05:08 IdrA wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:56 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day. Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers. that doesn't make much sense, given how hard it is to catch hackers, how productive it can be to hack, and how lenient the community is about everything there's no reason for smart people not to hack, and we'd probably never know if they do. the only thing stopping anyone is that you can't stream with it on, besides ethics.
+1. If hackers weren't smart, I'm pretty sure we wouldn't need "GM/Master map hacking threads" and such just to confirm accusations. It would be more obvious imo.
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On April 22 2013 05:00 Zenbrez wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:56 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day. Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers. There's not a lot of evidence to support your claim. I could be a brilliant person, that one day decided I wanted to hack. This doesn't suddenly decrease my IQ by 30, whether I made an effort to hide my hacking or not.
that's like saying "i could be a stupid person who one day decided to invent the theory of relativity"
people who hack normally do so because they aren't smart and having a maphack decreases the amount of intelligence needed to win games. why would an intelligent person hack? it does very little for them compared to a stupid person
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On April 22 2013 05:27 sertman wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 05:00 Zenbrez wrote:On April 22 2013 04:56 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day. Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers. There's not a lot of evidence to support your claim. I could be a brilliant person, that one day decided I wanted to hack. This doesn't suddenly decrease my IQ by 30, whether I made an effort to hide my hacking or not. that's like saying "i could be a stupid person who one day decided to invent the theory of relativity" people who hack normally do so because they aren't smart and having a maphack decreases the amount of intelligence needed to win games. why would an intelligent person hack? it does very little for them compared to a stupid person
So they can do better in online tournies, and probably not get caught or at least be a pain in the ass to catch.
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On April 22 2013 05:27 sertman wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 05:00 Zenbrez wrote:On April 22 2013 04:56 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day. Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers. There's not a lot of evidence to support your claim. I could be a brilliant person, that one day decided I wanted to hack. This doesn't suddenly decrease my IQ by 30, whether I made an effort to hide my hacking or not. that's like saying "i could be a stupid person who one day decided to invent the theory of relativity" people who hack normally do so because they aren't smart and having a maphack decreases the amount of intelligence needed to win games. why would an intelligent person hack? it does very little for them compared to a stupid person
Dude, do you even ladder? Since when you do need to be intelligent to win a game or use a hack? All you have to know is what unit counters the other unit and bam, you can win a game.
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On April 22 2013 05:19 Shin_Gouki wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 05:08 IdrA wrote:On April 22 2013 04:56 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day. Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers. that doesn't make much sense, given how hard it is to catch hackers, how productive it can be to hack, and how lenient the community is about everything there's no reason for smart people not to hack, and we'd probably never know if they do. the only thing stopping anyone is that you can't stream with it on, besides ethics. +1. If hackers weren't smart, I'm pretty sure we wouldn't need "GM/Master map hacking threads" and such just to confirm accusations. It would be more obvious imo.
Wrong, we need this thread because hackers can easily dodge blizzards warden. Some maphackers dont even hide their hacking, nothing smart about this. In the last 3 weeks i played at least vs 4-5 hackers where i could tell you he is hacking without having to watch the replay again.
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On April 22 2013 05:33 Sokrates wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 05:19 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 22 2013 05:08 IdrA wrote:On April 22 2013 04:56 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day. Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers. that doesn't make much sense, given how hard it is to catch hackers, how productive it can be to hack, and how lenient the community is about everything there's no reason for smart people not to hack, and we'd probably never know if they do. the only thing stopping anyone is that you can't stream with it on, besides ethics. +1. If hackers weren't smart, I'm pretty sure we wouldn't need "GM/Master map hacking threads" and such just to confirm accusations. It would be more obvious imo. Wrong, we need this thread because hackers can easily dodge blizzards warden. Some maphackers dont even hide their hacking, nothing smart about this. In the last 3 weeks i played at least vs 4-5 hackers where i could tell you he is hacking without having to watch the replay again.
I have had people tell me that I'm map hacking, and it was obvious and that they didn't need to watch the replay. Mid-High Master EU. An example is one with a Terran who was going for a Hellbat drop. He neglected to go down his ramp and kill my probe which was sitting on his natural up until the 9 min mark. Positioned Stalkers to intercept possible drop, only thing that surprised me was that Hellbats came out, and not mines... would have not made cannons.
But ya, some people just blurt out accusations but it can happen that some hidden strat/cheese is countered by their own stupidity.
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I don't understand why people go through so much trouble to hack? money? 'esports-fame'? surely no one can stretch something like this far enough to actually make a decent amount of money, if any?.. And fame.. well, qualify and show up at LAN, get owned, GL with rest of life..
I feel bad for CatZ and the others who had to play this Lee guy..
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Well I sure hope Marine has kicked him from iMp by now lol.
Is Demjien (the guy who's playing on the account and hacking) currently on a team or anything? Does he play in any leagues?
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On April 22 2013 05:40 BeyondCtrL wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 05:33 Sokrates wrote:On April 22 2013 05:19 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 22 2013 05:08 IdrA wrote:On April 22 2013 04:56 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day. Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers. that doesn't make much sense, given how hard it is to catch hackers, how productive it can be to hack, and how lenient the community is about everything there's no reason for smart people not to hack, and we'd probably never know if they do. the only thing stopping anyone is that you can't stream with it on, besides ethics. +1. If hackers weren't smart, I'm pretty sure we wouldn't need "GM/Master map hacking threads" and such just to confirm accusations. It would be more obvious imo. Wrong, we need this thread because hackers can easily dodge blizzards warden. Some maphackers dont even hide their hacking, nothing smart about this. In the last 3 weeks i played at least vs 4-5 hackers where i could tell you he is hacking without having to watch the replay again. I have had people tell me that I'm map hacking, and it was obvious and that they didn't need to watch the replay. Mid-High Master EU. An example is one with a Terran who was going for a Hellbat drop. He neglected to go down his ramp and kill my probe which was sitting on his natural up until the 9 min mark. Positioned Stalkers to intercept possible drop, only thing that surprised me was that Hellbats came out, and not mines... would have not made cannons. But ya, some people just blurt out accusations but it can happen that some hidden strat/cheese is countered by their own stupidity.
Do your research before you "blurt out accusations", all the hackers i accused were added to the hacklist on TL. I reported at least 8-10 hackers that were added to that list. Obvious maphackers were obvious.
I also got accused of hacking but who the fuck cares? You need a replay to prove anyway.
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United Kingdom14103 Posts
On April 21 2013 22:09 Grimmyman123 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 22:02 Targe wrote:There is a difference between levelling an account and playing in a major online tournament/clan war etc. for a player. Lower your pitchfork. Actually, they are equal, in that they breach the TOS in the same way, for the same reason, for the same offense. Now, morally, the former is much worse than the latter.
Never said that it was ok, but obviously we're here to talk about someone playing in clan wars and tournaments, not to talk about general account levelling, it doesn't have a reason to be in this thread.
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On April 22 2013 05:43 Doodsmack wrote:
Well I sure hope Marine has kicked him from iMp by now lol.
Is Demjien (the guy who's playing on the account and hacking) currently on a team or anything? Does he play in any leagues?
He is not widely known in Polish scene. Its like I first ever heard of this guy in this thread. I doubt that he plays in any significant tournaments.
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On April 22 2013 05:08 IdrA wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:56 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:51 SiskosGoatee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:40 Fluffboll wrote:On April 22 2013 04:38 Blargh wrote:
I'm just curious, but did this guy expect to go through a Blizzard-associated tournament using a hack (of some sort)? Surely he realized that if he made it up to the point where he had to play live that he wouldn't be able to use anything! Though, ~$1,200 is nice for just being in Code S. Cheaters/Hackers are not generally known for their intelligence, he most likely did not even think that far ahead. Please don't tell me you actually have such a rose coloured perception of the world. Protip: The smart hackers never got caught and continue to hack up to this day. Hence the word "generally". Most hackers are not clever, smart or intelligent. Of course there are smart hackers and cheaters but they are a minority amongst cheaters/hackers. that doesn't make much sense, given how hard it is to catch hackers, how productive it can be to hack, and how lenient the community is about everything there's no reason for smart people not to hack, and we'd probably never know if they do. the only thing stopping anyone is that you can't stream with it on, besides ethics.
it's a common misperception that you can't stream with hacks on. it's only ethics.
edit: if you are not stupid. then it's the possible consequences of being caught and ethics.
@fluff i think you might be a bit too naive. we know for sure that there are stupid people hacking, just look at gm / master hacker thread, but to think that this represents a majority of the hacking population is a bit of a stretch.
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On April 22 2013 05:41 blae000 wrote:
I don't understand why people go through so much trouble to hack? money? 'esports-fame'? surely no one can stretch something like this far enough to actually make a decent amount of money, if any?.. And fame.. well, qualify and show up at LAN, get owned, GL with rest of life..
I feel bad for CatZ and the others who had to play this Lee guy..
I think Spades did a pretty good job of extorting the most of his "hacking"
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I think you're handling this right, good work and good luck
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On April 21 2013 22:19 orangeorange wrote:I can assure you I am not a booster and am not affiliated with them in any way. I'm a casual player well into a real life career who's been following the NA/EU SC2 scene for a long time and happen to know some people in it. As I stated earlier, I've known this was going on with Physics for quite a while (and many pros who hit him on ladder have suspected him of hacking for months), but I kept quiet because it was none of my business and nobody would listen to me anyway. But when 1) he does something as egregious as play in a WCS qualifier and knock out deserving players, and 2) people are actually drawing attention to him, I felt like I could contribute something. That's it. As an additional matter, Kalinov pointed out exactly who it was that has been playing on Physics' account; that's all that should matter for purposes of this thread. Account boosting generally should be a separate discussion IMO (and has been discussed before on TL).
while Lee is dumb for hacking in a tournament it all stemmed down from account levelers.
We need to stop these people and anyone affiliated with account boosters should stop as well.
They do nothing for the community and when something like this goes down they are just as responsible as others.
I like to think of them as drug dealers.
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On April 22 2013 08:23 TruthMaker wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 22:19 orangeorange wrote:I can assure you I am not a booster and am not affiliated with them in any way. I'm a casual player well into a real life career who's been following the NA/EU SC2 scene for a long time and happen to know some people in it. As I stated earlier, I've known this was going on with Physics for quite a while (and many pros who hit him on ladder have suspected him of hacking for months), but I kept quiet because it was none of my business and nobody would listen to me anyway. But when 1) he does something as egregious as play in a WCS qualifier and knock out deserving players, and 2) people are actually drawing attention to him, I felt like I could contribute something. That's it. As an additional matter, Kalinov pointed out exactly who it was that has been playing on Physics' account; that's all that should matter for purposes of this thread. Account boosting generally should be a separate discussion IMO (and has been discussed before on TL). while Lee is dumb for hacking in a tournament it all stemmed down from account levelers. We need to stop these people and anyone affiliated with account boosters should stop as well. They do nothing for the community and when something like this goes down they are just as responsible as others. I like to think of them as drug dealers.
and just imagine how insanely easy it would be to detect if an account was possibly being leveled.
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Plz, could we just stop use the term "hacker" ? Because it's a case of cheat, not hack. From a developer point of view, see this term applied to someone that cheat in games is pretty ridiculous. He is possibly a cheater, just it.
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Sucks that this guy had the guts to go about this and get caught, and I feel for you as you seem like a respectful organization leader, taking this situation as it is brought up and speaking publicly about it.
As for PhysicsLee, it SUCKS that he took out some pros along the way, like CatZ and others. Pretty much tarnishes their dreams. ):
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On April 22 2013 09:20 megid wrote:
Plz, could we just stop use the term "hacker" ? Because it's a case of cheat, not hack. From a developer point of view, see this term applied to someone that cheat in games is pretty ridiculous. He is possibly a cheater, just it.
He's a hacker. You are not going to change the way people have been using the term for years sorry, wont happen.
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ok i'll explain, me cheat no no no ok ? i use different hotkey from different builds to build which one might be faster might not fast. please stop i will try to stream my 1v1. in wcs admin watch me play game root catz very very mad. have a nice day people.
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On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks
Could you please enlighten us regarding the reason behind why you are using multiple playstyles and different sets of hotkeys? 
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On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks
Well I can understand this.
I've used two somewhat different hotkey setups depending on the build I was using. Sometimes I want my MSC on 3, sometimes is my Probe scout. Other times I need my Colossus on that key. 2 is either occupied by Blink Stalkers, forces to defend a base from drop, High Templars or a Warp Prism. 0 is generally my Observer, but also can be my MSC or a Warp Prism.
The more I think about it, the more my hotkeys change.
The community jumps the gun really fast on stuff like this. What happened to Spades was a travesty. I watched each and every replay posted in the main thread and nothing was even remotely concerning. Unless the evidence is as clear (as it was with Daisuki) then he shouldn't have been disqualified or banned from anything. Furthermore if an MLG admin was watching... they perhaps we should rethink what is happening.
But again, if there is clear evidence he is cheating, then this is a done deal. I apologize if clear evidence has been presented and I missed it.
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On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks
With so much reply's here I think it would be better to make a bit longer post, this is to short in my opinion to even get close to unguilty.
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On April 23 2013 01:46 NerdFace wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks With so much reply's here I think it would be better to make a bit longer post, this is to short in my opinion to even get close to unguilty.
The precedent isn't on him to prove he isn't guilty, it is on us to prove he is guilty. Where is the evidence beyond some hearsay and the fact that he uses different hotkeys?
EDIT: Nevermind there is a replay, going to check it out later and post again.
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On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks
If you are so confident, stream some 1v1 again and show us that you are really capable of playing at that level and with those different hotkeys. But we all already know this won't happen because you are guilty of what you are accused of and your last attempt to clear your name with a 1v1 stream went terrible.
Based on your play during stream, we know you are not the person who got to GM. Give a way to verify that it is you playing (with old iMP manager, or w.e) and then play. Easiest way to show you are innocent beyond any doubt is to prove that. As it stands we have replays and replays (as posted in this and the reddit thread) of you not only not being on that level, but the person who is playing the account for you is using a production tab hack so that they can counter anything their opponent does.
Your team and former teams have all said this has been a problem and occurred in the past.
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Much respect to you for coming out and saying this. I also believe in innocence until proven guilt, and your story is a very touching one.
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On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks
no players use complete different hotkeys in playstyle in tour etc and then in simple fungames, i play since 1998 thats just not true, you can READ a player always out of his hotkeys ... thats how we find out accshare in broodwar leagues since 10 years ...
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On April 19 2013 04:48 orangeorange wrote:
Physics is a boosted account - he has a booster play both GM ladder games and clanwars for him. The booster uses a production tab hack but does not maphack, so the replays generally look fine (it's just that he always seems lucky in countering builds). Source: I know the guy who boosts his account and I've been following this situation for some time wondering when it would come to light.
Very, very easy way to prove this for yourself:
Tell physics to send you the replays from the games he played on stream yesterday (where he went 0-8), or any other games where you KNOW 100% that it's him. This would exclude clanwar reps where he all-killed, GM ladder games that are on replay sites like drop.sc, etc.
Compare the two batches of replays in SC2gears. They will be nothing alike.
The booster has good mechanics, but his apm is much lower (200-250 or so). The guy who you know as physics has different hotkeys and much higher apm (300-400+, because he spams a lot) but has much worse mechanics and is a significantly worse player overall.
There, that's it. You can even tell looking at Physics' match history on battlenet. Whenever he's on one of his insane ladder winstreaks, or playing a clanwar game, his apm will be in the 200's. Whenever it's him playing as himself, it will be in the 400's. The pattern will match up 100%.
If you want to discuss further, PM me.
you remind me of lelouch
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On April 23 2013 01:51 Aerisky wrote:
Much respect to you for coming out and saying this. I also believe in innocence until proven guilt, and your story is a very touching one.
You're gonna be disappointed
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On April 23 2013 02:01 NMxhendralisk wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 01:51 Aerisky wrote:
Much respect to you for coming out and saying this. I also believe in innocence until proven guilt, and your story is a very touching one. You're gonna be disappointed
Even though it seems pretty obvious at this point that this guy is a hacker, I dont think he'll be disappointing by believing in innocence until proven otherwise.
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On April 23 2013 02:02 Bonkarooni wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 02:01 NMxhendralisk wrote:On April 23 2013 01:51 Aerisky wrote:
Much respect to you for coming out and saying this. I also believe in innocence until proven guilt, and your story is a very touching one. You're gonna be disappointed Even though it seems pretty obvious at this point that this guy is a hacker, I dont think he'll be disappointing by believing in innocence until proven otherwise.
Sorry, I didn't really use the best word there. I mean, no reason to respect or be touched by physicslee is all
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On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
ok i'll explain, me cheat no no no ok ? i use different hotkey from different builds to build which one might be faster might not fast. please stop i will try to stream my 1v1. in wcs admin watch me play game root catz very very mad. have a nice day people.
Don't even try son. The cats out of the bag, ya donezo. The hotkeys of the games I have vs you are 100% different from the hotkeys the other person playing on your account has. You don't even TRY to spam the same hotkeys like he does. Yea yea, I sometimes switch hotkeys a little myself, but you're using two different complete sets. Ez
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Drama over noname pub guy. And i hate that fake attitude of OP like "I'm nice guy". There is no nice guys in the internet.
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On April 23 2013 01:50 Prplppleatr wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks If you are so confident, stream some 1v1 again and show us that you are really capable of playing at that level and with those different hotkeys. But we all already know this won't happen because you are guilty of what you are accused of and your last attempt to clear your name with a 1v1 stream went terrible. Based on your play during stream, we know you are not the person who got to GM. Give a way to verify that it is you playing (with old iMP manager, or w.e) and then play. Easiest way to show you are innocent beyond any doubt is to prove that. As it stands we have replays and replays (as posted in this and the reddit thread) of you not only not being on that level, but the person who is playing the account for you is using a production tab hack so that they can counter anything their opponent does. Your team and former teams have all said this has been a problem and occurred in the past.
He has a hand cam when streaming 2v2 (same hotkeys as the real physicslee aka not the 1v1er). So, having that on would be a start for identity confirmation.
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On April 23 2013 02:10 BlazingFear wrote:
Drama over noname pub guy. And i hate that fake attitude of OP like "I'm nice guy". There is no nice guys in the internet.
Actually marine is a really nice guy. :/
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On April 23 2013 02:10 BlazingFear wrote:
Drama over noname pub guy. And i hate that fake attitude of OP like "I'm nice guy". There is no nice guys in the internet.
I hate generic cynicism on the internet sometimes >.<
That said, I feel sorry for marine, and I have no sympathy for physics. Kind of lame.
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On April 23 2013 02:10 BlazingFear wrote:
Drama over noname pub guy. And i hate that fake attitude of OP like "I'm nice guy". There is no nice guys in the internet.
Lol what...where did this come from?
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On April 23 2013 01:51 Aerisky wrote:
Much respect to you for coming out and saying this. I also believe in innocence until proven guilt, and your story is a very touching one.
I posted a replay here, nothing much more to say. This guy is not just maphacking he is doing it so obvious that there isnt even a single doubt he is a hacker.
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On April 23 2013 02:05 NMxhendralisk wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 02:02 Bonkarooni wrote:On April 23 2013 02:01 NMxhendralisk wrote:On April 23 2013 01:51 Aerisky wrote:
Much respect to you for coming out and saying this. I also believe in innocence until proven guilt, and your story is a very touching one. You're gonna be disappointed Even though it seems pretty obvious at this point that this guy is a hacker, I dont think he'll be disappointing by believing in innocence until proven otherwise. Sorry, I didn't really use the best word there. I mean, no reason to respect or be touched by physicslee is all
I was referring to the OP. If Lee is revealed to have cheated or whatever, let him face the full consequences.
Also if anybody didn't notice, lee edited his post on the previous page.
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Best of luck from Fallacy Management, Marine. Let me know if there is something I can do to help.
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On April 23 2013 02:25 Aerisky wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 02:05 NMxhendralisk wrote:On April 23 2013 02:02 Bonkarooni wrote:On April 23 2013 02:01 NMxhendralisk wrote:On April 23 2013 01:51 Aerisky wrote:
Much respect to you for coming out and saying this. I also believe in innocence until proven guilt, and your story is a very touching one. You're gonna be disappointed Even though it seems pretty obvious at this point that this guy is a hacker, I dont think he'll be disappointing by believing in innocence until proven otherwise. Sorry, I didn't really use the best word there. I mean, no reason to respect or be touched by physicslee is all I was referring to the OP. If Lee is revealed to have cheated or whatever, let him face the full consequences. Also if anybody didn't notice, lee edited his post on the previous page.
So what did he say in the first place?
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LOL at physicslee posting in perfectly good english then editing it in a broken english to make it seem like he is a very innocent korean player. Nice try , nice try.
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"played sc2 since sc1"
God damn hipsters!
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On April 23 2013 01:53 CoR wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks no players use complete different hotkeys in playstyle in tour etc and then in simple fungames, i play since 1998 thats just not true, you can READ a player always out of his hotkeys ... thats how we find out accshare in broodwar leagues since 10 years ...
Not to mention the fact that his hotkeys and spamming signature in serious games just happens to match that of Dejmien...
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Just out of curiosity, is there any link someone can provide on a breakdown of evidence? I'm sure there has to be some with the allegations going around. All I really have seen is accusations and no links to any form or proof. I see tons of people accusing him though. I remember when Spades was accused in SC2. They had replay analysis and everything with current members of Root doing the commentary. I'm just saying I'd like some definitive proof that we can look at rather than 'hearsay'.
I love CatZ. I would be pretty upset to find he lost to someone hacking in the WCS. But, really? Online qualifers? I get the advantages, but CatZ is a big part of this scene and hes thrown a lot of his life into this game to be knocked out of a tournament by a hacker. That just doesn't seem right.
I'm sure lots of CatZ fans, like myself would be very upset to find definitive proof of him losing to hackers in a qualifier for a huge tournament. I know I would use what little resources I have my disposal to help CatZ with this unfortunate scenario.
Anyone??????
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On April 23 2013 03:23 Diddywhop wrote:
Just out of curiosity, is there any link someone can provide on a breakdown of evidence? I'm sure there has to be some with the allegations going around. All I really have seen is accusations and no links to any form or proof. I see tons of people accusing him though. I remember when Spades was accused in SC2. They had replay analysis and everything with current members of Root doing the commentary. I'm just saying I'd like some definitive proof that we can look at rather than 'hearsay'.
I love CatZ. I would be pretty upset to find he lost to someone hacking in the WCS. But, really? Online qualifers? I get the advantages, but CatZ is a big part of this scene and hes thrown a lot of his life into this game to be knocked out of a tournament by a hacker. That just doesn't seem right.
I'm sure lots of CatZ fans, like myself would be very upset to find definitive proof of him losing to hackers in a qualifier for a huge tournament. I know I would use what little resources I have my disposal to help CatZ with this unfortunate scenario.
Anyone??????
Um, the one in the OP. lol There are links to his 1v1 stream where he tries to prove he can play at GM, but loses horribly 0-8, there are also replays from the clan wars he played in, and other ladder games....remember this originally came up because one of the team/clan war leagues thought he was cheating and started investigating him.
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On April 23 2013 04:20 Prplppleatr wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 03:23 Diddywhop wrote:
Just out of curiosity, is there any link someone can provide on a breakdown of evidence? I'm sure there has to be some with the allegations going around. All I really have seen is accusations and no links to any form or proof. I see tons of people accusing him though. I remember when Spades was accused in SC2. They had replay analysis and everything with current members of Root doing the commentary. I'm just saying I'd like some definitive proof that we can look at rather than 'hearsay'.
I love CatZ. I would be pretty upset to find he lost to someone hacking in the WCS. But, really? Online qualifers? I get the advantages, but CatZ is a big part of this scene and hes thrown a lot of his life into this game to be knocked out of a tournament by a hacker. That just doesn't seem right.
I'm sure lots of CatZ fans, like myself would be very upset to find definitive proof of him losing to hackers in a qualifier for a huge tournament. I know I would use what little resources I have my disposal to help CatZ with this unfortunate scenario.
Anyone?????? Um, the one in the OP. lol There are links to his 1v1 stream where he tries to prove he can play at GM, but loses horribly 0-8, there are also replays from the clan wars he played in, and other ladder games....remember this originally came up because one of the team/clan war leagues thought he was cheating and started investigating him.
Not really the kind of proof I was looking for.
No, I saw those. It seems rather legitimate. I was just hoping for something a bit more up to how blatant it was with Spades. Not to mention, Spades was caught hacking before.
I don't think this proof will be enough to ruin him from competition.
Even being partial to CatZ on this matter, I've yet to see anything conclusive. Most of people with experience with the guy seems to believe he was paying for leveling by a maphacker..
Now that I think of it though. It wasn't really any more blatant with Spades, I think the camera lock was the obvious thing. I think his past rep hurt himt he most.
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On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks
On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
ok i'll explain, me cheat no no no ok ? i use different hotkey from different builds to build which one might be faster might not fast. please stop i will try to stream my 1v1. in wcs admin watch me play game root catz very very mad. have a nice day people.
so why exactly did you change your post from the first one to this one? are you trying to portray yourself as a helpless korean so others will sympathize with you?
you were caught maphacking in WoL...not surprised you wouldn't get caught in HotS
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On April 23 2013 04:45 .kv wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
ok i'll explain, me cheat no no no ok ? i use different hotkey from different builds to build which one might be faster might not fast. please stop i will try to stream my 1v1. in wcs admin watch me play game root catz very very mad. have a nice day people. so why exactly did you change your post from the first one to this one? are you trying to portray yourself as a helpless korean so others will sympathize with you? you were caught maphacking in WoL...not surprised you wouldn't get caught in HotS
Kinda fishy when someone who apparently speaks perfect english decides to do that
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Well, I wouldn't exactly call it "perfect english" either, haha :D
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On April 23 2013 04:45 .kv wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
ok i'll explain, me cheat no no no ok ? i use different hotkey from different builds to build which one might be faster might not fast. please stop i will try to stream my 1v1. in wcs admin watch me play game root catz very very mad. have a nice day people. so why exactly did you change your post from the first one to this one? are you trying to portray yourself as a helpless korean so others will sympathize with you? you were caught maphacking in WoL...not surprised you wouldn't get caught in HotS
Pretty suspect change, also a pretty awful excuse. I have heard of a lot of stylistic changes for players, but I don't think I have heard of a player changing hotkeys for specific builds before.
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As i said, OP is a fake "nice guy". It doesn't take a Sherlock to figure out that this guy accused of MH/Acc swapping whatever his name is, is actually guilty. I'm sure OP is, or even was aware of his player actions before it got out, hoping for some results and easy commercial for his company. But since it got out, he had to put up a show titled "Do not connect me with that accident, i was hurt when i was 5 years old, so i'm gonna act as a white knight and trust my guy!", simply to clear his e-sports company name and cut any connection to the fraud. Because no1 will do business with shady organization.
It's so damn obvious that OP is deep in this shit just as the player. Sure he could be unaware what's going on backstage, but only if that scumbag player would be hell smart with his actions, taking care of every detail to cover his fraud. But srsly, all you have to do is read his posts to see that he is 1) Low intelligent person, commiting so many mistakes in his plan 2) Can't properly speak for himself on the forum, calling people names and not using any logical arguments, going "shut the f up people" instead of putting effort of 30mins stream to clear up his name, but of course he can't do that because he is guilty. 3) It's a lot easier to communicate by writing, instead of giving speech. If this guy fails so much to convince us he is innocent, then his verbal defense or explanation to OP should be even more lacking and easy to see through
Dudes you need think out of the box. This is all the business, only $ matters. You can't trust the guy because he wrote that he had bad experience in the past and since then he has became a saint. He is not from redcross, he is not a volunteer, he leads profit oriented organization, so please, don't buy cheesy stories from someone who is here to take your money.
Also another thing. Part about "I've asked him if he did it, he says no thus i believe him" makes ABSOLUTELY no sense. It's your damn responsibility to take action and do close investigation of your player, if enough proves were given that he is fraud. There's been more than enough to do so. Why are you leaving this matter to the community? You have hired him, he is representating your company, but yet you do nothing else than creating this topic to find out how much we gonna uncover. You just hoped that your guy would get away with what has he done, thats why you didn't discipline him as soon as enough of proof came out.
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Because i saw some people including IdrA say that you cant stream with maphack on,this is false and it can be done.
A friend of mine was talking to us while streaming playing against an ai and he was telling exactly what the bot was about to do.
I do not know how to do it but it is done through xplit and it cant be fixed.
I and some other ppl told him to post it on reddit as to get more exposure so people are not sure that maphackers cant stream but he said he wanted to see if blizzard who he messaged were to react.
You may not believe it and i dont care really as i have nothing to win anyway but just bear it in mind and dont believe anything you see
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On April 23 2013 05:10 BlazingFear wrote:
As i said, OP is a fake "nice guy". It doesn't take a Sherlock to figure out that this guy accused of MH/Acc swapping whatever his name is, is actually guilty. I'm sure OP is, or even was aware of his player actions before it got out, hoping for some results and easy commercial for his company. But since it got out, he had to put up a show titled "Do not connect me with that accident, i was hurt when i was 5 years old, so i'm gonna act as a white knight and trust my guy!", simply to clear his e-sports company name and cut any connection to the fraud. Because no1 will do business with shady organization.
It's so damn obvious that OP is deep in this shit just as the player. Sure he could be unaware what's going on backstage, but only if that scumbag player would be hell smart with his actions, taking care of every detail to cover his fraud. But srsly, all you have to do is read his posts to see that he is 1) Low intelligent person, commiting so many mistakes in his plan 2) Can't properly speak for himself on the forum, calling people names and not using any logical arguments, going "shut the f up people" instead of putting effort of 30mins stream to clear up his name, but of course he can't do that because he is guilty. 3) It's a lot easier to communicate by writing, instead of giving speech. If this guy fails so much to convince us he is innocent, then his verbal defense or explanation to OP should be even more lacking and easy to see through
Dudes you need think out of the box. This is all the business, only $ matters. You can't trust the guy because he wrote that he had bad experience in the past and since then he has became a saint. He is not from redcross, he is not a volunteer, he leads profit oriented organization, so please, don't buy cheesy stories from someone who is here to take your money.
How familiar are you with the level of Starcraft Impulse eSports plays at? By and large it isn't about money (yet) for a lot of the teams at this level (I would call it High Amateur myself, but the line is blurred with some better known teams playing in lesser known leagues).
These complaints originated from the URTL, or  Under Rated Team League , with a top prize of 250$, not to mention the fact that Impulse currently has a single sponsor listed on their site. Where ever you think these eSports dollars are coming from, I suspect you are grossly overestimating the average income of the team(s) at this level.
Starcraft at the high amateur level is about reputation, most of the players on these teams know one another or at least know of one another and make lateral shifts between them intermittently. Management among these organizations is much the same way, players and organizations are hard pressed to shake a reputation as a group of cheaters once they have been established as one.
You are lobbing some serious accusations with little more than circumstantial evidence.
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impulse has some of the most genuinely kind people at the helm. hopefully they dont get a negative rep for one bad apple.
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On April 23 2013 05:10 BlazingFear wrote:
As i said, OP is a fake "nice guy". It doesn't take a Sherlock to figure out that this guy accused of MH/Acc swapping whatever his name is, is actually guilty. I'm sure OP is, or even was aware of his player actions before it got out, hoping for some results and easy commercial for his company. But since it got out, he had to put up a show titled "Do not connect me with that accident, i was hurt when i was 5 years old, so i'm gonna act as a white knight and trust my guy!", simply to clear his e-sports company name and cut any connection to the fraud. Because no1 will do business with shady organization.
It's so damn obvious that OP is deep in this shit just as the player. Sure he could be unaware what's going on backstage, but only if that scumbag player would be hell smart with his actions, taking care of every detail to cover his fraud. But srsly, all you have to do is read his posts to see that he is 1) Low intelligent person, commiting so many mistakes in his plan 2) Can't properly speak for himself on the forum, calling people names and not using any logical arguments, going "shut the f up people" instead of putting effort of 30mins stream to clear up his name, but of course he can't do that because he is guilty. 3) It's a lot easier to communicate by writing, instead of giving speech. If this guy fails so much to convince us he is innocent, then his verbal defense or explanation to OP should be even more lacking and easy to see through
Dudes you need think out of the box. This is all the business, only $ matters. You can't trust the guy because he wrote that he had bad experience in the past and since then he has became a saint. He is not from redcross, he is not a volunteer, he leads profit oriented organization, so please, don't buy cheesy stories from someone who is here to take your money.
Also another thing. Part about "I've asked him if he did it, he says no thus i believe him" makes ABSOLUTELY no sense. It's your damn responsibility to take action and do close investigation of your player, if enough proves were given that he is fraud. There's been more than enough to do so. Why are you leaving this matter to the community? You have hired him, he is representating your company, but yet you do nothing else than creating this topic to find out how much we gonna uncover. You just hoped that your guy would get away with what has he done, thats why you didn't discipline him as soon as enough of proof came out.
You know nothing, do you think this is EG or something? It's an amateur team playing in small clan wars and small team leagues for scraps. Players aren't getting anything and neither are the managers who dedicate their time and effort.
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Yeah Blazing you sound like a 9/11 truther. One of those guys who thinks they're smarter than everyone else because they can think of alternate motives. Yeah, this small startup amateur eSports team thought letting someone who they knew was a hacker on their team would win them a couple clan wars and get them famous? Get real. I personally talked to Marine about this, and we went through replays for hours trying to find evidence of this guy's cheating. Especially considering what happened with Knighter, and knowing that reputation in eSports is everything as we are an unforgiving community, you would still rather believe that Marine is a greedy mastermind trying to manipulate an entire community than that he's just a nice guy? This is nonsense and you should be embarassed to have posted it.
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On April 23 2013 08:50 redDain wrote:
Yeah Blazing you sound like a 9/11 truther. One of those guys who thinks they're smarter than everyone else because they can think of alternate motives. Yeah, this small startup amateur eSports team thought letting someone who they knew was a hacker on their team would win them a couple clan wars and get them famous? Get real. I personally talked to Marine about this, and we went through replays for hours trying to find evidence of this guy's cheating. Especially considering what happened with Knighter, and knowing that reputation in eSports is everything as we are an unforgiving community, you would still rather believe that Marine is a greedy mastermind trying to manipulate an entire community than that he's just a nice guy? This is nonsense and you should be embarassed to have posted it.
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. I can bust out old members who can tell you about imp.knighter, for example, who was another boosted clown on the team, had evidence against him, and marine turned a blind eye to him. Eventually, once enough people knew knighter was a clown, the kid bounced to league of legends, which physics will probably do soon as well.
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On April 23 2013 02:57 orangeorange wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 01:53 CoR wrote:On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks no players use complete different hotkeys in playstyle in tour etc and then in simple fungames, i play since 1998 thats just not true, you can READ a player always out of his hotkeys ... thats how we find out accshare in broodwar leagues since 10 years ... Not to mention the fact that his hotkeys and spamming signature in serious games just happens to match that of Dejmien...
Who's Dejmien? Someone who levels accounts for money?
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On April 23 2013 08:56 Sein wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 02:57 orangeorange wrote:On April 23 2013 01:53 CoR wrote:On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks no players use complete different hotkeys in playstyle in tour etc and then in simple fungames, i play since 1998 thats just not true, you can READ a player always out of his hotkeys ... thats how we find out accshare in broodwar leagues since 10 years ... Not to mention the fact that his hotkeys and spamming signature in serious games just happens to match that of Dejmien... Who's Dejmien? Someone who levels accounts for money?
Yes. Dejmien is the person of interest relating to PhysicsLee's boosted account.
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On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
Lol. Ok MLG Admin Was watching when i played RooT Catz his just rude Player who doesn't except losing. People who don't know me, just so many talks and rumor about me cheating w/e needs to end here. this witch hunting shit is really stupid. I'm pretty sure there's people asking me why do i use different hotkeys different play style. anybody can use different hotkey thats not what map hacking is plus i've been playing sc2 since Sc1 : BW played in cyber tourny in korea. so if you guys still wondering about me just keep it shut thanks
On April 23 2013 01:30 physicslee wrote:
ok i'll explain, me cheat no no no ok ? i use different hotkey from different builds to build which one might be faster might not fast. please stop i will try to stream my 1v1. in wcs admin watch me play game root catz very very mad. have a nice day people.
Um....
Why would Physicslee do something that shady if he wasn't guilty?
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Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
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On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him.
User was warned for this post
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That was helpful, good post. +1
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On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him.
He's not a fake korean, he speaks and types it fluently.
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Someone pls delete this, I fucked up ~ Buddha
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Shin, we have looked at the replays we have of him, it was difficult to prove that he cheated. A lot of it was suspicious and such, but there were very few replays available. Having evidence is not proof, if every time something suspicious happened we kicked that member from the team then no team would exist. Luck, intuition, and a number of other factors can be at play. It's not turning a blind eye, it's not having proof and gathering evidence that is incredibly difficult to get. Marine and I have looked at replays of both Knighter and Physics, and even brought in people from other teams that are high level to give us their opinion before confronting the player at all. No one from Impulse was saying that Physics was legit, just that we didn't have proof that he wasn't due to a lack of replays. Would have been nice if you had proof if you had brought it up while you were on the team though.
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On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit.
Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made.
On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him.
You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there.
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On April 23 2013 09:25 iamcaustic wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made. Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there.
I'd love to hear the story of how PhysicsLee got recruited... And no you guys are gullible chumps who wanted to believe a top 50 GM was part of your team when it was obvious that something was amiss. And I mean OBVIOUS.
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It is hard to belive that a blantant hacker like this can go on unnoticed for over a year. Even back in the day a lot of people were complaining about this guy, i think he even was added to the TL hacker list. The replay i uploaded is over 1 year old and it was so obvious he was hacking. In fact this guy was A KNOWN hacker, everyone who play against him in the ladder knew about this. He is doing this for over a year and yet you are unaware that he is a hacker until now.
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On April 23 2013 09:32 TricksAre4Figs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 09:25 iamcaustic wrote:On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made. On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there. I'd love to hear the story of how PhysicsLee got recruited... And no you guys are gullible chumps who wanted to believe a top 50 GM was part of your team when it was obvious that something was amiss. And I mean OBVIOUS.
Well, at this point it's become fairly obvious -- that's why he's been dropped from the team. The team did its investigation in the wake of these allegations and agreed that things weren't adding up as they should. If you think iMpulse is the first sub-premier team to be fooled by a cheater, then you may want to re-assess who the gullible one really is.
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On April 23 2013 09:32 TricksAre4Figs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 09:25 iamcaustic wrote:On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made. On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there. I'd love to hear the story of how PhysicsLee got recruited... And no you guys are gullible chumps who wanted to believe a top 50 GM was part of your team when it was obvious that something was amiss. And I mean OBVIOUS.
When did you know? Where did you say anything? I think Physics has been a part of impulse for about 2 months maybe less, I'd have to let Marine comment on that.
Also checked the GM Hacker thread, first mention of PhysicsLee is April 22, 2013...
Please show me where obvious is also. There's a lot of evidence in here, I'm not sure any of it warrants "OBVIOUS"
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On April 23 2013 09:10 Zath.erin wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. He's not a fake korean, he speaks and types it fluently.
This he does fluently type it. But I'm not sure whether he production tab hacks or not.
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http://drop.sc/164717 (1year old replay)
So dont tell me this isnt fucking obvious. Catz played against him on ladder back in the day and was calling him a hacker all the time.
He also gets mentioned as LLNphysics in the hackthread and someone said "rapdawg" is already confirmed (i suppose that was his older name).
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On April 23 2013 09:44 Buddhism101 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 09:32 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 09:25 iamcaustic wrote:On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made. On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there. I'd love to hear the story of how PhysicsLee got recruited... And no you guys are gullible chumps who wanted to believe a top 50 GM was part of your team when it was obvious that something was amiss. And I mean OBVIOUS. When did you know? Where did you say anything? I think Physics has been a part of impulse for about 2 months maybe less, I'd have to let Marine comment on that. Also checked the GM Hacker thread, first mention of PhysicsLee is April 22, 2013... Please show me where obvious is also. There's a lot of evidence in here, I'm not sure any of it warrants "OBVIOUS"
Marine was told about it prior to the reddit thread being created. I guess nothings obvious when you have a team of gold league clowns
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On April 23 2013 09:52 Shin_Gouki wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 09:44 Buddhism101 wrote:On April 23 2013 09:32 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 09:25 iamcaustic wrote:On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made. On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there. I'd love to hear the story of how PhysicsLee got recruited... And no you guys are gullible chumps who wanted to believe a top 50 GM was part of your team when it was obvious that something was amiss. And I mean OBVIOUS. When did you know? Where did you say anything? I think Physics has been a part of impulse for about 2 months maybe less, I'd have to let Marine comment on that. Also checked the GM Hacker thread, first mention of PhysicsLee is April 22, 2013... Please show me where obvious is also. There's a lot of evidence in here, I'm not sure any of it warrants "OBVIOUS" Marine was told about it prior to the reddit thread being created. I guess nothings obvious when you have a team of gold league clowns
So your advice is to just cut someone every time someone accuses someone else? You just seem bitter at Marine for some reason, did you confront him with advice / analysis / anything? Or are you just saying it's obvious now after the fact?
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On April 23 2013 09:44 Buddhism101 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 09:32 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 09:25 iamcaustic wrote:On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made. On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there. I'd love to hear the story of how PhysicsLee got recruited... And no you guys are gullible chumps who wanted to believe a top 50 GM was part of your team when it was obvious that something was amiss. And I mean OBVIOUS. When did you know? Where did you say anything? I think Physics has been a part of impulse for about 2 months maybe less, I'd have to let Marine comment on that. Also checked the GM Hacker thread, first mention of PhysicsLee is April 22, 2013... Please show me where obvious is also. There's a lot of evidence in here, I'm not sure any of it warrants "OBVIOUS"
When PhysicsLee went 22-0 in GM league you didn't think that was unusual? Nobody goes 22-0 in GM vs pros. And during this time period he was streaming but only TEAM GAMES? Finally Marine had Physics stream 1v1 and Physics played like a low master at best, went 0-8, the games were terrible never went beyond 2base play. And the whole time Marine and Dain and others were making up excuses for Physics. People tried to alert iMpulse but you guys stubbornly rejected the information and "stood behind your teammate" who was barely even in the team for 2 months?
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On April 23 2013 09:55 Buddhism101 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 09:52 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 23 2013 09:44 Buddhism101 wrote:On April 23 2013 09:32 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 09:25 iamcaustic wrote:On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made. On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there. I'd love to hear the story of how PhysicsLee got recruited... And no you guys are gullible chumps who wanted to believe a top 50 GM was part of your team when it was obvious that something was amiss. And I mean OBVIOUS. When did you know? Where did you say anything? I think Physics has been a part of impulse for about 2 months maybe less, I'd have to let Marine comment on that. Also checked the GM Hacker thread, first mention of PhysicsLee is April 22, 2013... Please show me where obvious is also. There's a lot of evidence in here, I'm not sure any of it warrants "OBVIOUS" Marine was told about it prior to the reddit thread being created. I guess nothings obvious when you have a team of gold league clowns So your advice is to just cut someone every time someone accuses someone else? You just seem bitter at Marine for some reason, did you confront him with advice / analysis / anything? Or are you just saying it's obvious now after the fact?
None of the above. When someone accuses a member on your team, you speak to that team mate and get it squashed ASAP, or you let that said player look like a clown because he was caught. Nothing more, nothing less. You can back your player, that's expected and it's fine. But you don't just sit there and hope everything breezes away.
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On April 23 2013 09:49 Sokrates wrote:http://drop.sc/164717 (1year old replay) So dont tell me this isnt fucking obvious. Catz played against him on ladder back in the day and was calling him a hacker all the time. He also gets mentioned as LLNphysics in the hackthread and someone said "rapdawg" is already confirmed (i suppose that was his older name).
WTF physics is rapdawg? Link to thread plz
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On April 23 2013 09:57 Shin_Gouki wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 09:55 Buddhism101 wrote:On April 23 2013 09:52 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 23 2013 09:44 Buddhism101 wrote:On April 23 2013 09:32 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 09:25 iamcaustic wrote:On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made. On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there. I'd love to hear the story of how PhysicsLee got recruited... And no you guys are gullible chumps who wanted to believe a top 50 GM was part of your team when it was obvious that something was amiss. And I mean OBVIOUS. When did you know? Where did you say anything? I think Physics has been a part of impulse for about 2 months maybe less, I'd have to let Marine comment on that. Also checked the GM Hacker thread, first mention of PhysicsLee is April 22, 2013... Please show me where obvious is also. There's a lot of evidence in here, I'm not sure any of it warrants "OBVIOUS" Marine was told about it prior to the reddit thread being created. I guess nothings obvious when you have a team of gold league clowns So your advice is to just cut someone every time someone accuses someone else? You just seem bitter at Marine for some reason, did you confront him with advice / analysis / anything? Or are you just saying it's obvious now after the fact? None of the above. When someone accuses a member on your team, you speak to that team mate and get it squashed ASAP, or you let that said player look like a clown because he was caught. Nothing more, nothing less. You can back your player, that's expected and it's fine. But you don't just sit there and hope everything breezes away.
If someone accuses a team member you talk to them and then what? He said he didn't do it. Well that helps.
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[/QUOTE]
Marine was told about it prior to the reddit thread being created. I guess nothings obvious when you have a team of gold league clowns[/QUOTE]
Shingoku first man. I am so disappointed in the manner in which you have acted. As someone who was part of this team, and up and left it in the middle of the night. As someone who was my friend why not come and talk to me? Anyways best of luck to you man. Hope you can release your anger some way more productive than this.
In regards to your accusations about me knowing about physics. Well yes of course I heard rumors before the Reddit post, and I was in the process of investigation. As I have claimed this entire time I do believe in "Innocent till proven guilty". I think everyone knows how difficult it is to get 100% proof, but as long as someone pleads innocence I want to stand by them and believe them when they have given me no reason not to.
Finally, today I talked to physics, and because he was unwilling to co-operate an longer in helping us with this issue I decided to let him go. I still am not sure if he is guilty or Innocent, but all I can say is that because he was unwilling to cooperate with us in this matter an longer we obviously felt it was time to let him go.
Issues like these are always very difficult to handle as a team owner. You want to believe in your players, but at the same time your trying to do your best to find the truth and get to the bottom of a matter. I hope that people can understand how difficult this is. I know some will always just believe the worst, but as always I do only the best I can.
-Marine-
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On April 23 2013 10:00 Buddhism101 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 09:57 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 23 2013 09:55 Buddhism101 wrote:On April 23 2013 09:52 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 23 2013 09:44 Buddhism101 wrote:On April 23 2013 09:32 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 09:25 iamcaustic wrote:On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made. On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there. I'd love to hear the story of how PhysicsLee got recruited... And no you guys are gullible chumps who wanted to believe a top 50 GM was part of your team when it was obvious that something was amiss. And I mean OBVIOUS. When did you know? Where did you say anything? I think Physics has been a part of impulse for about 2 months maybe less, I'd have to let Marine comment on that. Also checked the GM Hacker thread, first mention of PhysicsLee is April 22, 2013... Please show me where obvious is also. There's a lot of evidence in here, I'm not sure any of it warrants "OBVIOUS" Marine was told about it prior to the reddit thread being created. I guess nothings obvious when you have a team of gold league clowns So your advice is to just cut someone every time someone accuses someone else? You just seem bitter at Marine for some reason, did you confront him with advice / analysis / anything? Or are you just saying it's obvious now after the fact? None of the above. When someone accuses a member on your team, you speak to that team mate and get it squashed ASAP, or you let that said player look like a clown because he was caught. Nothing more, nothing less. You can back your player, that's expected and it's fine. But you don't just sit there and hope everything breezes away. If someone accuses a team member you talk to them and then what? He said he didn't do it. Well that helps.
Bro, I said talk to him and get it squashed ASAP. I guess you missed that part so let me elaborate. If the player says "Hey, I don't hack, these allegations aren't true!" Then you have that shit squashed by just streaming and showing the accusers they're clowns. Otherwise, you let said player look like a clown, it's really simple.
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On April 23 2013 10:00 iMpMarine wrote:
Marine was told about it prior to the reddit thread being created. I guess nothings obvious when you have a team of gold league clowns[/QUOTE]
Shingoku first man. I am so disappointed in the manner in which you have acted. As someone who was part of this team, and up and left it in the middle of the night. As someone who was my friend why not come and talk to me? Anyways best of luck to you man. Hope you can release your anger some way more productive than this.
In regards to your accusations about me knowing about physics. Well yes of course I heard rumors before the Reddit post, and I was in the process of investigation. As I have claimed this entire time I do believe in "Innocent till proven guilty". I think everyone knows how difficult it is to get 100% proof, but as long as someone pleads innocence I want to stand by them and believe them when they have given me no reason not to.
Finally, today I talked to physics, and because he was unwilling to co-operate an longer in helping us with this issue I decided to let him go. I still am not sure if he is guilty or Innocent, but all I can say is that because he was unwilling to cooperate with us in this matter an longer we obviously felt it was time to let him go.
Issues like these are always very difficult to handle as a team owner. You want to believe in your players, but at the same time your trying to do your best to find the truth and get to the bottom of a matter. I hope that people can understand how difficult this is. I know some will always just believe the worst, but as always I do only the best I can.
-Marine-[/QUOTE]
Honestly Marine pipe down with your high road bullshit. We told you what was going on and you made up excuses and called us "haters" and refused to take a fair look at the situation.
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On April 23 2013 10:03 Shin_Gouki wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 10:00 Buddhism101 wrote:On April 23 2013 09:57 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 23 2013 09:55 Buddhism101 wrote:On April 23 2013 09:52 Shin_Gouki wrote:On April 23 2013 09:44 Buddhism101 wrote:On April 23 2013 09:32 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 09:25 iamcaustic wrote:On April 23 2013 08:55 Shin_Gouki wrote:
Obviously, you guys haven't done anything "Analysis related" because you haven't even given a decent reason why physicslee is legit. Wait, what? PhysicsLee was removed from the team. Why would iMpulse give decent reasons why he's legit when management boots him for not being legit? There's a vast difference between supporting a cheater and taking the proper time to ensure the right decision is being made. On April 23 2013 09:08 TricksAre4Figs wrote:On April 23 2013 08:58 redDain wrote:
Shingouki you really should read threads before you respond. I'm not arguing that Physics is legit. He's been kicked from the team as of today. I was responding to the accusations that Marine knew he was hacking and let him on to get publicity.
I just want to say you guys are a bunch of dumbasses who let a fake korean cheating kid onto your team and stuck your necks out for him. You mean let a real Korean kid onto the team and did what any decent team should do -- take some time, investigate the allegations, inform the public that the player is being investigated but believing in a standard "innocent until proven guilty" model, and make an informed decision from there. I'd love to hear the story of how PhysicsLee got recruited... And no you guys are gullible chumps who wanted to believe a top 50 GM was part of your team when it was obvious that something was amiss. And I mean OBVIOUS. When did you know? Where did you say anything? I think Physics has been a part of impulse for about 2 months maybe less, I'd have to let Marine comment on that. Also checked the GM Hacker thread, first mention of PhysicsLee is April 22, 2013... Please show me where obvious is also. There's a lot of evidence in here, I'm not sure any of it warrants "OBVIOUS" Marine was told about it prior to the reddit thread being created. I guess nothings obvious when you have a team of gold league clowns So your advice is to just cut someone every time someone accuses someone else? You just seem bitter at Marine for some reason, did you confront him with advice / analysis / anything? Or are you just saying it's obvious now after the fact? None of the above. When someone accuses a member on your team, you speak to that team mate and get it squashed ASAP, or you let that said player look like a clown because he was caught. Nothing more, nothing less. You can back your player, that's expected and it's fine. But you don't just sit there and hope everything breezes away. If someone accuses a team member you talk to them and then what? He said he didn't do it. Well that helps. Bro, I said talk to him and get it squashed ASAP. I guess you missed that part so let me elaborate. If the player says "Hey, I don't hack, these allegations aren't true!" Then you have that shit squashed by just streaming and showing the accusers they're clowns. Otherwise, you let said player look like a clown, it's really simple.
When I messaged you the next day about why you left. All you said was that you had been drinking or something, and that you raged out.
I guess I missed the other message or as I did with the entire rest of the team that asked. I talked to them about the situation. I asked multiple people for advise including ex mangers from previous team. I did the best I could with the information in front of me. I believe in waiting, and looking at all the evidence when someone says they are innocent. It may look bad and that warrants an investigation, but everyone is entitled to fight charges in the effort to prove they are innocent, and none should automatically be guilty.
We play in a game where accusations and allegations fly. I heard once that MYi's entire team hacked and other such false rumors. Are we just to let this go. I think we need to investigate deeper to make sure that it is false.
I had missed some information apparently from some threads that honestly had I seen I probably would have acted much faster, but nobody is perfect. Anyways today when he was unwilling to help like I said I felt it was time to say goodbye
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On April 23 2013 10:05 TricksAre4Figs wrote:Marine was told about it prior to the reddit thread being created. I guess nothings obvious when you have a team of gold league clowns
Shingoku first man. I am so disappointed in the manner in which you have acted. As someone who was part of this team, and up and left it in the middle of the night. As someone who was my friend why not come and talk to me? Anyways best of luck to you man. Hope you can release your anger some way more productive than this.
In regards to your accusations about me knowing about physics. Well yes of course I heard rumors before the Reddit post, and I was in the process of investigation. As I have claimed this entire time I do believe in "Innocent till proven guilty". I think everyone knows how difficult it is to get 100% proof, but as long as someone pleads innocence I want to stand by them and believe them when they have given me no reason not to.
Finally, today I talked to physics, and because he was unwilling to co-operate an longer in helping us with this issue I decided to let him go. I still am not sure if he is guilty or Innocent, but all I can say is that because he was unwilling to cooperate with us in this matter an longer we obviously felt it was time to let him go.
Issues like these are always very difficult to handle as a team owner. You want to believe in your players, but at the same time your trying to do your best to find the truth and get to the bottom of a matter. I hope that people can understand how difficult this is. I know some will always just believe the worst, but as always I do only the best I can.
-Marine-[/QUOTE]
Honestly Marine pipe down with your high road bullshit. We told you what was going on and you made up excuses and called us "haters" and refused to take a fair look at the situation.[/QUOTE]
You come to me trying to put words in my mouth, and to accuse me of some of the worst things out there. I do not take the high road, and have made my mistakes, but I continue to do the best I can.
When people come to me however to accuse me of things I am not guilty of yes I am gonna be a bit upset, and I think that is quite understandable. Especially when trying to investigate a matter to its full extent.
In your world man people are guilty before innocent, and I don't live in that world my friend.
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On April 23 2013 10:05 TricksAre4Figs wrote:
Honestly Marine pipe down with your high road bullshit. We told you what was going on and you made up excuses and called us "haters" and refused to take a fair look at the situation.
Why do you say we as if you were at all relevant to the process that revealed what was going on with physics. All you've done is spout nonsense like marine was in on it for the money, as if there is money in amateur SC2 teams. Cool it with the personal attacks you're really coming off as foolish and immature.
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Time out for a second; you guys really need to fix your quote bbcode. Shit is hard to read.
Okay, moving on.
On April 23 2013 10:05 TricksAre4Figs wrote:
Honestly Marine pipe down with your high road bullshit. We told you what was going on and you made up excuses and called us "haters" and refused to take a fair look at the situation.
Were you one of the Twitch chat randoms, chatting about how PhysicsLee was a hacker?
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Yes, I watched with an open mind and it was OBVIOUS that Physics was not a GM player. And for the record I didn't attack iMp at that time or anyone else in iMp, just Physics himself. I was calling out PHYSICSLEE only at that time. However some of your members reacted very aggressively to us for merely trying to alert you to this highly suspicious player.
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I never mentioned ANYTHING ABOUT DRINKING. I was pissed, I hated the fact that another clown was accused. I told you "I left the team because I can't rep a tag that potentially has a hacker." After that, you pretty much just real-ID removed me, and I breezed my own way. And by breezin, I mean, I went for as much evidence as possible.
And who the fuck is "ShinGoku" I've been on the team for a year, get the name right.
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On April 23 2013 10:20 TricksAre4Figs wrote:
Yes, I watched with an open mind and it was OBVIOUS that Physics was not a GM player. And for the record I didn't attack iMp at that time or anyone else in iMp, just Physics himself. I was calling out PHYSICSLEE only at that time. However some of your members reacted very aggressively to us for merely trying to alert you to this highly suspicious player.
Yeah, it's not like Twitch chats ever shit on the player they're watching. I mean, it's not like Shin_Gouki just called the entirety of Impulse "Gold league players" just now. I guess he was being serious too, and all of Impulse are actually Gold Leaguers cheating their way to higher leagues.
You insulted a player in an environment filled to the brim with flamers, trolls and assholes, and you're remotely surprised that no one takes you seriously?
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On April 23 2013 10:20 TricksAre4Figs wrote:
Yes, I watched with an open mind and it was OBVIOUS that Physics was not a GM player. And for the record I didn't attack iMp at that time or anyone else in iMp, just Physics himself. I was calling out PHYSICSLEE only at that time. However some of your members reacted very aggressively to us for merely trying to alert you to this highly suspicious player.
I just want to take a moment to give you praise for possibly being the only honest person ever when making serious accusations in a Twitch chat.
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If you type in "physicslee maphack" in google you find my replay and another one. I guess that wasnt too hard to investigate.
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Yea, it takes a special kind of bias to not recognize that a player with 22 consecutive WINS in GRANDMASTER LEAGUE vs PROGAMERS cannot win 1 single game on stream and then, after 0-8, terrible defeats, turns off stream? And never to be seen again on stream[EDIT: playing 1v1's] in fact. Did you guys think these facts were no big deal?
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On April 23 2013 10:27 WolfintheSheep wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 10:20 TricksAre4Figs wrote:
Yes, I watched with an open mind and it was OBVIOUS that Physics was not a GM player. And for the record I didn't attack iMp at that time or anyone else in iMp, just Physics himself. I was calling out PHYSICSLEE only at that time. However some of your members reacted very aggressively to us for merely trying to alert you to this highly suspicious player. Yeah, it's not like Twitch chats ever shit on the player they're watching. I mean, it's not like Shin_Gouki just called the entirety of Impulse "Gold league players" just now. I guess he was being serious too, and all of Impulse are actually Gold Leaguers cheating their way to higher leagues. You insulted a player in an environment filled to the brim with flamers, trolls and assholes, and you're remotely surprised that no one takes you seriously?
Physics had no viewers but 5 or 6 at that time, but it is true in that regard. Everyone on twitch is usually BMing the player. Physics knew we knew though, laughing it off originally till he went 0-8.
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On April 23 2013 10:00 iMpMarine wrote:
Finally, today I talked to physics, and because he was unwilling to co-operate an longer in helping us with this issue I decided to let him go. I still am not sure if he is guilty or Innocent, but all I can say is that because he was unwilling to cooperate with us in this matter an longer we obviously felt it was time to let him go.
-Marine-
are you seriously not sure if he is guilty or innocent? you think players play with different hotkeys one for streaming and one for off streaming? you still think his macro is applicable for a GM player? you still think him having the build order advantage 100% of the time off stream is all luck? sorry but this blatant
Yes he was investigated by MLG to look further into it to see if he is a hacker and was later on removed in the tournament. They didn't remove him on the spot when 100s of people requested them to do so. Of course we don't know exactly what they found so we will just forget about this.
Bu what does it take to acknowledge that he is a hacker in HotS just like he was in WoL? Does it have to come out of his mouth? Does it take Blizzard to ban his account and bring him down to the Bronze league?
come on man....you are better than this
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On April 23 2013 10:34 TricksAre4Figs wrote:
Yea, it takes a special kind of bias to not recognize that a player with 22 consecutive WINS in GRANDMASTER LEAGUE vs PROGAMERS cannot win 1 single game on stream and then, after 0-8, terrible defeats, turns off stream? And never to be seen again on stream[EDIT: playing 1v1's] in fact. Did you guys think these facts were no big deal?
We were investigating him at that point. Why do you think PhysicsLee streamed that 0-8 loss? We told him to do it.
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Canada3083 Posts
I don't know why everyone is giving these people so much shit. At this point, yes, physicslee is clearly a suspicious character, but I don't think the OP and others from this team deserve this much shit. They took their time getting investigating whether one of their players was cheating or not - so what? Physicslee should be the one getting 100% of the blame here.
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On April 23 2013 10:39 .kv wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 10:00 iMpMarine wrote:
Finally, today I talked to physics, and because he was unwilling to co-operate an longer in helping us with this issue I decided to let him go. I still am not sure if he is guilty or Innocent, but all I can say is that because he was unwilling to cooperate with us in this matter an longer we obviously felt it was time to let him go.
-Marine- are you seriously not sure if he is guilty or innocent? you think players play with different hotkeys one for streaming and one for off streaming? you still think his macro is applicable for a GM player? you still think him having the build order advantage 100% of the time off stream is all luck? sorry but this blatant Yes he was investigated by MLG to look further into it to see if he is a hacker and was later on removed in the tournament. They didn't remove him on the spot when 100s of people requested them to do so. Of course we don't know exactly what they found so we will just forget about this. Bu what does it take to acknowledge that he is a hacker in HotS just like he was in WoL? Does it have to come out of his mouth? Does it take Blizzard to ban his account and bring him down to the Bronze league? come on man....you are better than this
Don't be a worthless prick. iMpMarine has done everything very professionally. This guy should actually be a model for team managers. He has not been disrespectful to any party, at all. I could care less whether or not he believes Physics hacks or not (I imagine he does, by now). He handled the situation perfectly from his position.
Him coming out and saying "Oh the player on my team was definitely cheating, just look at all of these replays!" doesn't do anything for anyone. Physics was released. Nothing more needs to be done. Grow up.
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On April 23 2013 11:06 Blargh wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 10:39 .kv wrote:On April 23 2013 10:00 iMpMarine wrote:
Finally, today I talked to physics, and because he was unwilling to co-operate an longer in helping us with this issue I decided to let him go. I still am not sure if he is guilty or Innocent, but all I can say is that because he was unwilling to cooperate with us in this matter an longer we obviously felt it was time to let him go.
-Marine- are you seriously not sure if he is guilty or innocent? you think players play with different hotkeys one for streaming and one for off streaming? you still think his macro is applicable for a GM player? you still think him having the build order advantage 100% of the time off stream is all luck? sorry but this blatant Yes he was investigated by MLG to look further into it to see if he is a hacker and was later on removed in the tournament. They didn't remove him on the spot when 100s of people requested them to do so. Of course we don't know exactly what they found so we will just forget about this. Bu what does it take to acknowledge that he is a hacker in HotS just like he was in WoL? Does it have to come out of his mouth? Does it take Blizzard to ban his account and bring him down to the Bronze league? come on man....you are better than this Him coming out and saying "Oh the player on my team was definitely cheating, just look at all of these replays!" doesn't do anything for anyone. Physics was released. Nothing more needs to be done. Grow up.
Why not? Just why not?
I get that this isnt easy to handle but after all that evidence you should at least have the balls and say "yes this guy was a maphacker and therefore he was kicked out of the team" and not go by "well there wasnt any real evidence just suspicious blabla innocent until proven."
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On April 23 2013 11:06 Blargh wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 10:39 .kv wrote:On April 23 2013 10:00 iMpMarine wrote:
Finally, today I talked to physics, and because he was unwilling to co-operate an longer in helping us with this issue I decided to let him go. I still am not sure if he is guilty or Innocent, but all I can say is that because he was unwilling to cooperate with us in this matter an longer we obviously felt it was time to let him go.
-Marine- are you seriously not sure if he is guilty or innocent? you think players play with different hotkeys one for streaming and one for off streaming? you still think his macro is applicable for a GM player? you still think him having the build order advantage 100% of the time off stream is all luck? sorry but this blatant Yes he was investigated by MLG to look further into it to see if he is a hacker and was later on removed in the tournament. They didn't remove him on the spot when 100s of people requested them to do so. Of course we don't know exactly what they found so we will just forget about this. Bu what does it take to acknowledge that he is a hacker in HotS just like he was in WoL? Does it have to come out of his mouth? Does it take Blizzard to ban his account and bring him down to the Bronze league? come on man....you are better than this Don't be a worthless prick. iMpMarine has done everything very professionally. This guy should actually be a model for team managers. He has not been disrespectful to any party, at all. I could care less whether or not he believes Physics hacks or not (I imagine he does, by now). He handled the situation perfectly from his position. Him coming out and saying "Oh the player on my team was definitely cheating, just look at all of these replays!" doesn't do anything for anyone. Physics was released. Nothing more needs to be done. Grow up.
huh? I actually know iMpMarine for quite awhile and have nothing but the utmost respect for him and what he's doing. I'm just baffled that he still isn't quite sure if he's guilty or not.
the "you are better than this" part is referring to him actually being a smart guy and should be better than this and know by now that he is indeed a hacker.
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Well at this point its obvious the same few people that hate Impulse will continue to bring false allegations and accusation against me and my team.
Maybe I missed a few things that people are pointing out now. All I know is I did my best to talk to people and try to get to the bottom of this matter which has now been resolved in the correct way I feel. As long as a player on my team claims his innocence and is willing to cooperate to fight the accusations I will stand by his side. That is true. It is when that person decides not to cooperate as we saw today that we decided to let Physics go.
I am sure people can always find fault in others when they look hard enough.
I think since the matter has been resolved in relation to our team. That we have released physicsLee. I will leave this thread now. Its just turning into a he said she said argument.
For those of you who know me. Thank you for your understand and support in this matter. I know in my heart I tried my best, and feel we have resolved this manner well.
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On April 23 2013 11:30 iMpMarine wrote:
Well at this point its obvious the same few people that hate Impulse will continue to bring false allegations and accusation against me and my team.
Maybe I missed a few things that people are pointing out now. All I know is I did my best to talk to people and try to get to the bottom of this matter which has now been resolved in the correct way I feel. As long as a player on my team claims his innocence and is willing to cooperate to fight the accusations I will stand by his side. That is true. It is when that person decides not to cooperate as we saw today that we decided to let Physics go.
I am sure people can always find fault in others when they look hard enough.
I think since the matter has been resolved in relation to our team. That we have released physicsLee. I will leave this thread now. Its just turning into a he said she said argument.
For those of you who know me. Thank you for your understand and support in this matter. I know in my heart I tried my best, and feel we have resolved this manner well.
You handled this as best you could. Hell if you were perfect people would have hated... I respect you for how you handled the situation and I am truly sorry that if it was true I wasn't able to warn you. His last couple of weeks at xO he didn't want to practice with us anymore and that is when he went from low GM to high GM... I honestly believe this is when it all started but it could have been before that or hell he might be innocent. Regardless I respect how you handled this marine and I hope you the best of luck in the future!
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On April 23 2013 11:12 Sokrates wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 11:06 Blargh wrote:On April 23 2013 10:39 .kv wrote:On April 23 2013 10:00 iMpMarine wrote:
Finally, today I talked to physics, and because he was unwilling to co-operate an longer in helping us with this issue I decided to let him go. I still am not sure if he is guilty or Innocent, but all I can say is that because he was unwilling to cooperate with us in this matter an longer we obviously felt it was time to let him go.
-Marine- are you seriously not sure if he is guilty or innocent? you think players play with different hotkeys one for streaming and one for off streaming? you still think his macro is applicable for a GM player? you still think him having the build order advantage 100% of the time off stream is all luck? sorry but this blatant Yes he was investigated by MLG to look further into it to see if he is a hacker and was later on removed in the tournament. They didn't remove him on the spot when 100s of people requested them to do so. Of course we don't know exactly what they found so we will just forget about this. Bu what does it take to acknowledge that he is a hacker in HotS just like he was in WoL? Does it have to come out of his mouth? Does it take Blizzard to ban his account and bring him down to the Bronze league? come on man....you are better than this Him coming out and saying "Oh the player on my team was definitely cheating, just look at all of these replays!" doesn't do anything for anyone. Physics was released. Nothing more needs to be done. Grow up. Why not? Just why not? I get that this isnt easy to handle but after all that evidence you should at least have the balls and say "yes this guy was a maphacker and therefore he was kicked out of the team" and not go by "well there wasnt any real evidence just suspicious blabla innocent until proven."
So whats the overall community "verdict"? was he a maphacker or did someone boost his account? This thread is a bit confusing.
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On April 23 2013 12:07 JacobShock wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 11:12 Sokrates wrote:On April 23 2013 11:06 Blargh wrote:On April 23 2013 10:39 .kv wrote:On April 23 2013 10:00 iMpMarine wrote:
Finally, today I talked to physics, and because he was unwilling to co-operate an longer in helping us with this issue I decided to let him go. I still am not sure if he is guilty or Innocent, but all I can say is that because he was unwilling to cooperate with us in this matter an longer we obviously felt it was time to let him go.
-Marine- are you seriously not sure if he is guilty or innocent? you think players play with different hotkeys one for streaming and one for off streaming? you still think his macro is applicable for a GM player? you still think him having the build order advantage 100% of the time off stream is all luck? sorry but this blatant Yes he was investigated by MLG to look further into it to see if he is a hacker and was later on removed in the tournament. They didn't remove him on the spot when 100s of people requested them to do so. Of course we don't know exactly what they found so we will just forget about this. Bu what does it take to acknowledge that he is a hacker in HotS just like he was in WoL? Does it have to come out of his mouth? Does it take Blizzard to ban his account and bring him down to the Bronze league? come on man....you are better than this Him coming out and saying "Oh the player on my team was definitely cheating, just look at all of these replays!" doesn't do anything for anyone. Physics was released. Nothing more needs to be done. Grow up. Why not? Just why not? I get that this isnt easy to handle but after all that evidence you should at least have the balls and say "yes this guy was a maphacker and therefore he was kicked out of the team" and not go by "well there wasnt any real evidence just suspicious blabla innocent until proven." So whats the overall community "verdict"? was he a maphacker or did someone boost his account? This thread is a bit confusing.
I mean, we've seen people be concluded as hackers for less. We're obviously not going to get a confession.
If you were to ask me to bet $100 one way or the other, I'd feel pretty good about betting he hacks. The two set of hotkeys is pretty fishy. The allegations from people are fairly abundant. From what I heard, there are a fair amount of replays out there with him going with blind counters.
Poor CatZ..
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On April 23 2013 12:07 JacobShock wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 11:12 Sokrates wrote:On April 23 2013 11:06 Blargh wrote:On April 23 2013 10:39 .kv wrote:On April 23 2013 10:00 iMpMarine wrote:
Finally, today I talked to physics, and because he was unwilling to co-operate an longer in helping us with this issue I decided to let him go. I still am not sure if he is guilty or Innocent, but all I can say is that because he was unwilling to cooperate with us in this matter an longer we obviously felt it was time to let him go.
-Marine- are you seriously not sure if he is guilty or innocent? you think players play with different hotkeys one for streaming and one for off streaming? you still think his macro is applicable for a GM player? you still think him having the build order advantage 100% of the time off stream is all luck? sorry but this blatant Yes he was investigated by MLG to look further into it to see if he is a hacker and was later on removed in the tournament. They didn't remove him on the spot when 100s of people requested them to do so. Of course we don't know exactly what they found so we will just forget about this. Bu what does it take to acknowledge that he is a hacker in HotS just like he was in WoL? Does it have to come out of his mouth? Does it take Blizzard to ban his account and bring him down to the Bronze league? come on man....you are better than this Him coming out and saying "Oh the player on my team was definitely cheating, just look at all of these replays!" doesn't do anything for anyone. Physics was released. Nothing more needs to be done. Grow up. Why not? Just why not? I get that this isnt easy to handle but after all that evidence you should at least have the balls and say "yes this guy was a maphacker and therefore he was kicked out of the team" and not go by "well there wasnt any real evidence just suspicious blabla innocent until proven." So whats the overall community "verdict"? was he a maphacker or did someone boost his account? This thread is a bit confusing.
Well I think the final verdict is one of the very first things posted in this thread, we just got enough evidence to prove it without a shadow of a doubt. See.
On April 19 2013 04:48 orangeorange wrote:
Physics is a boosted account - he has a booster play both GM ladder games and clanwars for him. The booster uses a production tab hack but does not maphack, so the replays generally look fine (it's just that he always seems lucky in countering builds). Source: I know the guy who boosts his account and I've been following this situation for some time wondering when it would come to light.
Very, very easy way to prove this for yourself:
Tell physics to send you the replays from the games he played on stream yesterday (where he went 0-8), or any other games where you KNOW 100% that it's him. This would exclude clanwar reps where he all-killed, GM ladder games that are on replay sites like drop.sc, etc.
Compare the two batches of replays in SC2gears. They will be nothing alike.
The booster has good mechanics, but his apm is much lower (200-250 or so). The guy who you know as physics has different hotkeys and much higher apm (300-400+, because he spams a lot) but has much worse mechanics and is a significantly worse player overall.
There, that's it. You can even tell looking at Physics' match history on battlenet. Whenever he's on one of his insane ladder winstreaks, or playing a clanwar game, his apm will be in the 200's. Whenever it's him playing as himself, it will be in the 400's. The pattern will match up 100%.
If you want to discuss further, PM me.
Based on the hotkey analysis and fishiness of play I would say this is 100% accurate. I don't know if we can prove Physicslee him self ever map hacked, but I believe the person he had play his account for ladder / clan wars / WCS was using a production hack, so the responsibility kind of falls on him.
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Alot of you are just being stupid and jumping to conclusions too fast, Ive played quite a few games with him, and he is definitely not a maphacker, although that doesnt mean he isnt a production tab hacker, as he does seem to get lucky way too often. He speaks and types korean fluently, so it may just be a korean who production tab hacks who took over PhysicsLee from whoever it was before.
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Wow big deal, he doesnt maphack he just uses a production tabhack. Now we are all stupid :D....
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On April 23 2013 16:08 Sokrates wrote:
Wow big deal, he doesnt maphack he just uses a production tabhack. Now we are all stupid :D....
hack is hack ?
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On April 23 2013 16:12 CoR wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 16:08 Sokrates wrote:
Wow big deal, he doesnt maphack he just uses a production tabhack. Now we are all stupid :D.... hack is hack ?
Whoosh
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Well, in the MLG/Blizzard interview about WCS AM qualifier it was said that he was found to be a cheater and blizzard banned him, so our suspicions and accusations were correct and Blizzard has already taken action
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This motherfucker got banned!! Fuck you Physiclee and anyone else that uses hacks!
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i dont mind the casual hackers, they are what they are, cant rid of them so whatever.
but its fucking mind boggling people hack in competitive environment, these fuckers need to be shunned much worse than mabonjwa. kill them with needles!!
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The funny thing is, and I think the thing that bothers me - he's not the first on iMp to be like this. After Knighter, wouldn't you be as vigilant as possible? As a manager myself, I practice with and watch my players play CONSTANTLY. If one of them was hacking I would know it. As someone who was at one point associated with iMp (for a very short amount of time) it is really hard to believe that NOBODY on the team saw this or guessed it from his play, given that when I was there practice involved players obsing each other constantly. How could nobody notice the inconsistencies?
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/pJ97T.png?1)
